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Totally digging the seats in that Cabrio Italia edition. I don't really get the criticism of the steering and clutch/stick. Sure, they're very light, but small cars benefit greatly from the ease of doing everything with a light touch. The Panda is probably the easiest car to drive I've ever been in and the 500 is identical for all intents and purposes. And the motoring press has heaped tons of praise on both cars. Even Jeremy Clarkson remarked in his review that he preferred driving the Panda to his Mercedes SL and Volvo XC90 and all the other test cars he was reviewing. He likes the 500 (and the Abarth in particular) even more. And he's not the only one. Jay Leno's excused since they gave him one for free, so of course he'll be positive. But every other review I've read of the Panda/500 has praised the way it drives and how much character it has. I have a blast every time I drive mine, even with the decidedly non-sporty diesel. Sure, it's bouncy and you feel every little nook and cranny in the road despite the relatively soft suspension. But the way it tackles B-roads is just plain good fun. Not fast, but fun.
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Sep 2, 2011 09:04
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KozmoNaut posted:I don't really get the criticism of the steering and clutch/stick. Sure, they're very light, but small cars benefit greatly from the ease of doing everything with a light touch. Light and flimsy are two different things. The stick and clutch on any Civic are light, but the feel when you use them is more precise and less toy-like than in the 500. The parts should not be so cheap that it feels like an errant sneeze would cause something to snap.
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Sep 2, 2011 19:07
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kimbo305 posted:Light and flimsy are two different things. The stick and clutch on any Civic are light, but the feel when you use them is more precise and less toy-like than in the 500. The parts should not be so cheap that it feels like an errant sneeze would cause something to snap. See, I don't get this. The controls in my Panda don't feel toy-like at all, the 3rd-4th shift in particular is just right, heavy enough to feel solid and feel the synchros working, but slick enough that it can be done with a flick of the wrist. It isn't as luxurious as a BMW or even a VW, but compared to my parents' Citroen and Peugeots, it feels drat good.
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Sep 2, 2011 19:18
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kimbo305 posted:Why add a carbon fiber knob to a shifter that feels like it only weighs 3 ounces? Yeah, I don't get this. I swapped out my old wooden shift knob with a heavy stainless one and it improved my shift feel 100%. The shifter seems to be one point where a little heft is a good thing.
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Sep 2, 2011 19:22
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kimbo305 posted:Light and flimsy are two different things. The stick and clutch on any Civic are light, but the feel when you use them is more precise and less toy-like than in the 500. The parts should not be so cheap that it feels like an errant sneeze would cause something to snap. I didn't feel like it was going to break when I drove it and that was coming from one of Ze Germans Build Quality Uber Alles brands. The shifter was definitely a low point, but I didn't think it was going to break.
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Sep 2, 2011 19:35
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Saw one in the wild today, seemed to absolutely tower over my '97 Mirage: How is the 500 for a Tall Person? I have trouble with DL and AA coach seats, but no problem with WN seats.
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Sep 2, 2011 21:22
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KozmoNaut posted:Totally digging the seats in that Cabrio Italia edition. My Charade has really light steering (strong power steering) and it really makes a good difference in tight radius stuff. Either de-powered or the actual manual steering feels ever so slightly more ponderous in tight spaces, though it has like a 12 foot turning radius.
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Sep 2, 2011 23:39
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:I didn't feel like it was going to break when I drove it and that was coming from one of Ze Germans Build Quality Uber Alles brands. The shifter was definitely a low point, but I didn't think it was going to break. I remember wanting to be ginger with the shifter and the little armrest because both gave off these creaks and rubs that suggested they would break if pushed. I'm sure both are more durable than that, but the perception is definitely at odds with the style and luxury the car presents from a distance.
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Sep 2, 2011 23:55
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BonzoESC posted:Saw one in the wild today, seemed to absolutely tower over my '97 Mirage: John Salley on The Car Show (like 7ft tall ex NBA player) fit in one fine, he liked it better then the Mini.
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Sep 3, 2011 00:27
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DJ Commie posted:My Charade has really light steering (strong power steering) and it really makes a good difference in tight radius stuff. Either de-powered or the actual manual steering feels ever so slightly more ponderous in tight spaces, though it has like a 12 foot turning radius. Absolutely, it certainly makes a difference. I know the super light "city steering" that you can switch on and off in most Fiats has been decried as the "girlie button" and drawn into question why you would even want it since the steering is so light already. Now, I drove a car with manual steering before, and it's not like I wouldn't be perfectly fine without it. But it's just so nice to have when parallel parking or navigating tight parking lots or all the other small spaces which Copenhagen seems to be full of. It makes palming the wheel completely effortless and with 3 turns lock to lock, you can pull some really nifty stuff like a proper Italian. When I have to drive a couple of hours on the freeway, I sometimes think to myself "why the hell didn't I buy a larger more comfortable car?". Then I get to a really tight parking garage and think "oh right, that's why!". KozmoNaut fucked around with this message at 08:53 on Sep 3, 2011 |
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Sep 3, 2011 08:51
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I saw a rather candid review of the Fiat 500 today in an unlikely place - No Reservations with Anthony Bordain (Naples episode). It was a bit out of place, as I can't recall him ever mentioning a car on his show before, but it clearly struck him as noteworthy enough to include in his show that's normally about travel, food and culture. Tony describes the Fiat simply as "This piece of **** my producers rented for me."
