Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.
Degrassi.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.

Vahakyla posted:

Hard to find war movies were protagonist looks like this.





Die Brücke (1959).

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.

feedmegin posted:

The Usenet equivalent of this thread goes back a long way, then there was a forum specifically for alternate history I remember posting on in the 90s. I think it was Turtledove? One of the authors who specialises in this sort of thing anyway, who got chased off there in a huff after posting some sort of bullshit. Strong 'don't you know WHO I AM' energy and stuff.

Dollars to Dimes it was S. M. Stirling.

Rascar Capac fucked around with this message at 12:29 on Nov 9, 2021

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.

Milo and POTUS posted:

Lethal weapon?

Gallipoli.

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.

Milo and POTUS posted:

What was that book about hitler that predated ww2? I think it was a far future where they won. I assumed this was it but it was written before it all started I think

Swastika Night (1937)?

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.

Cessna posted:

The Soviets didn’t disband their last cavalry unit until 1957, so I guess you could say “cavalry survived into the nuclear age” if you wanted to do so.

https://twitter.com/RecceGen/status/1449688830970376198?s=20

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.

zoux posted:

Gentlemen you could all begin wearing capes tomorrow if you so desired, though you would instantly and forever become "the cape guy"

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.
Foucault examines the move away from torture as a central part of Discipline and Punish (1975).

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.

Tulip posted:

I actually rather like Foucault, especially Archaeologies of Knowledge. However, contextually he was being brought up as a source to learn about the history of torture, which I do not think is an appropriate thing to learn from Foucault, regardless of whatever else you may learn from him.

As an academic, I believe that reading around a subject is good.

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.

Cessna posted:



This mindset shows up at every level. Look at the name of his book, “My Struggle.” Look at his favorite music – Wagnerian opera, which always ends in Gotterdammerung, the apocalyptic death of the gods themselves.

Apologies if this is just nitpicking, but Hitler's favourite music was Franz Lehár’s The Merry Widow.

https://www.tabletmag.com/sections/news/articles/the-merry-widows-fling-with-hitler

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.
I wonder if the thread might be able to help me identify some books I saw online quite recently, but can't seem to Google up?

It was two fairly recent volumes on the American Civil War by an American historian, the first one addressing the Lost Cause Myth, the second addressing the modern mythology of the Union side. I think they were published by one of the American university presses.

Bonus points if anyone can tell me if the books are any good or not!

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.

Cessna posted:

Not sure about the second, but is the first Myth of the Lost Cause by Bonekemper?

I don't think so, I'm pretty sure that both books were by the same author.

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.

Tomn posted:

Say, something that current events unfortunately had me thinking about. During WW2, were the Nazis pushing internal propaganda about how well they were treating their conquered peoples? Like "We are avoiding civilian casualties, we are only striking military targets, our occupation governments are firm but fair," sort of thing? Or was it not mentioned much at all? Or especially in the east was it just straightforward "they are subhumans, who cares"?

The 1944 Nazi propaganda film Theresienstadt was about how wonderfully Jews were being treated in the Theresienstadt ghetto, and by extension how well they were being treated in the rest of the Nazi-occupied east.

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.
If Viktor Suvorov's The Liberators: My Life in the Soviet Army (1981) is to be believed there were already a bunch of problems by the late 1960s.

NOTE: I have no idea if The Liberators is to be believed.

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.

Koramei posted:

I know nothing about the linguistics of this, but as I remember in one of the recent ACOUP posts, Devereaux mentions “shock” as more proper terminology for hand-to-hand fighting, in battles anyway?

"Shock" is certainly used for weapons in anthropology - I've read it used by Otterbein and probably Turney-High.

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.
For PTSD and the ancient world, I think these two papers are worth reading:

Greaves (2013) "Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder (PTSD) in Ancient Greece: A Methodological Review", in O'Brien & Boatright (eds.) Warfare and Society in the Ancient Eastern Mediterranean. Oxford: Archaeopress.

