|
OneThousandMonkeys posted:Why are we even talking about watching prequels that do nothing but cheapen the actual good movies? Keep them out of the order. They're loving horrible movies. Agreed. Leaving the origins a mystery or just making up whatever you want is a better choice than watching them.
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2012 20:05
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 12, 2024 17:57 |
|
|
Any credibility to this rumor? 'Darth Vader to be Resurrected' http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/357610/Darth-Vader-to-be-resurrected The article cites only 'industry insiders.' e: VVV I highly doubt it's credible; I guess what I meant to ask is whether or not anyone else has heard this completely unsubstantiated rumor. Slate Action fucked around with this message at 20:20 on Nov 12, 2012 |
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2012 20:08
|
|
|
Why do you think there is any credibility?
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2012 20:16
|
|
|
Slate Action posted:Any credibility to this rumor? 'Darth Vader to be Resurrected' The only thing that would make this anything resembling plausible is if they did indeed go with Tano as the villain. They could have a single scene in the past with Vader and Tano. I don't think that's very likely at all but anything is possible where Star Wars in concerned.
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2012 20:31
|
|
|
Strange Matter posted:That's why the 4,5,1,2,3,6 order is the only one that makes sense. So much is revealed in Empire-- Yoda, the Emperor, Luke's parentage-- all of which are spoiled completely by watching the prequels first. In fact, Yoda in the prequels actually kind of makes sense if you watch Empire first and interpret his character arc as Empire showing a humbled, enlightened Yoda who suffered his entire world view being upended and set on fire. It makes prequel Yoda as unenlightened and spritually enfeebled as the rest of the Jedi, and the only reason he survives is because he is the most powerful. It makes both Episode 5 and 3 even more nihilistic than they already are, which is sort of awesome I guess. Actually the only order that makes sense is 4, 5, 6.
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2012 21:24
|
|
|
Friendly Factory posted:Actually the only order that makes sense is 4, 5, 6. By which you mean, 4,5.
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2012 21:30
|
|
|
Madurai posted:By which you mean, 4,5. And you really mean 4.
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2012 21:36
|
|
|
Unless you're like Alec Guinness and think they're all just storybook trash! Jedi was worth all the Ewoks for the confrontation between Luke, Vader and the Emperor.
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2012 21:52
|
|
|
More directors on possibility of Star Wars: JJ Abrams has given a definite "no" saying that he's too busy with Star Trek. Guillermo del Toro has said he hasn't even been offered but if he was he'd be too busy.
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2012 22:23
|
|
|
OneThousandMonkeys posted:Why are we even talking about watching prequels that do nothing but cheapen the actual good movies? Keep them out of the order. They're loving horrible movies. I haven't watched Episodes 2 or 3 since they were in theaters. That doesn't mean I can't still feel terrible that they exist.
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2012 22:31
|
|
|
computer parts posted:And you really mean 4. That's my favorite, but I can't deny 5 is a better film.
|
|
#
?
Nov 12, 2012 23:48
|
|
|
The correct pro order is actually 0,5,6 -> 1,2,3,4SE,5SE,6SE. The theatrical versions of the original trilogy are wholly distinct from the 'special editions' and subsequent altered releases.
|
|
#
?
Nov 13, 2012 00:36
|
|
|
SuperMechagodzilla posted:The correct pro order is actually 0,5,6 -> 1,2,3,4SE,5SE,6SE.
|
|
#
?
Nov 13, 2012 00:49
|
|
|
The number of likely directors continues to be winnowed down. Brad Bird has announced on Twitter that he will not be directing.
|
|
#
?
