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PurpleXVI
Oct 30, 2011

Spewing insults, pissing off all your neighbors, betraying your allies, backing out of treaties and accords, and generally screwing over the global environment?
ALL PART OF MY BRILLIANT STRATEGY!
Let's Play Might & Magic VII



Might and Magic 7 is probably more fondly remembered than 6 in general, it features a remarkable amount of changes and upgrades, as well as content, considering it was made in only slightly more than a year. VI released in April 1998, and VII was June 1999. It adds more classes and races, actually has art rather than SCA cosplay for character images(players and NPC's both), fixes a number of bugs(and introduces a number of new ones that Grayface's MM7 patch fixes) and does an almost complete overhaul on magic and skills.

Considering how comparatively easy it would have been to just drop it into all the same stuff but with some new dungeons and a new linear questline, this is actually pretty impressive. Yeah, I call out the linear questline because we actually have choices in this one. Not just what to do, but mutually exclusive decisions on how to play the game beyond chargen.

Oh, yeah, and the game also looks nicer now.



First you've got a slightly less obtrusive UI(we can actually see our whole minimap now!), and if you look at the minimap you can see that rather than just having a single water colour, it actually shades from a lighter coastal to a deeper off-shore colour(not reflected in first-person but it's still a very nice touch on the maps, helps give them some life). There are empty symbols for all the default party-wide buffs over there on the right, too. Wizard Eye pops up in the dangling pearl in the upper right, and Torchlight flares from the, well, torch on the left of the minimap when it's cast. Maps are also less barren, featuring both more decorative sprites and more polygonal structures.

I know some people are split on some of the changes, but by and large I'm in favour of them. I know especially the magic changes annoyed some people back in the M&M6 thread.



Most of the background stats are the same, but the default "Magic" resistance has been stripped away and split into Body, Mind, Spirit, Dark, Light and Physical(though the latter four only appear on enemies as far as I'm aware).

Anyway, maybe this is getting ahead of ourselves. Maybe we should have a look at the intro:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lC4O9RvE2IA

Just look at the makeover on Archibald there, on his fancy dragon throne. Very cool, isn't it? Anyway, this buries the lede a bit, since our party doesn't start out directly dealing with anything related to the intro. Instead, they're a bunch of shiftless jerks that entered a contest to win a castle through a scavenger hunt on the Emerald Isles, and after chargen you get dropped right into that:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mH4DusvihQk

Looks like an extremely safe thing to be involved in. Surely no repercussions or dangers whatsoever.

Now, guess what? We're gonna need a party.

Create Four Jerks

I'm going to need four jerks, consisting of a Name, Gender, Face, Race and Class.

Name

I'm gonna be typing this out a lot so please don't force me to deal with "Poopzilla the Druid" or "Dongs the Thief."

Gender, Face & Race




Rows in order:

Female Dwarf, Male Dwarf
Female Goblin, Male Goblin
Female Human
Female Elf, Male Elf
Male Human

Like usual, gender doesn't impact anything stat-wise, but race does. It's not a huge change, but it affects base starting stats some, and we'll be stuck with those for a while. Dwarves are tough and slow(+Might, +Endurance, -Speed, -Accuracy), Elves are frail and bright(-Might, -Endurance, +Intellect, +Speed), Goblins are dumb and sneaky(+Might, -Intellect, -Personality, +Speed).

Class

Class has gotten a serious overhaul, largely due to the changes to Skills. All skills now have four ranks: Basic, Expert, Master and Grand Master, and while a class may be able to learn a skill, it may not be able to learn it all the way to Grand Master. In fact it's common that Grand Mastery in a given skill is limited to one or two classes, usually gated behind two promotions. Some promotions also unlock skills, and as each class has two seperate final promotions depending on which way our story choices go, sometimes those classes don't learn the same skills or skill masteries.

It gets intricate!

And doubly so for spells, since each spell type is segregated into Basic, Expert, Master and Grand Master tiers. You can't learn a spell of a given tier at all without the requisite skill mastery(though more mastery does still buff spells of a lower tier). So, say, without a Grand Master Water mage, we're never learning Lloyd's Beacon.


Archers are, like in MM6, hybrid fighter/elemental casters. Their Grand Master skills are Chainmail, Bow and Perception, and they eventually learn basic Light or Dark magic. Generally a solid choice since their Elemental magic gets up to Master rank at their top promotion and they can become Expert trap disarmers.


