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Sub Rosa posted:I did have that thought, but isn't it a verifiable claim that doesn't help scum if true? Sub Rosa posted:Or I guess maybe the question is if it isn't true, could the power gained from baiting charges with a fake claim be greater than being outed and lunched when we know it wasn't true? I loving hate setup spec in games. Even moreso in weird mod big games because nothing here is standard. Since you're a newbie though, the power could be literally anything. Some old games gave the scum an extra kill for certain parameters being met, so yeah taking it at face value is dumb.
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May 30, 2020 23:08
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| # ? Jun 1, 2024 18:41 |
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Tom Tucker posted:Had to go back and check who did it look how trusting this is scum implicitly trust claims because they know they have all the (or most of) the liars. Why would you just trust a weird miller vote them to empower claim otherwise. This seems like a really forced and bad read, the claim was the power to let town talk at night, something that would quickly either be proved to be true or outed as a falsehood outright. ##vote Tom Tucker
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May 30, 2020 23:08
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If I was gonna WIFOM you all I wouldn't have claimed and would've just breadcrumbed miller How's that for some WIFOM
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May 30, 2020 23:08
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Consider a scum group that can choose to allow the town to talk at night. They also have a scum member who gets bonus roleblocks or becomes untraceable if they end the day with a certain number of votes. Gee wiz just tell the town that Bobs town talking role is actually Squiggs let Squiggs get votes power him up say he let the town talk now his role is “too townie to be scum” hey throw a miller claim on there too just in case. Just a hypothetical but this is all in service of pointing out that Steak is scum due to his response.
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May 30, 2020 23:10
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Nep-Nep posted:This seems like a really forced and bad read, the claim was the power to let town talk at night, something that would quickly either be proved to be true or outed as a falsehood outright. If you think that’s the case then you have a failure of imagination. I can think of a dozen ways scum claim this, it’s confirmed, and they waltz away based on lazy thinking.
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May 30, 2020 23:11
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From my perspective all of these people debating about me having an alternative vote condition must have some sweet powers I'm compensating for
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May 30, 2020 23:12
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Tom Tucker posted:Consider a scum group that can choose to allow the town to talk at night. They also have a scum member who gets bonus roleblocks or becomes untraceable if they end the day with a certain number of votes. Ah, I see what you are saying. DGK2000 posted:so yeah taking it at face value is dumb. Yeah, that's why I'm trying to get how it works explained as much as possible. So again, Squiggly Sub Rosa posted:I'm guessing choosing to do so is a night action. So then if you choose to do so the night of day one, would it actually be night of day two we would be able to talk?
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May 30, 2020 23:15
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I had to ask for mod clarification which is why I haven't answered it. Unless it says somewhere in the OP when magic powers can be used it wasn't stated in my PM
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May 30, 2020 23:16
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Tom Tucker posted:If you think that’s the case then you have a failure of imagination. I can think of a dozen ways scum claim this, it’s confirmed, and they waltz away based on lazy thinking. I agree that Squiggly having the ability would not 100% prove his alignment but it would prove that he wasn't lying about that aspect of it, and that isn't really the point of my vote on you I think your reasoning for assuming Steak was acting in a scummy way in that spot was not good reasoning and I think that was a scummy case.
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May 30, 2020 23:19
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Okay speedy mod, I misread and actually start with two charges but only use one to let town talk at night. I have to use it at night for the following night
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May 30, 2020 23:20
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So, theoretically, you can create twilight twice as of right now? Once for N1 before N1 begins, or you can only start using it on N2 after activating a charge N1?
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May 30, 2020 23:21
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Twilight is such an insignificant power I’m not too plussed by this
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May 30, 2020 23:22
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N1 for N2 but then I could theoretically use it if people vote me at end of day for the rest of the game and still have a surplus charge
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May 30, 2020 23:22
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Sandwolf posted:Twilight is such an insignificant power I’m not too plussed by this That's what I'm saying
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May 30, 2020 23:23
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Nep-Nep posted:I agree that Squiggly having the ability would not 100% prove his alignment but it would prove that he wasn't lying about that aspect of it, and that isn't really the point of my vote on you I think your reasoning for assuming Steak was acting in a scummy way in that spot was not good reasoning and I think that was a scummy case. Well then you’re wrong but go for it. Ignore the speculation about Squiggs role. It’s irrelevant. Someone in the thread claimed a super weird miller vote needed empowered role. Steak didn’t ask questions, he didn’t follow up, he didn’t scratch his chin, he didn’t even say he believed Squiggs or why - he just said “that’s a cool role”. Who in the town is going to take an absurd claim at face value and not even pause for a moment. Scum. Why? Because they have no reason to doubt it. Steak didn’t say “I’d that’s your role” or “sounds legit” or “worth a shot” he jumped right to accepting the claim at face value.
