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Should troll Fancy Pelosi be allowed to stay? This poll is closed. |
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| No |
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| Total: | 486 votes | ||
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GreyjoyBastard posted:I'm not finding anything new on the bolded beyond the redacted thing, which by definition I don't know the content of? Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:It could also mean a lot of things. It is not especially likely that they found a legal rationale, but we don't know what the context is because the organization that FOIA'd hasn't released any of the actual materials to the public yet. They just put up a picture of one page out of 18. It is a "pre-decisional" memo, which means they were laying out the arguments for and against it based on case law. It doesn't mean they actually came to a decision on it. Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:They most likely redacted it because it contained internal deliberations and the FOIA request just mentioned the existence of materials related to the memo. FOIA requests have to be very specific and they are usually extremely literal with your request.
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Nov 1, 2021 02:09
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Trazz posted:"The political party that has been doing coded racism for 60 years surely isn't doing it this time and people are overreacting for no reason" I don't remember anyone saying it wasn't a conservative (and thus racist and such) phrase? Sanguinia posted:Well, guess its a good thing that not all conservatives are fascists, and that clearly its a bunch of dire-hard lefitsts embracing their anti-liberal sentiments and not nazis or nazi sympathizers, or those polls might be concerning. Can't wait to find common cause with our not-nazi right wing friends against those dirty liberals and the actual fascists they're currently aligned with over a shared love of sick owns once they retake power. I also really don't remember anyone saying this. Just that it's really hyperbolic to say that everyone who says it is a nazi and not some other kind of conservative, white supremacist, nationalist, or some such. Or a combination! I really think youre reading too much into semantics and ascribing that other stuff. You can just say "well I'm going to keep calling all right-wing people Nazis, the semantics aren't important to me" and disagree on that.
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Nov 1, 2021 03:32
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https://twitter.com/jeff_kaye/status/1454897555444101126 .....yeah the cia killed him lmao
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Nov 1, 2021 04:14
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The fair thing to say is that modern conservatives are all comfortable visibly associating with Nazis and working toward common goals with them. Or if they're uncomfortable, it's not too bad to put up with if it means you get to own some libs together. I don't think anyone is implying that they all directly adhere to the NSDAP's 25-point plan or something.
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Nov 1, 2021 04:17
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A big flaming stink posted:https://twitter.com/jeff_kaye/status/1454897555444101126 if you read the article. its basicaly delayed like a year.
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Nov 1, 2021 04:24
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Dapper_Swindler posted:if you read the article. its basicaly delayed like a year. What’s changing in the next twelve months that won’t warrant pushing it back further?
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Nov 1, 2021 04:26
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Dapper_Swindler posted:if you read the article. its basicaly delayed like a year. quote:A White House memo, signed by Biden, said "[t]emporary continued postponement is necessary to protect against identifiable harm to the military defense, intelligence operations, law enforcement, or the conduct of foreign relations that is of such gravity that it outweighs the public interest in immediate disclosure." not sure how that "identifiable harm" is gonna blow over in a year Dapper_Swindler posted:covid poo poo apparently. NARRA is still in disarray because of covid and poo poo apparently. cmon man you cannot be this credulous A big flaming stink fucked around with this message at 04:28 on Nov 1, 2021 |
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Nov 1, 2021 04:26
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Nottherealaborn posted:What’s changing in the next twelve months that won’t warrant pushing it back further? covid poo poo apparently. NARRA is still in disarray because of covid and poo poo apparently.
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Nov 1, 2021 04:27
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A big flaming stink posted:not sure how that "identifiable harm" is gonna blow over in a year source article for yahoo. https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/...aign=yahoo_feed quote:The order comes in response to the archivist of the United States recommending the president “temporarily certify the continued withholding of all of the information certified in 2018” and “direct two public releases of the information that has” ultimately “been determined to be appropriate for release to the public,” with one interim release on Dec. 15 and one more comprehensive release in late 2022, according to the memo.
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Nov 1, 2021 04:29
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a.lo posted:Hm Voters don't generally pick between one party or the other, its usually a choice between going to the polls or staying home. Enthusiasm for your side beyond just bad mouthing the opponent matters. GreyjoyBastard posted:I'm not finding anything new on the bolded beyond the redacted thing, which by definition I don't know the content of? Why is everyone mad about this 'Lets go Brandon' thing? By definition aren't they just expressing enthusiasm for someone named Brandon?
