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Shageletic posted:Just laughing as I angrily post at anyone who criticizes this TV show Everyone who disagrees with me is big mad. EVERYONE.
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Feb 10, 2022 21:21
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CainFortea posted:Everyone who disagrees with me is big mad. EVERYONE. I'm so MAD about television I PISS BLOOD 
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Feb 10, 2022 21:30
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I really hated the first and last episodes but the middle of the series was good, especially the Logaine episode.
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Feb 10, 2022 21:34
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Rarity posted:How dare people like a TV show, the absolute gall of it No you like whatever you like, that's not my concern. I do care that they did a bad job with the adaptation of a series I liked, so I want to post about it. The gall.
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Feb 10, 2022 22:13
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How are u posted:I liked it in general, but the last two eps were Not Great. The Dragon reveal was Not Great. It was OK, but not what it could have been. Those last two episodes feel like "holy poo poo, covid is loving everything up" production calls. It's the only way I can reconcile a lot of the show being very good (with a few missteps, in my opinion) to the last two just kind of floundering and having very weird creative decisions.
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Feb 10, 2022 22:24
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I mean, that's literally what happened so
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Feb 10, 2022 22:27
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 Last 2 episodes dropped my rating from "Better than books" to "I'll probably watch the season 2" 5th episode was the best one, but post-season I was bit annoyed that they wasted one of the eight episodes on a throwaway NPC character piece.
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Feb 10, 2022 23:20
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Eh there's more fundamental story telling mistakes, like undercooking the main characters, the dialogue largely being stiff and uninteresting, a complete lack of humor, whatever the hell is going on with Perrin Rafe's big Imdb credit before this was Agents of Shield hardly a source of comfort
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Feb 11, 2022 01:20
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Shageletic posted:Just rewatched it. Tam has three lines. It's pretty bare of drama, in a pretty key scene. Here is what Tam says in its entirety from the book quote:“. . . battles are always hot, even in the snow. Sweat heat. Blood heat. Only death is cool. Slope of the mountain . . . only place didn’t stink of death. Had to get away from smell of it . . . sight of it. . . . heard a baby cry. Their women fight alongside the men, sometimes, but why they had let her come, I don’t . . . gave birth there alone, before she died of her wounds. . . . covered the child with her cloak, but the wind . . . blown the cloak away. . . . child, blue with the cold. Should have been dead, too. . . . crying there. Crying in the snow. I couldn’t just leave a child. . . . no children of our own. . . . always knew you wanted children. I knew you’d take it to your heart, Kari. Yes, lass. Rand is a good name. A good name.” All of this is communicated in the episode through the flashback. You don't need Tam reiterating the details because the audience has seen them and Rand only needs to hear the part about a baby in the snow.
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Feb 11, 2022 01:51
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ONE YEAR LATER posted:Here is what Tam says in its entirety from the book Wait a second. Are you telling me that a visual medium is going to communicate things to me differently than a textual medium? Has anyone looked INTO THIS?!
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Feb 11, 2022 01:52
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I just wanna be clear I'm not trying to own anyone but I also think you're not giving the show enough credit. I get it, I am a giant fan of the series, like to the point that I've had daydreams when I was younger about being ultra rich and paying for a massive 1000 episode animated series that gets it correct down to the braid tug and crossed arms beneath the breasts. But even then I realize the reality of the situation both with TV production and dealing with a pandemic, and I have to cut them some slack and give them credit when they do stuff I like. But I'm also a biased source, I can't help but think of the books when I watch the show, so to me the characters have a few million words worth of development and baggage that I am well aware of so it plasters over what the show is missing. I've had my issues with some of the changes they've made, even minor ones, but I still want to see where things end up and maybe those issues won't be so bad in the long run.
