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Pattonesque posted:Some account of different factions and POVs in ME3's development would be fascinating agreed on Final Hours of ME3 but I believe it was also made during the game's development, so it offers an interesting window into a moment between Mass Effect 3 being largely complete and Mass Effect 3 being released to subsequent backlash in particular it's interesting to see Hudson's ideas about science and technology around apparently during development for ME1, ahead of any need for Bioware to do PR damage control - suggests that "Hudson and Walters locked themselves in a room and pulled something out their asses for the ending" has been exaggerated by the fanbase i.e. the basic concepts were there from the start, it was just the mechanical line-by-line script that needed to be rushed out by the producer and lead writer
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Feb 7, 2021 20:37
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Funky Valentine posted:Again fighting Cyborg Martin Sheen would've been a better ending. This I think would be a mistake. Illusive Man is a much better as a 'chessmaster' villain, not one who is actually any physical threat to the player. Having your last encounter with him just be a dialog battle (of which they should have taken a lot of notes from the previous year's Human Revolution) is the best way to end.
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Feb 7, 2021 20:42
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The second game also seems like it had a lot of people pulling in different directions during development as far as the story goes for example the heavy focus on Legion during promotional materials and his relatively speaking minor overall importance to the narrative. All the cut dialogue for Legion seems to suggest a lot of mishmash ideas changing on the fly I think the second game just had enough positive character work and other things going on that it wasn’t as big of a deal
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Feb 7, 2021 20:57
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Lt. Danger posted:agreed on Final Hours of ME3 but I believe it was also made during the game's development, so it offers an interesting window into a moment between Mass Effect 3 being largely complete and Mass Effect 3 being released to subsequent backlash "Bad man lock room keep out good guys" is one of those apocryphal gaming myths that's completely stupid to anyone who maybe thinks about it for a single minute, yet it somehow endures.
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Feb 7, 2021 20:58
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thrilla in vanilla posted:The second game also seems like it had a lot of people pulling in different directions during development as far as the story goes for example the heavy focus on Legion during promotional materials and his relatively speaking minor overall importance to the narrative. All the cut dialogue for Legion seems to suggest a lot of mishmash ideas changing on the fly I think the second game just had enough positive character work and other things going on that it wasn’t as big of a deal I thought the very earliest stuff with Legion was going to imply that Shepard was killed and returned via a Geth platform which... Would have been wild but also is a terrible idea.
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Feb 7, 2021 21:02
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it seems like game development in general is a very chaotic process with stuff being planned, scrapped, re-used and transformed on a continual basis. that recent Mac Walters interview about the cut Mass Effect 2 characters has design docs that are completely different to anything we saw in the final game, even for characters that made it in (Jacob was gonna kill himself over his feelings for Miranda! what the gently caress)
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Feb 7, 2021 21:06
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what are they going to give us to make up for the Miranda rear end shot
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Feb 7, 2021 21:06
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frajaq posted:what are they going to give us to make up for the Miranda rear end shot Thane will be naked at all times.
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Feb 7, 2021 21:13
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frajaq posted:what are they going to give us to make up for the Miranda rear end shot Mass effect will generate a nude Wrex.
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Feb 7, 2021 21:22
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thrilla in vanilla posted:The second game also seems like it had a lot of people pulling in different directions during development as far as the story goes for example the heavy focus on Legion during promotional materials and his relatively speaking minor overall importance to the narrative. All the cut dialogue for Legion seems to suggest a lot of mishmash ideas changing on the fly I think the second game just had enough positive character work and other things going on that it wasn’t as big of a deal There is only 6 missions where you can select party members in game where you can't use Legion(counting Reaper IFF as a Legion mission), it just one more mission than Tali, Samara and Thane. Also if you love Legion and don't care for your crew if you recruit both Zaeed and Kasumi and wake Grunt then after Horizon just do 5 side missions to unlock the Collector ship mission and then do the Reaper IFF you can then use Legion on 3 recruitment missions and all 12 loyalty missions.
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Feb 7, 2021 21:29
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Most of the problem of Legion's screentime is a consequence of the deeply stupid timed mission at the end.