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Nov 1, 2021 05:23
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Nottherealaborn posted:What’s changing in the next twelve months that won’t warrant pushing it back further? Biden shot JFK, doesn't want to news to affect the mid terms.
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Nov 1, 2021 05:26
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Cornpop shot JFK.
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Nov 1, 2021 05:35
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GoutPatrol posted:Cornpop shot JFK. I will say finding out Cornpop was real was probably the funniest moment of the 2020 election cycle for me.
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Nov 1, 2021 05:37
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Just responding to this argument because it was quoted on this page.Leon Trotsky posted:The argument that the Higher Education act was intending to grant the executive unilateral authority to cancel debt is based on one single line of the law that says that the Education Department has the ability "to modify, compromise, waive, or release any right, title, claim, lien, or demand, however acquired, including any equity or any right of redemption.” The law also defines “modify” as meaning to “change moderately or in a minor fashion." This is some real losing the forest for the trees analysis. In statutory interpretation the plain meaning rule is typically the first juncture of analysis. You only look at legislative intent if the plain text of the statute is not clear: Caminetti v. U.S., 242 U.S. 470, 37 S. Ct. 192 (1917): "...the meaning of the statute must, in the first instance, be sought in the language in which the act is framed, and if that is plain, ... the sole function of the courts is to enforce it according to its terms." You're getting way too caught up on legislative intent and also focusing on one small part of a series of powers granted to the Education Department: it has the ability "to modify, compromise, waive, or release any right, title, claim, lien, or demand, however acquired, including any equity or any right of redemption.” So, yes, it has the ability to modify, which would indeed just be a moderate change or one minor in fashion. But that is not the only power granted. It also has the power to "waive" or "release." Literally the first definition on Webster's for "waive" is "to relinquish (something, such as a legal right) voluntarily." It's a very simple analysis. This wouldn't take a genius lawyer to argue. It's basic statutory analysis. The statute on it's face in the plain meaning of the text grants the department clear authority to waive or release any right, title, claim, lien, or demand, however acquired. Now, I'm sure the 6-3 Supreme Court would shut it down regardless, but that doesn't mean the law isn't clear on its face.
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Nov 1, 2021 05:46
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A big flaming stink posted:https://twitter.com/jeff_kaye/status/1454897555444101126 Wouldn't anyone that was of any importance in those areas in 1963 be long dead by now?
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Nov 1, 2021 05:51
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Blind Pineapple posted:Wouldn't anyone that was of any importance in those areas in 1963 be long dead by now? Long dead? HW's only been in the ground for like 3 years, I wouldn't say that's long
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Nov 1, 2021 05:58
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I figured the reason Biden hadn't moved on stuff like the student debt cancellation was to keep the focus on passing the two current bills and not piss off anyone in the party. Once (if) he secures both bills, I would imagine executive orders and actions would be forthcoming. There's a meme/prayer going around hoping folks like Bernie would hold Biden's feet to the fire on executive order action to secure their vote on the reconciliation bill.
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Nov 1, 2021 06:04
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VorpalBunny posted:I figured the reason Biden hadn't moved on stuff like the student debt cancellation was to keep the focus on passing the two current bills and not piss off anyone in the party. Once (if) he secures both bills, I would imagine executive orders and actions would be forthcoming. There's a meme/prayer going around hoping folks like Bernie would hold Biden's feet to the fire on executive order action to secure their vote on the reconciliation bill. How is Bernie going to hold Biden's feet to the fire after he's already voted on the bill?
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Nov 1, 2021 06:16
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TheIncredulousHulk posted:How is Bernie going to hold Biden's feet to the fire after he's already voted on the bill? He voted on the reconciliation bill already? He voted on the bipartisan infrastructure bill, yes.
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Nov 1, 2021 06:35
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Darkrenown posted:The next time Joe and Jill are out together he should end the night by saying "Let's go, Brandon!", wink at the camera, and leave with his wife. Chuds just gave him carte blanche to say he's off to gently caress. Go Brandon lets.
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Nov 1, 2021 06:40
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Blind Pineapple posted:Wouldn't anyone that was of any importance in those areas in 1963 be long dead by now? kissinger is still alive and will never die
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Nov 1, 2021 06:59
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Herstory Begins Now posted:what margin are you betting on 2% Republicans over the Democrats. I should have bought in earlier on Predict it. . . GreyjoyBastard posted:I'm not finding anything new on the bolded beyond the redacted thing, which by definition I don't know the content of? We don't know it's contents, but we sure do know that Biden has a weird hatred of millennials and that we are all whiny and ask for handouts too much. And Jesus, Biden is 78. He isn't loving anybody. Well, except Americans in general by not passing the original Build Back Better.
