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100 metric tons will sink a handysize bulk carrier by about 2/3 of an inch. Handysizes are small, the bigger ones (Chinamax) carry about 350 - 400 thousand metric tons. poo poo, 100 tons isn't ocean freighter amount of cargo, it's a rounding error. About four days worth of fuel for a 35 000 dead weight tons freighter... Enough to go about 1200 nautical miles or so. Every time I've had someone bring up blimps as part of the supply chain, they were people with no idea of what the supply chain actually involves.
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Jan 30, 2014 04:21
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benito posted:100 tons is about forty 20' containers. That are empty. Modern container ships carry 10,000 20' containers that actually have freight in them. The biggest can go over 15,000 TEUs. Haha, I missed the ocean freighters quote. As for transporting cargo, that whole ``let`s drop this poo poo without any infrastructure` is thinking mostly of disaster relief and military operations - two scenarios that often do need lots of stuff in primitive areas. It`s the same reason Ilyushins and Antonovs are so popular in those roles. Snowdens Secret posted:I wonder if that's actually easier or simpler than just having a ballast tank of compressed air that you vent and refill from the atmosphere. Using air means you`d miss out on the lift.
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Jan 30, 2014 04:35
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The big problem is, when it comes to shipping goods, anything the airship promises to do can be done better, faster or cheaper by other existing modes of transportation. Got a lot of poo poo to move across an ocean? Ships. Got a lot of poo poo to move across land? Trains. Got poo poo to move with a deadline or multiple destinations? Trucks. Got poo poo that needs to be there by yesterday? Air Freight. Heck, if you needed to move 100 tons (metric or otherwise), the 744 Freighter could handle it with room to spare. Or, if we're talking the 250-ton capacity, it has a (theoretical) top speed of 115 mph. If we flew NYC to London, the same 744 would, admittedly, have to make two trips, but could arrive in London on it's 3rd trip at the same time as the airship finishing it's first trip. e: Now of course, there are, in theory, other missions which airships can serve a role, but you will have to do a lot of convincing to people who aren't into gluing plastic gears onto pseudo-Victorian era clothing. CovfefeCatCafe fucked around with this message at 04:53 on Jan 30, 2014 |
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Jan 30, 2014 04:50
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I thought the main promise of the airship freighters is that they will open up to extraction large areas of energy or mineral reserves that were previously economically unviable because of their remote location or inaccessibility. Nobody is claiming they will replace ships and trains from what I've seen anyway.
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Jan 30, 2014 04:56
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Nebakenezzer posted:Using air means you`d miss out on the lift. Yes but pumping helium (and having all the extra piping and valving for the helium to go through) sounds lossy, and leaking your liftgas seems like the worst possible option. The weight penalty seems the same either way. Regardless, compressing gas isn't exactly fast unless you have a huge and heavy compressor, which at the least makes it questionable for trim ballast.
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Jan 30, 2014 05:01
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~Coxy posted:I thought the main promise of the airship freighters is that they will open up to extraction large areas of energy or mineral reserves that were previously economically unviable because of their remote location or inaccessibility. The natural resource industry is pretty good at making inaccessible places accessible - they'll build airports, roads, ports, train tracks, no big deals. Plus unless you're talking about gold or diamonds, which they can just fly out by plane, 100 tons is peanuts for those guys. A smallish crude oil tanker hauls 80 000 tons, a 100 car train is what... 10 000 tons? Plus raw materials are low value / weight cargos, nobody's going to airlift them. (Unless, again, you're talking gold or diamond or some fancy poo poo.) Unless you meant things like helicopter loggers, but that's way too small a market to start up a blimp production line.
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Jan 30, 2014 05:35
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So I thought this was pretty clever...until the last 10 seconds, then it was loving hilarious: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eduNjwNvcH4
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Jan 30, 2014 08:33
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FrozenVent posted:The natural resource industry is pretty good at making inaccessible places accessible - they'll build airports, roads, ports, train tracks, no big deals. Plus unless you're talking about gold or diamonds, which they can just fly out by plane, 100 tons is peanuts for those guys. A smallish crude oil tanker hauls 80 000 tons, a 100 car train is what... 10 000 tons? I don't necessarily see a specific need, but the whole advantage in theory is that you can get the operation up and running and set up your mine infrastructure concurrent with building your infrastructure to remove the resources. When you are discussing costs and revenues in the tens to hundreds of millions per day, two weeks makes a huge difference. Also, all of those things that you listed that they'll "just build" are incredibly expensive. They build those things if they're necessary because amounts of money at stake are gargantuan. If there's a way to do part of the process cheaper and faster with airships, it will happen.
