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Disinterested posted:HorseLord has a lot of sympathy for dictators as long as they're not uncool American-sponsored types. I think you'll be waiting a long time for a fan of Stalin to get on the anti-Putin bandwagon. You've got to be seriously delusional to not realise that Putin is a massive imperialist, although I wouldn't be surprised.
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Mar 2, 2015 16:29
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mfcrocker posted:You've got to be seriously delusional to not realise that Putin is a massive imperialist, although I wouldn't be surprised. Tankies still love Mother Russia, even as Russia's crony capitalism makes America look and think they've gone too far.
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Mar 2, 2015 16:33
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"KIEV HOMONAZIS" has been gone over in the Eastern Europe thread so many times it has come to the point even the pro-kremlin trolls don't bother using it anymore. That's how weak a position it is. The Morning Star has some good articles and provides a very different viewpoint to other papers, but yes, there is a tendency to polarise things like the Ukraine crisis, where despite America bad, sometimes, just sometimes, the alternative is worse.
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Mar 2, 2015 16:34
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Now that we're in a position where literally everyone is poo poo, internationalism can finally take off. There's nowhere to run.
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Mar 2, 2015 16:36
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I think Putin is bad. I also think the CIA is bad. I can't tell what stuff is bad Putin and what stuff is bad CIA but I can tell that it's definitely bad.
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Mar 2, 2015 16:37
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Spangly A posted:Now that we're in a position where literally everyone is poo poo, internationalism can finally take off. There's nowhere to run. Maybe we should just use trident and let the planet start over instead
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Mar 2, 2015 16:39
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Jose posted:Maybe we should just use trident and let the planet start over instead Shill for "Big Gum" spotted. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BOmTN6xV5h0
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Mar 2, 2015 16:42
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Jose posted:Maybe we should just use trident and let the planet start over instead Doubt we have enough missiles. We could give Violet Club a solid kick and sort plymouth out though.
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Mar 2, 2015 16:44
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DesperateDan posted:The Morning Star has some good articles and provides a very different viewpoint to other papers, but yes, there is a tendency to polarise things like the Ukraine crisis, where despite America bad, sometimes, just sometimes, the alternative is worse. Pretty much standard in socialist circles really 
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Mar 2, 2015 17:32
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Anglo imperialism is poo poo if you're a third-world country, but if you're a more developed and, let's be perfectly frank, white country, you could do a lot worse than coming under the auspices of Washington and London and all that.
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Mar 2, 2015 17:59
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Disinterested posted:HorseLord has a lot of sympathy for dictators as long as they're not uncool American-sponsored types. I think you'll be waiting a long time for a fan of Stalin to get on the anti-Putin bandwagon. mfcrocker posted:You've got to be seriously delusional to not realise that Putin is a massive imperialist, although I wouldn't be surprised. TinTower posted:Tankies still love Mother Russia, even as Russia's crony capitalism makes America look and think they've gone too far. I actually hate Putin very much, I think the capitalist regime in Russia is disgusting and illegitimate, and I also dislike the fact that the only reason they align themselves with Ukrainian separatists is so they can inevitably stab them in the back as part of their own imperialist schemes. What I'm interested in is why you think because I don't buy the western narrative of events I automatically buy into the capitalist Russia one, especially when I've not voiced any support of Putin or the post soviet collapse Kremin ever in my entire life, never mind this forum. I'm not actually surprised that you jump to this, though, UKMT is a thread for milquetoast liberals who've a hardon for communist symbolism but only actually want the kind of 'socialism' which looks suspiciously just like capitalism but with the trains nationalized again and higher benefits payments. HorseLord fucked around with this message at 18:24 on Mar 2, 2015 |
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Mar 2, 2015 18:18