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Nov 1, 2021 07:24
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Peter Daou Zen posted:And Jesus, Biden is 78. He isn't loving anybody. Well, except Americans in general by not passing the original Build Back Better. I dunno, I've read the stories from goons who work in nursing homes
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Nov 1, 2021 07:31
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VorpalBunny posted:He voted on the reconciliation bill already? He voted on the bipartisan infrastructure bill, yes. ??? You're proposing a scenario in which Biden's holding off on doing any student debt relief until both bills are passed in order to not upset anybody. You then say that Bernie's going to hold Biden's feet to the fire on it in exchange for his votes on the bill. I'm asking you how in this scenario in which the student debt relief is being delayed until after both bills that Bernie's vote is effective leverage since he will have already cast it by the time you think Biden's going to address the debt relief question
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Nov 1, 2021 07:36
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It's not my idea, but this is the general idea I have seen thrown around in online conversations about where Biden goes from here: https://twitter.com/KyleKulinski/status/1454161234337562626
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Nov 1, 2021 07:49
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VorpalBunny posted:It's not my idea, but this is the general idea I have seen thrown around in online conversations about where Biden goes from here: When was it ten trillion? The size of the fish story of what this reconciliation was supposed to be just keeps getting bigger and it grinds my gears more and more. Can the thread be outraged about this hyperbole too even though its aimed at democrats rather than republicans? That'd be nice. Like, its entirely possible to be angry at 1.75 trillion + 1.5 trillion adding up to only 3.25 trillion out of the original 6 without lying and claiming that the Democrats self-negotiated down from 10 to less than 2.
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Nov 1, 2021 07:53
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Sanguinia posted:When was it ten trillion? The size of the fish story of what this reconciliation was supposed to be just keeps getting bigger and it grinds my gears more and more. Can the thread be outraged about this hyperbole too even though its aimed at democrats rather than republicans? That'd be nice. Like, its entirely possible to be angry at 1.75 trillion + 1.5 trillion adding up to only 3.25 trillion out of the original 6 without lying and claiming that the Democrats self-negotiated down from 10 to less than 2. i think we'll stick with being angry about nearly every single material benefit for the working class being stripped from the bill by ostensible members of the democratic caucus, thanks
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Nov 1, 2021 08:08
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A big flaming stink posted:i think we'll stick with being angry about nearly every single material benefit for the working class being stripped from the bill by ostensible members of the democratic caucus, thanks Last I checked almost every material benefit was still in it, just on a shorter timer or scaled back. The last article about climate provisions I saw said that 1.75 trillion deal had like 85% of the original climate funding still in it.
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Nov 1, 2021 08:11
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VorpalBunny posted:It's not my idea, but this is the general idea I have seen thrown around in online conversations about where Biden goes from here: Okay but that doesn't square with the idea that Biden's holding off until afterwards to play nice with people. The progressive wing can make that demand all they want and Biden could say sure whatever, but once the vote goes through they have no way to enforce their demand if he decides not to. Any fire-to-feet holding would have to occur before the passage of the bill
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Nov 1, 2021 08:21
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TheIncredulousHulk posted:Okay but that doesn't square with the idea that Biden's holding off until afterwards to play nice with people. The progressive wing can make that demand all they want and Biden could say sure whatever, but once the vote goes through they have no way to enforce their demand if he decides not to. Any fire-to-feet holding would have to occur before the passage of the bill There's this thing coming up called an election in about a year, maybe the threat of some of the most popular and well-known politicians in America going on TV and saying "Joe Biden promised to cancel student debt and he isn't" right before that might be a form of foot fire?