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Feb 7, 2021 21:38
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chaosapiant posted:Here’s a cool idea I just had laying in bed: replace Kai Leng with a husked/resurrected Virmire casualty. It would have a lot of reason to hate you once indoctrinated and could make for some cool and emotional moments. Hire me BioWare. i always thought that the ending AI thing should have switched forms a bunch between squad mates you lost and friends who have died. the one it greets you as is Jenkins because thats corny enough to work.
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Feb 7, 2021 22:28
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And then Shepard goes, "...who?"
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Feb 7, 2021 22:29
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exquisite tea posted:And then Shepard goes, "...who?" i mean yeah pretty much. but its better than rando kid. like i get why they did the kid and its fine but its also just idk corny and dumb. if your gonna go corny and dumb, go with my dumb ideas.
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Feb 7, 2021 22:32
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DourCricket posted:This I think would be a mistake. Illusive Man is a much better as a 'chessmaster' villain, not one who is actually any physical threat to the player. Having your last encounter with him just be a dialog battle (of which they should have taken a lot of notes from the previous year's Human Revolution) is the best way to end. That was BioWare's reasoning too. On The Illusive Man's character page in the Art of Mass Effect artbook, there's a sketch of a big giant Reaperfied hulk TIM that they thought was going to be the final boss of ME3 and it didn't take them long to realize no wait, this is stupid, TIM is a cerebral villain, not a physical one so you should talk him death instead of fighting another big dumb robot.
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Feb 7, 2021 22:32
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exquisite tea posted:And then Shepard goes, "...who?" one of my favorite little touches in ME2 was if you go "thanks but no thanks" to Garrus in ME1 and you go on the Archangel mission Shepard will go "Garrus ... Vakarian?" when he reveals himself instead of the joyful "Garrus!" she says if you play like a normal person
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Feb 7, 2021 22:33
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DourCricket posted:This I think would be a mistake. Illusive Man is a much better as a 'chessmaster' villain, not one who is actually any physical threat to the player. Having your last encounter with him just be a dialog battle (of which they should have taken a lot of notes from the previous year's Human Revolution) is the best way to end. yeah. i liked TIM at the end, he is just this broken indoctrinated shell like saren was and much like saren, there is a little bit left that realizes that. also i did every paragon thing but i could never get him to off himself. anyway hints? Dapper_Swindler fucked around with this message at 22:37 on Feb 7, 2021 |
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Feb 7, 2021 22:33
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gotta pick middle investigative options and pass a speech check every time you speak with TIM (Mars, Thessia, Cerberus HQ)
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Feb 7, 2021 22:44
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Dapper_Swindler posted:yeah. i liked TIM at the end, he is just this broken indoctrinated shell like saren was and much like saren, there is a little bit left that realizes that. also i did every paragon thing but i could never get him to off himself. anyway hints? If I recall right, if you start a new game without an import it's actually not possible to have enough paragon/renegade points to pass the first check. Raygereio fucked around with this message at 22:53 on Feb 7, 2021 |
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Feb 7, 2021 22:46
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Raygereio posted:You need to pass all 6 persuade/intimidate checks in TIM's dialogues. The first three one on Mars, Thessia & the Cerberus base are hidden behind investigate dialogue options. lol. well guess i will try again with legenday. hope ME1 is as fixed/"fixed" as they act like it is.
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Feb 7, 2021 22:50
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I just want a game where your space Barbies go *pew pew pew* and are friends and kiss
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Feb 7, 2021 22:57
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Best Bi Geek Squid posted:I just want a game where your space Barbies go *pew pew pew* and are friends and kiss I remember a certain internet film reviewer whom I no longer watch because he turned out to be a massive shithead went to one of the Barbie cgi movies for shits and giggles and it was like Barbie In Space or some poo poo and he was like "This is just Mass Effect. Barbie is Commander Shepard, and this is her favourite store on the Citadel." So you're not far off there.
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Feb 7, 2021 23:03
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Best Bi Geek Squid posted:I just want a game where your space Barbies go *pew pew pew* and are friends and kiss https://www.kickstarter.com/project...OQfLID1762IfUkt Here ya go 👍
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Feb 8, 2021 00:08
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OhFunny posted:What squad mates did everyone frequently use? Seriously, Mordin's arc and finale had more character than the entire cast of Andromeda. "I made a MISTAKE! Looked at big picture. Made up of little pictures. Too many variables!"
