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It's funny how everyone started rebelling as soon as the "good guy" wanted to take over leadership and they were calling for a vote but then they have no problem with the Governor suddenly becoming the leader despite being totally new to the camp.
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Nov 25, 2013 15:25
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It's going to be interesting if someone walks up behind the Governor when he's looking at his aquarium and is all "hey whatcha doin OH MY GODDDD". Two leaders died in the last couple days? Well that's weird! Oh well
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Nov 25, 2013 15:29
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One person can't operate a tank on his own, you need like a 3 person team at least. I suppose you could drive it and then switch to a different position, but it sure won't be easy. They'll probably only use it to knock down the fence.
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Nov 25, 2013 15:33
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That DICK! posted:I'm not saying it's a good idea. It's a bad idea. I just don't see any other solution outside of the boring S3 re-hash. Did you actually read the post, or are you just that content in the fact that you read a picture-book. I don't think the limits of your imagination should be the goal standard by which measuring the show is accomplished.
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Nov 25, 2013 15:38
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I didn't dislike this episode I just aren't a fan of where it's going. A reboot of season 3 but with slight changes isn't really what I was after, I guess I will give the episode a chance and see what happens after the mid-season break, something good might still come from this.
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Nov 25, 2013 15:42
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Mexcillent posted:I don't think the limits of your imagination should be the goal standard by which measuring the show is accomplished. "Your feeble imagination can't begin to comprehend the thing that I read happens in a comic book  "
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Nov 25, 2013 15:49
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The previous episode had me worried and now I'm just kinda disappointed with this weird direction they're taking. Why the hell did he kill Martinez? Did I miss some sort of ultra-subtle motive? The guy seemed perfectly understanding about their past and even wanted to bring the governer in on the leadership, then SMACK golf club to the head out of nowhere. I thought they were gonna fix the character after season 3 but he's still just a boring murderous twat, now with extra comic-book style Brooding Darkness™
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Nov 25, 2013 15:53
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Krowley posted:The previous episode had me worried and now I'm just kinda disappointed with this weird direction they're taking. Martinez via the talking dead figured it was with the Gov trying to keep his new alias in check. That he was struggling between Brian who just wants his family safe, and The Gov who wants it all. And Martinez saying he isnt sure he can keep them safe, is what let the Govener show himself again (as shown by him holding Martinez over the pit before letting go). The supply run also showed the contrast between the two brothers, Pete(rick) as the nice guy trying to survive while being good and not hurting anyone, and the other brother wanting to survive at all costs, and showing what happens when you dont act to help your group survive, everything gets taken away. The Gov after trying to escape and seeing the zombie road, knew something had to be done to protect his family and the people. So he eliminated the weak link which was Pete. And got the other brother on his side, saying you have to act to survive, not sit and hope. Based on the preview of next week, the Gov is using the prison as a means of telling everyone "Its fortified better then our little open camp, they have supplies, we can take it down with this tank, before they take us down.". When we all know the Governor wants revenge for what they did to his people, and Michonne. The fact they showed the Gov trying to adapt into this new person, then going back to his old ways is a nice way of saying "He cant be redeemed from what he was"
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Nov 25, 2013 16:12
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That DICK! posted:"Your feeble imagination can't begin to comprehend the thing that I read happens in a comic book *Watches show based on comic book, posts this*
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Nov 25, 2013 16:17
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The governor is clearly only interested in helping the prison group by imparting his knowledge of impassable zombie mud-moats.Mexcillent posted:*Watches show based on comic book, posts this* Will you please shut up and stop poo poo posting about your cartoons?
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Nov 25, 2013 16:25
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Fog Tripper posted:Will you please shut up and stop poo poo posting about your cartoons? Buddy, the minute you stop watching this show (poorly) for self-insertion is the minute I'll stop thinking about the show in terms of the comic book it is adapted from. Mexcillent fucked around with this message at 16:55 on Nov 25, 2013 |
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Nov 25, 2013 16:32
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Mexcillent posted:Whoa, humans don't do lovely things? Amazing.
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Nov 25, 2013 17:13
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Mexcillent posted:Whoa, humans don't do lovely things? Amazing. They took an entire hour to show us otherwise, then wiped that all out the next one making it a waste of time. I'm sure you can see that.