Rees (2020) "We need to talk about Epizelus: ‘PTSD’ and the ancient world", Medical Humanities 46(1), 46-54. http://dx.doi.org/10.1136/medhum-2018-011557

Rascar Capac fucked around with this message at 20:33 on Jul 8, 2022

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.
Devereaux's blog post is wrong in saying that Epizelos at Marathon is the only claimed case of ancient PTSD. Lawrence Tritle (a combat veteran) has discussed the portrayal of the Spartan Clearchus in Xenophon (another combat veteran) in those terms.

Also, as noted in the papers I posted links to above, it might well be that trauma in the ancient world did not present in ways that would conform to the DSM-V.

Rascar Capac fucked around with this message at 21:20 on Jul 8, 2022

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.

Cessna posted:

Wasn't there a book, Achilles in Vietnam, about looking at the Iliad in modern psychological terms?

I have not read it.

There is, unfortunately I haven't read it either (yet).

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.

PittTheElder posted:

Bit of a derail but that's a good point actually, why the gently caress doesn't the UK play as one team? Note that I know nothing about football except that England fans always think they will win and they never do

The nations of the UK started playing internationals with each other before there was a FIFA or UEFA (England v Scotland in 1872), and this got grandfathered in when international football expanded and became more organised.

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.

Libluini posted:

Pro-slavery is kind of an extinct stance today, with the exception of some terminally online weirdos.

In terms of raw numbers there are more enslaved people today than at any other time inhuman history, so it seems that there actually are quite a few pro-slavery people out there.

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.
It isn't a separate issue.

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.


I'd recommend this book to anyone interested in critiques of Diamond. It's more focussed on his book Collapse than Guns, Germs and Steel, but it is relevant to the latter.

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.

zoux posted:

So why were Europeans the premiere world colonists and imperialists and not the Ottomans or Chinese or indeed the native American civilizations

If we were to follow Eric Wolf's Europe and the People Without History (1982), the key factors would be:

1) The rise of the Italian port-cities as traders, as a consequence of the movement of the capital of the Islamic caliphate from Damascus to Baghdad and the withdrawal of the Byzantine Empire from maritime trade.

2) A "crisis of feudalism" around A.D. 1300 which European elites responded to by increasing the scale and intensity of war.

There's a useful summary here which touches on a lot of the points people have been discussing:

https://www.livinganthropologically.com/eric-wolf-europe-people-without-history/

Note that this piece points out that it didn't have to be Europe, as a bunch of the relevant technological factors were available across Eurasia. That it was Europe was down to a non-deterministic historical process, rather than a deterministic geographic one.

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.
Kohima-Imphal. Indian units were also in Italy at places like Monte Cassino.

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.

wdarkk posted:

I forget where the source was, but at least one person has died this way. It became a thing in ufo circles because that’s how it was reported over the radio.

Frederick Valentich.

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.
The topic of PTSD in pre-modern warfare sometimes comes up in the thread, so this new book might be of interest: Combat Stress in Pre-modern Europe.

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.
By way of contrast, here are some officers of the Austro-Hungarian Honvéd Inf. Regt. No.309 in a trench somewhere near Sosnow (today called Sosniv) on the river Strypa in western Ukraine, photographed sometime in 1916:

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.

Tulip posted:

I should put some time into looking into the historiography of that claim about Hittite iron. It's a claim that I grew up with (its in the Age of Empires manual and I did read the game manuals as a rule growing up), but its very hard to square with any of the available evidence. I've seen the debunking but not the initial claims and its honestly an odd one, the Hittite military definitely has successes but they weren't like, head and shoulders over other bronze age states, so why did people reach for an unlikely explanation for a phenomena that...didn't actually happen?

I've done a little digging, and the Hittite iron hypothesis seems to come from V. Gordon Childe's What Happened in History (1942). He believed ironworking had developed in Anatolia in the 13th century BC due to Hittite documents recording iron objects. He then goes on to argue that around 1200 BC, various of the Hittite subject peoples learned ironworking themselves and used it to destroy the Hittite empire and then the other Bronze Age kingdoms. Iron also radically shifts the nature of society in the regions that are using it.

Childe was wrong, at least about the development and spread of ironworking in the Mediterranean and western Asia: the bronze-to-iron transition takes much longer than this, and basic iron doesn't have all that much of an advantage over bronze. Given the available archeological evidence in the 1940s, however, his theory may have been viable for the era.