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Sep 5, 2011 20:52
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Sounds like Bourdain 
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Sep 5, 2011 21:11
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http://youtu.be/qIGORDUHgwM?t=11m27s Pretty sure that's a Smart Car. Edit for content: I finally had the chance to sit in a 500, and can confirm that even at 6'1" I can fit in the back seat. Also, I have yet to talk to anyone at the dealership who actually has a clue about the car. Or any car. Corn Syrup fucked around with this message at 22:51 on Sep 8, 2011 |
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Sep 8, 2011 22:44
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Boozahol posted:http://youtu.be/qIGORDUHgwM?t=11m27s Definitely a Smart.
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Sep 9, 2011 07:06
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grover posted:
No ifs, ands, or buts. Italian drivers are Nucking Futs. My first memory of an Italian highway was seeing a middle-aged woman driving a Mercedes inbetween the lane lines like that's the way everyone should do it. I'd have a nervous breakdown if I ever had to drive myself around in Rome.
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Sep 9, 2011 08:29
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Mr.AARP posted:No ifs, ands, or buts. Italian drivers are Nucking Futs. My first memory of an Italian highway was seeing a middle-aged woman driving a Mercedes inbetween the lane lines like that's the way everyone should do it. Driving in Rome is an exhilerating experience. And it's funny to American sensibilities but the 500 is a pretty big car there.
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Sep 9, 2011 15:52
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Mr. Wiggles posted:Driving in Rome is an exhilerating experience. And it's funny to American sensibilities but the 500 is a pretty big car there. Most Italians (and in fact most mediterraneans) seem to cut their driving teeth on mopeds, usually with a hot woman perched on the back, and without fail they drive like they don't want to see the next morning. A 500 is a major step up in safety compared to that. Back in the 90's I drove a 40hp Fiat Cinquecento round large parts of Italy and Greece and I'm continually surprised that noone hit me and vice versa.
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Sep 9, 2011 16:08
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There is nothing faster than a teenage Italian male with a date waiting, and Italian cars should always be driven with this mindset.
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Sep 9, 2011 18:39
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Driving in Japan is pretty nuts too, I learned a lot in my early 20's driving around Japan for three years. Lots of two lane roads that should have been one ways. Tight squeezes that would freak out most people don't bother me much 
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Sep 9, 2011 19:21
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Mr. Wiggles posted:Driving in Rome is an exhilerating experience. And it's funny to American sensibilities but the 500 is a pretty big car there. Try driving a Renault Megane with the big(er) diesel diesel there - its like you're kind of the road
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Sep 9, 2011 23:53
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leica posted:Driving in Japan is pretty nuts too, I learned a lot in my early 20's driving around Japan for three years. Lots of two lane roads that should have been one ways. Tight squeezes that would freak out most people don't bother me much
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Sep 10, 2011 10:47
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Purchased a Olive Green Sport with the Brown interior in mid September. Manual, of course. Put about 1k on it so far and its absolutely brilliant. This car embodies the very essence of having fun driving a slow car fast. Leans over a bit around fast corners, but once its leaned over a certain amount its stable as all get out. Due to the short wheelbase, I can even coax a little oversteer out of it. I test drove a manual sport back when the dealers first set up on our shores (April, I think) and liked it, but didn't love it. I test drove over 40 cars in pursuit of the "perfect fit" and hadn't found one. My fiance wanted to check out a mini and the fiat with me and we drove a Mini Cooper S and the Fiat back to back. The mini was absolutely faster, and handled better, but it wasn't nearly as much fun. I don't know if they improved build quality between the first run and now (mine was built in late August) but I fell in love and purchased it a week later. I'd encourage any naysayers to go to a studio and test drive the car by yourself. Flog the crap out of it on the back roads and if you can deal with owning a subcompact car, you'd be happy with it.
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Oct 2, 2011 05:04
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Looks like they've been testing out the Abarth in Michigan and someone grabbed some photos and specs: http://www.fiat500abarth.us/blog/fiat-chrysler-news/fiat-abarth-spy-shots-specs/ 160hp or a 200hp upgrade option! Not bad.
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Oct 27, 2011 19:17
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200hp from a production turbo 1.4 is pretty drat solid if you ask me.