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Nov 1, 2021 08:51
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Sanguinia posted:I'm so tired of reading this. The willful lying that people on this forum do by pretending part of that 6 trillion wasn't the Infrastructure spending in the other bill because "THEY CUT 6 TRILLION DOWN TO 1.5 THE loving FAILURES," sounds more dramatic and scores more ownage points in their head is tiresome as hell. Have the integrity to admit the total spending number is still over 3 trillion so your criticisms can have a shred of honesty to them rather than being blatant spin design to project your rage. Sanguinia posted:When was it ten trillion? The size of the fish story of what this reconciliation was supposed to be just keeps getting bigger and it grinds my gears more and more. Can the thread be outraged about this hyperbole too even though its aimed at democrats rather than republicans? That'd be nice. Like, its entirely possible to be angry at 1.75 trillion + 1.5 trillion adding up to only 3.25 trillion out of the original 6 without lying and claiming that the Democrats self-negotiated down from 10 to less than 2. So, after the last time I brought it up and you said that $6t was never in the works, I did a looksee: The original bill floated by Sanders and other progressives back in June was at $6 trillion over ten years. Legislation was drafted but never came to a vote. This is not to be confused for the $6 Trillion Biden 2022 budget, which is the whole budget and not the Infrastructure bill, which was announced in May. The $10 Trillion figure was floated by AOC saying that $6T was not enough to combat the different crises we face now, but never had any legislation written. So to help you out here: $6 trillion for infrastructure was originally drafted but never came to a vote, not to be confused with the Biden-backed $6T total budget for 2022. $10 trillion was suggested but never drafted. The bill that was then presented is the 'original' $3.5 trillion that went through the Dems before being brought up to Congress. And after Manchin and Sinema, we're sitting at $1.8 trillion. So to respond to you: yes, the idea started as $6T and was compromised down to $3.5T, and is further being gutted by Manchin, Sinema and others to even reduce that to what we have now. So even if the total budget is over $3 trillion of $6 trillion offered by Biden, that is nearly half of what was originally described. And the Infrastructure bill itself has been, from concept to current state, massively undercut. And I agree with you, we should argue that reducing the total budget by nearly half is something we should be focusing on. It's a lovely proposition. But part of that comes from the bill that is most likely going to end up reduced again by a handful of people (because the reduction from $6t to $3.5t came well before the current drama) going against a serious majority of the population in order to line their own pockets.
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Nov 1, 2021 09:00
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Sanguinia posted:There's this thing coming up called an election in about a year, maybe the threat of some of the most popular and well-known politicians in America going on TV and saying "Joe Biden promised to cancel student debt and he isn't" right before that might be a form of foot fire? You really think Bernie Sanders is going to deliberately sabotage the midterm elections? This is seriously a thing that you are suggesting could happen?
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Nov 1, 2021 09:13
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J.A.B.C. posted:So, after the last time I brought it up and you said that $6t was never in the works, I did a looksee: I appreciate that you approached my posts with informational material that helped clarify the whole messy argument, it was really helpful. TheIncredulousHulk posted:You really think Bernie Sanders is going to deliberately sabotage the midterm elections? This is seriously a thing that you are suggesting could happen? Bernie already made his demands for these spending bills, and suddenly demanding something else totally unrelated as another red line for his vote could easily blow them up. Would that do less to sabotage the midterm elections? Making the demand for student loan action with what you're going to say on the campaign trail on the line is much smarter politically than potentially toppling over this already fragile christmas tree. Starting another fight when you're already fighting 3-4 is not good strategy.
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Nov 1, 2021 09:33
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TheIncredulousHulk posted:Long dead? HW's only been in the ground for like 3 years, I wouldn't say that's long I mean, Kissinger’s still alive… Oh my god, was it Kissinger? 
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Nov 1, 2021 10:18
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nine-gear crow posted:I mean, Kissinger’s still alive… Oh my god, was it Kissinger? Someday the world will no longer need us. No need for the gun, or the hand to pull the trigger.
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Nov 1, 2021 10:41
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nine-gear crow posted:I mean, Kissinger’s still alive… Oh my god, was it Kissinger? I heard in an interview recently that he's co-writing a book on artificial intelligence. If he's still alive when we can upload brains into supercomputers, no doubt he'll be the first uploaded, and the last as he'll quickly go rampant and end us all.
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Nov 1, 2021 10:57
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Smeef posted:I heard in an interview recently that he's co-writing a book on artificial intelligence. If he's still alive when we can upload brains into supercomputers, no doubt he'll be the first uploaded, and the last as he'll quickly go rampant and end us all. Somewhere in Wales Alastair Reynolds just woke up in a cold sweat.
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Nov 1, 2021 11:58
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Smeef posted:I heard in an interview recently that he's co-writing a book on artificial intelligence. If he's still alive when we can upload brains into supercomputers, no doubt he'll be the first uploaded, and the last as he'll quickly go rampant and end us all. 
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Nov 1, 2021 14:21
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| # ? Apr 26, 2024 22:37 |
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New thread here: https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3983623
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Nov 1, 2021 14:52
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