Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Locked thread
Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens

nvining posted:

I'm not totally sure what to make of the fact that when we write serious, useful posts about things like design decisions and the building of systems, we get "huh" and when I go off the rails after a frustrating day in the code mines, I get a million comments along the lines of "Best Post Ever."

People's comments that we should just leave everything in and ship it have been duly noted. :)
The serious posts are super interesting to read but there's not necessarily much we can say about them. People can generate an infinite stream of babble about non-euclidean chickens though.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens
I'm sure I've seen this come up elsewhere and the dev's respone was My Games was introduced in Vista, so it didn't really take off as everyone stuck with the old method. IIRC that's why it's standard for GFWL, because even if you're running XP GFWL will have made the directory.

Of course, XP-compatibility may not be a priority these days.

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens
Gabions are now some sort of horrifying deathtrap for their builders. If you order multiple, your whole military will lay down their arms and pick up shovels whilst they build. Should they come across a Loathsome Fishman en route (say, whilst collecting logs yet to be stockpiled) they'll just flee, refusing to drop their tools or go pick up a rifle. I've had multiple proud soldiers of the Empire chased to the bounds of the map and hacked to death with coral axes because of this.

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens
Work parties so seem a little reluctant to actually do their workshop jobs this patch- my chefs & woodworkers have farming on so they can collect food & bamboo when out of supplies, but instead spend all their time on it.

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens
Is there a downside to unhappiness now? Previously unhappiness led to cults and then to murder, right?

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens

nvining posted:

Oh yes, this happened last night:

https://community.gaslampgames.com/threads/revision-36c-now-in-experimental-branch.12509/

I will now go fix a save game with fifteen different bugs in it because why not.

Great so far- one thing though, resources committed to something under construction (but not yet built) still count as being in your stockpile. I tried building 2 buildings, each requiring 6 bricks, with a 10-brick standing order on and ended up stuck for no obvious reason.

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens
Thanks!

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens
It doesn't seem like you can use bamboo for planks, but my colonists don't realise that and keep lugging it up to the carpentry bench, then to the stockpile, then back.

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens

nvining posted:

So THAT's where the meat is coming from! *files ticket*
Also RE: containers, colonists seem to prefer to stack objects *then* put the full stack in a stockpile, which is usually inefficient. Also hauling military won't interrupt their job if they come under attack either.

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens
Burial just seems to confuse my colonists. I've got 6 uncancellable 'Bury Body' jobs that keep flickering between colonists for <1s or so and never getting done.

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens

Wipfmetz posted:

What's the benefit of Pumpkin Pies, btw? I spend 1 wheat and 1 pumpkin for 1 pie, when I could have 2 bread and 2 stews for the same input.
Presumably food will be classed at some point?

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens
Hm. How is negotiation with Fishmen supposed to go? They keep sending envoy parties, who then attack my crops and get hassled off. I don't have the option to switch to allowing crop destruction or to switch to the 'kill 'em all' policy either...

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens
Loving the creepy Obeliskian stone circles- I hope we get to mine and use the stone at some point. I'd happily make an Obeliskian brick oven if it cooks faster.

However, in the current build I keep getting mysterious hangs where colonists simply walk in place. Menu options don't work, the game doesn't respond to alt-f4, only killing the process in task manager will close it (not even 'End task').
A save from just before my latest colony locks up is here.

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens

LeJackal posted:

Well, combat still seems to be borked. My squad just stands around as bandits stab them in the back.
I think they'll only engage at max range. I've had squads fleeing to a set distance constantly as the bandits moved and only shoot once the bandits stopped and spent a few seconds picking up loot.

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens

Legin Noslen posted:

In my opinion the biggest pain in the rear end is housing, or rather trying to make enough enormous 7x11 lower-class bunkhouses or tiny 5x5 middle-class houses so that nobody has to sleep on the floor.
I think this is a good point. Compare to DF- bedrooms are quick to dig out, and the furniture is built from plentiful basic resources at a starting workshop. Setting up beds is just a quick diversion from the fun of teching up your colony. Plus, as building is fast and dwarves arrive slowly, you can spend a little extra time to build more bedrooms in advance or make them larger/fancier.