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HorseLord posted:I actually hate Putin very much, I think the capitalist regime in Russia is disgusting and illegitimate, and I also dislike the fact that the only reason they align themselves with Ukrainian separatists is so they can inevitably stab them in the back as part of their own imperialist schemes. Mmmhmm. And yet you have argued that the Russian invasion of Crimea was effectively a legitimate act because 'Crimea is Russia', and have essentially argued that the seperatist militias are hardy communists fighting the fascist Ukranian menace. I don't think we'll take it amiss if you avoid UKMT because you think we're dangerous compromisers for not loving Stalin or whatever your moronic badposting persona roots for. Disinterested fucked around with this message at 18:26 on Mar 2, 2015 |
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Mar 2, 2015 18:23
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Disinterested posted:Mmmhmm. And yet you have argued that the Russian invasion of Crimea was effectively a legitimate act because 'Crimea is Russia', and have essentially argued that the seperatist militias are hardy communists fighting the fascist Ukranian menace. Crimea is Russia and Crimea's government decided on joining Russia, which they can do, because they're Crimea's government. It's a simple matter of self determination, which is a thing Lenin was big on. Weather their choice is wise or not I have no right to condemn it. There are explicitly communist regiments and battalions in the union of people's republics' military, this is literally, actually true and factual. Further, 68 seats out of 100 in the Donetsk Soviet are held by the Communist Donetsk Republic party. Sorry reality has a communist bias. HorseLord fucked around with this message at 18:45 on Mar 2, 2015 |
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Mar 2, 2015 18:28
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HorseLord posted:I have a bias against reality. HorseLord posted:Crimea is Russia and Crimea's government decided on joining Russia, which they can do, because they're Crimea's government. You conveniently miss out the fact that the government that assented to referendum and annexation was installed by Russia after an invasion, and was led by what had previously been the minority party. Whether or not the referendum was a reflection of public opinion is very suspect (as in, at the very least the margin probably would have been very much closer if not for military occupation and other forms of manipulation). HorseLord posted:It's a simple matter of self determination, which is a thing Lenin was big on. Don't try to feed me this nonsense. Marxism-Leninism is not in rude health in Donetsk. In fact, some of this poo poo is an undoing of Lenin's legacy - Lenin was very conscious of historic Russian attempts to poo poo all over Ukraine and thoroughly encouraged the development of Ukranian culture. The current Russian policy is, meanwhile, strongly in accord with the Stalinist policy with respect to Ukraine. The proper Leninist position would be to reject the conflict entirely. HorseLord posted:There are explicitly communist regiments and battalions in the union of people's republics' military, this is literally, actually true and factual. Further, 68 seats out of 100 in the Donetsk Soviet are held by the Communist Donetsk Republic party. Sorry reality has a communist bias. 11 are held by the Communist party proper. I am not overly impressed with the communist credentials of these communist parties, particularly given their rather-stronger-than-Leninist nationalisms. Both sides, it is admitted by everyone, are composed of an unpleasant mixture of individuals. Nobody denies fascists are fighting on the Ukranian side. They also fight on the seperatist side. But if you think the company you keep really matters, you should be as embarrassed as I, since fascists (some of whom are bankrolled by Putin) around Europe are largely on the Russian side on this one!
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Mar 2, 2015 19:05
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HorseLord posted:Crimea is Russia and Crimea's government decided on joining Russia, which they can do, because they're Crimea's government. It's a simple matter of self determination, which is a thing Lenin was big on. Weather their choice is wise or not I have no right to condemn it. That was that time where putins men seized the regional parliament, and deputies "voted for a referendum". So far as we know, because cameras were not allowed anywhere near it by those guys with guns that putin sent, but they were all totes honest guys. Then there was that referendum that was literally held under the gun by said armed men, even when propaganda outlets were claiming there no armed men (while said armed men wandered in and out of camera shot). Really legit. Is the reason you are doing this here because you know how well it would go in the Eastern Europe thread?
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Mar 2, 2015 19:09
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DesperateDan posted:That was that time where putins men seized the regional parliament, and deputies "voted for a referendum". So far as we know, because cameras were not allowed anywhere near it by those guys with guns that putin sent, but they were all totes honest guys. Then there was that referendum that was literally held under the gun by said armed men, even when propaganda outlets were claiming there no armed men (while said armed men wandered in and out of camera shot). Be more interesting and say it was aliens.