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May 30, 2020 23:24
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Okay, I get what you're saying. I don't think that's the scumslip you think it is but hearing your thought processes that sounds less forced than I first read it. ##unvote
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May 30, 2020 23:28
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In all fairness, Tom has a point which is why I thought steak was voting me for being a miller and was sarcastic about his cool power part It did not strike me as a genuine post
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May 30, 2020 23:28
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Tom Tucker posted:Well then you’re wrong but go for it. Ignore the speculation about Squiggs role. It’s irrelevant. Someone in the thread claimed a super weird miller vote needed empowered role. implicitly believing his claim is more suspicious than if i said the same thing but preceded by "i believe squiggly"...? i get what you're saying, but "'makes sense" very much does not = "true", so... yeah
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May 30, 2020 23:34
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Mr. Steak posted:implicitly believing his claim is more suspicious than if i said the same thing but preceded by "i believe squiggly"...? i get what you're saying, but "'makes sense" very much does not = "true", so... yeah 100% yes it’s more scummy that’s my whole point and I’m glad you’re on the record with that and not that it was just a quickly worded post!
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May 30, 2020 23:36
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Tom Tucker posted:100% yes it’s more scummy that’s my whole point and I’m glad you’re on the record with that and not that it was just a quickly worded post! ok yea, for the record i believed squiggly at face value
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May 30, 2020 23:37
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Is accepting claims at face value how you typically play Mafia?
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May 30, 2020 23:52
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Sub Rosa posted:Is accepting claims at face value how you typically play Mafia? i dont do anything the same way regardless of context. so no, i neither typically do or don't play mafia by accepting claims at face value
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May 30, 2020 23:55
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...which was worded in a totally nonsense way but whatever. i believe squiggly cuz whats the harm in believing him? he's also now said he already has 2 shots of the ability, so theres no need to do the thing that scum-squigga would be tempting us to do
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May 30, 2020 23:56
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im also generally of the assumption that flatly believing claims is more harmful to scum than otherwise. i mean, just speaking from personal experience as scum, i've faced the most annoying difficulties when someone is treated as having a confirmed role, and am sitting much more comfortably when town is overly critical of any claims
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May 30, 2020 23:59
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It's super suspicious to me that you are attempting to justify your no-thought acceptance of a claim with a bunch of theorycrafting about whether it's good for town to act in a certain way of not. It feels like you are dragging this into a question again about whether to believe Squiggs or not and not the conversation I want to have about YOUR knee-jerk reaction, which was independent of all of this after-the-fact theorizing. You saw a claim, you believed it wholesale with no hesitation, to the point where you voted for someone who claimed to get empowered through votes. That instantaneous reaction, amid other players' reactions, stands out:Sandwolf posted:for the most part I believe Squiggly’s claim Sub Rosa posted:Can you clarify if this means you need two votes on you at the end of the day, or just at some point in the day? Do they need to be at the same time if not at the same point in the day? These are much more townie posts because they show thought and curiosity and doubt. When someone claims the first gear that turns in a townie's head is "do I believe this?" - you can either say yes or no (Sandwolf) or ask for more info (Sub Rosa), and then at that point it's a second gear that engages in order to act on that conclusion. In Steak's case this gear was entirely skipped because scum don't need it - they don't need to internally or externally interrogate claims because they have no (or at least much LESS) reason to ask "do I believe this?".
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May 31, 2020 01:17
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I'm currently wondering how town magic users gain charges. Voting for the winning vote getter, or over time are my best guesses. Using a different power of theirs has also come up as a possibility.
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May 31, 2020 01:25
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Maigius posted:I'm currently wondering how town magic users gain charges. Voting for the winning vote getter, or over time are my best guesses. Using a different power of theirs has also come up as a possibility. Scum could regain by performing the NK, if that is not the power itself.