Pure casters of the Mind/Body/Spirit schools. Their Grand Master skills are: Mind, Body, Spirit, Light or Dark and Merchant. They're passable physical combatants since they can wear shields and Master the mace.


Once again, Druids are hybrid Cleric/Sorcerers. They can learn all of the elemental and divine types of magic up to Master, but can't touch Light or Dark magic. Their Grand Master skills are Meditation and Alchemy. While Alchemy was kind of dogshit in MM6, in MM7 GM Alchemy effectively results in a +50 boost to all stats for all characters, and a lot of buffs and protections can be stuffed into bottles, they're also actually useful for healing and restoring SP, now! So not a complete waste of time.


If you want faces crushed and mashed without as little sapient thought behind it as possible, the Knight is your class. They can attain Grand Mastery in Swords, Spears, Platemail, Shields, Bodybuilding, Repair and Arms Master. Arms Master is a new skill added for MM7 which just generally makes you better at combat. It generally makes you hit faster, hit more accurately and do more damage. Having a +damage effect under the rank of Master Arms Master prevents any given type of weapon from being too easily left behind for those characters who can learn it(Knight, Thief, Monk).


Monks are a class I've never really made much use of before. Their magic use is odd, capping out at either Basic or Expert(depending on promotion track) Divine types, and their Grand Mastery categories are Unarmed, Dodge, Staff, Learning and Body Building. They could potentially kick rear end, I suppose, they'd be little restricted by gear since their entire thing is not using gear but just running up to people and punching them, but they also have a low selection of utility skills(Master Disarm Trap with their low-magic promotion track) and almost no magic.


Paladins, which I totally did not forget to add to the post the first time around, are Cleric/Knight hybrids who, like Archers, get entry-level access to Light or Dark on their second promotion. Their GM skills are Mace, Shield and Repair, and they otherwise have Master access to Body Building, Platemail and Swords. They'll always be more tanky than Archers, and shore up your access to buffs and heals, but they'll almost certainly end up with a lower damage output.


Rangers are like a fighter/druid hybrid, getting up to Expert in all Divine and Elemental skills(but as per usual, not Light or Dark). Their only two GM skills are Axe and Identify Monster, which makes them feel more like barbarians than anything. Considering the new spell system in MM7, I'd say that magic which doesn't at least reach Master rank isn't deeply worth pursuing, and their shortage of GM or M combat and utility skills hurts them a bit in that case.


Masters of elemental magic and getting bullied. They obviously Grand Master all the elemental magic schools, and then either Light OR Dark, but also Identify Item and Identify Monster, and they can become Master alchemists, though the really good poo poo there is gated behind Grand Mastery, so if you want me to mess with alchemy, force me to bring a Druid.


Thieves are the third "non-magical" class(I consider Monks to be non-magical due to their extremely minor dip into it), being like an elemental version of the Monk who eventually gets completely negligible Elemental access in the end-game. They might potentially be at least as dangerous in combat as a Knight, though, as their eventual dagger mastery allows super-fast, high-volume, high-damage attacks, and once they Grand Master their leather armor, a chunk of their AC gets added straight to their elemental resistances. Predictably they are also potential Grand Masters of Stealing and Disarm Traps.

If someone else submits an idea you really like, please go ahead and vote for it, so I know what most people are in favour of.

And dear God please leave me with some competent spellcasters and at least one person who can disarm traps without blowing the entire party up. Amen.

Spoilers

Unlike MM6, MM7 actually has some twists and surprises. Spoiling these will make me cry to the mods and get either me or you probated. Please don't get me probated.

PurpleXVI fucked around with this message at 22:12 on May 27, 2023

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PurpleXVI
Oct 30, 2011

Spewing insults, pissing off all your neighbors, betraying your allies, backing out of treaties and accords, and generally screwing over the global environment?
ALL PART OF MY BRILLIANT STRATEGY!
Index

Update 01: Seeing Green
Update 02: Castle Harmondump
Update 03: Arcomage the Assembling
Update 04: Operation Karen
Update 05: On Barrowed Time
Update 06: The Party Duke of Tatalia
Update 07: Deyja Vu
Update 08: Wizards, No Sense of Urban Planning
Update 09: War and Peace Profit
Update 10: Nighon Holiday Special
Update 11: Mistakes Were Made
Update 12: The Road Not Travelled
Update 13: The Walls of Mist
Update 14: An A-maze-ing Tale
Update 15: The Other Collectathon
Update 16: Dragon Cave Z
Update 17: The Final Countdown

PurpleXVI fucked around with this message at 20:42 on Jun 1, 2021

Libluini
May 18, 2012

I gravitated towards the Greens, eventually even joining the party itself.