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Nov 25, 2013 17:16
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The thing is, we can have a human antagonist ready to go to all out war against innocent people. You could even bring back an old villain and spice him up. They managed to do it with a prison of a bunch of nameless strangers, they can do it here. It's just that the Governor is so loving random. First he's an insane megalomaniacal dictator with a messiah complex who does horrible things in the name of the greater good because he has only one piece of his family left. Then he's a broken man with nothing left who attacks the prison for revenge but keeps them alive because he's a cackling cartoon villain. Then he's a Hannibal Lector styled serial killer who likes torturing pretty girls because he's just a bad guy. Then he's a cartoon villain AGAIN when he can't finish off the same weakened prison with a goddamn rocket launcher and an army of 30+ people, and kills his own people because he's that much of a pussy. Then he's a nice guy again who was even ready to leave the people who gave him shelter. Then he's an insane megalomaniacal dictator with a messiah complex who does horrible things in the name of the greater good not because of family because he has all that back now, but now because he was abused as a child. Oh and he still likes revenge. And he still wants to torture any and all pretty girls that aren't into his latest single, "In the Prison."
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Nov 25, 2013 17:28
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PaganGoatPants posted:They took an entire hour to show us otherwise, then wiped that all out the next one making it a waste of time. I'm sure you can see that. I mean I was pretty sure there was lots of tension last hour about what the Governor would do to the people he came across, I don't think he was "redeemed" but I do think he was humanized. He just happens to be a particularly lovely human. I actually hate season 3, it's awful and the governor was handled really poorly (as he kind of always is). But, I think these last two episodes worked against the negatives of his characterization in terms of complicating and humanizing him. I don't think that either episode was a waste of time.
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Nov 25, 2013 17:29
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Mexcillent posted:I mean I was pretty sure there was lots of tension last hour about what the Governor would do to the people he came across, I don't think he was "redeemed" but I do think he was humanized. He just happens to be a particularly lovely human. This. Overall, I liked the episode and am glad the writer's didn't go for a redemption arc with the Governor. I'm not sure how I feel about the big plot of the season being Woodbury Redux, though. I'm confident it's going to better written than before and I don't think they're recycling old plots because they ran out of ideas, but it's still a bit iffy. Is this really such an important plot line that it needs to redone just because it was executed kind of shittily the first time around?
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Nov 25, 2013 17:45
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It seems like evera lot of folks are missing that the theme for this season has been "Are there really some things you can't come back from?" Between Rick and the crazy zombie-looking lady waxing philosophical in the beginning, Rick trying to protect Carl from "crossing a line", Herschel refusing to keep himself safe and let people die, Carol killing "for the greater good", to the Governor episodes, we're seeing different takes on that same theme. Unfortunately it looks like the answer is going to be "It depends".
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Nov 25, 2013 17:55
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Dez Orwell posted:Unfortunately it looks like the answer is going to be "It depends".
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Nov 25, 2013 18:05
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Ugggh. The Governor is so stupid. What a waste of time. We had to suffer through him last season, and now we have to deal with him again. We got the hamfisted redemption arc and "my daddy beat me" story to try to fish up the emotions that weren't there last season. It's like one big do-over. He's actually half interesting when he's playing the guy who's trying to bury his past. But now we're right back to it. Also, can we get some more women who are worth more than a good lay? Who are these women who have survived this far and are still useless? Baldbeard fucked around with this message at 18:21 on Nov 25, 2013 |
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Nov 25, 2013 18:17
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fullroundaction posted:They've made actual characters that people like out of Carol, Michonne, and Herschel this season. That's a pretty big accomplishment. 1. What was bad about Carol or Herschel? 2. What is good about Michonne now, really? She stopped being absolute irredeemable poo poo, but that doesn't mean she started being good.
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Nov 25, 2013 18:27
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Dez Orwell posted:It seems like evera lot of folks are missing that the theme for this season has been "Are there really some things you can't come back from?" Between Rick and the crazy zombie-looking lady waxing philosophical in the beginning, Rick trying to protect Carl from "crossing a line", Herschel refusing to keep himself safe and let people die, Carol killing "for the greater good", to the Governor episodes, we're seeing different takes on that same theme. That's not so much a theme as it is a catchphrase at this point.
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Nov 25, 2013 18:38
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Tension? You mean there are people here who didn't choreograph basically everything beforehand assuming the Governor was the same exact character as before? The most eye rolling moment was the lake zombie reveal. A good scene would have been to show the actual process of getting it down there, if "So yeah the Gov is still completely broken" is what they were going for.
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Nov 25, 2013 18:41
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rawdog pozfail posted:Tension? You mean there are people here who didn't choreograph basically everything beforehand assuming the Governor was the same exact character as before? You're spot on with the first part. But for the second, did you miss him rolling the guy off the pier with the sound of the chain? But yeah, I felt absolutely zero tension. The most emotion stirred up was a compulsion to roll my eyes repeatedly. It felt like the whole point of the past few episodes was the writers sitting down and going "hey, how can we get the governor a tank? Wouldn't that be badassed? We'll kill off Martinez and the other black dude, because clearly last season was a success and we need more governor."
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Nov 25, 2013 18:56
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Fog Tripper posted:did you miss him rolling the guy off the pier with the sound of the chain? Huh, I guess I did. I was pretty bored during the episode so I must have been turned away. Did it show what the chain was attached to? Seems like the process would be more involved than just dumping it down there, I thought it showed the zombie's foot caught on something but I guess if was just showing the chain.
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Nov 25, 2013 19:05
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rawdog pozfail posted:Huh, I guess I did. I was pretty bored during the episode so I must have been turned away. Did it show what the chain was attached to? Seems like the process would be more involved than just dumping it down there, I thought it showed the zombie's foot caught on something but I guess if was just showing the chain. Didn't notice it tied to the leg when he rolled him in, but I do recall hearing it. At the time I thought it was just to keep the body from floating to the surface. But now it was clearly muahaha I am evil governator type of silliness. I like a good dramatic character arc. However it is helpful to have it occur with someone I actually give a drat about. I'd care many-fold more about an arc with characters they've killed off like Martinez. Killed off just as offhandedly as the redshirts. The writers simply don't seem to have a grasp of what makes an interesting character worth keeping around. Fog Tripper fucked around with this message at 19:17 on Nov 25, 2013 |
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Nov 25, 2013 19:12
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verybad posted:What's so bad about that answer? It's not like show doesn't elaborate more on its answer, it's just that the writers recognize that there aren't any easy answers and so they don't give you one. Yeah, I should have clarified. "It depends" is a perfectly valid answer because in reality, there are no absolutes. Some people can do awful things and be completely unaffected by them. I meant unfortunately in the sense that as soon as the season is over, someone in here is going to be dropping questions along the lines of "Is the Governor actually Brian Heriot?", or "Why did that old man turn into a zombie, he wasn't bitten."
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Nov 25, 2013 19:15
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rawdog pozfail posted:Huh, I guess I did. I was pretty bored during the episode so I must have been turned away.
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Nov 25, 2013 19:21
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Ashekaban posted:Martinez via the talking dead figured it was with the Gov trying to keep his new alias in check. That he was struggling between Brian who just wants his family safe, and The Gov who wants it all. And Martinez saying he isnt sure he can keep them safe, is what let the Govener show himself again (as shown by him holding Martinez over the pit before letting go). The supply run also showed the contrast between the two brothers, Pete(rick) as the nice guy trying to survive while being good and not hurting anyone, and the other brother wanting to survive at all costs, and showing what happens when you dont act to help your group survive, everything gets taken away. The Gov after trying to escape and seeing the zombie road, knew something had to be done to protect his family and the people. So he eliminated the weak link which was Pete. And got the other brother on his side, saying you have to act to survive, not sit and hope. Agreed. I think this was more effective then if the Governor had just showed up with a new group again, attacking the prison. Knowing what he did for the past few months, seeing him try to change and fail, that makes his attack much more interesting. I won't deny they could have told a compelling story of "The Governor realizes it's tough to survive out there, so he leaves the camper camp with his new family and goes to Rick hat in hand begging to be let in." But what we've got is interesting, and I can't believe they'd just set everything up to replay last year's finale note for note. Keep in mind too that Rick is starting to feel the prison isn't so safe. They have threats from the inside (Carol and people who might share her absolutist attitude; the flu) and mass hordes on the outside they can't defend from. A strong attack from the Governor might get them to leave the prison and search for greener pastures. I wonder...why don't they just find an island? Zombies can't swim. Surely they could go on the road and find some island in another state or something. Or are there lakes in GA?