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Feb 11, 2022 02:08
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CainFortea posted:Wait a second. Are you telling me that a visual medium is going to communicate things to me differently than a textual medium? Yeah that's it. I was hoping for the scene to have some sort of impact but it was just subsumed in the unnecessary Dragon mystery. I wouldn't be nearly as hard on this show if its missteps were due to the virus and that shitstorm. But after the lackluster pilot, and then the headscratching idea to focus on 1 off characters on an 8 episode series, I remember sharing my doubts but some of the same people here saying there are no possible criticisms regarding the show, said there would be room for character development for the main cast later in the series. That didn't happen. Again, narrative space was taken up by weird and badly thought out tangents like three lover quarrels and the characters rushing through the plot. So far the show is mediocre. I'm hoping they turn this around in the next season, but considering what we've gotten so far, I'm doubtful.
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Feb 12, 2022 20:11
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"that didn't happen" in response to people saying "there's room for characters to grow later in the series" when we haven't gotten later in the series yet is why I make fun of your posts. You can't say that didn't happen because of how linear time works.
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Feb 12, 2022 21:29
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CainFortea posted:"that didn't happen" in response to people saying "there's room for characters to grow later in the series" when we haven't gotten later in the series yet is why I make fun of your posts. go have your meltdown somewhere else
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Feb 12, 2022 21:39
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I've had like a few months to think about it and really I feel it's a rushed start and end with a pretty good middle. The opening needed more time to develop things, including a proper prologue, and the ending needed the covid pandemic to not happen. I'm hopeful based on the Logain episode, Rockstar Thom Merrilin, and the fundamental moral struggle between Rand and whatshisface at the end that they can pull off a decent season two.
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Feb 12, 2022 21:58
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Morrow posted:
Do you mean the guy dressed like he's a part-time host at the Olive Garden?
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Feb 12, 2022 22:05
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Hughmoris posted:Do you mean the guy dressed like he's a part-time host at the Olive Garden? Yeah that dude was awesome
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Feb 12, 2022 22:58
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My favourite thing about the criticisms is people's continued inability to correlate how Karene/Stepin's fate could perhaps be Moiraine/Lan's fate some dayHughmoris posted:Do you mean the guy dressed like he's a part-time host at the Olive Garden? Olive Garden is definitely the work of Shai'tan tbh
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Feb 13, 2022 00:21
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ChubbyChecker posted:go have your meltdown somewhere else I feel like the issue here is your unreasonable understanding of what a meltdown is. There's something about this show that just makes people lose their sense of proportion and reality when it comes to criticisms. Like, there's stuff you can easily complain about it without having to claim to be a time traveler.
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Feb 13, 2022 01:42
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So seeing after that finale I went and read the whole first book and yeah WOW hahaha they did not stick that landing. Like holy poo poo the difference. We missed out on Rand going full Avatar State on a whole rear end army and a fuckin sword of light! What! I'm not actually sure what they were thinking because the production value wouldn't have had to change that much; they had already shoved in a big CGI battle for some reason, but then decided to go with some funky camera rotations for the showdown instead. I don't actually know how book fans aren't going more feral. They might as well have not adapted this showdown at all if that's how they were gonna do it. 
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Feb 13, 2022 02:25
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Rarity posted:
Rand trapped in a dream world in which there are unlimited garlic breadsticks
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Feb 13, 2022 04:03
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BrianWilly posted:So seeing after that finale I went and read the whole first book and yeah WOW hahaha they did not stick that landing. Like holy poo poo the difference. We missed out on Rand going full Avatar State on a whole rear end army and a fuckin sword of light! What! I'm not actually sure what they were thinking because the production value wouldn't have had to change that much; they had already shoved in a big CGI battle for some reason, but then decided to go with some funky camera rotations for the showdown instead. I don't actually know how book fans aren't going more feral. They might as well have not adapted this showdown at all if that's how they were gonna do it. Are we gonna do this every page? The last two episodes might well have been cowritten by "Barney Harris Leaving" and "Covid Restrictions". They were low on time and money and had to write out a main character at the last minute while also having a giant battle without real people (covid) or cgi people/monsters (money). Plus the end of tEotW is a jarring departure from the rest of the series.
