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hypnophant posted:I’m in no way claiming otherwise, I just don’t think it’s wise to ignore tankies entirely just because they’re toothless now. A lot of people on the right ten years ago thought white supremacists were toothless and ignored them until they demonstrated they weren’t. Like Mitt Romney, maybe. I dunno. are you both sidesing fuckin' tankies and the early online days of stormfront and the white power movement? I don't know what the gently caress you're getting at man. nazis are a far more violent and dangerous group and I don't think your argument that would be at home in the Reagan era is really making a ton of like, just what the gently caress?
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Nov 1, 2022 00:09
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Comrade Blyatlov posted:Yeeeeeeuuuuuuup also probably half feds.
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Nov 1, 2022 00:11
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kupachek posted:It's not hindsight when you're aware of them and the dangers they pose in the moment. I was aware of them and the danger they posed in the 90's through until now. I remember in August of 2002 a guy (of British and Polish descent) I used to have beers with down at the river attended one of those backyard bbq's and spent a while telling me about the skinheads he met and how they just accepted him and how friendly they were. Same way most gangs recruit, they offer acceptance, validation and purpose. Guy was from a good family, solid middle class, his father was a history professor, and he was the middle son of three. For whatever reason he was seeking something for a while and gravitated towards the white nationalists. He put in some time in uniform, and then hosed off to europe by working his passage on a ship and basically spent a year or so backpacking before coming back and settling into a quiet life. Alright. Do you see how your personal experiences have given you a view most people don’t have? Do you see how they led you to view the white supremacist movement as threatening even at a point when others, who didn’t share your experience, thought they were marginalized and toothless? Do you wish now that those same people - people on the right especially, who were most able to take effective action by removing white supremacists from their movements but least predisposed to do so - had taken the threat more seriously? I wish that very much, and I don’t expect the American left to stay toothless forever, so it’s important to me that the crazies do stay marginalized. You can call this a purity test or infighting if you like but IMO the movement needs to be able to police its worst voices or, well, you get the GOP circa the last five years maffew buildings posted:are you both sidesing fuckin' tankies and the early online days of stormfront and the white power movement? I don't know what the gently caress you're getting at man. nazis are a far more violent and dangerous group and I don't think your argument that would be at home in the Reagan era is really making a ton of like, just what the gently caress? I’m getting at if the mainstream Republican party hadn’t spent a decade saying there was no problem with white supremacists, they might have dealt with the problem before it took over hypnophant fucked around with this message at 00:16 on Nov 1, 2022 |
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Nov 1, 2022 00:13
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Here, to break the chain, here's some sovshit from the guy that went to J6, reenlisted, got arrested and sentenced to 3.5 years, and is now filing sovshit on looseleaf paper from prison. https://twitter.com/ryanjreilly/status/1587168600019927040 https://twitter.com/ryanjreilly/status/1587174967321321472 He's also requesting the US Attorney answer seven True or False questions because that will do it.
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Nov 1, 2022 00:14
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hypnophant posted:Alright. Do you see how your personal experiences have given you a view most people don’t have? Do you see how they led you to view the white supremacist movement as threatening even at a point when others, who didn’t share your experience, thought they were marginalized and toothless? I hate to break it to you but this current incarnation of white supremacists getting mainstreamed is what the conservative movement wanted
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Nov 1, 2022 00:14
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kupachek posted:
I’m married to a West Indian woman, and it took a while for me as a white guy who grew up in middle class suburbia to see the states and how differently she was treated. I kept saying she was imagining whatever slight or subtle comment she observed. But now? I see it every time and it drives me nuts when people don’t think we’re together.
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Nov 1, 2022 00:17
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maffew buildings posted:I hate to break it to you but this current incarnation of white supremacists getting mainstreamed is what the conservative movement wanted “The movement” wasn’t and isn’t a monolith and I don’t believe there wasn’t a different path that could have been taken. I was still in in 2016 and I had a lot of conservative friends who loving hated trump, and some of them (you know, the ones I keep in touch with) still do. I think if the republican leadership had recognized the threat and acted early, they could have prevented trump from winning the primary. It probably would have lost them the general, but that is a bargain they could have and should have made, and maybe a few of them would have preferred that timeline to this one. But they didn’t do that because they didn’t think white supremacists were a serious threat.