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Mar 2, 2015 19:15
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DesperateDan posted:Is the reason you are doing this here because you know how well it would go in the Eastern Europe thread? He's tried and he gets shot down and then tries again in a new thread. He'll opine at length about how the starvation of Ukranians under Stalin was not intentional or targeted, and about how Stalin was generally a cool guy, if prompted. He is the kind of person who gives communism a bad name - and ironically makes Full Communism all the more unlikely for all his efforts to defend it.
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Mar 2, 2015 19:17
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HorseLord posted:
This guy gets it.
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Mar 2, 2015 19:29
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EmptyVessel posted:Caught this in passing earlier today. George Orwell described the key English characteristics as gentleness, hypocrisy and kindness towards animals.
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Mar 2, 2015 19:35
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HorseLord posted:Be more interesting and say it was aliens. What, you mean where people watched the seizure on livestreams, noted that the dudes that came on helicopters from russia with russian uniforms and the very latest in russian kit might just be russians, then even putin admitted sending in the troops after the focus had shifted? I don't think they saw aliens.
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Mar 2, 2015 19:36
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HorseLord posted:What I'm interested in is why you think because I don't buy the western narrative of events I automatically buy into the capitalist Russia one, especially when I've not voiced any support of Putin or the post soviet collapse Kremin ever in my entire life, never mind this forum. Calling it a NATO-backed junta is pretty much Russia's current narrative buddy. Also loving lol that if you're not a loving Russia-worshipping Stalinist that you must be a milquetoast liberal. You're the actualisation of what PWM thinks the UKMT is. Kudos, that takes some work.
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Mar 2, 2015 19:41
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He is.
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Mar 2, 2015 19:44
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Good news everyone! The DWP has decided that when it comes to immigrants' children who live back in their home country, welfare support payments are actually the responsibility of the country where the immigrant works!quote:Eight-year-old at the centre of a benefits row
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Mar 2, 2015 19:48
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 wow much marketing, such fail
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Mar 2, 2015 20:12
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Mahmoud Ahmadinejad posted:
is this real Surely that's not real
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Mar 2, 2015 20:14
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i bet it's real, and it's probably going to be fairly effective, too
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Mar 2, 2015 20:16
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You know they'll get some votes purely for that gently caress I just had a nightmare vision of election campaigns run solely through memes
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Mar 2, 2015 20:17
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I would hope that anybody old enough to vote would be mature enough to be sick of that loving meme.
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Mar 2, 2015 20:23
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Well, you would, but life is full of disappointments. Like, I still meet people going "Challenge accepted" unironically
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Mar 2, 2015 20:24
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HorseLord posted:I'm not actually surprised that you jump to this, though, UKMT is a thread for milquetoast liberals who've a hardon for communist symbolism but only actually want the kind of 'socialism' which looks suspiciously just like capitalism but with the trains nationalized again and higher benefits payments. You say that like it's a bad thing.
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Mar 2, 2015 20:58
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I would like to know if HorseLord supports North Korea as they oppose American imperialism (this is something the CPGB-ML actually espouse).
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Mar 2, 2015 20:59
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A meme is no different from a catchphrase or a soundbite. *monorail cat picture* You hear that mister Anderson? That is the sound of inevitability.
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Mar 2, 2015 21:07
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Pork Pie Hat posted:Except for the part where those few locals are doing part of the job of the strikers. That's totally not undermining the point of the strike at all. What about a strike called by the Ulster Workers Council? Not all strikes are equal.
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Mar 2, 2015 21:07
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Vote Tory....FTW
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Mar 2, 2015 21:11
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All your kids are belong to us?
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Mar 2, 2015 21:16
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V. Illych L. posted:i bet it's real, and it's probably going to be fairly effective, too The best way to appeal to the masses is to act like them. Even if it is poo poo.
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Mar 2, 2015 21:30
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Personally I'm looking forward to the leadership debates opening with a 'spontaneous' Gangnam Style dance.
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Mar 2, 2015 21:38
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StoneOfShame posted:I would like to know if HorseLord supports North Korea as they oppose American imperialism (this is something the CPGB-ML actually espouse). HorseLord is Maoist-Rebel-News-Two, confirmed.
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Mar 2, 2015 21:45
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E: double post
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Mar 2, 2015 21:46
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baka kaba posted:You know they'll get some votes purely for that 
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Mar 2, 2015 21:53
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