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Feb 8, 2021 00:13
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I forgot how much I loved Wrex's voice work https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8lkEp_D25hc&t=52s
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Feb 8, 2021 00:41
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DourCricket posted:This I think would be a mistake. Illusive Man is a much better as a 'chessmaster' villain, not one who is actually any physical threat to the player. Having your last encounter with him just be a dialog battle (of which they should have taken a lot of notes from the previous year's Human Revolution) is the best way to end. I thought that one of the big things going on with the Illusive Man was that he's losing himself to indoctrination so that he presumably doesn't have the same chessmaster capability as he used to, hence why he's blatantly acting out in the open and throwing huge piles of men around to stop the person that he spent stupid amounts of money to resurrect from doing what he wanted them to do when he resurrected them. Decaying to the point where he just throws himself at you would fit.
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Feb 8, 2021 01:36
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Chocobo posted:I forgot how much I loved Wrex's voice work imagine having a voice so rumbly that steve blum is cast to play the fresh-faced baby version of you
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Feb 8, 2021 01:39
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Hank Morgan posted:My big disappointment with the Shepard clone was that it was not the opposite gender Shepard. I think even for a DLC that was already extremely meta it was a missed opportunity to have a bit of fun and play Mark Meer and Jennifer Hale off each other. Counterpoint: The bit where dudeshep has an existential crisis about the way he talks to people is loving gold
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Feb 8, 2021 16:27
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Psycho Landlord posted:Counterpoint: The bit where dudeshep has an existential crisis about the way he talks to people is loving gold I should go? I...should go? I should go?
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Feb 8, 2021 16:43
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If this linking to subverse? I’m getting a 404 but I’m guessing it’s subverse. X-Com / shmup and everyone fucks everyone else? With multi-colored endings? What’s not to like?
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Feb 8, 2021 16:47
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there are waaay too many threads devoted to bioware's decent into destruction and irrelevance
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Feb 8, 2021 17:37
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Happy Noodle Boy posted:If this linking to subverse? I’m getting a 404 but I’m guessing it’s subverse. Yeah my B, it is indeed Subverse. Moola posted:there are waaay too many threads devoted to bioware's decent into destruction and irrelevance This isn't the Anthem thread okay? We have at least 2/3rds of amazing games here to enjoy. And I will argue until my death that the good in ME3 heavily outweighs the bad. e: and Andromeda exists too whatever DourCricket fucked around with this message at 17:54 on Feb 8, 2021 |
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Feb 8, 2021 17:47
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i think the balancing act in ME3 is especially finicky, because the bad stuff is so bad and so prevalent. not just the ending, but how facile the quarian/geth conflict became, the stupid kid flashbacks, the weird celebrity cameos like that IGN journalist, the reduction of the big final conflict to a silly stats minigame and a few combat arenas. there's a constant feeling of cheap, sloppy implementation that covers ME3 like a film of grease. the gunplay is the series' best by a mile (the multiplayer is proof of that), tuchanka is still a high point and the additional character interaction is mostly solid, but most of the remaining fun stuff is in the DLC's, at least two of which read like an apology for the ending
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Feb 8, 2021 18:03
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Oxxidation posted:i think the balancing act in ME3 is especially finicky, because the bad stuff is so bad and so prevalent. not just the ending, but how facile the quarian/geth conflict became, the stupid kid flashbacks, the weird celebrity cameos like that IGN journalist, the reduction of the big final conflict to a silly stats minigame and a few combat arenas. there's a constant feeling of cheap, sloppy implementation that covers ME3 like a film of grease. the gunplay is the series' best by a mile (the multiplayer is proof of that), tuchanka is still a high point and the additional character interaction is mostly solid, but most of the remaining fun stuff is in the DLC's, at least two of which read like an apology for the ending This is why I find it hard to replay ME3 single player at all. It's not like you can just do the good bit and then stop, the good and the bad bits are deeply intertwined throughout the entire game its very messy, unlike the multiplayer which is 100% pure gold
