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Rangpur posted:It's not really a cut and dry thing though, is it? There's a strong subjective component as well. In most of the SMT games the death of the main character results in a game over. I loving hate that. It drives me In. Sane. With EO you can certainly get wiped out in an ambush, and it probably happens more often in this game than any of the others. However you don't automatically lose to some piddling little imp because they got lucky with a longshot Hama, and the like. To me, that makes the experience less grating overall. Oh yeah it's certainly a balance and depends on the specific game in discussion. Still, in general trash fights are way more threatening in EO, you may rarely get longshotted by an instant death move on a load-bearing character in SMT before you hit the point where you can be immune to those things but you've just got a lot more resources and are able to clear through enemies with them having done relatively less damage to the party. Though to be fair I always prepare like a motherfucker in SMT games.
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Sep 22, 2014 21:30
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Oh, hell. How have I not noticed this yet? It'll be great to read comments about people who haven't played this before. I can't really give a good idea of what it's like to play this game fresh because all my memories of it have been washed away by the ongoing process of obtaining the True True Ending. I won't blame you if you cheat to get that because god drat.
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Sep 22, 2014 21:54
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Hivac posted:It'll be great to read comments about people who haven't played this before. I can't really give a good idea of what it's like to play this game fresh because all my memories of it have been washed away by the ongoing process of obtaining the True True Ending. Wait, the what now?
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Sep 22, 2014 21:55
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Dr. Fetus posted:Wait, the what now? The one you get past the true last boss and 100% items. You know. The level 99 one. 
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Sep 22, 2014 21:56
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I've never heard of such a thing, but if that really exists, I am definitely cheating for that one. There is no way I'm getting that one legit. 
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Sep 22, 2014 21:59
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Dr. Fetus posted:I've never heard of such a thing, but if that really exists, I am definitely cheating for that one. There is no way I'm getting that one legit. Oh,it's not so bad. I'm already closing in on 80! It's only taken me a bit less than a week of gametime! And then I get to finish the gear registry! And the quests! It'll be so much fun! (For people going fresh into this game: don't try to get absolute total 100% completion in this game. It'll burn you out on the series.  )
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Sep 22, 2014 22:04
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For people who don't know, the level cap is 70. For Etrian Odyssey 3 and beyond, you raise that cap by killing three super-bosses that've been a mainstay of the series since the first one: (Fire) Wyrm, (Ice) Drake, and (Thunder) Dragon. Each one would bump the level cap ten levels, to 99. However, Etrian Odyssey 1 and 2 were extremely different. You had to reach level 70, then retire your character. You basically kick them out for an enhanced recruit that get some bonus stats at half the original level. And with the bonus of bumping that specific character's level cap up... by 1. And you have to do it repeatedly from 70 to 99.  ...Pretty sure that's how it went, right? Might be wrong, but I'm pretty sure it was something along those lines.
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Sep 23, 2014 01:29
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BlackPersona posted:For people who don't know, the level cap is 70. For Etrian Odyssey 3 and beyond, you raise that cap by killing three super-bosses that've been a mainstay of the series since the first one: (Fire) Wyrm, (Ice) Drake, and (Thunder) Dragon. Each one would bump the level cap ten levels, to 99. What the gently caress? Who thought that was a good idea?
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Sep 23, 2014 01:31
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BlackPersona posted:For people who don't know, the level cap is 70. For Etrian Odyssey 3 and beyond, you raise that cap by killing three super-bosses that've been a mainstay of the series since the first one: (Fire) Wyrm, (Ice) Drake, and (Thunder) Dragon. Each one would bump the level cap ten levels, to 99. Yep, that's exactly how it went, and it's absolutely as moronic as it sounds. It didn't apply to EO1 though. EO1 had a hard cap of 70, and it couldn't be raised there. Thankfully raising the level cap is completely unnecessary in this game. Will post the update later if I can get the URL replacer working. I could do it myself but manually replacing over 150 image URLs doesn't sound like my idea of a good time.
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Sep 23, 2014 01:35
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Calling it a true ending is misleading. It's really just a way for the developers to say, "look we know at least one of you spergy fucks is crazy enough to try this even if you didn't get anything for it, so here's a token acknowledgment of the effort." The only endings which mean anything are the main storyline and 100% completion of the compendium.
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Sep 23, 2014 01:59
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Rangpur posted:Calling it a true ending is misleading. It's really just a way for the developers to say, "look we know at least one of you spergy fucks is crazy enough to try this even if you didn't get anything for it, so here's a token acknowledgment of the effort." Which, considering how the equipment compendium exists in 2, is still way more out of the way then the rest of the games. This game is a big favorite of mine, but I won't deny that it has a lot of questionable decisions. Edit: I'm fairly sure that ending breaks the fourth wall and tells you to go outside or something along those lines. Reco fucked around with this message at 02:05 on Sep 23, 2014 |
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Sep 23, 2014 02:02
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Well I finished up the update and was gonna post it. Then the site said it was over 60000 characters. Whoops.  Excuse me while I figure out where to split this. You'll get the second part tomorrow.
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Sep 23, 2014 02:57
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Never Trust a Squirrel PC-88 Version : So about that Troubadour that joined us. : Not. One. Word. : I didn't even know music could sound that bad. : You should have just let me poison him. No one would know. Or care. : Do you think about things other than making people suffer?: Sometimes. Not that much.: Shh. Look ahead. Now that would make for a fine dinner. Now we start encountering the mobile FOEs. We can see FOEs that are adjacent to us on the map screen, but they won't show up on the map most of the time unless we've stepped on that specific tile. Not even painting them will make them show up. Generally it's usually best to map out their areas by stepping on a bunch of tiles in said areas so we can learn their movement patterns. This FOE's movement pattern is quite simple.  It just moves around in a square. Now an FOE takes one step for each turn we make. A turn is counted as a turn in battle, or one step on the field. This also means that if we get into a battle on an FOE's path, they can join in once they've reached us, so that's something we need to be aware of.  PC-88 Version : The plants are alive too?: Now I'm just realizing how weird this place is.: Moving around means it's fresh and lively. It'll make for a decent side dish for tonight's dinner. Cactoid HP: 90 AT: 13 DF: 10 Exp: 314 Skills: Needles Item Drops: -Common: Cactus Pin - 1 needed for Wakizashi (Katana.) 3 needed for Spike (Axe.) --Light, sharp thorn from a Cactoid's head. -Rare: Cactus Log - 1 needed for Green Boot. 2 needed for Nail Glove. --A cactus's flexible trunk. -Conditional: N/A Description: A cactus that evolved into a monster over the years. It attacks with sharp needles. Weakness: Fire (150%) Resistance: N/A Cactoids aren't really a threat at all. Yeah they have high attack, but at this point they only appear alone.  : Oh my liver did not need that.It did do some high damage to Frederik, but take a look at the Cactoid's health.  Our party can just finish it off without it getting another attack in. At this point it can't one shot any of our party members at full health, even if it lands a critical hit. These guys really aren't a threat alone. And even in groups, they're usually the least threatening enemy in the encounter. Save these guys for last unless they're paired up with a Hedgehog or Woodmai. These things are just pretty much a check for keeping your party members topped off since they only way they can actually kill someone is if they're not at full health. : Wonder if this new shot works. : Perfect.PC-88 Version Something that's pretty annoying in the DS games is that you can't really pan the camera. So sometimes you can only see FOEs while in the middle of turning. The 3DS games fixed that by letting you look around the area with the circle pad. : Ah, now this one looks like it has some meat on it's bones. Watch closely, I'm gonna show ya'll how to hunt deer. Furyhorn Type: Normal Behavior: Patrol Aggressive: No HP: 420 AT: 18 DF: 18 Known as Ragelopes in EO1 and Untold, these guys return to kill your party if you get careless with your movements. They can kill two party members at the same time, or confuse your party members and make them kill each other.  