The Linke is a party I grudgingly accept exists, but I've learned enough about DDR-history I can't bring myself to trust a party that was once the SED, a party leading the corrupt state apparatus ...
Grimey Drawer
I'm always taking a knight or paladin as first character, to better beat people up. And since we had a paladin last time, my suggestion is:

Owen Deathstalker
Male, Human, Knight, Portrait on the right.


(As good old Owen has a beard, canonically, but not quite as full as the second portrait.)

Oh yeah, description:

Edit:

Owen has exactly one major trait: He can not stop killing people if he sees something bad or shady happening. Even though the innocent have nothing to fear from him (theoretically), they tend to avoid him after seeing him disemboweling murderers, bandits and local corrupt magistrates with a sharpened spoon. Which is quite ironic, since he tends to hang around shady characters quite often himself. Rumors say he slaughtered his way out of his manor, just with a rusty sword, after a disagreement with his empress lead to her bribing all of his servants to trap and kill him. Since then he has been wandering the world, seeking wrongs to be righted. Or to be more precise, filleted.

Though no-one has ever heard of this "empress" he keeps talking about. He may be just insane.

Libluini fucked around with this message at 17:09 on Mar 16, 2021

ultrafilter
Aug 23, 2007

It's okay if you have any questions.


PurpleXVI posted:

..."Dongs the Thief."
...at least one person who can disarm traps without blowing the entire party up. Amen.

:hmmyes:

Slaan
Mar 16, 2009



ASHERAH DEMANDS I FEAST, I VOTE FOR A FEAST OF FLESH
Name: Zina
Race: Goblin
Sex: Female
Portrait: Row 2, Column 2
Class: Druid

Zina was a apiarist for most of her life. She kept bees for their honey to use in medicines, wax for candles and the bees themselves for the occasional snack.

She joined the party to enter the scavenger hunt so that she could set up a large scale beekeeping operation on the castle grounds for fun and profit. So many candles and medicines and Mead and more could be set up there. Her clan and her bees would be so happy.

Plus. She might get to sample some new flavors for her cooking and ingredients for her potions. Lich flambé anyone?

Jobbo_Fett
Mar 7, 2014

Slava Ukrayini


Clapping Larry
All gobbo team, all the gobbo time

Guildenstern Mother
Mar 31, 2010

Why walk when you can ride?
Eddie the Sorcerer

First male elf pic, keep the default voice for him (yes I know we won't get to hear it)

Eddie is smart but kind of awkward, like a slightly less over the top Urkel.

Junpei
Oct 4, 2015

Although next time, you would be wise to heed the ancient Japanese proverb... phone first!
I think you forgot a Paladin description...

But anyway:

Aisha
2nd Female Human (the black lady)
Sorcerer(ess)

PurpleXVI
Oct 30, 2011

Spewing insults, pissing off all your neighbors, betraying your allies, backing out of treaties and accords, and generally screwing over the global environment?
ALL PART OF MY BRILLIANT STRATEGY!

Junpei posted:

I think you forgot a Paladin description...

I have no idea how that one slipped past me, I knew something looked off but couldn't figure out what. :v:

ultrafilter
Aug 23, 2007

It's okay if you have any questions.


Also, did you mean to use the poo poo post tag?

Alien Arcana
Feb 14, 2012

You're related to soup, Admiral.
I feel like now that we have both race and class options, we should have at least one character that plays against type.
Also we didn't have a Cleric last time and we're really gonna want one this time, so

Zaggut the Goblin Cleric
(Portrait: 1st male goblin)

Also I just noticed that the two male goblins have precisely opposite facial hair, it's weird.

BraveLittleToaster
May 5, 2019
Time for more Might & Magic goodness. I really enjoyed the last thread, so this one must be even better still. As for character:

Female Dwarf Portrait 1, name of Stashley. She'll be the Thief for prying open locks, traps, skulls, organs, and whatever gets in range.