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May 31, 2020 01:26
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Maigius posted:I'm currently wondering how town magic users gain charges. Voting for the winning vote getter, or over time are my best guesses. Using a different power of theirs has also come up as a possibility. ##vote Maigius
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May 31, 2020 01:33
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eh, i dont feel the need to justify myself. but the discussion made me go on a little tangent
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May 31, 2020 01:34
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Each one is probably unique and setup spec is not helpful Squiggly has indirectly claimed to be a magic user who gets charged from having at least two people voting for him during the day. According to him he starts with 2 charges and it takes 1 to let us talk so there's no reason to charge him up since he has enough to let us talk N2 and N3.
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May 31, 2020 01:35
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Tom Tucker posted:These are much more townie posts because they show thought and curiosity and doubt. When someone claims the first gear that turns in a townie's head is "do I believe this?" - you can either say yes or no (Sandwolf) or ask for more info (Sub Rosa), and then at that point it's a second gear that engages in order to act on that conclusion. anyway, i find it interesting that you think scum would have no "gears" about how they want to respond to something like squiggly's post. can you walk me through exactly what might have been going through my scum mind when i was writing my response to squigg's claim?
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May 31, 2020 01:38
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Maigius posted:I'm currently wondering how town magic users gain charges. Voting for the winning vote getter, or over time are my best guesses. Using a different power of theirs has also come up as a possibility. is there a particular reason you specified "town" here?
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May 31, 2020 01:39
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Votecount for Day 1  Spoonsy (3): LordNad, Mr. Humalong (2): CapitalistPig, Spoonsy Scientastic (2): Voodoofly, Jose Valasquez (2): CapnAndy, Mr. Steak, Jose Valasquez, Pussy Quipped (1): b-minus1, Mr. Steak, Sandwolf (1): Scientastic, Sub Rosa (1): Sandwolf Mr. Steak (1): Scientastic, CapnAndy (1): Scientastic, Pussy Quipped, CapitalistPig, Sub Rosa, Nep-Nep (1): hambeet dmboogie (1): Nep-Nep, Jose Valasquez, xopods (1): SalTheBard Maigius (1): xopods, Scientastic, Jeabus Mahogany (0): Mr. Steak, CapitalistPig (0): dmboogie, Mr. Humalong, Tom Tucker (0): Voodoofly, Squiggly (0): Voodoofly, merk (0): Sub Rosa, Voodoofly (0): Spoonsy, Not Voting (8): cheese sandwich, LordNad, Maigius, merk, MisterJed, Nep-Nep, Squiggly, Sub RosaWith 26 alive, it's 14 votes to execute. The current deadline is June 01st, 2020 at 6 p.m. EDT -- that's in about 1 day, 21 hours.
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May 31, 2020 01:50
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Tom Tucker posted:These are much more townie posts because they show thought and curiosity and doubt. When someone claims the first gear that turns in a townie's head is "do I believe this?" - you can either say yes or no (Sandwolf) or ask for more info (Sub Rosa), and then at that point it's a second gear that engages in order to act on that conclusion. What's bugging me is how Squiggly has shifted the claim around since then. Now he starts with charges so he doesn't need those votes, and apparently it's not night, it's twilight? It's not enough to vote him, but it's bugging me.
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May 31, 2020 01:52
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Oh no the lovely posts are getting longer and longer
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May 31, 2020 02:02
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CapnAndy posted:I disagree in this case. Squiggly's initial claim is inherently provable; he says it takes two votes to let the town talk at night. This is very low risk -- two votes is nothing with 24 people alive -- and then either the town can talk at night or not, and either way we'll know if he was telling the truth or not. I don't blame Steak at all for going along with it, it seems low risk for a pretty good benefit, because either the town gets to talk, which is good, or we've found a liar, which is very good. It sounded mistaken. I don't see any reason to charge him though. He has enough for the next two nights. If it's helpful, it's easy enough to charge him later. That said ##vote Maigius Nothing but setup spec and then what looks like an actual scumslip
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May 31, 2020 02:05
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I can’t read posts longer than a few sentences it’s only d1 ffs
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May 31, 2020 02:05
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Mr. Humalong posted:Oh no the lovely posts are getting longer and longer Mr. Humalong posted:Lazy players would love a cop to follow, especially on day 1. Shame on you. Mr. Humalong posted:As a bulletproof, strongman, brutal gunsmith I will be investigating each and everyone one of my suspects.
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May 31, 2020 02:23
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Mr. Steak posted:is there a particular reason you specified "town" here? lol scum found ##vote maigius
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May 31, 2020 02:30
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| # ? Jun 1, 2024 18:41 |
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I haven't checked the thread since thursday and holy hell are there posts. Could someone helpfully summarize what has happened so far
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May 31, 2020 02:31
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