PC-88 Version Pay close attention to the bottom screen here.   : I don't think our dinner is going down without a fight. Hrk!  : I think that thing just crushed his lungs, heart, and well everything.: Maybe we should just give up on dinner and find a replacement for Ken?: Nonsense, we need to fill up our stomachs now. Aw great, his corpse is in the way. Come on, I'm gonna look for another spot to get a better shot. PC-88 Version Notice how we got pushed back as we escaped? Now what would happen if the game couldn't push us back?  PC-88 Version : Ah, now this is a better spot!: Okay I'm having second thoughts about this. Can't we just eat Ken's remains for dinner? I'm sure his stomach's still in good condition. I'm out of- oh crap this wall's in the way.  And this is what happens when our party is sandwiched between a wall and an FOE. They can't back out, and there's no where to run. All we can do is watch them all die. Atlus decided with the addition of sidestepping, that it should be easier to trap yourself against an FOE. In the first and third games, the only way to trap yourself was to get into a random encounter with your back against the wall, and let an FOE join the fight. In EO2, when your party runs into an FOE, they turn to face it, so if they're just walking along the wall and an FOE runs into them from the side, they'll turn so that their backs are against the wall. EO4 and onwards removed this mechanic entirely.  : This was a really stupid idea.  When the front row dies, the back row switches places with the front row. It stays like this if you win the battle, so remember to switch it back.  : Well if the deer meat doesn't work out, you're free to eat my corpse.   : Oh shoot, I missed. I blame all these deaths. Oh well, looks like it's up to you, Aliara to feed our guild tonight.: Oh please work.  : I DON'T WANT TO DIE!  : Well poisoned meat wouldn't have made for a good dinner anyway. :  PC-88 Version   The party is dead, just like this LP. Thank you for reading everyone, and have a nice day! Okay there's still more. Now this is a screen you'll probably see a lot when playing an Etrian Odyssey game. Don't be discouraged. Failure is a big part of these games, they're rather brutal after all. Now, if you want to get the most out of the playthrough that resulted in a death, accept the prompt to save your map data. It will make it easier to learn from your mistakes, and help to avoid making the same mistake again.  PC-88 Version : AAAAAAHHHHHhhhhh. Huh?: Ohhh. What's wrong Aliara?: You better have a good reason for waking us up this late.: Oh, sorry. I had a weird nightmare where you all acted like idiots and then a deer killed us all. I blame the Troubadour, his music put a bunch of weird thoughts into my head.: Yeah, his music was pretty awful. Why did we even let him sing us a lullaby after his first songs?: Well I couldn't just say no to him after he joined us. Anyways, I don't think any of us are in a mood to sleep after that. How about another trip into the Labyrinth?: Might as well make good use of our time while we're up.PC-88 Version : What the hell was up with that dinosaur!? Wasn't that thing staying still before? Why is it rampaging around now?: Don't ask me. That thing almost had me for dinner!: The only reason I can think of is some idiot decided to poke at the thing or something.: Didn't our gathering team mention something about a dinosaur when the girl got her wounds?: Oh looks like someone is gonna miss out on dinner tonight. Hey, why's our map filled in like this? We haven't been to those areas yet.: Oh, I kind of got bored and filled some of it in. I drew in what I remembered from that weird dream anyway.: Well if it's wrong, we can change it later.This is why it's important to save your map data, and by extension make a good map of stuff in case you die for some reason. Notice how we can see the FOEs on the map even though we've technically never been there? Now we can watch for it's patterns on the map even when our party isn't near it.  Another simple patrol pattern. The thing to watch out for is to not run into the FOE when returning from the west door. : Huh, that was a pretty accurate map for something that came from a dream. Maybe you should get nightmares more often.: How about no? Hey Fedot, you sure you didn't want to hunt those deer down?: What? No! We're nowhere near strong enough to take those on. Maybe sometime later. We'll have to settle for hedgehog and snail meat for now. : No. We're not doing this. : Oh how lucky. This is really strong medicine. The Medica II heals for 200 compared to the Medica's 50. Yeah it's overkill at this point. We won't need that massive amount of healing for a while, but it could come in handy during an emergency.  : Look! I think I see something over here. You can barely make out a squirrel-like animal in the shadow of a large plant. The rodent doesn't seem to fear your party, and it chirps brightly as it approaches. It seems as though it wants you to pet it. You wonder if you should oblige the creature...  : Oh, can I pet it? It's kind of cute.: No! Squirrels are vicious and devious animals that seek to feast on your entrails. Don't do it if you value your life!: Uhhh, Fedot?: Okaaaay. I don't see what's the harm. Go right ahead.You reach out to the small animal... : Aw- wait, what are you doing!? : Hey! Get out of our stuff!  : What did that critter make off with!?  : drat it! It took one of our Warp Wires!: I told you they're vicious animals!: Did you see where it went?: No, it just ran off somewhere. I don't think we can catch it at this point.It's too late for you to catch the animal by now... You sigh, and move on with your journey. : Well good thing we had a spare. We'll just have to be more careful next time.And here's a massive dick move by Atlus. Warp Wires are pretty much an essential item to have on you at all times. Forgetting to bring a Warp Wire on a trip can result in some lost progress. But Atlus decided to punish players that only brought one Warp Wire with this event. Saying no to this event makes nothing happen. Saying yes without having a Warp Wire on you still has the squirrel try to steal something, but it gives up when it can't find the Warp Wire. And then the game decides to be all passive aggressive for you not having a Warp Wire, saying that whatever it was the squirrel was looking for, it wasn't anything valuable since you have everything you need on you. Thankfully EO2 is the only game where you can actually lose Warp Wires. PC-88 Version Oh this might be bad.    : Why are they ganging up on me!?: Maybe they just don't like you.Right now may be a good time to go into how the enemy AI works in the EO games. Most of the time the enemy likes to target the person with the highest HP in the front or back rows. Enemies have a 60% to target the person with the highest HP in the front row, a 30% chance to target the person with the highest HP in the back row, and a 10% to target someone else entirely. Not all enemies follow this AI. Some follow different rules, and might do something like target the back row, or the weakest person. : Oh, I've got this. Choke and die!    : Oh come on! Seriously, these things are not a threat at all. Even without the Town Crown, Ken would have lived. PC-88 Version : Huh, this area's pretty rocky. It should make a good mining spot for the others.: Maybe we could learn how to gather materials to save time for the other team.: No, we need to focus on learning how to fight. The gathering team can work off the map we give them, but we have to go in blind.This is what the mining points of this stratum contain. Mine: Common: Amazonite - 1 needed for Iron Glove, Bird Stare, Venom Ring, and Leg Guard. 3 needed for Matchlock (Gun.) 7 needed for Warabide (Katana.) 5 needed for the quest Paint the town blue. -Bluish rock used for weapons or fuel. Uncommon: Aragonite - 1 needed for Luck Beads. 5 needed for Boar Spear (Sword.) 7 needed for Tshirovha (Axe.) -Seashell-like rock used as a polishing tool. Rare: Garnet - 1 needed for Apt Piece and Power Ring. -Highly transparent crimson gem. PC-88 Version This thing couldn't even kill Nick. Our party is perfectly fine against these things. : How are cacti this strong? And, oh crap, we better finish this thing off fast! Unless an FOE decides to join the fight!  Fortunately our party finishes it off before this happens, and I finally get one of it's drops. PC-88 Version : Found something over here.Upon closer inspection, there are a number of shining coins lying amongst the roots. Could another explorer have dropped them? You're tempted to retrieve them, but you have to wonder about the circumstances...  : Hmm, I don't think that Ragelope is coming by here anytime soon.: They're called Furyhorns here.: Whatever. I think it's safe to pick these out.You pick the coins out from the tangled roots of the trees. Their total worth is 100en... A careless adventurer must have simply dropped them here. Heartened by the lucky find, you return to your investigation.  : Woo! Free money! Maybe we can actually buy our food now instead of feeding off the wildlife.: Ahahahaha, no.: But I'm sick of eating hedgehogs! Can't we eat some real food?: I'm sorry, but we need to spend most of out money on supplies, and we don't have much to spend in the first place. The patrol pattern for the FOE here. Once again, just watch when you open the door when coming back. You can run into the Furyhorn right away if you open the door at the wrong time.  : Another mining point. I'll mark this one down too. : How many deer are in this forest?: A lot, apparently. Just keep following my lead and we can sneak past them. The patrol pattern for this FOE. They'll get more complicated later.  The party's getting closer to a level up here. Two more fights should do it. PC-88 Version : GAH! Thankfully the Venomfly opted for a regular attack instead of poisoning anyone, so I decided to stick around for the fight instead of running away. I probably shouldn't have done that.  Crap. Well I guess we were overdue for another Nick death.   Or not! Frederik saves the day here with his regenall!  : Oh god, this still hurts so much, but thanks old man!: You can thank me properly by giving me a blood sacrifice.: Oh, sure. Wait what? A few heals later, Aliara's poison actually lands for once. On both of them even. : Oh finally!  When both enemies and party members are poisoned, they all take damage at the end of a turn. Aliara's poison does some nice damage here, but it still has a really low chance to land on anything at this point. Still, it's a better contribution than her just bashing things with her staff. PC-88 Version : Well that's some lame treasure.: Look on the bright side, it makes up for the one we lost.Even though Atlus took away a Warp Wire if you had one, if you explore this area, you'll get one in a chest, which can be a godsend if you lost your only one. Of course if you have a spare already, eh, it's only 100 en saved. PC-88 Version Okay, this encounter might actually be a threat. Even if the Cactoid doesn't kill anyone, the person that took the hit is in a good position to be finished off by the Woodmai.  Unless the AI decided to be stupid and attack a back row member instead. And it didn't even hit Fedot at that.  Something you can do if you have Regenall leveled up a good amount at this point, is to leave one weak enemy alone, and just spend time defending so your health gets restored. I'm out of Medicas, and Frederik is out of TP at this point, so this is my only method of healing right now.  Incidentally, I happened to build up Ken's Force meter completely here.  Seriously?  At least I got the Cactoid's drops here. Oh crap, this is bad. Fortunately the party's stronger here, so they might be able to get through this. Not to mention, I have Ken's Force Skill ready.  : Maybe this move will take care of them. Crap. : Uh oh.  CRAP! : My arms are stuck! I can't do it! And it even wasted his Force Meter too. To make things worse, only Ken, Nick, and Aliara can escape right now since Frederik and Fedot's legs are bound. ABORT! ABORT!  : You guys got to get out of here...CRAP! All the escape attempts failed here too.  : Can't find any way out! Find anything Aliara?: I'm looking as hard as I can! : Look harder! Ugh.: Found a way out! Thankfully, if someone fails at an escape attempt, the escape chance rises by 10%, eventually capping at 90%. Something that seems to have been changed or removed in the 3DS games because the escape rates are so terrible there. : We're not staying here are we? : Nope.  We unlock some new pieces of gear, nothing really special, but I buy some Green Boots for Ken and Nick since they could some increases in defense. The party takes a rest later. : Can't believe we got out of that.: Good to see you're alright Ken, because we're going back in there now.: What!? We just explored a lot of the second floor, and got knocked out by those Crawlers, and you want to go back in!? Why are you doing this to us!?: Don't be such a baby. Don't you want to see what was down that hallway?: Come on, we can probably make it to the third floor this time.: I too am curious about that hallway. We just need to be more careful this time.: Well it's 4 to 1 Ken. Sorry, but you don't have a choice.: Oh fine. Can't believe I'm still doing this.
Araxxor fucked around with this message at 06:00 on Sep 5, 2015 |
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Sep 23, 2014 03:00
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Wow, the amount that this game likes to kick you in the nuts is pretty funny. I'm all for hard games, but this seems a bit... unfair.
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Sep 23, 2014 03:26
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PotatoManJack posted:Wow, the amount that this game likes to kick you in the nuts is pretty funny. The 1st Stratum is always the hardest part of any Etrian Odyssey game. Except Untold, the postgame there is incredibly brutal.
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Sep 23, 2014 03:40
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PotatoManJack posted:I'm all for hard games, but this seems a bit... unfair. Every time someone says this, an Atlus dev gets his wings.
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Sep 23, 2014 03:43
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EO2 is peak unfairness on both sides of the coin for the series. The game actively hates you, but Hexers and Ronin are seriously overpowered and can just obliterate almost everything once you get the right skills on them.
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Sep 23, 2014 03:49
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Nick Death Count: 6
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Sep 23, 2014 03:53
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PotatoManJack posted:Wow, the amount that this game likes to kick you in the nuts is pretty funny. Hey, you're only two floors into the dungeon the first time the game decides to steal your lifeline. You might be able to crawl back before something eats you. Maybe. And then you'll have learned a valuable lesson about nature for the next five times the game pulls the same trick.
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Sep 23, 2014 03:54
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PotatoManJack posted:Wow, the amount that this game likes to kick you in the nuts is pretty funny. We've barely scratched the surface on that front. This is an Atlus game. They get off on our tears.
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Sep 23, 2014 04:04
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This party especially is going to kind of late bloom because Ronin and Dark Hunters are merely a'ight at taking hits, especially as things stand. We're trading that for the fact that with our force skills charged up we can completely emasculate bosses with Riot Gun/Dominate and our party being really well situated skill wise to make mad phat stacks of En off the conditional drops.
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Sep 23, 2014 04:27
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PotatoManJack posted:Wow, the amount that this game likes to kick you in the nuts is pretty funny. Like in other Atlus games (e.g. SMT, Persona etc) the early game is unfairly difficult simply because your party has no skills, no levels and thus no options. Ronin and Dark Hunters are glass cannons, however at the moment they're all glass and no cannon; hexers guzzle TP and at the moment she can't make her poison stick; the poor war magus is doing his best but healbotting is always a thankless job (not to mention TP-less). Once they get some levels, however, you'll see bosses completely humiliated by this setup.
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Sep 23, 2014 05:21
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The thing is, I've Atlus played games like SMT:N and Persona 1 & 2 (and quite enjoyed them) but never found those games to be unfair as such, and more just tough. Sure you might go into a boss with the wrong party make-up in SMT:N but usually you have a save spot close by, and you have back-up demons to switch in if you can't work through it. This seems more a case of "Haha - you die through no fault of your own" type of stuff. Still, it makes the LP that much more enjoyable to watch (because I'm not the one playing it)
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Sep 23, 2014 08:43
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Hexers can actually destroy the first stratum pretty easily. It's just that Aliara isn't built for it. If you don't want a Hexer to be dead weight, max out Torpor. It puts all enemies to sleep and has an 87% chance of doing that at max level. And it only needs 5 points to max out. The problem with doing that is that it delays maxing out poison by 5 levels, which I don't want to do at this point.
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Sep 23, 2014 17:54
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That said you can still have a Hexer in good shape to have Poison to an acceptably high level for the fight you want it for most early on and still level Torpor to five. Torpor's really fuckin' good to have given it's got 2/3 the cost of Poison at max and for standard enemies is pretty much just as lethal. It's just not a 'stick this on a thing and they are certain to die' button like level 10 Poison is. Nor is it a license to print money like level 10 poison and the willingness to spend some time.
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Sep 23, 2014 18:00
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It also helps to remember that Sleep causes the target to take extra (twice?) damage on the hit that wakes them up. In later games with heavier single-burst damage like 4, you could do insane amounts of damage if you could nail a big hit on a sleeping target.