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Nov 1, 2022 00:24
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Trump was legitimately the best candidate in the 2016 GOP field. Everyone else was just that bad.
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Nov 1, 2022 00:31
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Happy Halloween, Assholes. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YqZNPPpFSkM
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Nov 1, 2022 00:32
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Platystemon posted:Trump was legitimately the best candidate in the 2016 GOP field. Hilary wasn’t the best candidate in 2016 but she was the candidate the party leadership supported.
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Nov 1, 2022 00:36
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I have to give Hillary credit for being the top conservative candidate of 2016.
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Nov 1, 2022 00:39
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hypnophant posted:
A decade? poo poo they've spent considerable time since 1961 courting white supremacists and racists and Neo-nazis and Klansmen. The Republican party has been tied to them for over 60 years. Barry Goldwater pioneered the Republican push towards embracing racism.
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Nov 1, 2022 00:39
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Platystemon posted:Trump was legitimately the best candidate in the 2016 GOP field. Jeb!
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Nov 1, 2022 00:45
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Yeah O.K. I’ll admit that I am not particularly familiar with ¡Jeb!’s policies. He was such a low energy candidate that his policies were never a topic of discussion. Like I know that Kasich was huge piece of poo poo as governor who was only held up as the “reasonable alternative” because he was juxtaposed with DJT and the Zodiac. I don’t know what ¡Jeb! was up to in Florida, and it’s possible that he would have been no worse than his brother. As low a bar as that is, it’s totally out of reach of the other three I just mentioned.
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Nov 1, 2022 00:51
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and lo, what jeb hath warned, hath come to pass
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Nov 1, 2022 00:55
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orange juche posted:A decade? poo poo they've spent considerable time since 1961 courting white supremacists and racists and Neo-nazis and Klansmen. The Republican party has been tied to them for over 60 years. “Courting” doesn’t necessarily mean “supports the goals and ideology of”, unless you think Biden authentically supports student loan forgiveness. I don’t mean republican leaders thought white supremacists didn’t exist, I mean they thought they could rile them up for votes and keep them mostly out of power. They couldn’t and it was a stupid, despicable risk to make. Ok I’m starting to see the objection you guys are making, which is that the dirtbag left is a smaller block than the kkk faction and not worth engaging, so the devil’s bargain isn’t appealing for leaders on the left. Thanks everyone sorry for taking so long to figure out what should have been obvious
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Nov 1, 2022 00:58
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Please clap.
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Nov 1, 2022 00:58
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The sad thing with Goldwater is if he'd kept control of the Republican party ideology they wouldn't be nearly as dangerous today because he hated the Religious Right. They'd be just as racist but far more generally reviled because they probably wouldn't have abortion or  LGBTQ people as wedge issues.
Vincent Van Goatse fucked around with this message at 01:03 on Nov 1, 2022 |
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Nov 1, 2022 01:01
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Lake of Methane posted:Happy Halloween, Assholes. Keep an eye out for freaky ghost beds! And Happy Halloween! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0tdyU_gW6WE
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Nov 1, 2022 01:07
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hypnophant posted:Alright. Do you see how your personal experiences have given you a view most people don’t have? Do you see how they led you to view the white supremacist movement as threatening even at a point when others, who didn’t share your experience, thought they were marginalized and toothless? You were privileged by not being a position to need to know, not finding out the reality of things, much the same way that I'm privileged enough to be insulated from the worst of it by being passable. hypnophant posted:But they didn’t do that because they didn’t think white supremacists were a serious threat. Nystral posted:I’m married to a West Indian woman, and it took a while for me as a white guy who grew up in middle class suburbia to see the states and how differently she was treated. I kept saying she was imagining whatever slight or subtle comment she observed. But now? I see it every time and it drives me nuts when people don’t think we’re together. I don't fault people for being unaware, because in a lot of the country there is "polite racism", where someone will be sociable, and have a friend of business partner of a differing ethnicity, but they'd never allow "one of them" to marry their daughter (or sister), and an absolute fuckload of backroom talk where when they feel like they are in familiar company they can let loose with how they feel. The latter type make up a decent chunk of the ones who tossed the social mask away during trumps tenure. Those were the average people who otherwise seemed like kind folks. Once someone becomes aware of the presence of the attitudes, how they handle it is whats important. Some people are content to jam their heads into the sand and pretend racism has been solved. hypnophant posted:Ok I’m starting to see the objection you guys are making, which is that the dirtbag left is a smaller block than the kkk faction and not worth engaging, so the devil’s bargain isn’t appealing for leaders on the left. Thanks everyone sorry for taking so long to figure out what should have been obvious There are two snarling rabid dobermans, a rightwing one is six feet away and closing, the other is leftwing and about two hundred yards off and hasn't noticed you yet. I advise you to focus on dealing with the one that is the active threat and about to try ripping your throat out, you can worry about the second leftwing dobberman if you survive the immediate danger posed by the rightwing one. Prioritize the threats. Lunatic tankies are a remote enough threat that we don't need to fixate or think hard about them right now when being distracted and taking our eyes off the lunatic rightwing could be fatal. Do I need to bold that to drive the point home?