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Oct 27, 2011 20:32
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Chiming in on the Mazda2 lovefest in this thread. I test drove both the 500 and the Mazda2 three times before deciding. I'll ape the numb feel of the 500 being a turn-off, but that wasn't what tipped the scales. It was what happened past the limits. The 500 had higher limits (due to the rubber and curb weight), but drat if the 2 wasn't a blast to drive past them. Minimal understeer, tons of turn-in left once the tires sing. The car loves to rotate, and will lift-oversteer in the right conditions. The 500 just understeered. The 500 was more like a Golf, while the Mazda2 was more like a Neon with a shorter wheelbase. (In terms of handling alone) As to the Fiesta comparison, there is none. Whatever DNA the platform brought over was decimated by its upbringing at Ford. I had the Fiesta understeer on me in corners at speeds that I've never experienced in another car before. Reminded me of a minivan. I had to apologise to the salesman who accompanied me. I really had no clue that a new car could handle that poorly. Maybe it was lovely rubber, but what the car did when the grip ran out was abysmal.
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Oct 27, 2011 21:20
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sliderule posted:As to the Fiesta comparison, there is none. Whatever DNA the platform brought over was decimated by its upbringing at Ford. I had the Fiesta understeer on me in corners at speeds that I've never experienced in another car before. Reminded me of a minivan. I had to apologise to the salesman who accompanied me. I really had no clue that a new car could handle that poorly. Maybe it was lovely rubber, but what the car did when the grip ran out was abysmal. We're you in an SFE model maybe? We have an manual SE hatch, and while it does understeer at the limit, its no where near minivan bad. Its actually quite good at attacking roundabouts and tossing around.
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Oct 28, 2011 01:23
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sliderule posted:As to the Fiesta comparison, there is none. Whatever DNA the platform brought over was decimated by its upbringing at Ford. I had the Fiesta understeer on me in corners at speeds that I've never experienced in another car before. Reminded me of a minivan. I had to apologise to the salesman who accompanied me. I really had no clue that a new car could handle that poorly. Maybe it was lovely rubber, but what the car did when the grip ran out was abysmal. My money is on massively overinflated tyres. That said apparently the US market Fiesta is noticeably worse than the rest of world one (which is every bit as good as a 2)
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Oct 28, 2011 01:30
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no new updates about the abarth 500? Apparently its getting unveiled at 1:35pm pacific time today. The specs that have been released look pretty good. Cant wait till I can take one for a test drive.
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Nov 16, 2011 20:28
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KozmoNaut posted:200hp from a production turbo 1.4 is pretty drat solid if you ask me. That's what the 2.0T in the GTI does, right?
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Nov 16, 2011 20:59
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BonzoESC posted:That's what the 2.0T in the GTI does, right? 210hp, 270hp in the R version.
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Nov 16, 2011 23:13
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The GTI is getting really close to 3000lbs, almost another half of a 500 tacked on.
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Nov 16, 2011 23:50
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DJ Commie posted:The GTI is getting really close to 3000lbs, almost another half of a 500 tacked on. It's over 3,000 IIRC.
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Nov 16, 2011 23:58
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D C posted:It's over 3,000 IIRC. Mk 6 is 3034 lbs
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Nov 17, 2011 00:49
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Negromancer posted:no new updates about the abarth 500? Apparently its getting unveiled at 1:35pm pacific time today. The specs that have been released look pretty good. Cant wait till I can take one for a test drive. There's a bunch of poo poo out on all the usual suspects.
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Nov 17, 2011 00:51
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I added a quick summary + links and photos on my blog. Basically 160hp, 170 torque, 2,533 curb weight, 5-speed manual transmission. Full spec sheet available here: http://www.media.chrysler.com/dcxms/assets/specs/12_Fiat500Abarth_Specs.pdf
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Nov 17, 2011 00:55
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Gotta wait for the SS, bro.
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Nov 17, 2011 06:21
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What should Chrysler do?: http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/2011/11/fiat-500-yup-its-flopping
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Nov 17, 2011 09:11
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A negative Chrysler article from truth about cars? SHOCKING! How about we give the brand and the model a little time before we start throwing roses on the casket. And let the Abarth come out.
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Nov 17, 2011 13:32
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They had a hard time initially getting the dealer network set up which contributed to why they were never going to hit the 50k target, but the declining monthly volume is somewhat worrying. I am seeing more and more on the road but then again I live in an urban area. edit: also the marketing disasterpiece that was hilarious too Basically Chrysler has really hosed up the launch in general so I'm not sure how much of it is due to 'muricans don't want small cars and how much of it has to do with Chrysler peeing itself. (probably like 40/60, sales targets aren't that ambitious) KYOON GRIFFEY JR fucked around with this message at 14:13 on Nov 17, 2011 |
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Nov 17, 2011 14:09
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I think it's far from over, but I think they need to continue to refine the marketing and get some people grassrooting the car for them. I really thought I would have seen a lot more of these sell in Boston, but they're still not that comon sightings.
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Nov 17, 2011 15:37
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