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Baronjutter posted:Hell yeah, I love learning poo poo, specially if the person educating me really knows their poo poo. I loving hate May and the green party but she did nothing wrong in her interview and she's 100% right about shrimp, stop eating that poo poo you idiots. Wait, I can see why people would be neutral on the Greens but what have they done to make you hate them? I didn't know it was possible to hate the Greens and the Conservatives at the same time.
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Jun 5, 2013 21:10
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Cordyceps Headache posted:Wait, I can see why people would be neutral on the Greens but what have they done to make you hate them? I didn't know it was possible to hate the Greens and the Conservatives at the same time. The only knock I've really heard against the greens is their support for fringe weirdo stuff like being afraid of wifi signals and supporting some junk science medicine like acupuncture and such. Though last election I also seem to remember their fiscal policy actually being not too far off from the cons?
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Jun 5, 2013 21:18
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Squibbles posted:The only knock I've really heard against the greens is their support for fringe weirdo stuff like being afraid of wifi signals and supporting some junk science medicine like acupuncture and such. Their nuclear power policy is also reactionary poo poo. I also recall their fiscal stuff to be neocon or bordering on neocon.
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Jun 5, 2013 21:23
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Scratching the surface of the Green Party leads to sadness. Oh well, guess I'm voting straight Leninist next election again.
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Jun 5, 2013 21:26
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Blade_of_tyshalle posted:Scratching the surface of the Green Party leads to sadness. I voted communist here once, but I knew the guy. Besides, everyone knew the NDP candidate was going to win, so why not?
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Jun 5, 2013 21:30
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Blade_of_tyshalle posted:Scratching the surface of the Green Party leads to sadness. Imagine the hubbub if Canadians elected just one member of Marxist-Leninist or the Communist Party. Harper could win a 99% majority and Toronto Sun would still put on the cover, "CANADA GOES COMMUNIST". I'm sure Fox News would alert everyone that the Red have now taken Canada and we must no longer negotiate with communist scum up north.
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Jun 5, 2013 21:32
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So you're saying we should conspire to elect a single Communist to Parliament so the Americans will kill Keystone forever? This is a good plan, who's our Marxchurian candidate?
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Jun 5, 2013 21:36
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Paper Jam Dipper posted:Imagine the hubbub if Canadians elected just one member of Marxist-Leninist or the Communist Party. Harper could win a 99% majority and Toronto Sun would still put on the cover, "CANADA GOES COMMUNIST". I'm sure Fox News would alert everyone that the Red have now taken Canada and we must no longer negotiate with communist scum up north. How about one of each? Doube commie flavour 
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Jun 5, 2013 21:36
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JohnnyCanuck posted:Their nuclear power policy is also reactionary poo poo. I also recall their fiscal stuff to be neocon or bordering on neocon. They want to stop permitting and phase out currently-producing uranium mines in Canada (which is 20% of the world's uranium production), which is responsible for 15,000 jobs in Saskatchewan alone, and they also completely oppose the export of any fissionable material including thorium. Their policy on the energy industry is literally 1.21 Energy Industry: No to Nuclear. The Green Party also believes in promoting homeopathy and naturopathy as "complimentary health care" choices.
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Jun 5, 2013 21:37
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Majuju posted:They want to stop permitting and phase out currently-producing uranium mines in Canada (which is 20% of the world's uranium production), which is responsible for 15,000 jobs in Saskatchewan alone, and they also completely oppose the export of any fissionable material including thorium. Their policy on the energy industry is literally 1.21 Energy Industry: No to Nuclear. As someone who had radiation therapy, they can go gently caress themselves. Taking ginger and avacado pits wouldn't do poo poo to my cancer.
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Jun 5, 2013 21:38
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Holy poo poo. Christy Clark chose my riding (Westside-Kelowna) to run in a by-election in. It wasn't particularly close, the Liberal beat the New Democrat 13k to 7k, but damned if I won't see if we can do something to change that.
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Jun 5, 2013 21:39
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Majuju posted:They want to stop permitting and phase out currently-producing uranium mines in Canada (which is 20% of the world's uranium production), which is responsible for 15,000 jobs in Saskatchewan alone, and they also completely oppose the export of any fissionable material including thorium. Their policy on the energy industry is literally 1.21 Energy Industry: No to Nuclear. Christ, really? I knew about the nuclear stuff, but I sort of figured, "hey they'll moderate if they ever actually come close to being a mainstream party". They're hardly the only environmental group to fear nuclear. But I've never met someone who promoted homeopathy that had any concrete grasp of environmental science or actual environmental issues. Stop depressing me goons. 
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Jun 5, 2013 21:46
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Crack cocaine also is a complimentary health care choice.