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Nov 1, 2022 01:13
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hypnophant posted:https://amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2019/mar/18/tulsi-gabbard-2020-progressive-steve-bannon-right Oh word we can call Joe Biden a socialist and progressive leftist radical as well I guess.
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Nov 1, 2022 01:20
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kupachek posted:There are two snarling rabid dobermans, a rightwing one is six feet away and closing, the other is leftwing and about two hundred yards off and hasn't noticed you yet. I advise you to focus on dealing with the one that is the active threat and about to try ripping your throat out, you can worry about the second leftwing dobberman if you survive the immediate danger posed by the rightwing one. Prioritize the threats. You can prioritize the threats without getting in bed with the second rabid doberman, is what I’m saying.
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Nov 1, 2022 01:21
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That Works posted:Oh word we can call Joe Biden a socialist and progressive leftist radical as well I guess. The guardian is a mainstream center-left paper bud. The hill is pretty mainstream as well I think. Your definitions aren’t everyone’s definitions
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Nov 1, 2022 01:23
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Platystemon posted:Yeah O.K. I’ll admit that I am not particularly familiar with ¡Jeb!’s policies. He was such a low energy candidate that his policies were never a topic of discussion. Standard last-generation Republican horseshit. Medicaid privatization, tort reform, charter schools, destroying diversity initiatives, anti-mass transit, gun laws (SYG passed under him), largely ships passing in the night with the Evangelicals until the Terri Schiavo case when he decided to polish his churchy resume by getting the state of FL involved.
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Nov 1, 2022 01:25
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hypnophant posted:The guardian is a mainstream center-left paper bud. The hill is pretty mainstream as well I think. Your definitions aren’t everyone’s definitions The Hill is centrist bullshit, and The Guardian is barely left leaning.
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Nov 1, 2022 01:31
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kupachek posted:There are two snarling rabid dobermans, a rightwing one is six feet away and closing, the other is leftwing and about two hundred yards off and hasn't noticed you yet. I advise you to focus on dealing with the one that is the active threat and about to try ripping your throat out, you can worry about the second leftwing dobberman if you survive the immediate danger posed by the rightwing one. Prioritize the threats. The left wing doberman is also currently snarling at a cop that is about to blow it away and then go the pound and pretend to be another doberman to kill all the other left wing dobermans.
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Nov 1, 2022 01:36
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orange juche posted:The Hill is centrist bullshit, and The Guardian is barely left leaning. Do you think you’re disagreeing with what I said, or did you just want to call the hill bullshit
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Nov 1, 2022 01:37
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bird food bathtub posted:The left wing doberman is also currently snarling at a cop that is about to blow it away and then go the pound and pretend to be another doberman to kill all the other left wing dobermans. hypnophant posted:You can prioritize the threats without getting in bed with the second rabid doberman, is what I’m saying. You drift around worse than a rural alcoholic coming home from the bar on a sunday night, each successive post you're getting worse about what the gently caress you're even talking about. Therefor; https://i.imgur.com/ordrXzy.mp4
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Nov 1, 2022 02:08
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It's November in some parts of the Empire so...