Nov 18, 2012 23:19
|
|
vote_no posted:This is a delightful analysis of the Force, and I think more accurately describes why the Yoda fight in the prequel was so hated -- it wasn't only that it seemed ridiculous, it was that it was completely out of character. Another interesting thing to note about the Emperor using Force Lightning is that, A: up until that point, someone fresh to the series would think the Emperor is just another frail old relic like Yoda, long removed from combative prowess and reduced to the point of philosophical exposition, and B: Force lightning is so thoroughly removed from anything any character has done with the Force, that the exact moment it happens is completely shocking to the viewer. Something I always liked about Star Wars before the prequels was that the Sith and the Dark Side weren't just palette-swapped Jedi with a few extra powers, they were pursuants of this strange, twisted knowledge, giving up their humanity in exchange for power unlike anything the force could give them. When Luke, Yoda, or Ben use the force, it's relatively naturalistic; enhancing one's reflexes, enhancing your empathic connections with others, and bringing yourself to inner harmony. The most impressive displays of force by Jedi are prophetic visions, and being able to defy physics to move objects with your mind is seen as being the very edge of the Force's power, done only by its most gifted or skilled adherents. Compare this to Vader and the Emperor: Vader uses the force to turn the bodies of his victims against themselves, and the Emperor literally defies anything seen before. Vader and Palpatine are more than just fallen jedi, they're akin to dark sorcerers out of a Robert E. Howard story. When the Emperor starts throwing literal lightning from his hands, he has completely gone beyond what the audience is used to the Force being able to do; he's not moving objects or receiving divination, he's not enhancing the natural strengths of his mortal body, he is literally generating dark energy to torture his victim. Hell, disregarding the EU and the prequels, you could make an argument that the Emperor throwing lightning isn't even an expression of the Force at all, but some strange power the Emperor has learned and mastered from decades of researching forbidden knowledge. One could easily believe that "Dark Side" is merely a metaphorical term, completely independent from force ability, to describe those who have turned away from the Jedi's search for enlightenment to amass power for themselves from any and every source available, no matter the cost. I suppose that, personally, this is my biggest problem with the prequels, that they completely dissolve any of the mysticism of the Dark side and the powers it implies. The emperor no longer throws lightning because he is an ancient sorcerer versed in forbidden knowledge; he throws lightning because that's what Dark Side practitioners do. Vader's lightsaber is red, not because he chose to make it so, but simply because the Sith have a dress code. The emperor is not an impossibly ancient old man, The Dark Side just rots your body, and Vader's mechanical enhancements are the result of a single battle, not a potentially deliberate choice to dehumanize himself in search of greater combat prowess. SuperMechagodzilla posted:The correct pro order is actually 0,5,6 -> 1,2,3,4SE,5SE,6SE. I personally prefer 0, 5, 2, 3, 6, myself.
|
|
|
#
?
Nov 19, 2012 00:04
|
|
|
muscles like this? posted:The number of likely directors continues to be winnowed down. Brad Bird has announced on Twitter that he will not be directing. I really wondering what they're motivations are. Is this like Before Watchmen where DC ran through a list of comic authors who rejected the proposal out of respect for Alan Moore and felt it was a cash-in? It still attracted some top-notch talent, but the number of people they went through and the names that they had wanted was pretty glaring.
|
|
#
?
Nov 19, 2012 00:20
|
|
Young Freud posted:I really wondering what they're motivations are. Is this like Before Watchmen where DC ran through a list of comic authors who rejected the proposal out of respect for Alan Moore and felt it was a cash-in? It still attracted some top-notch talent, but the number of people they went through and the names that they had wanted was pretty glaring. They may just be trying to stop the flow of fan/hate mail and "ideas" that will storm any likely director before it happens. I doubt that the director they go with is looking forward to waking up every day for the next 9 years to a pile of cheeto-dust-stained letters and e-mails full of nerd rage and terrible suggestions.
|
|
|
#
?
Nov 19, 2012 00:24
|
|
|
mr. stefan posted:Another interesting thing to note about the Emperor using Force Lightning is that, A: up until that point, someone fresh to the series would think the Emperor is just another frail old relic like Yoda, long removed from combative prowess and reduced to the point of philosophical exposition, and B: Force lightning is so thoroughly removed from anything any character has done with the Force, that the exact moment it happens is completely shocking to the viewer. Well said. I agree completely. The lightning also appears as completely overwhelming; Yoda says that Luke requires no more training, so it would seem this power is irresistible -- a manifestation, like you say, of the awesome power of the Emperor. Then, in the prequels, it turns out you can just absorb it. Oh, OK.
|
|
#
?