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Feb 13, 2022 04:57
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I feel like TV show watchers reading the book and responding to the differences is a pretty valid reaction regardless of when they get around to reading. The show simply misfired as they tried to work around the newfound limitations.
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Feb 13, 2022 05:04
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Ego Trip posted:They were low on time and money and had to write out a main character at the last minute while also having a giant battle without real people (covid) or cgi people/monsters (money). Like, we still did get a bunch of stuff in the show finale. Whatever restrictions they faced, they still did end up putting in a big CGI battle and a confrontation between Rand and the Dark One...it's just that both scenes were much shittier than what they could have been! Instead of Rand decimating an army with fire and earth as befitting his status as the loving Dragon Reborn, we had random characters throwing lightning and then a weird fakeout death. Instead of Rand slicing the Dark One's tether to the world with a light katana drawn from a source of pure saidin, we instead spun the camera in a tight circle with the same ol' white/black channeling CGI that we've seen a dozen times already. I'm not a TV producer and I fully understand that making a series is hard and no one would try to make a bad finale and that there are a bajillion seemingly small technical reasons why certain things end up being done in certain ways that are outside of anyone's control, but it seems like they did have the means to do some sort of justice to the book finale and then just...did something else entirely anyway. It's like someone was adapting LotR but instead of Gandalf fighting a Balrog, it's Gimli fighting a dragon in the same scene instead. Like...it didn't seem like you made anything easier for yourself, but the end result is somehow worse anyway. And if you're not going to depict the capstone events of this series then I'm sorry, but maybe you shouldn't be depicting the series? I just don't understand the development process here.
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Feb 13, 2022 05:31
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BrianWilly posted:And if you're not going to depict the capstone events of this series then I'm sorry, but maybe you shouldn't be depicting the series? I just don't understand the development process here. Couple things. First off yeah the finale of this season wasn't ideal. A lot of that I chalk up to COVID and Harris but where my green buddy at, Rafe? Where's my green man? Past that though one thing i'll point out, and this isn't any kind of spoiler at all, but all of Eye of the World, this entire first season, is basically a trailer in length relative to the rest of the book series. Like, literally -- we've seen one fifteenth of the whole series on screen, and one fifteenth of a 90 minute movie would be a six minute trailer. If you like the ending of Eye of the World keep reading because that poo poo is just warming up.
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Feb 13, 2022 05:41
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Yeah keep reading because The Great Hunt is in my personal top three books of the series (the other two are Shadow Rising and Memory of Light)
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Feb 13, 2022 05:59
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The ending of The Eye of the World was a lot of fun in the book. I def recommend show watchers check it out, it's pretty wild and largely unrecognizable from the show.
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Feb 13, 2022 06:45
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Even without COVID or Barney leaving I still don't think we'd have got Rand smashing the army at Tarwin's Gap. They very clearly wanted to give the others stuff to do during the finale so either way I reckon the girls would have been the ones to deal with that.
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Feb 13, 2022 07:21
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Shageletic posted:The ending of The Eye of the World was a lot of fun in the book. I def recommend show watchers check it out, it's pretty wild and largely unrecognizable from the show. Indeed. Show ending vs Book ending is no contest the book. Well worth checking out.
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Feb 13, 2022 07:32
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BrianWilly posted:The problem with that claim is that I'm not sure why the finale from the book that I just now read couldn't have been done with the exact same resources that they used for the poor finale that we got. I agree wholeheartedly with this. Less so the idea of “don’t do it at all”, but definitely the argument that the show didn’t seem to make life easier on itself, with a finished product that doesn’t show off some of the coolest parts of the book.
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Feb 13, 2022 08:34
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Rarity posted:How dare people like a TV show, the absolute gall of it There's a difference between liking the show and rabidly attacking even the slightest criticism, often without ever saying why the criticism is wrong. Just "lol no that was perfect, actually" to everything. I like the show quite a lot and rate it very highly. I've pushed back against unfounded criticism several times. I understand TV is a different medium and never expected a 1:1 adaptation. I still think it's hilarious how even something as innocuous as "I think the lighting could have been better in this scene" activates Caine's trap card. It's like the Bors comic with the dude in the well.