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Nov 1, 2022 02:14
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Platystemon posted:Yeah O.K. I’ll admit that I am not particularly familiar with ¡Jeb!’s policies. He was such a low energy candidate that his policies were never a topic of discussion. Jeb literally helped with the successful coup that occured in 2000 so.....
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Nov 1, 2022 02:17
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Yeah but the Brooks Bros. riot was a bunch of guys in suits, which is so much more decorous than what happened on January Sixth.
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Nov 1, 2022 02:24
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I get that right wingers are an actual real threat IRL compared to shithead online “leftists” but I also don’t share a forum and online communities with right wingers so pardon me for focusing on the people getting deep into the same kind of poo poo and chasing good posters off on my home turf
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Nov 1, 2022 02:28
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where's your home turf with good posters
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Nov 1, 2022 02:31
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tankies literally support an aggressor regime committing genocide in a land war in europe. hating on them should not be controversial
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Nov 1, 2022 02:32
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pmchem posted:tankies literally support an aggressor regime committing genocide in a land war in europe. hating on them should not be controversial Hating them shouldn't be controversial but it's largely wasted energy. You could spend as much worry about them as you would the LaRouche Movement. They're both pitiable extremists with little influence
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Nov 1, 2022 02:38
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Two events to report, one grimly comical to ease whatever this strange argument is, and one… terrible. Comical, on the way home today I saw a great bearded brute of a man, a Hagrid, an Enkidu, enthusiastically doing a paid sign dance for Herschel Walker. This is the republican machine — dudes paid to debase themselves, and it working because ignorant of the man or his positions, people driving see the name, and come voting time, vote the name. Second event I will let stand on the merits: https://www.help.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/report_an_analysis_of_the_origins_of_covid-19_102722.pdf
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Nov 1, 2022 02:39
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hypnophant posted:“The movement” wasn’t and isn’t a monolith and I don’t believe there wasn’t a different path that could have been taken. I was still in in 2016 and I had a lot of conservative friends who loving hated trump, and some of them (you know, the ones I keep in touch with) still do. I think if the republican leadership had recognized the threat and acted early, they could have prevented trump from winning the primary. It probably would have lost them the general, but that is a bargain they could have and should have made, and maybe a few of them would have preferred that timeline to this one. But they didn’t do that because they didn’t think white supremacists were a serious threat. there was no other place for the party of Reagan to end up, the only question was how long until someone realized they could go full mask off and unleash the crazies
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Nov 1, 2022 02:44
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Wrennic_26 posted:Second event I will let stand on the merits: https://www.help.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/report_an_analysis_of_the_origins_of_covid-19_102722.pdf these loving people jesus loving christ
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Nov 1, 2022 02:49
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Wrennic_26 posted:Two events to report, one grimly comical to ease whatever this strange argument is, and one… terrible. Scanned the intro and saw it was sign by Burr before letting out an audible groan.
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Nov 1, 2022 02:50
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Nobody ITT is making the argument y'all are bandying the strawman of. Calling attention to tankie bile doesn't mean anyone's asserting combatting them should take precedence over opposing the far right. Hell, part of the concern is that the tankies are doing precisely what they've so long bemoaned an alleged liberal propensity for: allying themselves with the far right to undermine Western liberal democracies. One doesn't need to look very far to find scum who've dropped their masks in the past few months openly rooting for the deaths of innocents. Whether it's to Ukrainian civilians torn apart by Russian bombs and bullets or to European grandmothers freezing to death in their homes because Putin wielded natural gas as a weapon to advance his imperial ambitions, they are jerking themselves raw. There's a drat good reason it's three arrows, not two. The whole lot of authoritarian shits are different heads of the same detestable hydra. Defending democracy and progress in America and around the world demands being ready to fend off each while not fully losing track of the threat from one head while the other's actively drawing your attention, lest it take the opportunity to bite us in the rear end at the worst possible moment. Ridiculing and deplatforming tankies now while they're a pathetic niche might help prevent their propagation. 
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Nov 1, 2022 02:58
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