Nov 19, 2012 01:27
|
|
|
Slate Action posted:Any credibility to this rumor? 'Darth Vader to be Resurrected' It's been confirmed Vader will appear through a video diary.
|
|
#
?
Nov 19, 2012 03:16
|
|
|
Warm und Fuzzy posted:It's been confirmed Vader will appear through a video diary. Darth Vader: Sith Lord, Father, Video Blogger.
|
|
#
?
Nov 19, 2012 03:34
|
|
|
SuperShadow confirmed it!
|
|
#
?
Nov 19, 2012 08:21
|
|
|
mr. stefan posted:Another interesting thing to note about the Emperor using Force Lightning is that, A: up until that point, someone fresh to the series would think the Emperor is just another frail old relic like Yoda, long removed from combative prowess and reduced to the point of philosophical exposition, and B: Force lightning is so thoroughly removed from anything any character has done with the Force, that the exact moment it happens is completely shocking to the viewer. Can you write the next 3 movies? Seriously though, well said.
|
|
#
?
Nov 19, 2012 15:20
|
|
|
mr. stefan posted:... Very well written. I agree with you 100%.
|
|
#
?
Nov 19, 2012 15:57
|
|
|
I would hope Vader gets more than 3 sentences worth of lines. Was so disappointed at how little of Vader there was in Episode 3. Also JEJ needs to get those lines recorded NOW, he isn't that young anymore, 81. Same with John Williams. If he kicks off before he can do some more Star Wars composing it just wont be the same.
|
|
#
?
Nov 20, 2012 17:54
|
|
|
You know things might not be for the best if you have to try and race to get talent locked in before they drop dead. I agree Williams would be welcome, but it's not as though someone couldn't emulate him. I disagree with trying to resurrect Vader. His character arc is complete. He's a ghost, meaning it would be a new guy in the suit, which makes no sense whatsoever: Vader's appearance was functional, designed to support his decaying body. What, someone else is gonna get dropped in lava? I have such high hopes for this project. Then I see Mark Hamill in "Airborne" and get really sad.
|
|
#
?
Nov 20, 2012 17:59
|
|
|
vote_no posted:Well said. I agree completely. The lightning also appears as completely overwhelming; Yoda says that Luke requires no more training, so it would seem this power is irresistible -- a manifestation, like you say, of the awesome power of the Emperor. Then, in the prequels, it turns out you can just absorb it. Oh, OK. This is an interesting thing to bring up, and goes into how the real failure of the prequels is their demystification of everything. Star Wars itself was born out of this Dune/Flash Gordon/etc. melting pot of previous sci-fi when the genres were less delineated and you'd have space ships and magic simultaneously. The prequels are a product of their time in how they leave that behind. Yoda and the Emperor as an example, when I was a kid I figured Yoda was supposed to be a human, just what a human would end up looking like if they somehow lived to be 900 years old. The Emperor was beyond understanding when I saw Empire Strikes Back as a kid. Even Vader kneels to this guy he must be pretty serious. The way they designed the character's face in that hologram conversation was brilliant. Like with Yoda, very human expressions and yet clearly beyond what most life is capable of. You see this sort of power very very slowly coming back into the world through Luke and Vader. In the first half of A New Hope "the force" is some spooky superstition made up by some crazy order of knights called Jedi. Obi Wan's stories about Darth Vader are great because they emphasize his piloting skills and other realistic (in the context of the movie) stuff instead of "yeah he was a jedi he could move stuff with his mind!" but at the same time he conjures this great Flash Gordony age of daring that's gone now. Luke can aim really well, Vader can choke someone from across the room, both are superior pilots. By RotJ none of these qualities matter, I think, in finding Luke/finding out Luke is alive, Vader also grows a bit in capability. They both go way beyond short range parlor trick kind of stuff.