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Sep 23, 2014 18:05
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Guild BeowulfPC-88 Version : And that dinosaur STILL hasn't calmed down.: Seems like that thing needs to be killed at this point. It's an active danger to explorers now. Finally got a level up here. PC-88 Version Ken has mastered Dead Law, so he'll be maxing out Overhead next.  Nick's Climax is a pretty special skill. If an enemy's HP is below a threshold, and Climax is used on it, the enemy is killed instantly. Not only that, but Nick is healed by the amount of health the enemy had left when it got killed. Most forms of instant death tend to rely on RNG, and the chances of that happening is lowered if an enemy is resistant to it. The important thing about Climax is that it's a reliable form of instant death. It only checks for two things when it's used on an enemy. 1) Is the enemy below the HP threshold? 2) Is the enemy immune to instant death? If it's no to the first, Climax will always miss. If it's yes to both, Climax just ends up doing a pitiful amount of damage. If it's yes to the first, and no to the second, the enemy is killed. Climax doesn't care if the enemy in question is resistant to instant death, only if they're immune. Unfortunately, like most JRPGs, bosses tend to be immune to instant death, so Climax isn't useful there. In EO1, at max level, Climax could kill an enemy if it was below 25% HP. In this game, at level 1 it only kills at 10%. But at level 10, it kills below 55% HP. Sounds pretty strong, especially if there's a problematic random encounter. But there's one aspect that makes Climax incredibly broken, which I'll cover later. We're not gonna take this skill, as we can't really use it that well at the moment. But we do want it maxed by the end of the second stratum. I have Nick learn Cuffs instead. If you're using a Whip Dark Hunter, you want at least one of the binding skills maxed, maybe two. But not all three, since that's a huge waste of skill points.  Frederik has mastered Regenall.  Fedot takes a second level of Medishot, which will make it even easier to deal with the Venomflies, and some future encounters.  Aliara practices her poison curse some more. She'll stop being dead weight eventually.   Perhaps some sort of key is necessary to gain entry. We won't be able to open this for a long time. : Okay, Ken. Nick. I know you want to get that door open, but I don't think slashing at it with weapons is- you too Frederik!?: You never know unless you try!: Fhgrhff. I can't believe we had to waste our time coming back here, only to find a locked door.: Not really. Look at what I found!  No prompt to enter this secret passage, oddly enough. : Hmm, an empty room. Maybe there's more passages around here.: Let's look around this place. It seems that the path continues beyond the wall... You search for a way past the wall, but the forest is too thick and it seems to be no use. Even if you could climb the wall, the branches are too high for you to reach.  : No good. Looks like the only way we can get past this is above the wall.: Hey, what about that Pauline chick? She looked pretty nimble. Maybe she can jump up there and give us a way up.: Good point, we may have to come back with her later.: Don't bring me along for that trip. I'm getting sick of this place.And here's a new feature I am not fond of. Class specific passageways. Basically, if you don't have the right class in your party for these, in this case a Survivalist, you can't pass. And you have to restructure your party and backtrack all the way back here just to get past a wall. This is the reason why I characters had to be made for all the classes, because these things are pretty much everywhere in the Labyrinth. Most of the time these lead to treasure, but sometimes they lead to new sections of dungeon. Sometimes there happens to be a series of these class specific barriers, and you have to bring a specific party to get past them. With absolutely no indication on which classes you should bring since you can only go through them one at a time. Thankfully getting past these isn't required to progress in the game, but some quests do require this. There's a reason Atlus never brought these back in future EO games, and the remake is pretty much guaranteed to not have these because of the story mode. PC-88 Version Well this encounter isn't a threat either. Our party can take out the Venomfly before it can do anything, and the damage from the Cactoid can be healed up easily.    A look at our 3 damage dealer's outputs for now. PC-88 Version But the way to the path is blocked, and there seems to be no way to walk through it. : It doesn't look like there's a way around this one either.Just as you had despaired on passing the forest wall, the dark hunter present speaks up. : Not so fast! Watch this!With one stroke of the whip, the dark hunter latches onto a thick branch on the other side! If you use the whip as a line, you may be able to make it over the wall! : Hmm, nice job Nick. : Hope you guys know how to climb. : Oh sweet!The treasures on the other side of the barriers for this area contains much stronger weapons for the classes used to access them, except for one, which contains a Flame Jar, a pretty powerful attack item for this point.   Now that's a big number. Nick's not gonna be hitting as hard as Ken, but it's still a nice upgrade. : Uh, how do we get past this one? What the writing could possibly mean is beyond you... But it's apparent that a spell of some sort has been cast upon the stone monument. : All I see is a bunch of letters and words I don't understand. : Perhaps that Bellamy fellow can understand this? He was dabbling in magic, right?Our Alchemist is needed for this one.  You strain your eyes and discover that it's some sort of emblem engraved into a rock. A shining gem is embedded in the emblem's center... You are certain beyond a doubt that magic is present in that emblem. : Maybe it's a switch of some kind.: But how do we reach it?As the rest of you debate on how best to reach the gem, the gunner pushes you aside. : Stay back, I've got this.With a single, well-aimed shot, the gunner hits the gem and activates the spell! The nature of the magic seems to have been wind-based... You can barely remain on your feet as the spell draws you to the other side of the wall! The spell's effect will wear off with time. Now is your best chance to cross the wall. Okay, so the flavor text explanations for how you get past these barriers for the others are kind of neat, and based on what they're capable of. But for the Gunner, he shoots something and then magic happens. What?   : Whee! Oh that was fun! Can we do it again?: Please no. I landed on my back when we jumped over.: Party pooper. : Oh good, I wanted to get a replacement for this gun. My old one was starting to get worn out.  And now Fedot is hitting as hard as Nick.    Look at those sweet numbers.  This area has two Furyhorns patrolling it.  Also easy to get around.  This is an event that's exclusive to a password game. Unlike most of the other password related stuff, this one's actually beneficial.  You greet him, and he warmly returns the greeting. : Oh, hello. What are you doing down here? ; I heard that Odyssey had come to the Grand Duchy. Would that happen to be you?: Yep, but we go by Firefly now.You nod your assent, and the guard gives you a fascinated look before continuing. : That's wonderful! To think a guild that famous would come to our Labyrinth!Obviously impressed, the guard tells you that he wishes to help you with your investigation. He offers your choice of a weapon or medicine for your adventure. Either is 1000en. : I have a Gladius and a Therica BX. Which one do you want? You consider lying to him, but realize that no words can take the place of real money. : We'll take the wea-: We'd love to take the medicine, but we don't have enough for it right now.: I see... Well, I'll be here for a while, so come back if you change your mind.The guard watches you leave. There was an event in the first game where a guard would offer you a sword or some medicine for 100en. The sword was a ripoff, and the medicine was the better deal. It's the same case here. The Gladius is a pretty strong sword, but at 1000en it's a ripoff, and none of our party members can even make good use of a sword at the moment. The Therica BX on the other hand is a super good deal. What this does is heal every status effect on the whole party, acting like a max level Medishot/Refresh. What makes this an even better deal, is that you can't buy these until you've reached the postgame. Even if you don't want to use it, it sells more than 1000en, so this could also be an opportunity to make some money if you wanted to. Sadly we can't afford it right now. While a password game does have some minor downsides, upsides like these definitely make those well worth it.  : Oh I think we can get through this one without any funny business.  The Color Boot gives some more defense and AGI, but only certain classes can wear it. I have Fedot wear these since Gunners are really slow.  