|
Which is why I put forth the hypothesis that Chuck is acting on a pathological desire to control Jimmy. Chuck may have had a hand in Jimmy getting caught, knowing that Jimmy would turn to him (chuck) and then he could control Jimmy from there.
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 05:42
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 5, 2024 16:19 |
|
|
Stop saying Chuck got Jimmy the job in the mail room. Jimmy could have gotten a job in loving any mail room he wanted. That it was the one at HHM is because Jimmy wanted to work in the same building as his brother.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 05:44
|
|
|
Tao Jones posted:I think that's certainly true, and if his treatment of Jimmy is what caused his electromagnetic hypersensitivity, it's even a little sympathetic, to a point. What doesn't seem like it's been fully explained, to me, is that Chuck was willing to stand up to Jimmy in the interrogation room for the Chicago Sunroof and willing to confront him then. Yeah I see what you're saying. I don't think we have the complete picture yet about Jimmy's past. Maybe seeing that will shed some light on things? In the podcast, the creators said that they cut the original teaser for the latest episode, which was another flashback, but they were tightlipped about what it contained because they might reuse it again later. Which, imo, says to me that there's something we're missing.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 05:44
|
|
|
SpiderHyphenMan posted:Stop saying Chuck got Jimmy the job in the mail room. Jimmy could have gotten a job in loving any mail room he wanted. That it was the one at HHM is because Jimmy wanted to work in the same building as his brother. I think his brother being a partner could have been significant in this especially if Jimmy has a criminal record.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 05:46
|
|
|
SpiderHyphenMan posted:Stop saying Chuck got Jimmy the job in the mail room. Jimmy could have gotten a job in loving any mail room he wanted. That it was the one at HHM is because Jimmy wanted to work in the same building as his brother. Not arguing against or for you here. I'd have to rewatch the first episode and see what Chuck was like when they talked in the holding area. Anyone have a fresh memory of the words that were spoken? Your point of Jimmy wanting to work with Chuck stands.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 05:47
|
|
|
fleshweasel posted:I think his brother being a partner could have been significant in this especially if Jimmy has a criminal record. ...yet.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 05:50
|
|
|
i hope chuck dies
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 05:57
|
|
|
I don't know anything about lawyers...what's keeping HMM from just stealing the case from Jimmy? Couldn't they just go to the clients and say "we have more resources than that McGill guy, hire us". Is it just professional courtesy? Another question: The Kettlemans were stealing little by little over a long time, right? I don't remember where I got that idea, but it seems really weird that they'd take a bit of money and just put it in a pile and let it grow. Regarding this episode, there's been a lot of praise for Bob Odenkirk and Michael McKean, but Kim's actress did really good with her few scenes. Whether it was Hamlin yelling at her or Jimmy yelling at her, she reacted really well.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 06:00
|
|
|
FreeKillB posted:^^^^^^^^^^: Chuck is comfortable with the idea as Jimmy working under him as a peon, as a form of probation. He thought he was doing right by Jimmy by confronting him and setting him on the straight path. He's not comfortable with thinking of Jimmy as an equal. Yeah this exactly. When he first starts working the case with Jimmy and sits at the desk and immediately gives him orders, Chuck was having the time of his life.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 06:00
|
|
|
HaroldofTheRock posted:I don't know anything about lawyers...what's keeping HMM from just stealing the case from Jimmy? Couldn't they just go to the clients and say "we have more resources than that McGill guy, hire us". Is it just professional courtesy? It leaves the firm open to a lawsuit from Jimmy, which if it gets public makes the firm look like it stole from a hardworking lawyer who is trying to protect seniors. It would be a PR nightmare.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 06:06
|
|
wins.
|
PassTheRemote posted:
You've missed the point. It's irrelevant whether Jimmy is a nicer person then Chuck. What matters is whether Jimmy will compromise himself and break the law when it suits him. As you point out yourself, laws aren't always moral and correct, and if it comes to a juncture between doing what's legal and doing what you think is right, Jimmy will tend to go for the latter. That could make him a great person, but in Chuck's eyes that's a terrifying quality for a lawyer to hold because they have a rigid code of ethics that have to be adhered to. Of course Jimmy is capable of reform, and if he was going to reform then the show wouldn't be called Better Call Saul and we would instead see him returning to ignoble PD work and being miserable. But he won't, because we know he won't. The system is stacked against him, and it's more fun to watch him get what he's due and take that shortcut. We want to see him embrace becoming the sort of lawyer that guilty people hire. Guilty people need legal representation too and Saul will probably fight for them harder than any other lawyer alive. But while his ethical flexibility towards doing what's right instead of what's legal will make him an effective and successful lawyer, it's going to have some pretty horrible unforeseen consequences. It's not always as simple as just being a Good Criminal. Last Chance posted:But we just learned that Chuck had been keeping Jimmy down and lying to him for years. So with that info, how does Chuck not seem like he's the type who's not afraid of hurting his brother's feelings? He's afraid! He's a coward who hides behind Hamlin! It should be noted that Chuck's cowardice is so bad that it's pathological. All of that bottled up contempt, jealousy and guilt towards Jimmy is literally driving Chuck insane.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 06:06
|
|
|
Digiwizzard posted:Of course Jimmy is capable of reform, and if he was going to reform then the show wouldn't be called Better Call Saul and we would instead see him returning to ignoble PD work and being miserable. But he won't, because we know he won't.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 06:10