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Jan 30, 2014 12:54
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You'd need a ridiculous amount of 100 ton capacity airships (which don't currently exist) to make any kind of major exploitation worthwhile. Plus there's nothing that says they can't run the mine and stockpile while the export infrastructure is being built.
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Jan 30, 2014 13:11
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Jan 30, 2014 14:25
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So Boeing had some fun yesterday.
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Jan 30, 2014 15:22
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So they're sending the team to NYC in shipping crates?
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Jan 30, 2014 15:23
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hobbesmaster posted:So they're sending the team to NYC in shipping crates? Nah, that plane's going to carry the 121 million skittles.
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Jan 30, 2014 15:25
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That's a LOT of weed. Did Air Methods paint an EC-130 up like Moreno?
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Jan 30, 2014 15:31
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Yeah, it was awesome. Damp, but awesome. I'd get into a legal shitstorm if I just shared my photos- so... they're over here http://www.airlinereporter.com/2014/01/12th-plane-boeing-unveils-seahawks-themed-747-8f/
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Jan 30, 2014 16:27
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iyaayas01 posted:So I thought this was pretty clever...until the last 10 seconds, then it was loving hilarious:
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Jan 30, 2014 18:17
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grover posted:hahahaha, was that Kareem Abdul Jabbar? Who the gently caress else would you want co-piloting your plane in the 1980's? Otto?
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Jan 30, 2014 18:19
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gently caress. Yes.
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Jan 30, 2014 18:23
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Unf. I feel like I plug this guy all the time but there is more afterburner goodness here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YXo5awLzkKU The first time I saw a J79 up close for real I was really surprised at how huge of a motor it is, I guess for some reason I always thought it was relatively small.
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Jan 30, 2014 18:27
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Powercube posted:Yeah, it was awesome. Damp, but awesome. I'd get into a legal shitstorm if I just shared my photos- so... they're over here http://www.airlinereporter.com/2014/01/12th-plane-boeing-unveils-seahawks-themed-747-8f/ "Do not be surprised if one of the tests Boeing performs over the next few days is “How does it look near the Space Needle?”." Awesome.
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Jan 30, 2014 18:48
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iyaayas01 posted:So I thought this was pretty clever...until the last 10 seconds, then it was loving hilarious: Well, I feel better about my flight tomorrow already. Thanks, Delta!
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Jan 30, 2014 18:53
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CroatianAlzheimers posted:Well, I feel better about my flight tomorrow already. Thanks, Delta! Last time I flew Delta was with my family on a vacation out to Italy from ORD. Our bags got lost as soon as JFK (our connection) and left outside in puddles apparently. After much haggling they promised us 100 bucks a day spending money until we got our bags back so we were all completely fine with that. They also said we can grab our bags in Florence which is where we were headed anyway, we were traveling around. The people working Delta in Florence very kindly informed us our bags were indeed in Europe! But they were stuck in Paris. We said gently caress it, just get them to our doorstep in Wisconsin by the time we get home in 2 weeks. They did deliver on this promise so we get our completely mold covered clothes as they never thought to dry out 4 soaking wet luggage trunks in the 2+ weeks they had them. We ended up just tossing everything. Never again.
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Jan 30, 2014 19:26
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Preoptopus posted:Last time I flew Delta was with my family on a vacation out to Italy from ORD. Our bags got lost as soon as JFK (our connection) and left outside in puddles apparently. After much haggling they promised us 100 bucks a day spending money until we got our bags back so we were all completely fine with that. They also said we can grab our bags in Florence which is where we were headed anyway, we were traveling around. The people working Delta in Florence very kindly informed us our bags were indeed in Europe! But they were stuck in Paris. We said gently caress it, just get them to our doorstep in Wisconsin by the time we get home in 2 weeks. They did deliver on this promise so we get our completely mold covered clothes as they never thought to dry out 4 soaking wet luggage trunks in the 2+ weeks they had them. We ended up just tossing everything. Never again. Yeah, I know that Delta is just an acronym for Don't Expect Luggage To Arrive. However, they haven't lost a piece of my luggage since TYooL 2000. That being said, I miss Northwest. Especially since we (DTW) used to be a Northwest hub.