A nice bit of money, but it's still not enough to for the Therica BX. : Okay, NOW can we buy some food?: No. The better equipment and supplies are pretty expensive and we need to save up for those. And that medicine that guard had.: Oh come on! : You can't expect us to eat snails and hedgehogs forever!  : Oh thanks Ken. That should feed us for the next week.: GAH!   The Wing Leaf is a very nice piece of armor at this point. I put it on Aliara since she's the squishiest of our back row so far.  I notice our party's close to a level up, so I just wander around this floor getting into fights.  If you run into these encounters though, you may want to run. But eventually our party levels up.  Ken levels up Overhead to 2, Nick puts another point in Cuffs.  I want Frederik to get this skill, so I put another point in War Lore.  While I do want this skill maxed out, we won't see the paralysis and terror status effects for a while.  Instead I'm putting a point into Haltshot. New to this game (and never used in any other game) are FOE manipulating items and skills. Some like Haltshot can stop FOEs in their tracks, while others can lure them away to a certain spot. Not all FOEs are affected by these, and I don't really find them too useful. Still I want two points into this before the end of the first stratum. Aliara just levels up Poison to 5. At this point it can hit affected targets for around 85 damage, but it only has a 35% chance of hitting. Better than nothing at least.  This is all we can explore on the second floor at the moment.  : Ah, a new floor. New things to discover.: And maybe animals other than snails and hedgehogs that we can eat.Huh, what's that gray icon?  PC-88 Version  : Huh, a new monster already?: No, wait. I don't think it wants to hurt us.But after a second of meeting its eyes, it looks to the north, as if directing you there. A second growl indicates that it wishes you to go there, and it faces you once again. You can travel the northern path indicated by the beast, or continue on your way. : Huh? Up that way? Alright then.: Nah, let's check out this path fir-Yipes!  The beast bares its fangs and growls threateningly... : Okay okay! We'll go that way!You step back and contemplate whether or not to take the path that the beast indicated.  : Someone's here. PC-88 VersionBefore you can draw your weapons, a figure appears...  : Oh, I'm Fedot. Leader of Guild Firefly. And that's Ken, Nick, Frederik, and Aliara.: So what are you doing here?The good-natured protector notes your confused expressions before continuing pleasantly.  : Since you're new to the forest, I thought I should teach you about something useful.With this, the man points to a mysterious shaft of light in a hollow to the south.  : So what does it do?: It has the useful function of teleporting explorers from the entrance back to here. All the guilds make use of it when we explore the forest. You should do the same.: So wait, does this mean we can skip the first and second floors now? Awesome! Wait, how do we use it?: There's no trick to it, just touch the light. Then you can come here from town in a flash.: So who made these things? They sound helpful.: Ah... Who made them, you ask? I'm afraid no one knows the answer to that one.The man called Flausgul gazes at the Geomagnetic Pole, his long hair blowing in the wind. : That reminds me... Eventually, you'll encounter what we called the Geomagnetic Field as well. It's even more mysterious. It can teleport you from town to the Labyrinth and back.: Oh, so this pole's a one way deal.: Things like that are good to know if you're going to explore the forest.While the protector speaks, the black beast you encountered before walks up to him. : Aha... Excuse me, but Kurogane is here for me.Flausgul calls the beast's name, and walks away... You can activate the Geomagnetic Pole as he instructed, or ignore it and continue on your journey. In EO1, you never really interacted with any other explorers or guilds. For the most part, your guild was alone when exploring Etria's Labyrinth aside from some recurring NPCs you interacted with. Also fun fact, Flausgul's and Kurogane's names were mistranslated. Their names were supposed to be Hrothgar and Wulfgar. This was corrected in the remake. PC-88 Version: Right, let's set this thing up.  New to this game are the Geomagnetic Poles. They serve as checkpoints within the Labyrinth. Every stratum has two of these, on the third and fifth floors. Unfortunately, only one of these can be active at a time. Activating a new one deactivates the previous one, and these can only take you into the Labyrinth, not out. And you can't save your game here like at the Geomagnetic Fields. In the first game, the only checkpoints in the Labyrinth were the shortcuts and the Geomagnetic Fields, so if you wanted to travel down to the 5th floor of a stratum, you had to walk a long way. These are gone in the 3rd and 4th games, but the shortcut placements in each stratum made getting down to the floor you wanted really easy. : Huh, he was pretty helpful.: Oh, over here everyone! I think I found another passageway.  : That I can't open up from this side. Open, Sesame! Open, Barley! What's the password for this?: Uh, you can stop hitting the trees now. I'll just mark it down for later, so we know where to look on the other side.: Very well then.Even if you find shortcuts you can't open, mark them down so you know if you're close to opening one up from the other side. PC-88 Version  Roller HP: 87 AT: 10 DF: 13 Exp: 265 Skills: Rolling Item Drops: -Common: Gum Hide - 1 needed for Wing Leaf and Sherwani. 2 needed for Bullwhip, Hide Aspis, and Rough Hat. 3 needed for Hide Plate. 5 needed for Iron Glove. --Animal hide with buoyant properties. -Rare: Shell Wart - 1 needed for Briar Whip. 5 needed for Tshirovha (Axe.) 7 needed for Kurodachi (Katana.) --Thorns protruding from a beast's carapace. -Conditional: N/A Description: A small creature which can curl up in its shell in order to roll around and ram its enemies. Weakness: Fire (150%) Resistance: Physical (75%) Ah, these things pretty much test your party composition. They're resistant to physical attacks, and can hit harder with Rolling. Physical attacks don't do too much against them, but fire will take them down easily. : On tonight's menu- what is that anyway?: Armadillo? Armored rat? It'll be nice to eat something new for once anyway.  : Man this thing has a hard shell!: We can barely scratch it.  : Oh god! They hit hard too!: Oh for the love of. Okay, this is how it's done.  : Roasted, toasted, and burned to a crisp. And the party gains nothing from the battle. : I think you put too much fire in that shot.: I'm not eating that.: Yeah I'll settle for the hedgehogs.: Eh, I'll lighten up on the shots next time. Oh well, I'd say we made some pretty good progress. And we can come back here thanks to that Geomagnetic Pole. What do you say we go back for now?: OH THANK GOD! YES PLEASE! I sell off our drops and old equipment at the store, but nothing got unlocked.  PC-88 Version : Pretty much everyday we go into the Labyrinth is like that. Anything new happen to you lately? : My father went to market the other day to buy me a new dress. I thought I might wear it in the shop to show it off, but it does get dusty in here. Maybe you can come back this weekend and I'll wear it then!: I'm sure you'll look as cute as a button then. PC-88 Version : We managed to reach the third floor today. And with little to no accidents I may add. : Good to hear. Though your job as explorers has only just begun. The Grand Duchy maintains a guard corps presence in the Labyrinth, but it is small. Just like this town... It's a shame the explorers can so easily outmatch the guards. Perhaps we should look to the guilds when recruiting new members of the guard corps.: That would probably be a good idea.: Either way, we'll need your explorer's strength to proceed with our investigations. Thank you for assisting us. I'm expecting great things from you all.: We won't disappoint! PC-88 Version  : Occasionally, you may encounter other guilds in the Labyrinth. There's a man from the guild called Beowulf who's always very supportive for beginners.: Oh, we just met him. He was pretty helpful.: Naturally, Guild Beowulf isn't the only guild you can expect to meet in your travels. That's all the advice I have for you. Never underestimate the Labyrinth.PC-88 Version : Yep. We're looking to go up to the 4th floor soon.: What? : Eh? Yeh want to move up even faster...? Don't be daft! The Labyrinth isn't a playground! I give yeh credit for having guts, but don't overdo it! Know yer limitations, and take it slow! G'luck out there!: He has a point Fedot. You don't want to tire out the guild now. I think poor Ken's exhausted. So, what's on the quest list? : Oh, yeh'll take it? S'pose yeh've got a soft spot for this town! Haw! What I need yeh to do is get 3 materials for the hunting horn those guards carry.: The what now?: Yeh've not seen it? They blow on the thing to communicate, or when they're in trouble. The more explorers that flock to this town, the more guards yeh see. Think yeh'll sign up?: Nah, I don't like having responsibilities like that.: Anyway, yeh can get the Red Shards they need from one of the Labyrinth critters. G'luck!The Red Shards are a random drop from an enemy on the third floor we haven't encountered yet. Not too complicated.  : Oh, it's that one yeh're aftter? The Duke's guards went on a mission in the Labyrinth... Yer job is to bring them food and other supplies, but I warn yeh—it's a damned heavy load! I s'pose yeh could divide it up equally, but there's a wee problem with that.: I don't like where this is going.: If someone carrying the stuff dies, the monsters will scarf it up lickety-split. So yeh can't let a single man die until yeh've delivered the goods, understand? The guards're up on the 4th floor. Careful with that stuff, all right? I don't know why this quest is given to you this early. The quest distribution per floor in this game is really bad. Also this is another annoying thing with most of EO2's quests. Most of them can be failed, and if you do, you have to report the quest early, and accept it again to get another try. Not many of EO1's quests could be failed, so this is a change I'm also not fond of. Also the condition for failing this one is super easy, and we're nowhere close to entering the 4th floor either. : Uh, you guys might want to take a look at this quest. Hey Cass? Can you tell us more about this? : Ah, yeh're taking the quest? This one should make a great warmup for the hard stuff. Yeh knew the huge monster in the northern clearing on the 1st floor? Well, some stupid blighter took a poke at it. It's usually calm, but now that it's been riled... It's attacking anyone who comes near. Bad news, that one. Lotta people think the beastie needs killing, so there's yer job. And if you can't hack it, yeh've no chance of reaching the floating castle. Go get 'em, and g'luck!: Great. Who's the idiot that annoyed the dinosaur?: Look, Pauline and the others are here. Maybe they know what happened.: Oh I would think so. So. Pauline. Care to tell me where you got those wounds from? : Uhhhh... : Oh, she decided not listen to your warning about the creature, and poked at it. Then it bit at her and started stomping around.: Why would you tell them that!?: I'm not taking the blame for the mess you've caused. For the record, we tried to stop her, but her curiosity got the best of her.: I hate you so much. This was not how my tale of glory was supposed to start.: Oh, really now? Oh, here's our main haul of food we got from the Labyrinth. Good work on the gathering. Make sure Pauline doesn't get any.:  So remember that immobile FOE on the first floor? Once you take this quest, it starts moving around. The Gashtor is actually a weaker version of another FOE in the first stratum, which is why we saw it so early. It's also a quest FOE, so once we kill it, it's gone for good. Unfortunately our party isn't strong enough to take it out yet. Maybe by level 8 or 9.  PC-88 Verison  : You there! Could you please lend me a hand and clear the area?: Uh, sure! Out of the way people!: If you could please excuse us, we need to get through here! Phew... thank you. Yet another explorer who got badly injured in the Labyrinth. Even experienced explorers can run into trouble if they're ambushed by monsters. Remember that during your own journeys.: Yeah that Labyrinth slammed that lesson into our face a few times.  : That was fast! I didn't think you had it in you.: Hey!: Oh, I didn't mean anything by it. You just don't look that strong... I was worried. But at this pace, I think you'll do great things! Good luck up there, children!: Go get some rest guys. We'll try to reach the 4th floor sometime this week.
Araxxor fucked around with this message at 04:37 on Sep 6, 2015 |
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Sep 23, 2014 18:14
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I'm starting to think we should have had Snake replace Fedot at this rate.
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Sep 23, 2014 18:54
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theshim posted:I'm starting to think we should have had Snake replace Fedot at this rate. FOE eater doesn't really have the same ring to it though
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Sep 24, 2014 00:47
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Bellmaker posted:Do you really need to max out Medishot ASAP? The nastier status effects shouldn't show until later on (at least from my experience with EO1)... Is it an accuracy issue? Actually, I was completely wrong about this. There are enemies in the second stratum that can petrify you, and I thought Medishot healed that at max level. It doesn't. Only the Medic's refresh can heal petrification. Not even the Protector's version heals it. So you only need two levels of it for the first stratum. It heals everything except petrification at level 4. Level 5 just decreases the TP cost by 3 and gives it a higher speed modifier. You'll still want level 4 Medishot, just not in the first stratum. A maxed out Medishot might still be useful because of the Gunner's terrible TP pool. Can't really work on an update for a while because of university exams. I might have a class discussion for the Landsknecht ready at least.
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Sep 26, 2014 05:31
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Dr. Fetus posted:Actually, I was completely wrong about this. There are enemies in the second stratum that can petrify you, and I thought Medishot healed that at max level. It doesn't. Only the Medic's refresh can heal petrification. Not even the Protector's version heals it. So you only need two levels of it for the first stratum. It heals everything except petrification at level 4. Level 5 just decreases the TP cost by 3 and gives it a higher speed modifier. You'll still want level 4 Medishot, just not in the first stratum. A maxed out Medishot might still be useful because of the Gunner's terrible TP pool. I've got a class discussion for EO2 Landknecht for you right here:  (It was my favorite class in EO1)
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Sep 26, 2014 05:35
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theshim posted:I'm starting to think we should have had Snake replace Fedot at this rate. What the hell else is he supposed to hunt? The deer around here are dynamite.
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Sep 26, 2014 05:52
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Game Mechanics - Common Skills In the Etrian Odyssey games, when a class levels up, not only do they get stronger stat wise, but they get an extra skill point to make use of. These skill points can be used to make a class learn a new skill, or to make one of their skills even stronger. Skills in EO2 need 1, 5, or 10 points to max out. Classes tend to have some skills that can be decent in the earlygame, but as the game goes on, having those skills tends to be a huge waste of skill points. Most classes have a really big damage skill that can be pretty helpful to have, and they tend to have some utility skills to make dungeon crawling a bit easier, or to help support the party in battle. Unfortunately, one of the big problems in the series is when leveling up a skill, the game doesn't tell you how much that skill gets better. When leveling up a skill, it could say that the damage increases, but it could be a 1% increase or a 10% increase for all you know. Some skills are also useless and it's a waste of skill points to even level those up. The series didn't get better about that until EO4. HP Up Max lvl: 10 1 - 2% Increase 2 - 4% 3 - 7% 4 - 10% 5 - 14% 6 - 21% 7 - 26% 8 - 31% 9 - 37% 10 - 45% You can see right here how scaling can work for some skills. A few levels might not do much, but maxing it out gives you a lot more benefits. HP Up is a pretty nice stat to max out, as it can make tankier classes even tankier, and squishy classes less squishy. TP Up Max lvl: 10 1 - 2% Increase 2 - 4% 3 - 8% 4 - 14% 5 - 22% 6 - 32% 7 - 44% 8 - 58% 9 - 74% 10 - 92% TP Up can be a good investment on any class, especially when their TP pool practically gets doubled at level 10. However, both HP Up and TP Up are skills you want to take later, rather than sooner due to how they scale. Doubling a 30 TP pool to around 60 in the early game isn't really impressive when it could go from 100 TP to around 200 later on. STR/TEC/VIT/AGI/LUC Up Max lvl: 10 A level in any of these increases that stat by 1, up to 10 points. Some of these stats are used as prerequisites, but if you want a class to be better in a certain area, you can pump up their stats to make them hit harder, be more sturdy, make them faster, or make sure that ailments are more likely to hit. ESC Up Max lvl: 1 The formula for escaping from battles is as follows: Escape Chance = [10 * (AGI + LUC + 5) / (Enemy's Average AGI + Enemy's Average LUC + 5)]% The numbers are rounded down after calculations. On average, this means fighting enemies of equal strength will give your around a 10% chance to escape from battle. Putting a point in ESC Up will increase the chance by 30% only for the classes that have this skill. Each failed escape attempt increases the escape chance by 10%, maxing out at 90%. A party that has everyone invest in this skill will have a high chance of escaping on the first or second turn if everyone attempts to escape. Gathering Skills Max lvl: 5 Each class has access to some gathering skills, which can be used at certain spots in the Labyrinth to get items. Listed below are the different gathering skills, and which classes can get them. Chop Alchemist, Dark Hunter, and War Magus. Take Medic, Troubadour, Hexer, and Gunner. Mine Landsknecht, Protector, and Ronin. Survivalsts and Beasts are exceptions to this. A Survivalist has access to all the gathering skills, while a Beast only has one skill that lets you gather from all 3 different gathering points. Araxxor fucked around with this message at 23:28 on Jul 2, 2015 |