* mr. stefan recognizes the slow burn these minor details create in the original trilogy. When descriptions of how the force works are kept just vague enough, every action is the new tradition. Through RotJ we see Luke do things about on par with what Vader does in Empire. We slowly feel like Luke is in control and knows what he's doing (especially when he turns himself in and first meets the Emperor, undoes his handcuffs etc.). When he finally loses it and defeats Vader, The Emperor, you notice isn't actually saying or doing much at this point, we sort of forget about him in the face of this more tangible conflict between father and son. So when he comes out nowhere with the lightening aftewards it's crazy. In the prequels we get a regimen instead of this more natural coming into knowledge of how stuff works. Obi Wan improvised having a drone shoot at Luke while he was wearing a visor so now the way you learn how to use the force is to have a drone shoot at your five year old self as you defend yourself with a Yoda-sized light saber. The explicit cataloging and breaking down of every aspect of the universe is great for selling toys and figures, but makes for boring cinema. There are some shamefully awful Dune prequels I had the misfortune of reading as well that do something similar, where ancient battles and surreal legends are turned into Terminator Salvation or AvP but with telekinesis. They made the mistake of looking to popular sci-fi for inspiration instead of looking inwards at these better left unknown bits of information that are what set off everyone's imagination regarding Star Wars in the first place. It seems and unnecessary move given the licensing and merchandising potential for Star Wars stuff in general, I don't think the prequels really needed to go in that direction. Whatever story they do have in mind for this seventh episode though, I do hope they look to the past for how they choose to execute it. I'm not asking for Beyond the Black Rainbow here but just hoping they look at fantasy and heroic epics in general again instead of just stories with lasers. I feel like the original trilogy was this fantastical mash-up of Robert E. Howard stories and Dune while the prequel trilogy was written by Wookiepedia. *I'm sure it's been discussed many times but I always loved how this fight starts out with Luke doing fine and regularly getting the upper hand, and he hasn't even moved anything with his mind yet! Wow! Then Vader decides he wants to get to the point so he just completely destroys him with no effort. Before the movie even ended that made you NEED to learn more about this guy and want to see another movie. Neo Rasa fucked around with this message at 18:34 on Nov 20, 2012 |
|
#
?
Nov 20, 2012 18:31
|
|
|
RoughDraft2.0 posted:I disagree with trying to resurrect Vader. His character arc is complete. He's a ghost, meaning it would be a new guy in the suit, which makes no sense whatsoever: Vader's appearance was functional, designed to support his decaying body. What, someone else is gonna get dropped in lava? Think of it this way: Nobody in the galaxy knows who Darth Vader really was, except for Luke and Leia. To everyone else, he was just the terrifying mystic knight, the zealous and tyrannical right hand of the Emperor. Some new villain gets a set of replica armor and poses as a resurrected Vader, and to the citizens of the galaxy, ignorant of the power of the Force, think that is plausible and scary. Luke, a crazy old washed-up Jedi, is the only one who knows that it can't really be Vader, and he's investigating. A new hero gets caught up in this mess somehow, and Luke serves as his mentor, then dies, leaving nobody else but the new trilogy's protagonist to inherit the increasingly relevant mystery of who's impersonating the Dark Lord.
|
|
#
?
Nov 20, 2012 19:04
|
|
|
Bongo Bill posted:Think of it this way: Then right at the end it does a cutaway shot of showing NuVader looking ominous, and then Ian Holm looking ominous in the same position, no further context, credits roll.
|
|
#
?
Nov 20, 2012 19:08
|
|
|
Bongo Bill posted:Think of it this way: Now, if someone could just get a hold of his glove... 
|
|
#
?
Nov 20, 2012 19:12
|
|
|
thrawn527 posted:Now, if someone could just get a hold of his glove...
|
|
#
?
Nov 20, 2012 19:15
|
|
|
Strange Matter posted:The whales in the background make me think it's a crossover with Star Trek IV. *ahem* Whaladons.
|
|
#
?
Nov 20, 2012 19:16
|
|
|
thrawn527 posted:*ahem* Whaladons. quote:The rare white hump-back breed of Whaladon was almost totally wiped out, save for Leviathor, leader of the Whaladons. 
|
|
#
?
Nov 20, 2012 19:19
|
|
|
Strange Matter posted:Stop making me hate you Star Wars Clearly you have never been invited to a Mofference.
|
|
#
?