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Jun 5, 2013 21:48
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Cordyceps Headache posted:Christ, really? Cordyceps Headache posted:Wait, I can see why people would be neutral on the Greens but what have they done to make you hate them? I didn't know it was possible to hate the Greens and the Conservatives at the same time. Exactly. I hate them both because the Conservatives are gigantic assholes, and the Green can be outright loons at times.
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Jun 5, 2013 21:49
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The Greens are truly awful, all they're doing is bringing down the left with them. Hell, more people have been killed through homeopathy than nuclear energy.
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Jun 5, 2013 21:52
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bunnyofdoom posted:How about one of each? Doube commie flavour SPLITTER!!
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Jun 5, 2013 21:54
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bunnyofdoom posted:Exactly. I hate them both because the Conservatives are gigantic assholes, and the Green can be outright loons at times. That seems a little harsh. Team Theology (Conservative supporter/staffer for one of the senators?) has been posting reasonably well here. I actually look forward to see what he has to say sometime which breaks up the echo chamber here. I haven't seem a lot of Green Party supporters/staffers here though. Moore and Kenney are probably going to replace Harper for 2015 but I dunno if it will hurt the Cons in the east since they're both from the west.
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Jun 5, 2013 22:01
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quaint bucket posted:That seems a little harsh. Team Theology (Conservative supporter/staffer for one of the senators?) has been posting reasonably well here. I actually look forward to see what he has to say sometime which breaks up the echo chamber here. True. He is a gentleman. However, I meant it more as the government. Doing things like exlcuding Marc Garneau from the Canadarm exhibit opening, muzzling scientists, and a whole host of other incidents leads me to apply to that label to them.
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Jun 5, 2013 22:04
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Regarding hatred towards the Greens, There's also the more cynical view that the Green party is bad because it puts another split in the already divided left wing and helps the Conservatives.
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Jun 5, 2013 22:14
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bunnyofdoom posted:True. He is a gentleman. However, I meant it more as the government. Doing things like exlcuding Marc Garneau from the Canadarm exhibit opening, muzzling scientists, and a whole host of other incidents leads me to apply to that label to them. Yeah, when someone says "Conservatives are assholes" the capital C tends to mean the Party. Might be something that gets missed sometimes.
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Jun 5, 2013 22:15
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bunnyofdoom posted:True. He is a gentleman. However, I meant it more as the government. Doing things like exlcuding Marc Garneau from the Canadarm exhibit opening, muzzling scientists, and a whole host of other incidents leads me to apply to that label to them. Quite frankly, I think excluding Marc Garneau was not a big deal and distract from more serious problems. I don't know much about the scientists being muzzled but I can't help but feel that's common practice for most business? Provide articles for me and I can do some personal research. I'm happy they got rid of the LGR but I'm not happy that there hasn't been any realistic movement on the firearm act. I would have been happy with at least abolishing the ATT (ineffective red tape) or clarifying the Safe Storage but right now they're just teasing/reading the population with "leaked secret memos." E: I took C as in describing Team Theology as part of the government as a staffer (from my understanding) as much as bunnydoom is Liberal due to being staffer as well. Is this inaccurate? V thank you! I have some reading to do! V quaint bucket fucked around with this message at 22:44 on Jun 5, 2013 |
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Jun 5, 2013 22:31
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quaint bucket posted:I don't know much about the scientists being muzzled but I can't help but feel that's common practice for most business? Provide articles for me and I can do some personal research. I don't know how much it happens with other governments but there's certainly been a narrative in the last year or two about scientists not being allowed to talk to the media. An article about it here: http://www.thestar.com/opinion/editorialopinion/2012/02/26/is_the_conservative_government_muzzling_federal_scientists.html Another article about a US scientist who was apparently asked to sign an agreement that prevented him from talking to the media because he was doing some joint research with some federally funded Canadian scientists: http://www.cbc.ca/news/technology/story/2013/02/15/science-audio-munchow-scientist-muzzling.html International science journal Nature has criticized the CPC for muzzling scientists (I believe Nature may have brought it up more than once now too): http://www.cbc.ca/news/technology/story/2012/03/02/nature-science-canada.html
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Jun 5, 2013 22:39
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Paper Jam Dipper posted:Yeah, when someone says "Conservatives are assholes" the capital C tends to mean the Party. Might be something that gets missed sometimes. Supporting and defending an awful party, largely consisting of awful people, tends to cast aspersions on your moral fiber!
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Jun 5, 2013 22:42
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quaint bucket posted:I don't know much about the scientists being muzzled but I can't help but feel that's common practice for most business? Provide articles for me and I can do some personal research. It's common practice for business (which includes highly, HIGHLY unethical uses of non-disclosure agreements, like funding twenty studies and then using the one that, by random 'this is accurate within 97%, 19 times out of 20' mathematical chance, supports your new product while shredding the results of the other nineteen), but government is not a business. Government funded science on matters of public interest (like Canada's environment) shouldn't be hushed up if it doesn't support the government's favourite things.