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Sep 27, 2014 00:29
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Class Discussion - Landsknecht The rest of the portraits The EO1 class portraits. Why are you using this class? Why aren't you using a Ronin? Anyways, known as Swordman in Japan, yes without the s, Landsknechts are front line fighters that are kind of a jack of all trades class in what they are capable of. Balanced offenses and defenses, and have some supporting abilities. They can be skilled in two ways, learning how to use swords for quick strikes and multi target damage. Or they can learn how to use axes to inflict status ailments and deal a great amount of damage to a single target. Some of their skills need the Landsknecht to know hot to use both swords and axes. A popular way to build them in EO1 was to make them learn how to use both swords and axes, using swords for multi target damage, and axes for single targets, and changing the equipped weapon depending on the situation. They were pretty much the damage dealer of choice along with the Survivalist, and could clear out random encounters with ease. Unfortunately, they didn't handle the transition to EO2 that well. Landsknechts got nerfed in this game, and they were one of the classes hit hardest along with the Survivalist. The TP costs on their skills got increased, and their damage output was lowered a bit. Not to mention they have to compete with the Ronin, who can do almost everything a Landsknecht can, but better. The only things Landsknechts have over Ronin are that they have stronger defenses, and they have access to the Chaser skills. Those can do some decent damage if a party is built around those, but actually setting up for those is a pretty questionable strategy. Stats Level 1 HP - 45 TP - 20 STR - 6 TEC - 5 VIT - 6 AGI - 5 LUC - 5 Level 70 HP - 515 TP - 117 STR - 58 TEC - 32 VIT - 58 AGI - 51 LUC - 35 For the record, I'm only including the stats below for completion’s sake. Reaching level 99 on any class is not an easy thing to do for reasons I'll cover later. It's probably best to ignore this, and when talking stat wise, I'll be referring to their level 70 stats. Level 99 HP - 746 TP - 251 STR - 75 TEC - 49 VIT - 76 AGI - 70 LUC - 53 Landsknechts have all around balanced stats. If you decide to level up their stats, strength is one choice for increasing their physical damage. Their skills cost a lot of TP and they have pretty small TP pools, so increasing their TP may also be something you want to consider. Agility is also a good investment if you want them to move faster, or if you want to make use of their status effect skills. Swords/Axes Max lvl: 10 Both of these are prerequisite skills that just exist to unlock other skills. At level 1 they give a 2% boost to sword and axe skills, respectively. And at level 10 they give a 11% boost to damage. It should be noted that using a sword as a weapon gives a boost in speed, while using an axe will slow down its wielder. Because of that and other reasons, the sword skills are better than the axe skills. Counter Needs lvl. 8 Swords and Axes Max lvl: 5 This skill is a passive that lets the Landsknecht counter physical attacks from enemies. At level 1 it has a 15% chance to counter and hits the enemy with 50% of the damage taken. At level 5 it has a 35% chance to counter and hits back with 100% of the damage they took. Not a skill I would probably invest in unless there's nowhere else to make use of their skill points. It's more of a nice thing to have, rather than anything vital. An interesting thing to note about this skill, is that even if the Protector's Force Skill, or any other skill that can block any damage a Landsknecht takes is used, this skill can still proc and counter the enemy with the damage they would have taken otherwise. 2-Hit Needs lvl. 5 Swords and Axes Max lvl: 5 This is a passive skill that gives normal attacks have a chance of hitting twice. This does not apply to skills. At level 1 it gives a 5% chance of hitting twice. At level 5 it gives a 13% chance, and at level 10 it gives a 35% chance of hitting twice. Again, not a skill I would take unless there's nothing else to level up. It is kind of nice to have and can save the Landsknecht some TP in regular encounters. Cleaver Needs lvl. 1 Swords Max lvl: 10 This is a pretty basic damage skill. At level 1 it costs 3 TP and increases by 1 per level, and costs 12 TP at level 10 and has a 220% damage modifier, and a 190% speed modifier. Tornado Needs lvl. 3 Swords Max lvl: 10 Another damaging skill, but it deals slightly less than Cleaver at level 10 with a 210% modifier instead of 220%. But it has a splashing effect, and hits enemies adjacent to the main target for 100% instead of 210%. It only costs 13 TP at 10, so this skill is probably the better investment. It does have a 140% speed modifier instead, so that's something to consider if you want to take this skill over Cleaver. Allslash Needs lvl. 5 Swords Max lvl: 10 This used to be the skill to rush towards in EO1 since it could shred random encounters and was pretty much guaranteed to shred 3 monster mobs at level 10. Unfortunately, this skill got several nerfs, making it pretty much useless. The TP cost starts at 8 and increases by 1 per level. At level 10 this skill has a 150% damage modifier and costs 17 TP, and can strike 2 to 4 enemies in a battle. For comparison, in the first game, this skill had a 190% damage modifier and could strike 3-4 enemies in battle at level 10. Ouch. Yeah, just ignore this skill. The low damage isn't really worth it, and it'll eat up a huge chunk of your TP pool for a majority of the game. Tornado is probably the better skill to go with for clearing out random encounters. Though something that did change from EO1 is that it has a chance of striking the same enemy again, so that's something to consider if you insist on taking this skill. Hypercut Needs lvl. 5 Swords + lvl. 1 AGI Up Max lvl: 5 Another damaging skill, but it has a really high speed modifier. If you took any of the other sword skills, there's pretty much little point in taking this one. It deals 200% damage at max level, costs 12 TP, and has a speed modifier of 290%. If you already have another sword skill maxed all this does is ensure that you attack before the enemy. If speed really is an issue, go ahead and level up this skill if you want, but this skill is kind of redundant in my opinion. Riskcut Needs lvl. 7 Swords Max lvl: 5 This is a damage skill that gets stronger as the Landsknecht loses HP. It costs 4 TP at level 1, and 12 TP at level 5. It deals 150% damage if the Landsknecht is above 50% health, and 180% damage if the Landsknecht is below that. Considering that the Landsknecht has a bunch of other sword skills that deal a decent amount of damage, more than this skill even, I don't really see the point of taking this skill at all. Again, ignore. Deathaxe Needs lvl. 1 Axes Max lvl: 10 A really basic axe attack. At level 1 it costs 3 TP. Each level increases the TP cost by 1, and at level 10 it costs 12 TP, and does 230% damage, just slightly more than a sword skill. You might want to skip out on this skill since a couple of the later axe skills make this one redundant. Silencer Needs lvl. 3 Axes Max lvl: 10 This skill has a chance to bind an enemy's head. It deals the same amount of damage as Deathaxe at level 10, but costs 13 TP at that level. It has a 60% chance to bind at level 10. This skill could be nice if you wanted a way to bind enemy heads, but the thing to be aware of is that Landsknechts have low luck, which doesn't help with inflicting ailments like these. Brawn Needs lvl. 5 Axes + lvl. 1 STR Up Max lvl: 5 At max level this skill deals 258% damage, but it will always go last. It does more damage than all the other axe skills, but it's pretty risky to use. Know the risks of taking this skill. Lifeaxe Needs lvl. 5 Axes Max lvl: 5 The opposite skill of Riskcut. It deals more damage the higher your HP is. It can deal a maximum of 210% damage. Which is less than most of the other axe skills and only gets worse as the Landsknecht takes damage. Another useless skill. Stunner Needs lvl. 7 Axes Max lvl: 10 This skill has a chance to stun the enemy it strikes. It starts off costing 9 TP and has a 5% chance to stun the target, and the chance increases to 95% at level 10, and deals 230% damage. This skill may sound good on paper, but it's pretty useless in practice. Stuns don't carry over to the next turn, so this skill has to go first to get the most out of it, and using axes slow down the Landsknecht a lot. Not to mention their luck is a bit