Randalor
Sep 4, 2011



"Old man" McTuckett
Dwarf druid
Old dwarf portrait


Bonus points if you make him a "crazy tin-hat conspiracy" theorist who believes the demons from the previous game were actually space aliens, their tower was actually an interdimensional portal, and then tie every problem the party has into more and more elaborate conspiracy theories.

Also, when did this game release in relation to X-Com: Terror from the Deep? Because I'm getting some serious Terror from the Deep vibes from that opening cutscene.

PurpleXVI
Oct 30, 2011

Spewing insults, pissing off all your neighbors, betraying your allies, backing out of treaties and accords, and generally screwing over the global environment?
ALL PART OF MY BRILLIANT STRATEGY!

ultrafilter posted:

Also, did you mean to use the poo poo post tag?

Nope! :v: I didn't notice it defaulted to that until after I'd posted.

I am an extreme genius.

Randalor posted:

Also, when did this game release in relation to X-Com: Terror from the Deep? Because I'm getting some serious Terror from the Deep vibes from that opening cutscene.

TFTD was 1995.

Guildenstern Mother
Mar 31, 2010

Why walk when you can ride?

Randalor posted:

"Old man" McTuckett
Dwarf druid
Old dwarf portrait


Bonus points if you make him a "crazy tin-hat conspiracy" theorist who believes the demons from the previous game were actually space aliens, their tower was actually an interdimensional portal, and then tie every problem the party has into more and more elaborate conspiracy theories.


I like this aside from the druid part, we already made him take one last game.

Alien Arcana
Feb 14, 2012

You're related to soup, Admiral.

BraveLittleToaster posted:

Female Dwarf Portrait 1, name of Stashley.

Ooh, gonna second this one, I love the dwarf-thief archetype.

Randalor
Sep 4, 2011



Guildenstern Mother posted:

I like this aside from the druid part, we already made him take one last game.

Yeah, but I want to see him play with the alchemy system.

Xerophyte
Mar 17, 2008

This space intentionally left blank

Gudrun the Dwarf Monk has, after long years of training with the ancient masters of her people, learned the noble martial art of getting drunk and punching people.

[E:]

PurpleXVI posted:

I am an extreme genius.

You are a Super Goober, even! You can't be expected to sweat the small stuff with a fancy title like that. :haw:

Xerophyte fucked around with this message at 17:25 on Mar 16, 2021

EL Skirvo
Jun 17, 2006


I think Doctor Thunder is probably the best modeler alive today, I just really love all his work.
If you do take an archer, keep in mind he won't get expert disarm until after his *second* promotion, which doesn't make a ton of sense to me, but that's how they decided to work him. Enough perception on everyone should help minimize people dying outright till you can get telekinesis or decent disarm skill.

Monks take awhile to develop but I was surprised to see him outstripping the knight in terms of damage and tankiness; his ac and dmg #'s really start going through the roof as he gets +items to unarmed and dodge. Definitely a solid choice if you go the evil route. Really excited to see this LP, as it's a much more solid game than I originally remembered!

Name: Solomon David
Race: Human
Sex: Male
Portrait: Row 5, Column 2
Class: Monk

A man in search of the purest essence of fighting form, Solomon joins our party with arrogance only matched by his skill

ultrafilter
Aug 23, 2007

It's okay if you have any questions.


PurpleXVI posted:

Nope! :v: I didn't notice it defaulted to that until after I'd posted.

I am an extreme genius.

Post the tag you want and I'll report the post. That'll get it changed.

Angry Lobster
May 16, 2011

Served with honor
and some clarified butter.

EL Skirvo posted:



Name: Solomon David
Race: Human
Sexy: Male
Portrait: Row 5, Column 2
Class: Monk

A man in search of the purest essence of fighting form, Solomon joins our party with arrogance only matched by his skill

:hmmyes:

Black Robe
Sep 12, 2017

Generic Magic User


Alien Arcana posted:

I feel like now that we have both race and class options, we should have at least one character that plays against type.
Also we didn't have a Cleric last time and we're really gonna want one this time, so

Zaggut the Goblin Cleric
(Portrait: 1st male goblin)

Also I just noticed that the two male goblins have precisely opposite facial hair, it's weird.