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.

Vincent Van Goatse posted:

More germane to the Fascist invasion of Ethiopia was the Battle of Adwa in 1896, which saw an Italian army thrashed by Ethiopian forces armed by France and Russia. Even the British got the poo poo kicked in a few times when they underestimated indigenous resistance, Isandlwana being the most notable case.

In War Before Civilization (1996), Lawrence Keeley argues that between the 17th-19th centuries European and American armies generally performed badly against indigenous troops in open battle, but did much better when they were behind fortifications. I don't really know enough about the wars he's discussing to assess the idea properly, but I've always found it interesting.

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.

Tomn posted:

I don't exactly know enough about warfare during that period to give a definitive answer, but what exactly does "indigenous" mean here? Like for instance, in India I know that European mercenaries were in high demand especially during the latter half of the covered period, and not just for siege work. Is this purely relating to the North American tribes? Or does this thesis cover Central and South America as well, or indeed Africa and Asia?

I'm misusing the word indigenous, but I was struggling to come up with a better replacement for Keeley's use of "primitive". He's certainly not just talking about North America though, as he also gives examples for Africa and South America.

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.
Anything to post my favourite experimental archaeology photo:



Gregory Aldrete (left) and Scott Bartell (right), two of the authors of Reconstructing Ancient Linen Body Armor – Unraveling the Linothorax Mystery (2013).

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.

Kermit The Grog posted:

Follow-up question, I'm not sure the truth of it, but I've always heard a lot of nazis fled to Argentina, is that true? If so, why there in particular? Between watching the nazi hunter show Hunters and learning about the Central and South America goodwill tour Walt Disney was a part of during the war, I've been really curious of Central and South America's part in WW2.

I've had Argentinean journalist Uki Goñi's book The Real Odessa: How Nazi war criminals escaped Europe in my to-read pile for years now.

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.

Siivola posted:

It's kind of hard to say. Like Easton asks about 13 minutes in, why didn't anyone invent the rondel dagger until the 14th century, when mail has been around for so much longer? Why do people wear swords, even though they're bad?

My guess is, the sword is there to look cool and if you need to use it someone's loving up.

Surely the sword is connected to rank and social status, which is why they continued to be worn?

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.

zoux posted:

It is pretty weird that we had a comedy set in a stalag just 20 years after the end of the war. It'd be like a modern comedy that was about Americans held hostage by inept Al Qaeda mujahedeen in Tora Bora.

Some time back Channel 4 sketch show The Kevin Bishop Show did the American remake of Allo Allo, but with all the cultural and ethic stereotypes updated to the Vietnam War...

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.
People interested in the development of Roman military equipment might want to take a look at the 2020 paper Panoply and Identity during the Roman Republic in the Papers of the British School at Rome.

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.
If you're in the British Museum, go see Pete Marsh (Lindow Man), the Sutton Hoo helmet, the hoard of Roman silver from Mildenhall, the skeleton from Maiden Castle with a ballista bolthead in its spine.

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.
The 30cm wooden rulers with all the monarchs on that you can buy in every single gift shop here start with Edward the Confessor in 1042, so that's canon.

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.

Ainsley McTree posted:

Is he the "after you kill someone, you will have the best sex of your life--the best sex of your life" guy or is that a different villain

(i'd google but i can't think of a phrasing i'd want on my work computer's search history)

It's a comment made all the stranger by the fact that Grossman is not a combat veteran and never deployed:



Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.
Recently I was writing up a section of an excavation in a Classical Greek city, and I found that our pottery expert had identified painted letters on the base of a cup fragment: ΓΛΑΥ E. They suggested that this was an abbreviation for Glau[kon] e[imi], translating literally to "Glaukon I am" or "I belong to Glaukon". This, plausibly, is the name of the last person to own the house the cup was excavated from, in 348 BC.

As I said in the report I wrote, those painted letters are now probably the only evidence that that individual ever existed.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Rascar Capac
Aug 31, 2016

Surprisingly nice, for an evil Inca mummy.

Wikipedia posted: posted:

In March 1797 Cockchafer captured Two Friends.[7]

Maybe the real Cockchafers were the friends we met along the way?

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply