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Kalman posted:It's a charity to support the children of police, EMS, and fire responders who died performing their jobs, not a "cops boosters club." Which, notably, means that there is no circumstance in which that charity could support Wilson. I'm saying that the state criminal justice apparatus has a mentality in which defending your own is the first principle, and clearly the St. Louis county system is a particularly obvious and egregious example.
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Dec 1, 2014 19:27
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stinkles1112 posted:I find a lot of people's characterization of South Park to be unfairly harsh most of the time but in this case, yeah, that's truly a terrible message. It does seem like they've been trying to make up for their earlier awful opinions lately though, except for the recent episode about trans-bathrooms. I may have misinterpreted their message, but that one was also awful. The hate crime episode is awful though, but it was 14 drat years ago and I think their Zimmerman episode is a pretty good indication that they've changed as people since then.
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Dec 1, 2014 19:30
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Joementum posted:Obama is going to issue an executive order that requires civilian oversight approval for police departments acquiring military surplus materials and ask Congress for $75m to fund body cameras. It's cool that the immediate and real concern of police misconduct will be completely suborned to hypothetical 1984 libertarian arguments.
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Dec 1, 2014 19:31
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So, the budget is still up come December 11th, correct? Has there been any kind of progress towards something new?
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Dec 1, 2014 19:32
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zoux posted:It's cool that the immediate and real concern of police misconduct will be completely suborned to hypothetical 1984 libertarian arguments. What about my privacy? If police have body cameras, someone might make a public records request and be able to see me not getting a ticket after I showed the cop my business card!
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Dec 1, 2014 19:32
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zoux posted:It's cool that the immediate and real concern of police misconduct will be completely suborned to hypothetical 1984 libertarian arguments. The whiplash from Rand in particular will be funny to watch.
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Dec 1, 2014 19:34
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zoux posted:It's cool that the immediate and real concern of police misconduct will be completely suborned to hypothetical 1984 libertarian arguments. Imagine a boot stomping on a human face - on camera.
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Dec 1, 2014 19:34
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Slippery slope!!! SLIPPERY SLOPE!!!! Of course the real "I'm just tellin' you how it is" reason this won't pass is that police "can't do their jobs" if they are constantly being monitored.
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Dec 1, 2014 19:35
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fknlo posted:So, the budget is still up come December 11th, correct? Has there been any kind of progress towards something new? The 2014 losses and the Darren Wilson sympathizers left me missing the good old budget fight days. Holy poo poo I never thought I'd say that.
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Dec 1, 2014 19:36
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Joementum posted:The whiplash from Rand in particular will be funny to watch. Surely the man who has fought harder than any man, probably in history, for racial equality will be in favor of more oversight over a system that demonstrably disproportionately targets minorities.
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Dec 1, 2014 19:38
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The "privacy concerns" objection to cameras-on-cops doesn't make any sense to me. If a cop is there, you aren't in private anyway. The camera doesn't see anything the police don't see.
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Dec 1, 2014 19:43
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Ditocoaf posted:The "privacy concerns" objection to cameras-on-cops doesn't make any sense to me. If a cop is there, you aren't in private anyway. The camera doesn't see anything the police don't see. It's not for cops, the hypothetical concern is for the citizens they are recording.
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Dec 1, 2014 19:46
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I read that right after reading the 'police demand apology from st Louis Rams' story. The balls on these guys.
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Dec 1, 2014 19:50
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From a great roundup of past reporting on Presidential children comes the revelation that Lincoln's kids really could have shown some more class. James Garfield's sons were apparently also quiet poorly behaved.
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Dec 1, 2014 19:52
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How are they cameras handled by departments that do use them? I would imagine it would be like the recordings on the black box of an airplane. It doesn't record every moment of every flight forever, it's only a set period of time that it can hold as memory. I would imagine the police handling it the same way. You just keep the information if there is an ticket given or an arrest made and ditch the stuff that is just the officer walking around all day.
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Dec 1, 2014 19:56
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zoux posted:It's not for cops, the hypothetical concern is for the citizens they are recording. I know, that's what I'm saying, though: if a cop is already watching you, you aren't in private. The cop's memory is already "recording" everything, it's just more prone to making poo poo up than a camera. If you want privacy, you'd want the cop to go away regardless of whether he was wearing a camera, wouldn't you?
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Dec 1, 2014 19:57
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Armyman25 posted:How are they cameras handled by departments that do use them? I would imagine it would be like the recordings on the black box of an airplane. It doesn't record every moment of every flight forever, it's only a set period of time that it can hold as memory. I would imagine the police handling it the same way. You just keep the information if there is an ticket given or an arrest made and ditch the stuff that is just the officer walking around all day. Most of the body cameras in use are required to be activated by the officer. Ditocoaf posted:I know, that's what I'm saying, though: if a cop is already watching you, you aren't in private. The cop's memory is already "recording" everything, it's just more prone to making poo poo up than a camera. If you want privacy, you'd want the cop to go away regardless of whether he was wearing a camera, wouldn't you? Not if you and the officer both would rather not have your conversation recorded.
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Dec 1, 2014 20:01
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Ditocoaf posted:I know, that's what I'm saying, though: if a cop is already watching you, you aren't in private. The cop's memory is already "recording" everything, it's just more prone to making poo poo up than a camera. If you want privacy, you'd want the cop to go away regardless of whether he was wearing a camera, wouldn't you? Do libertarians strike you as generally reasonable and rational people?
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Dec 1, 2014 20:02
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Good Citizen posted:I read that right after reading the 'police demand apology from st Louis Rams' story. The balls on these guys. Oh, man, this. I was listening to sports talk today and the local guy was outraged that 5 St. Louis Rams players ("thugs") had the audacity to express an opinion about this poo poo. "Your job is to PLAY FOOTBALL not EXPRESS AN OPINION!" I wanted to call in and ask him what he thought about Muhammed Ali, Tommie Smith and John Carlos or even the LA Clippers players who wore warm up suits over their jerseys last year but I was driving. Or remind him that "Your job is to discuss SPORTS, not politics!" What a shithead this guy was. Not sure what made the players "thugs". Yes I am Sadly, most of the callers had the guys back.
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Dec 1, 2014 20:11
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In their defense they do play for a St Louis sports team.
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Dec 1, 2014 20:15
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Flip Yr Wig posted:I'm saying that the state criminal justice apparatus has a mentality in which defending your own is the first principle, and clearly the St. Louis county system is a particularly obvious and egregious example. Absolutely. It just has nothing to do with a guy who is the son of a dead cop being involved in a charity for the children of dead first responders. There are a hundred reasons to question McCulloch's objectivity. His participation in that particular charity really isn't one of them.
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Dec 1, 2014 20:18
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DemeaninDemon posted:In their defense they do play for a St Louis sports team. After what they did to Oakland, thug is too kind of a word. That was murder.
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Dec 1, 2014 20:19
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Cheekio posted:The 2014 losses and the Darren Wilson sympathizers left me missing the good old budget fight days. Holy poo poo I never thought I'd say that. Well strap in because there are fun times ahead. Don't know how likely it all is, but I heard some clips from my representative (Bill Flores) on the radio this morning talking about spite defundings. poo poo like defunding Air Force One and taking away the president's vacation time or some poo poo like that.
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Dec 1, 2014 20:24
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ReidRansom posted:Well strap in because there are fun times ahead. Don't know how likely it all is, but I heard some clips from my representative (Bill Flores) on the radio this morning talking about spite defundings. poo poo like defunding Air Force One and taking away the president's vacation time or some poo poo like that. I used to be in Flores' district! I left for UT right before Chet Edwards lost.
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Dec 1, 2014 20:26
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Mr Interweb posted:I didn't know evil liberals were attacking poor, defenseless Trig for making the decision to be a stupid, down syndrome baby and choosing to belong to Sarah Palin. With all that said, if I were Obama I'd probably have to sit my kids down and kindly ask them why the gently caress they were acting like that on national TV.
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Dec 1, 2014 20:31
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Badger of Basra posted:I used to be in Flores' district! I left for UT right before Chet Edwards lost. Flores is a turd. But I've got a great job here at A&M, so I'm OK suffering the embarrassment of having a lovely rep. Too bad Chet got hosed out though; he was about as decent as you could get for a largely rural democrat in Texas.
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Dec 1, 2014 20:32
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ReidRansom posted:Well strap in because there are fun times ahead. Don't know how likely it all is, but I heard some clips from my representative (Bill Flores) on the radio this morning talking about spite defundings. poo poo like defunding Air Force One and taking away the president's vacation time or some poo poo like that. Oh man, if they actually manage to do any of this (they won't)....
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Dec 1, 2014 20:33
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ReidRansom posted:Flores is a turd. But I've got a great job here at A&M, so I'm OK suffering the embarrassment of having a lovely rep. Too bad Chet got hosed out though; he was about as decent as you could get for a largely rural democrat in Texas. I think the stat was that he was the Democrat with the most +R PVI district in the country or something, pretty crazy. I volunteered for him in 2006 and 2008, he was a cool guy.
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Dec 1, 2014 20:34
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Badger of Basra posted:I think the stat was that he was the Democrat with the most +R PVI district in the country or something, pretty crazy. I volunteered for him in 2006 and 2008, he was a cool guy. Yeah, I recall that stat coming up a lot during the campaign. And hell, we may have met or at least talked at some point if you were volunteering for him in 08. Small world.
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Dec 1, 2014 20:37
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If republicans do budget shenanigans next year, how could they possibly avoid all the blame? They will control senate and house.
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Dec 1, 2014 20:39
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swampcow posted:If republicans do budget shenanigans next year, how could they possibly avoid all the blame? They will control senate and house. "We sent a bill to the President that funds the government."
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Dec 1, 2014 20:41
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Kalman posted:Absolutely. It just has nothing to do with a guy who is the son of a dead cop being involved in a charity for the children of dead first responders. You're right in that I'm not arguing for a law that tries to establish criteria that disqualifies prosecutors or other agents of the justice system from public office or participation in certain cases based on nebulous criteria of personal histories. But at the very least, the fact that he is openly a major supporter of the police means he was biased about this case from the get-go. Obviously, objectivity is an impossible ideal, and any judge or prosecutor comes to a case with biases. But the pro-police bias is ruining the credibility of the justice system, and clearly some kind of change in personnel is necessary.
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Dec 1, 2014 20:41
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Flip Yr Wig posted:You're right in that I'm not arguing for a law that tries to establish criteria that disqualifies prosecutors or other agents of the justice system from public office or participation in certain cases based on nebulous criteria of personal histories. But at the very least, the fact that he is openly a major supporter of the police means he was biased about this case from the get-go. Obviously, objectivity is an impossible ideal, and any judge or prosecutor comes to a case with biases. But the pro-police bias is ruining the credibility of the justice system, and clearly some kind of change in personnel is necessary. So you think Walker should have recused himself from the Prop8 case? I mean, he's pretty clearly a supporter of gay people and his pro-gay bias is ruining the credibility of the justice system. Again: there are plenty of reasons to criticize McCulloch. Helping run a charity that isn't even police-specific isn't a sympathetic one and it isn't even close to the kind of bias people should worry about. His public statements are plenty - it's not really necessary to target him for something that's unequivocally a good thing to do.
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Dec 1, 2014 20:56
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Joementum posted:"We sent a bill to the President that funds the government." This would anger the same people though.
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Dec 1, 2014 20:56
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Kalman posted:So you think Walker should have recused himself from the Prop8 case? I mean, he's pretty clearly a supporter of gay people and his pro-gay bias is ruining the credibility of the justice system. at least the northern district of california bothered to consider whether walker should have been recused to ensure the process was impartial
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Dec 1, 2014 20:58
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swampcow posted:If republicans do budget shenanigans next year, how could they possibly avoid all the blame? They will control senate and house. Hey have you seen all this data that supports anthropologic climate change?
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Dec 1, 2014 20:59
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Kalman posted:So you think Walker should have recused himself from the Prop8 case? I mean, he's pretty clearly a supporter of gay people and his pro-gay bias is ruining the credibility of the justice system. No, I don't think there is a specific enough legally defensible criteria that would require McColloch to recuse himself, just as there wasn't for Walker. However, McColloch's constituency have every right to be outraged that an elected official represents the interests of the police over the citizens, and if we had a healthy democracy, he would be held accountable to that. There are very good arguments, of course, that this shouldn't even be an elected office, namely, that it typically rewards "tough on crime" candidates, but I'm not sure I feel like digging into that can of worms.
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Dec 1, 2014 21:01
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the lady who criticized obama's daughter has resigned. suck it, hours of prayer.
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Dec 1, 2014 21:01
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ReidRansom posted:Well strap in because there are fun times ahead. Don't know how likely it all is, but I heard some clips from my representative (Bill Flores) on the radio this morning talking about spite defundings. poo poo like defunding Air Force One and taking away the president's vacation time or some poo poo like that. Man, republicans sure hate that a black man is in office. I don't think they ever tried that poo poo with Clinton.
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Dec 1, 2014 21:01
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Jagchosis posted:the lady who criticized obama's daughter has resigned. suck it, hours of prayer. Good.
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Dec 1, 2014 21:02
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