Randalor posted:

"Old man" McTuckett
Dwarf druid
Old dwarf portrait


Bonus points if you make him a "crazy tin-hat conspiracy" theorist who believes the demons from the previous game were actually space aliens, their tower was actually an interdimensional portal, and then tie every problem the party has into more and more elaborate conspiracy theories.


Also, the really important question: do the party still get goofy reaction faces when stuff happens or they get hit?

PurpleXVI
Oct 30, 2011

Spewing insults, pissing off all your neighbors, betraying your allies, backing out of treaties and accords, and generally screwing over the global environment?
ALL PART OF MY BRILLIANT STRATEGY!

ultrafilter posted:

Post the tag you want and I'll report the post. That'll get it changed.

I already PM'd one of the mods, I'm sure they'll fix it at some point.

Looking forward to taking my pick of all these options, a lot of them sound fun.

Black Robe posted:

Also, the really important question: do the party still get goofy reaction faces when stuff happens or they get hit?

Of course! If they're more or less goofy is up to the viewer, though.

Lady Jaybird
Jan 23, 2014

to ride eternal, shiny and chrome

THUNDERDOME LOSER 2022



Urist McUrist Dwarf Monk Dwarf Portrait on the right

Roxors
Feb 18, 2011
I think you really under played how bad the ranger is. It just is worse than other classes at almost everything, and expert magic is pretty much useless after a couple hours. The thing about the skill system is that it really rewards focusing on the skills you can grandmaster or master. A lot of skills get huge multipliers for it.
Monks are pretty good if you go the low magic route, It is the only class other than thief that can get master trap disarming, and they can dish out stupid amounts of damage while being very tanky. Just for convenience, I pretty much always take a monk or thief in my parties just because of traps, which get really really stupid.

So yeah, I'm voting for a Goblin Monk with the 3rd goblin portrait named Blast Hardcheese

Also, please show off the glorious voice acting in this games, it is really special.

Obligatum VII
May 5, 2014

Haunting you until no 8 arrives.
I echo the idea of an all goblin team potentially being pretty funny. Making their way on up in the world, sick of being level 1 adventurer fodder. If you can't beat em, join them, right?

Libluini
May 18, 2012

I gravitated towards the Greens, eventually even joining the party itself.

The Linke is a party I grudgingly accept exists, but I've learned enough about DDR-history I can't bring myself to trust a party that was once the SED, a party leading the corrupt state apparatus ...
Grimey Drawer

Obligatum VII posted:

I echo the idea of an all goblin team potentially being pretty funny. Making their way on up in the world, sick of being level 1 adventurer fodder. If you can't beat em, join them, right?

I mean, have you seen the intro? One of the canon teams is four goblins. Now, four goblins fighting for the other side, that would be even funnier. Which is why all my parties start with making a goblin knight or paladin, before I even decide what the other characters should be. :v:

Raitzeno
Nov 24, 2007

What? It seemed like
a good idea at the time.

Obligatum VII posted:

I echo the idea of an all goblin team potentially being pretty funny. Making their way on up in the world, sick of being level 1 adventurer fodder. If you can't beat em, join them, right?

:emptyquote:

Narsham
Jun 5, 2008
Rightmost dwarf portrait
Dwarf Sorcerer
Name: Borin

Borin has fantastical magical and mystical powers, and has been dragged down the path of the Sorcerer as a result. But he really wants to be a thief: flashing daggers, witty repartee, clever heists. Despite his intellect, he tends towards distractedness and fixation. He's the sort of person who, after the party slays a dragon and everyone else is looting, sits down for a moment to work out a plan for sneaking into the cave and stealing the dragon's horde and getting away without detection, because that's what a skilled thief would do. He'd still be working on how to lure the dragon out of the cave by the time the others are ready to go, and pointing out that he doesn't need to because the dragon is already dead is likely to elicit the response that "If we assume the dragon isn't dead and its horde is still here, then I need a foolproof plan to lure it away long enough for us to get the gold!"
"But it is dead!"
"But what if it weren't? Going in without a plan is a bad idea."

If he didn't show such promise, someone would surely have murdered him by now.

Guildenstern Mother
Mar 31, 2010

Why walk when you can ride?
My vote is for something that's not a reference to another LP/pop culture if possible.