low. So this skill needs a lot of investment to even be a bit worthwhile, maxing out AGI and LUC is pretty much necessary for this. The thing that makes this skill even worse is that bosses are heavily resistant to status ailments, to the point where they reduce the chances of a status ailment landing down to 10-30% of the normal value. Honestly I would probably ignore this skill too. Blazer/Freezer/Shocker Needs lvl. 5 Swords and Axes Max lvl: 5 These skills are unique to Landsknechts, and probably the main reason to use them if you insist on using one over a Ronin. These skills let Landsknechts deal elemental damage to any enemy on the screen, but only if the enemies get hit with the right elemental attacks. In EO1 these were exclusive to sword Landsknechts, but now in EO2 axe Landsknechts can use them too. Blazer will only activate if an enemy got hit with a Fire attack, and so on and so forth. These skills are purely elemental, so it's not like Freezer is Ice/Slashing (crushing if using an axe) damage. The way these skills work is that a Landsknecht will prepare to use the chaser of your choice at the start of a turn. Once an enemy is hit with the corresponding element of your chaser, the Landsknecht will strike the enemy. This can activate multiple times, and can activate up to 7 times at level 5 if you're lucky. At level 1 it costs 6 TP, but the chaser will only proc once. Each time a chaser skill activates, the chance of it happening again goes down. The chance reduction is 100% at level 1, meaning that the skill can only proc once, and each level reduces the chance of a chaser not activating by 21% and increases the TP cost by 2. Meaning at level 5, chaser skills have a 16% chance to not activate per chase. The skills also cost 14 TP each at that level. War Cry Needs lvl. 1 STR Up Max lvl: 5 War Cry provides an attack buff to the Landsknecht at the cost of them taking more damage. It costs 5 TP at level 1 and decreases to 1 at level 5. At level 1 it increases attack by 10% and no extra damage is taken, while at level 5 it increases damage by 70% and causes the Landsknecht to take an extra 50% damage while the buff is active. Pretty risky to use, but if you're gonna take this skill, it's just best to max it out since the damage boost is pretty big at level 5. Unbound Max lvl: 5 This was known in EO1 as a really terrible skill called Arm Heal. All it did was unbind the Landsknecht's arms, and only 3 of the 10 levels did anything, and that was reduce the TP cost. Here it actually got changed into something useful. It removes up to 3 bindings on any party member. At level 1 and 2 it removes one binding and costs 3 TP. 3 and 4 reduces the TP cost to 2 and removes 2 bindings, and level 5 reduces the TP cost to 1 and removes 3 bindings. I wouldn't level this up all the way to 5. Level 3 Unbound is going to be enough for most of the game, and the situations where a party member gets completely bound are rare. And generally in those situations you'll want to use a Therica AX instead of a single target unbinding skill. Gathering Skill: Mine Force Skill: All-Out Slashes all enemies on the screen for a huge amount of damage. Unlike Issen, it doesn't have any additional effects. One of the main problems with Landsknechts is that their damage output is really low, and it doesn't help that their axe skills are pretty much useless. A skill that has a damage modifier of around 200% would be pretty powerful in EO1. But in EO2, most of the offensive classes have skills that have damage modifiers that can deal around 400%. Landsknechts don't really have any big damage skills aside from Brawn. Which means that other offensive classes such as Ronin, Dark Hunters, and Gunners overshadow them. The only way Landsknechts can really dish out a lot of damage is if they make good use of their chaser skills, which pretty much requires you to build a party specifically to make use of that. Overall this is a class that's not really worth using, and is dead weight in the post game. Araxxor fucked around with this message at 21:45 on Jun 21, 2015 |
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Sep 27, 2014 00:29
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Yeesh. I knew Landsknechts got nerfed pretty hard, the Allslash nerf is the real dealbreaker there. My Landsknecht was Allslashing all day in EO1.
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Sep 27, 2014 02:45
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I don't care what anyone says, the chaser skills in EO1/2 are absolute trash and never end up doing much. Landsknecht's main issue is that they're supposed to be a tankier offensive attacker but they lose the damage needed to keep up and moderate defense is still grounds for being 2-3 shotted in EO terms. They worked in EO1 because they actually were able to do enough damage to keep up with the enemy health totals. In EO2 they just can't keep up and end up doing mostly chip damage to enemies. For people who have played EO3, imagine Gladiator with no sub, no Blade Rave, no Nine Smashes and no Charge. That's pretty much EO2 Landsknecht. EOU nerfed Landsknecht from EO1 again but that was mainly due to increasing the complexity of the game system and increasing TP costs. They were still absolutely viable in a party composition, and i hope that they remain useful in EOU2. Also, the portraits in the discussion are actually the ones from EO1. The character designs are the same but the art is slightly better and they're in different poses. For some reason there's next to no readily available information about EO2 and I've never been able to find a good source for portraits myself. Edit: vvv I'll be damned. Thanks for that, I've been looking for the EO2 class portraits for a long time. double edit: ahhh they're jpgs oh well, at least there's all the portraits in one place.
Reco fucked around with this message at 03:57 on Sep 27, 2014 |
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Sep 27, 2014 03:43
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Hivac posted:Also, the portraits in the discussion are actually the ones from EO1. The character designs are the same but the art is slightly better and they're in different poses. For some reason there's next to no readily available information about EO2 and I've never been able to find a good source for portraits myself. http://www.legendra.com/rpg/fiche-rpg_id-2392-supports_id-36-rpg-etrian_odyssey_ii__heroes_of_lagaard.html#galerie_art_2392_36_20_1 This site has (almost?) all the EO2 character sprites
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Sep 27, 2014 03:48
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Hivac posted:I don't care what anyone says, the chaser skills in EO1/2 are absolute trash and never end up doing much. Landsknecht's main issue is that they're supposed to be a tankier offensive attacker but they lose the damage needed to keep up and moderate defense is still grounds for being 2-3 shotted in EO terms. They worked in EO1 because they actually were able to do enough damage to keep up with the enemy health totals. In EO2 they just can't keep up and end up doing mostly chip damage to enemies. For people who have played EO3, imagine Gladiator with no sub, no Blade Rave, no Nine Smashes and no Charge. That's pretty much EO2 Landsknecht. Yeah I never really used the chasers too much in the first two games. The way they worked meant that you needed a specific party to make them work. On the other hand, EO3 shows what happens if you make the chaser skills too good. I'm not really surprised they got nerfed in 4, although they're still good there. I had a tough time finding the EO2 artwork for any of the EO1 classes. I did find some but the pictures were really grainy. I did find another site that had them, but half of the portraits were missing. Some of the art did make an improvement. For one thing, the 2nd male Protector has much better proportions than he did in the first game. EDIT: ^ Oh thanks, but I don't think I'll be using those since the image quality of those aren't that great. It does have all the class artwork though. Araxxor fucked around with this message at 04:03 on Sep 27, 2014 |
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Sep 27, 2014 03:57
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I like the idea of a dude using tons of different weapons as appropriate, but I have yet to find an RPG that'll actually support that.
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Sep 29, 2014 06:58
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Glazius posted:I like the idea of a dude using tons of different weapons as appropriate, but I have yet to find an RPG that'll actually support that. I can't think of any jRPG, but in the Infinity Engine games you could equip multiple weapons depending on character class (i.e. warriors had 4 quickslots, wizards 2 etc) and switch on the fly in battle. The two main problems are always that games punish weapon switching in battle and that you usually can't spec characters to support specializing in more than one weapon at a time.
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Sep 29, 2014 07:24
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