In CE, housing requires multiple resources that are slow and labour-intensive to acquire (stone and flax), and requires one be processed in a specially-built workshop. It eats up a substantial portion of your colony's industrial capacity for quite a long time. In addition, because construction is slow and colonists arrive quickly (at least early-game) you perpetually feel behind and don't have the time to do anything fun with housing. It becomes a chore, not something you have control over.

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens

Alavaria posted:

Flax and textile workshop are gone now,
Oh, that's good news! I missed that.

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens
How does farming work now? I built a chili farm, it works sort of sensibly- workers pour labour in, plants are planted, grow, harvest, disappear, are re-planted. Which seems a bit weird given they're labelled 'annual' but hey, I'm not complaining.

I planted a field of tea, it took weeks to grow, provided one harvest, then just got stuck on fully-grown plants and never gave up another harvest? I thought that maybe it was a bug with just that field, so I built a coconut field and it's on step 5: growing- constantly filling up the work counter and ticking back down to 0. Is that... per tree? Do I have to hit a full growth ticker per tree before it goes onto harvesting?

Does time play any role in harvesting now or is it just labour in -> food out when it hits the cap? We can still assign multiple fields to a work team but when I did that for my full 5-person chili team they just kept working on their tiny plot.

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens
Farms are definitely broken. My coconut farm gets to 88/88 Labour on Growing Stage 7/7, then *poof* all the coconuts vanish and it cycles back to 5/7. I've put a save on dropbox here: https://www.dropbox.com/s/38jjmo1uiz0eva2/ClockworkEmpires-038.zip?dl=0

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens

nvining posted:

That said, we explicitly tried it the other way (with global queues) and it was just a hideous mess that pissed off everybody for an entirely different set of reasons, and we're certainly not doing per-module queues and job lists for the exact same reason - it will still confuse everybody as to "hey, why are you making 50 planks when nothing else is getting done, and what's going and why" except multiplied by every module in your workshop. So it seems like the issue is that you can't have as many workbenches or whatevers for the things you want to queue up without incurring a massive happiness penalty?
Honestly I'd prefer if there was a truly global list that the colonists did automatically. Currently, building a bed requires you to order the bed to be built, then order it to be placed. It'd make more sense if ordering a bed to be placed automatically put 'build bed' in the jobs list (that we see for foraging, construction etc.) and you could rearrange the priority of that list. Then explicitly ordering things through the workshop could just be for trade goods. You never have to duplicate orders and you feel more like a supervisor than micromanager. Handling food/booze this way would be hard though (1 job per person per day by their class?).

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens
Decor is still... odd. I really don't get the point of it at the moment.

If you built Wooden Decor at a Carpentry from planks and constructing a Cabinet required 1x Wooden Decor, then that'd be fine. It wouldn't work as well with the trade system as boxed goods, but it's probably good enough to just sell 'Wooden Decor' to traders.
If you built a Boxed Cabinet at a Carpentry from planks and constructing a Cabinet required a Boxed Cabinet, then that'd be fine. More fiddly, as you have to keep going back and making new requests for different types of cabinets as you can't keep a standing order for each type open without a huge workshop with a rock-bottom Quality, but fine.

Now...
You have to build Decor at your Carpentry from planks. Then build a Boxed Cabinet from the same workbench from Decor. Then place the cabinet. Why are there 3 steps, not 2? All it seems to add is the ability for you to make any decor out of wood OR glass OR stone & clay. But doesn't that just remove a lot of the distinction of biomes and different start locations anyway? You can build a clay pot from wooden planks, or a barometer from stone, which means that colonies that're wood-poor but stone-rich look exactly like those in a verdant forest.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens
It probably didn't help they kept having to rewrite lots of fundamental stuff. Stockpiles, workshops, memories, the job system... they kept changing pretty late on in development.

  • Locked thread