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Jun 5, 2013 22:44
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LP97S posted:Hell, more people have been killed through homeopathy than nuclear energy.
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Jun 5, 2013 22:45
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LP97S posted:The Greens are truly awful, all they're doing is bringing down the left with them. Hell, more people have been killed through homeopathy than nuclear energy. My favorite personal anecdote regarding homeopathy is the time a woman ran into the pharmacy where I worked, right near closing time, desperately seeking her sleeping pills. She was all jittery and panicked looking when I told her they had to be locked up for the night since they can't be sold when a pharmacist isn't on duty. She said she meant the different ones, the Calm-Forte, those don't need to be locked up. I showed her where they were, and she grabbed all two dozen boxes of homeopathic sleeping pills that she was apparently addicted to and ran off to pay for them.
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Jun 5, 2013 22:45
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quaint bucket posted:I don't know much about the scientists being muzzled but I can't help but feel that's common practice for most business? It is to a point, however the federal government isn't a business and should have no trade secrets or proprietary research that needs to be guarded. In fact, if they are doing research and not publishing it for public (corporate) consumption, then you should be probably be asking why they are bothering. * Hopefully, no one in government notices that they could save a lot of money on all this muzzled research they aren't using anyways.
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Jun 5, 2013 22:49
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Funkdreamer posted:poo poo D&D says edit: just so we're clear, we're talking about homeopaths, a group of people who sometimes advise against immunization. Here's Mulcair getting good press. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=RZnrYIqLSoA
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Jun 5, 2013 22:53
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What did Mulcair do in QP today that was so great? A couple people in here were really stoked about it but I can't follow QP from my job so I rely on you guys for post-facto video clips.
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Jun 5, 2013 22:56
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quaint bucket posted:I don't know much about the scientists being muzzled but I can't help but feel that's common practice for most business? Provide articles for me and I can do some personal research.
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Jun 5, 2013 22:56
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bunnyofdoom posted:True. He is a gentleman. However, I meant it more as the government. Doing things like exlcuding Marc Garneau from the Canadarm exhibit opening, muzzling scientists, and a whole host of other incidents leads me to apply to that label to them. That was a dick move. But I would chalk it up as much to a political slight as I would literally no one thinking "Hey, maybe Canadian space dude should be at the Canadian space event". I mean definitely a few people were being assholes, but I can assure you a person or two in the room when the decision was made just didn't think of it at the time. Which is both sad, and ridiculous. quaint bucket posted:That seems a little harsh. Team Theology (Conservative supporter/staffer for one of the senators?) has been posting reasonably well here. I actually look forward to see what he has to say sometime which breaks up the echo chamber here. Senator, man if only I worked in an office with so little power and such a huge budget. Then I could play games all day! For the record, staffers aren't usually in agreement with their bosses (MP, Minister, Senator or otherwise) over everything. We just do our jobs as our bosses would like them done to the best of our ability (if we are good at our job).
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Jun 5, 2013 23:15
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Funkdreamer posted:poo poo D&D says Good argument, bro.
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Jun 5, 2013 23:16
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On the point of business suppressing information: true, they do so for the purpose of running multiple research until they get the answer they seek; however, don't they also do it to protect intellectual property? My understanding is that the work of the scientists/researchers are effectively the property of the business corporate but I will concede that the government is not a business. After reading the articles, editorial, and the DemocracyWatch document, I can understand the reason for the Media Relations department with the goal of "one department, one voice" and the purpose of controlling the messages in order to protect the government's interest (multiple industries, including fishery). It's a fairly reasonable fear that a research could harm an industry and thus affect the economy as a result; however, it's pretty clear the Media Relations department is ineffectual and adds unnecessary red tape. I don't believe they're actively muzzling the scientists but it is definitely hindering their ability to discuss their findings in an active discussion/debate with their peers through the appropriate media outlet due to the strict deadlines that reporters have to deal with. It's red tapes and ineffectual policies that's slowing down the scientists beyond the timeline of an news article lifespan, thus unintentionally "muzzling" them. Definitely get rid of the MR department or at least streamline them for more prompt response. Not a popular assessment, I think?
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Jun 5, 2013 23:25
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I don't think being cautiously anti-nuclear power is inherently whacked-out, but from the sounds of it the Canadian Greens seem to have a whole lot more whackaloonery going on than just the nuclear stuff. The Australian Greens at this point are more like the NDP with an environmental agenda, we won't touch stuff like homeopathy or anti-vax with a ten-foot pole, and it doesn't sound like the CG have any good measures in place to dilute the more cracked-out of their constituency.