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Feb 8, 2021 18:06
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Bioware has always been a little uneven: Mass Effect 2 has "humans are genetically diverse", butt shots, a mis-balanced Suicide Mission, an awkward transition to working for Cerberus; Mass Effect 1 has Malthusian economics, Saren/Benezia, awful gameplay, a scientific explanation for psychic blue space babes in turn Bioware aren't all that egregious - even Obsidian got in on the gaming-journalism-stunt-casting with the New Vegas DLCs
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Feb 8, 2021 18:12
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Oxxidation posted:i think the balancing act in ME3 is especially finicky, because the bad stuff is so bad and so prevalent. not just the ending, but how facile the quarian/geth conflict became, the stupid kid flashbacks, the weird celebrity cameos like that IGN journalist, the reduction of the big final conflict to a silly stats minigame and a few combat arenas. there's a constant feeling of cheap, sloppy implementation that covers ME3 like a film of grease. the gunplay is the series' best by a mile (the multiplayer is proof of that), tuchanka is still a high point and the additional character interaction is mostly solid, but most of the remaining fun stuff is in the DLC's, at least two of which read like an apology for the ending God the cop out when you go to the geth cyperspace on not showing what the quarian's look like is now just flooding back to me.
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Feb 8, 2021 18:17
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Lt. Danger posted:Bioware has always been a little uneven: Mass Effect 2 has "humans are genetically diverse", butt shots, a mis-balanced Suicide Mission, an awkward transition to working for Cerberus; Mass Effect 1 has Malthusian economics, Saren/Benezia, awful gameplay, a scientific explanation for psychic blue space babes Mass effect 1s gameplay actually rules though?
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Feb 8, 2021 18:20
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Lt. Danger posted:Bioware has always been a little uneven: Mass Effect 2 has "humans are genetically diverse", butt shots, a mis-balanced Suicide Mission, an awkward transition to working for Cerberus; Mass Effect 1 has Malthusian economics, Saren/Benezia, awful gameplay, a scientific explanation for psychic blue space babes Saren kicking around a trash can inside Sovereign screaming RAAARGH! ARRGHHA! in Mass Effect 1 is the absolute lowest point in the trilogy and I'm including the star child here.
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Feb 8, 2021 18:20
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BexGu posted:God the cop out when you go to the geth cyperspace on not showing what the quarian's look like is now just flooding back to me. Do you have any idea how many stock photos Bioware would need to find for that?
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Feb 8, 2021 18:24
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Oxxidation posted:i think the balancing act in ME3 is especially finicky, because the bad stuff is so bad and so prevalent. not just the ending, but how facile the quarian/geth conflict became, the stupid kid flashbacks, the weird celebrity cameos like that IGN journalist, the reduction of the big final conflict to a silly stats minigame and a few combat arenas. there's a constant feeling of cheap, sloppy implementation that covers ME3 like a film of grease. the gunplay is the series' best by a mile (the multiplayer is proof of that), tuchanka is still a high point and the additional character interaction is mostly solid, but most of the remaining fun stuff is in the DLC's, at least two of which read like an apology for the ending Conversely I do think the good can also be found throughout the whole game. Tuchanka is basically the crowning moment of the series, even if you didn't do everything perfectly to get there. Rannoch is tied up too neatly and quickly but I like how things you do in all 3 games plays some part in your ending there -- my first playthrough I did too many wrong things and had to make the agonizing choice of - do I save these robot people who have been forced into doing a terrible thing to survive or not murder my girlfriend and her whole race? And with all the build-up they had done between the two in the previous games I genuinely believed that yes, they're willing to wipe each other out at this point even if a handful on both sides don't want to. And man, that hosed me up real good. And the character stuff in this game is just amazing. Seeing NPCs interact with each other on the ship without you there, side stories where you just.. hang out? I loved it. Basically every squadmate who gives a crap about you coming to see you and then you have to try and convince them you're not entirely falling apart under the stress of this clearly unwinnable war. The mood and tone of ME3 just gets to me and mixed with all of the great story parts (and the gameplay of course but whatever) I can't help but genuinely love it, warts and all.
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Feb 8, 2021 18:27
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