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Feb 13, 2022 09:28
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Grundulum posted:I agree wholeheartedly with this. Less so the idea of “don’t do it at all”, but definitely the argument that the show didn’t seem to make life easier on itself, with a finished product that doesn’t show off some of the coolest parts of the book. One of the things that got lost in the COVID shuffle for the last two episodes was, every other episode's script got run by Brandon (and I think Maria / Harriett) for notes and comments. They didn't have time to do that for the last two episodes, so welp. Generally those notes seem to have been 'why not stay closer to the book".
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Feb 13, 2022 15:23
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"Just wait for season two to four for the wasted emo warder episode to pay off." My dude idk if I'll watch s2 or s3 or s4. I certainly won't get prime if my plug dries up for how disappointing s1 was. That could have been conveyed easily enough as an aside and we could have had loial and exposition and development of the EF5. Can't do that though because rand would have been known as TDR 2 episodes earlier!
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Feb 13, 2022 15:42
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So many of you have never seen Babylon 5 and that makes me sad. 
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Feb 13, 2022 16:24
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Hieronymous Alloy posted:If you like the ending of Eye of the World keep reading because that poo poo is just warming up. That's like your opinion, man. Top 3 Wheel of Time Books: First three books. Jordan should have finished there. I read the all 10 so far released books back in the day and never picked up the series again. I reread last fall the first 5 books before quitting and still think that the first 3 are the best.
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Feb 13, 2022 17:53
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I'm the odd duck out here. I'm (slowly) going through book 2 and I'm losing interest. It's probably the last book of the franchise I'm going to read. I understand why people say it meanders because this book is that personified. I guess I'd maybe be more enthused if I read it while the books were still coming out but with the knowledge that there are a dozen more books after this really killed my interest. A shame because I enjoyed the first book well enough, as derivative as some ideas were. I get why people like these and I do envy them but I just don't have the time or inclination to read anymore after this.
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Feb 13, 2022 18:06
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adhuin posted:That's like your opinion, man. you should really get around to reading the last three books, Sanderson's writing has a much brisker pace
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Feb 13, 2022 18:20
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adhuin posted:That's like your opinion, man. This is an absolutely wild take, even for this thread, drat
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Feb 13, 2022 18:22
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Could not get beyond a single episode of this. Never read the books, it just really didn't make any sense whatsoever. Less even than Mazzalazarazamatazazon.
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Feb 13, 2022 18:33
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Jimbot posted:A shame because I enjoyed the first book well enough, as derivative as some ideas were. I get why people like these and I do envy them but I just don't have the time or inclination to read anymore after this. That's fair, it's not a series for everyone. The series does get more novel as it progresses, or at least it did in the 90's. The first book was fairly intentionally derivative -- it's setting up the various trope pins so that he can knock them down and rearrange them in new ways in the later books. Of course, one problem with that is that was was new and original in 1992 and then imitated a million times by everything from Dragon Age to Game of Thrones, isn't necessarily still all that new to new readers hitting it for the first time. The second, bigger problem is that fifteen 800 page books is a big ask for any reader and not everyone has that kinda time. What I'd suggest is yeah do keep reading the second book. Most of Jordan's individual books have a recurring pattern of "some cool stuff happens at the beginning to set the stage , then you meander for a few hundred pages to get the pieces in place, then KABLAM of an ending," and the series overall has the same general pattern too. But not everyone wants to meander around for hundreds of pages and that's fine. It's not really a series for everyone, it's a series for people who want what it brings to the table and are fine waiting around for a while to let it happen. The pit-cooked whole pig of fantasy -- thick and fattening and tasty but it's gonna take a long time to cook and you'll probably feel a bit bloated afterwards.
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Feb 13, 2022 18:53
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