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Nov 25, 2013 19:43
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rawdog pozfail posted:Tension? You mean there are people here who didn't choreograph basically everything beforehand assuming the Governor was the same exact character as before? Perhaps you would've felt more tension if you'd engaged with the material enough to at least follow the events of the episode.
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Nov 25, 2013 19:55
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verybad posted:Perhaps you would've felt more tension if you'd engaged with the material enough to at least follow the events of the episode. Nope.
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Nov 25, 2013 19:57
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How is the attack even supposed to work? We see them talking to each other but the minute the Governor showed up the survivors from Woodbury would be all "what are you fools doing with that guy? that motherfucker right there used to lead our community before he decided to kill everyone".
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Nov 25, 2013 20:01
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There's nothing particularly deep or inspiring about a character who loves his people like a family, and then starts randomly killing innocents without warning on the excuse of protecting people, who he of course turns on in some way or another just because he's a bad guy, and then randomly inserting a reason why he's that way (First it's heads in the tank, now it's the zombie daughter, now it's the dead zombie daughter, now it's the dead wife, now it's child abuse). That's not good character development, that's the writers contriving a villain because we need a villain and making up bullshit as they go along so you won't notice how lovely of a job they're doing.
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Nov 25, 2013 20:05
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What kind of tank was that anyways? I'm not a military expert by any means, but it didn't look like any sort of modern US tank I have seen. It looked Russian or Chinese or something to me.
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Nov 25, 2013 20:12
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MeLKoR posted:How is the attack even supposed to work? We see them talking to each other but the minute the Governor showed up the survivors from Woodbury would be all "what are you fools doing with that guy? that motherfucker right there used to lead our community before he decided to kill everyone". Martinez, the black guy, and that one woman they found were the only people to witness that. They're all dead now.
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Nov 25, 2013 20:17
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The REAL Gtab Fan posted:Martinez, the black guy, and that one woman they found were the only people to witness that. They're all dead now. It's not like the remaining Woodbury redshirts are completely clueless about what happened with the governor and his attack on the prison.
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Nov 25, 2013 20:25
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VDay posted:It's not like the remaining Woodbury redshirts are completely clueless about what happened with the governor and his attack on the prison. "Hey! You! You guys outside the fence with the tank! You know that guy you're with, the one who seems really nice and loves children and has been taking care of you the past couple of weeks?! The one who would risk his life to get oxygen for a dying elderly man?! He's BAD. Because we said so! He like, ran a town and destroyed it and stuff! You believe us, right?"
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Nov 25, 2013 20:38
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Well, there has also been a dramatic increase in leadership turnover since he arrived.
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Nov 25, 2013 20:44
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Astroman posted:"Hey! You! You guys outside the fence with the tank! You know that guy you're with, the one who seems really nice and loves children and has been taking care of you the past couple of weeks?! The one who would risk his life to get oxygen for a dying elderly man?! He's BAD. Because we said so! He like, ran a town and destroyed it and stuff! You believe us, right?" I mean, if you deliberately make their argument sound stupid and make them sound like bumbling idiots then I guess it's not very convincing. But having a dozen people come out of the prison and all say that the governor used to run their town until one day he convinced a bunch of them that the prison is evil and went to attack them, only to mercilessly slaughter his own people, would raise quite a few red flags for the guy who showed up and took over when the two guys previously in charge just happened to die in two days. Especially considering that Martinez told them that he and the governor used to be part of another community that had it pretty good. Don't get me wrong. I don't actually think any of this is going to happen and they're going to have a big dumb standoff instead, but it's not exactly unthinkable that Rick & Co could try and appeal to the people the governor's with. Like I said though, based on the preview I don't think any of that is going to happen.
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Nov 25, 2013 20:48
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I think the Governor has learned his lesson and won't allow them to talk. It's gonna be a quick blitzkrieg attack and massacre.
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Nov 25, 2013 20:52
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NESguerilla posted:What kind of tank was that anyways? I'm not a military expert by any means, but it didn't look like any sort of modern US tank I have seen. It looked Russian or Chinese or something to me. It's an M60 Patton tank. It's actually plausible because they're the kind of thing that'd only be found in a podunk reserve depot.
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Nov 25, 2013 21:08
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