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Jan 30, 2014 20:05
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grover posted:hahahaha, was that Kareem Abdul Jabbar? You must have him confused with somebody else. His name is Roger Murdock, he's the co-pilot.
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Jan 30, 2014 20:16
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FrozenVent posted:Who the gently caress else would you want co-piloting your plane in the 1980's? Otto?
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Jan 30, 2014 21:44
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Looks like they're still having fun, currently flying a "12" pattern over Washington. http://flightaware.com/live/flight/BOE12
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Jan 30, 2014 22:39
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You know, it's things like this that make me wish I could afford to just up and move to Seattle. Maybe next year...
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Jan 30, 2014 23:24
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YF19pilot posted:You know, it's things like this that make me wish I could afford to just up and move to Seattle. Maybe next year... It's a lot of fun  N770BA looks a bit different by Powercube, on Flickr
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Jan 30, 2014 23:25
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PREYING MANTITS posted:Looks like they're still having fun, currently flying a "12" pattern over Washington. Nice to see that someone at Boeing has a sense of humor. has Airbus ever done anything similar?
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Jan 30, 2014 23:27
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buttcrackmenace posted:Nice to see that someone at Boeing has a sense of humor. Seeing as Airbus isn't based in a city that prides itself on having the most obnoxious fans north of Brazil, I'd think not. 
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Jan 30, 2014 23:29
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Naturally Selected posted:Seeing as Airbus isn't based in a city that prides itself on having the most obnoxious fans north of Brazil, I'd think not. 49ers fan spotted also that Delta safety video is actually really funny. How they handled the "Smoking is not allowed on any Delta flight" line is hilarious. Psion fucked around with this message at 23:54 on Jan 30, 2014 |
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Jan 30, 2014 23:51
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Phanatic posted:You must have him confused with somebody else. His name is Roger Murdock, he's the co-pilot. Yeah, but my dad says he doesn't really try unless it's the playoffs.
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Jan 31, 2014 00:09
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YF19pilot posted:Yeah, but my dad says he doesn't really try unless it's the playoffs. You ever seen a grown man naked Joey?
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Jan 31, 2014 00:26
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buttcrackmenace posted:Nice to see that someone at Boeing has a sense of humor. They do have their own football club.
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Jan 31, 2014 00:43
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FrozenVent posted:You'd need a ridiculous amount of 100 ton capacity airships (which don't currently exist) to make any kind of major exploitation worthwhile. What, pray tell, do you run the mine with? That's where the airship is (potentially) useful.
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Jan 31, 2014 00:49
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:What, pray tell, do you run the mine with? That's where the airship is (potentially) useful. Good luck hauling poo poo like this by airship. Edit: a big one can weigh 14,100 metric tons. Have fun with that blimps. wdarkk fucked around with this message at 00:56 on Jan 31, 2014 |
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Jan 31, 2014 00:52
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Listen, I just want blimps to be a thing because they're cool 
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Jan 31, 2014 00:53
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wdarkk posted:Good luck hauling poo poo like this by airship. Those are primarily in use for brown coal, which is wildly abundant in places that aren't the arctic. I have some experience with mines and such and I can see how the drat thing is potentially useful. Doesn't mean it will be, but there's definitely a niche worth exploring. Is there a market for more than say, ten of these things? Highly doubtful.
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Jan 31, 2014 00:59
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KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:Those are primarily in use for brown coal, which is wildly abundant in places that aren't the arctic. You'll see! YOU'LL ALL SEE!! Ohmygod, I've become the grover of airships 
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Jan 31, 2014 01:07
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Nebakenezzer posted:You'll see! YOU'LL ALL SEE!! Don't worry, as far as I know, people don't loathe and despise you 
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Jan 31, 2014 01:13
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