Nov 20, 2012 19:29
|
|
|
MrBigglesworth posted:Same with John Williams. If he kicks off before he can do some more Star Wars composing it just wont be the same. I'm not that worried about John Williams not scoring the new films if he isn't up to it or doesn't want to. Or is, you know, dead by the time they're working on Episode VIII or whatever. Joel McNelly did good work for Shadows of the Empire so I think somebody else could do an excellent job taking influences from Williams without aping him and producing derivative crap.
|
|
#
?
Nov 20, 2012 20:09
|
|
|
mr. stefan posted:The emperor is not an impossibly ancient old man, The Dark Side just rots your body, and Vader's mechanical enhancements are the result of a single battle, not a potentially deliberate choice to dehumanize himself in search of greater combat prowess. That was just your theory, though. This is the problem with any sort of prequel, people come up with their own theories that they hold onto for years and so anything will be a disappointment. That doesn't mean that those stories shouldn't be told, though. But don't blame Lucas for not being a mindreader.
|
|
#
?
Nov 20, 2012 21:30
|
|
|
Hatter106 posted:That was just your theory, though. His point is that the mysteries were far more compelling than the solutions, and to a degree that means that no, those stories shouldn't have been told. Whatever they brought to the universe wasn't worth what they removed. It'd be like Tarentino explaining that the briefcase in Pulp Fiction is full of gold bars. Okay, great, question answered but now it's hard to give a poo poo. And with that said, it's not hard to argue that Lucas was going for something mythical and magical with Yoda, the emperor, and the force in general. The sources he was cribbing from were pretty obvious, and going back to explain those things in a more literal way robs them of any power they had.
|
|
#
?
Nov 20, 2012 22:20
|
|
|
sethsez posted:His point is that the mysteries were far more compelling than the solutions, and to a degree that means that no, those stories shouldn't have been told. Whatever they brought to the universe wasn't worth what they removed. It'd be like Tarentino explaining that the briefcase in Pulp Fiction is full of gold bars. Okay, great, question answered but now it's hard to give a poo poo. The short form of this argument is "midichlorians."
|
|
#
?
Nov 20, 2012 22:23
|
|
|
Neo Rasa posted:mr. stefan recognizes the slow burn these minor details create in the original trilogy. When descriptions of how the force works are kept just vague enough, every action is the new tradition. Through RotJ we see Luke do things about on par with what Vader does in Empire. We slowly feel like Luke is in control and knows what he's doing (especially when he turns himself in and first meets the Emperor, undoes his handcuffs etc.). It always seemed to me it was the Emperor who undid Luke's handcuffs, in a casual demonstration of his fine control and mastery of the Force. quote:*I'm sure it's been discussed many times but I always loved how this fight starts out with Luke doing fine and regularly getting the upper hand, and he hasn't even moved anything with his mind yet! Wow! Then Vader decides he wants to get to the point so he just completely destroys him with no effort. Before the movie even ended that made you NEED to learn more about this guy and want to see another movie. I liked how the fight progressed in 3 distinct stages. In the first, Vader is just testing the waters and holds his saber with one hand. After they meet again, Vader very ostentatiously puts his other hand on his saber and steps up the pressure by Force-throwing things at Luke. And the third time he comes out of the shadows with no warning and, as you say, completely destroys Luke. Easily my favorite duel in all the movies. The lightsabers still have a sense of weight and power and it's very well choreographed.
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2012 15:14
|
|
|
Good News. It's been confirmed they are bringing back Lawrence Kasdan, the writer of Empire Strike Back/Return of the Jedi/Raiders of the Lost Ark, to pen either the second or third film. Here's to hoping that he writes the centerpiece Episode XIII. http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/star-wars-lawrence-kasdan-simon-393459
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2012 15:50
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 12, 2024 17:57 |
|
|
EX-GAIJIN AT LAST posted:It always seemed to me it was the Emperor who undid Luke's handcuffs, in a casual demonstration of his fine control and mastery of the Force. I'm pretty sure that it was. "You no longer need those", gestures, then they undo. The whole point of the scene is to emphasize that the Emperor feels totally in control and that HE's in charge.
|
|
#
?
Nov 21, 2012 16:10
|
|