By popular demand
Jul 17, 2007

IT *BZZT* WASP ME--
IT WASP ME ALL *BZZT* ALONG!


I'm just gonna vote for the Young Ones:
Vivian as a human warrior
Rick as a simpering monk
Neil as an elf druid
Mike as a selfish sorcerer

Alien Arcana
Feb 14, 2012

You're related to soup, Admiral.

Guildenstern Mother posted:

My vote is for something that's not a reference to another LP/pop culture if possible.

:same:

Randalor
Sep 4, 2011



Guildenstern Mother posted:

My vote is for something that's not a reference to another LP/pop culture if possible.

What if it's a reference to the direct prequel to the game being LPed? Wait, is this set in the same setting as M&MVI?

Angry Lobster
May 16, 2011

Served with honor
and some clarified butter.

Randalor posted:

What if it's a reference to the direct prequel to the game being LPed? Wait, is this set in the same setting as M&MVI?

Same world, different continent.

clockwork chaos
Sep 15, 2009




Nina'vel Icevater
Lady Elf Paladin
either portrait

Beink snooty elf is boring, big mama Nina vant hug cute sqvishy humans, come to Nina little ones!

Zereth
Jul 8, 2003



I vote for a Mechanically Optimized Spellcaster. You're the one playing the game, you know what to pick here.

Named Spellbot 2000.

Guy Fawkes
Aug 1, 2014

Lvl 62, +5 meadow defense
Well, let's get some inspiration from the box illustration:

Bron Headbasher
Male Dwarf Paladin
Face on the left

Tired of the stereotype of the drunkard, goblin-hating, elf-hating, hard working, grumpy and greedy dwarf, Bron has taken the path of enjoying open life, consorts with elf and goblins, has adopted an healthy lifestyle and keeps hitting on the head all those insisting to him to behave more "dwarfy".

Amara the Sorceress
Female Human Sorceress
Third face from the left

Gifted with a natural beauty and talent for sorcery, Amara balances such virtues with the sharpest tongue in generations and a short fused temper; therefore she tends to find herself in a lot of troubles, only to escape thanks to the use of excessively destructive spells.

Darius Derander
Male Human Knight
Face on the Right

Lost in constant search for challenges and adventures, Darius left behind long ago the simple concepts of glory hunting and thrill seeking to fully embrace the ways of Leeroy Johnson.

Eldrielle
Female Elf Thief
The face on the Right

A passionate and dedicate collector of the strange, the unusual, the cute (and the valuable), Eldrielle found hereself more often than not on the wrong side of the authorities , expecially for her nasty habits of taking wathewer she fancies without reguard for antiquated concepts like property, ownership and laws. On the run from several irate owners, police officers and bounty hunters, she is now searching for a work in order to pay for a very loooooong travel...

Obligatum VII
May 5, 2014

Haunting you until no 8 arrives.

Randalor posted:

What if it's a reference to the direct prequel to the game being LPed? Wait, is this set in the same setting as M&MVI?

Oh, that gives me an idea. I'm awful with names so I don't have a suggestion there, but I would suggest:
A goblin that is the traumatized survivor of the MM6 gang's early level goblin massacre. They still have nightmare about Deadeye
Any class would work.

Randalor
Sep 4, 2011



Obligatum VII posted:

Oh, that gives me an idea. I'm awful with names so I don't have a suggestion there, but I would suggest:
A goblin that is the traumatized survivor of the MM6 gang's early level goblin massacre. They still have nightmare about Deadeye
Any class would work.

Hell, take it a step further if you want to go that route, you have a goblin survivor of their massacre, a dwarven survivor of the defilement of the mines, a human from the town they "accidentally" Armageddon'ed who only survived because they had gone to the next town over to deliver the town's exports, and *Insert literally anything that isn't an elf here*

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sweet geek swag
Mar 29, 2006

Adjust lasers to FUN!





Randalor posted:

Hell, take it a step further if you want to go that route, you have a goblin survivor of their massacre, a dwarven survivor of the defilement of the mines, a human from the town they "accidentally" Armageddon'ed who only survived because they had gone to the next town over to deliver the town's exports, and *Insert literally anything that isn't an elf here*

No, no. You need the elf. A drunk elf that thinks they are all exaggerating.

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