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Jun 5, 2013 23:26
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Waaaah the Christians are out to get me
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The more I get involved in politics, the more angry I get, it's not a good cycle. I moved from being pretty unengaged, then went through the 'we are all on the same side, it's all a bit of a game' period and now honestly think that most of the people heavily involved with the modern conservative party are either evil, stupid or both. (No offense TT) Also, I'm really glad I'm out of Ottawa, 4 years was too long.
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Jun 5, 2013 23:27
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 What a great little shrug. Mulcair seems like a fun guy.
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Jun 5, 2013 23:29
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quaint bucket posted:I don't believe they're actively muzzling the scientists but it is definitely hindering their ability to discuss their findings in an active discussion/debate with their peers through the appropriate media outlet due to the strict deadlines that reporters have to deal with.
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Jun 5, 2013 23:46
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Team THEOLOGY posted:That was a dick move. But I would chalk it up as much to a political slight as I would literally no one thinking "Hey, maybe Canadian space dude should be at the Canadian space event". I mean definitely a few people were being assholes, but I can assure you a person or two in the room when the decision was made just didn't think of it at the time. Which is both sad, and ridiculous. "Team Theology" posted:Senator, man if only I worked in an office with so little power and such a huge budget. Then I could play games all day! For the record, staffers aren't usually in agreement with their bosses (MP, Minister, Senator or otherwise) over everything. We just do our jobs as our bosses would like them done to the best of our ability (if we are good at our job). Man, I wish I still worked in the senate. I really liked my little office there. And, as my posts in the thread show, I clearly am not on board with Liberal stuff all the time either. But that doesn't mean I don't bust my rear end off, nor that I slack off. That being said, sorry for any offense TT. I was not intending to insult you at all, but rather the party itself, especially with regards to some of it's policies I find highly objectionable. quaint bucket posted:
quote:
Not quite. I did mean the party, as in more of the movers and shakers. Since my original quote was based off us critique the Greens for their policies, I felt it would be construed as me saying Conservative policies were gigantically assholish. Like I said, I have no problems with TT at all,, he is a gentleman. Furthurmore, staffers do tend to disagree with the party they do belong to, because we're human, we are allowed our own opinions. However, we work for the parties we do because our values for the most part match our parties.
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Jun 5, 2013 23:46
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Alctel posted:The more I get involved in politics, the more angry I get, it's not a good cycle. Let me begin by saying I have been in Ottawa my whole life save for schooling. It definitely could knock that attitude into someone. Also Bunny as usual I know you are a gentleman you would have to be pretty flippant about being a jackass for me to take any offence. (Now for content) That seems like one of those comments where you go "all Asians are evil but no offence Asians". Not going into the fundamentals I just think a lot of politics is a debate between people and what they think the role of the government should be versus the role of the individual. Also my family has almost always been in small business and politics is generally (aside from the occasional champagne socialist) about people wanting to get the best for themselves. Anyway it's all good you are more than welcome to disagree with me, the party or what have you. But I think I could say the same about anything rhetorical the NDP has said about raising taxes which (and I know this for a fact because I know what my families margins are) would bankrupt our small business and put our employees out of work. Again, this is just a minutiae example and I don't really want to get into my personal reasons for being a Conservative and very individualistic-"ally" driven versus communally but I think you guys get the point. Everyone comes with ideas and ideals which they think are right, I don't think my ideas are right for everyone but they are for me and mine and really that's what most people (whether they think it or not) are fighting for in a democracy. Sure I'm Conservative, but I'm no fool and I don't think myself evil. I just think most people (even those that don't think it) walk a pretty self serving path - even when they don't mean to. That being said I have first had experienced wages going up and us having to let go great staff because we couldn't afford them because people still didn't want to pay more for goods. Certainly in retail and the like, from my observations. All that to say we all have different views and feel we can justify them. To call someone out on being hateful or stupid is distasteful to me. PS: I love all you guys. Politics are politics and disagreements are what they are but I bear no ill will to those who disagree. Hell, if (read: when) we lose government I won't be mad at anyone, or the NDP, or the Libs (Bunny, see I remembered!). It will be our fault and I get that. But to think anyone in this 'Game of Seats' is innocent or without there blemishes is foolish and to decry someone for their political views without fully understanding why or where they come from is foolish at best and ignorant at worst. Team THEOLOGY fucked around with this message at 00:02 on Jun 6, 2013 |
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Jun 5, 2013 23:58
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bunnyofdoom posted:Um, where did I even mention the LGR in my post? Why are you jumping to this one issue that I never mentioned? Personal thought.
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Jun 6, 2013 00:03
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