|
|
|
SpiderHyphenMan posted:Any criminal record bad enough to keep him from working in a drat mail room would preclude him from getting a license to practice law. Jimmy's not a felon. Not really. Passing the bar includes a character and fitness examination; it depends on each state, but most of them do NOT disqualify you automatically for a felony conviction. (It's literally like just Texas, Mississippi, and Missouri that automatically disqualify you.) It is entirely up to the discretion of whatever organization the state has appointed to license attorneys, and you get it drilled into you at law school that so long as you are entirely honest about your past, you have made amends for your crimes, and you have shown proper moral turpitude since, you can pass the bar. It might be extremely difficult with a felony conviction in your past, but it is definitely doable. There was a row a few years back when Tulane Law School admitted a convicted murderer. The general consensus was that while most states won't license this dude when and if he graduates, at least one state most likely will. He murdered a professor of his when he was 20, was in prison for something like 15 years or so, and was evidently a model citizen since his crime. While I haven't heard anything about him since, that should give you an idea of how someone who would never be able to get a white collar job could become a lawyer. There may not be many, but there are definitely lawyers who were felons. And let me tell you something, if you come from a good law school, you have good grades and were on the law review, and you pass the bar, the vast majority of law firms won't give a flying poo poo if you were a felon in the past. (Becoming a partner, or hell, even getting past poo poo-tier scrub associate is a different matter entirely) This is also why Chuck is such a hypocrite. He knows this, he knows that the legal profession holds very dear the idea that people can change and we should help them when they've shown proof of that change, and he completely rejects that idea when it comes to his brother.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 06:22
|
|
|
I think the real lie of Chuck's "people can't change" thing is that he's very suddenly going to be all "wow, I miraculously overcame my totally real medical condition! I'm a changed man!"
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 06:45
|
|
|
Just watched the episode. I think Chuck's got a reasonable point. He's like super duper into this whole law business and Jimmy is just in it for a quick buck and to prove himself. Makes me think that Jimmy can succeed anywhere and he's just following in his brother's shadow too much without really understanding the gravity of being a legitimate lawyer. Family would have come out and say that to begin with though instead of sabotaging your every move like a total rear end in a top hat
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 07:52
|
|
|
Last Chance posted:Well, we don't know what happens in the post-Cinnabon-apocalypse of Saul's life. I want a goddamn redemption story that takes place then. And I'm fairly sure that we're going to get something like that eventually. Saul defends Jesse post-Bad after he gets picked up for the nazi incident. The two go into practice after
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 08:00
|
|
|
Doltos posted:Just watched the episode. I think Chuck's got a reasonable point. He's like super duper into this whole law business and Jimmy is just in it for a quick buck and to prove himself. Nah, I think if he were in it for a quick buck he wouldn't have returned his little bit of the Kettleman's ill-gotten gains and he would've taken the deal without issue. And he wouldn't be a swell lad charging only $140 per will. That's a great rate, as I understand it.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 08:02
|
|
|
Doltos posted:Just watched the episode. I think Chuck's got a reasonable point. He's like super duper into this whole law business and Jimmy is just in it for a quick buck and to prove himself. Makes me think that Jimmy can succeed anywhere and he's just following in his brother's shadow too much without really understanding the gravity of being a legitimate lawyer. Well you may be right about him proving himself but I have no goddamn idea how you got "in it for a quick buck". Is it because he wants to make money and be successful in this profession he's invested time and money into for years?
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 08:07
|
|
|
A MIRACLE posted:Better Call Saul takes place in a different universe than Breaking Bad and the show continues for 12 seasons without him ever interacting with the dad from malcom in the middle Twist: Bryan Cranston does appear in an episode, but as Hal from Malcolm in the Middle.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 08:10
|
|
|
Lumberjack Bonanza posted:Well you may be right about him proving himself but I have no goddamn idea how you got "in it for a quick buck". Is it because he wants to make money and be successful in this profession he's invested time and money into for years? to be fair it's easy to come to that conclusion based on the Slippin Jimmy we saw before. The old folks thing is the first glimmer of actual giving a gently caress that we see from him. Sure it's a bit patronizing and he's not exactly the grandson they never had but it's an extension of him caring for Chuck. Sure he likes using Chuck's connections but he also does genuinely look after him
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 08:15
|
|
|
Jimmy is gonna do the "S'all good, man . . .. errr, Saul Goodman" again during next week's wolfcry segment.. That will be early in the episode and he'll change his name shortly thereafter to further disown his brother. I think everybody pretty much figured there would be an S2 but there is no guarantee of an S3, so having him change his name as the closer for S1 makes the most sense. Not that Vince & Co play by normal rules but structurally, that makes sense. Plus, we can see him scoping out his new law firm and getting crazy with it sooner, which will be really fun.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 08:15
|
|
|
Mr. Fowl posted:Twist: Bryan Cranston does appear in an episode, but as Hal from Malcolm in the Middle. Twist: Bryan Cranston shows up, but as Walter White holding two guns with bloody bandages on his body and head and a police dog still hanging onto his ankle with its teeth
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 08:20
|
|
|
Alan Smithee posted:to be fair it's easy to come to that conclusion based on the Slippin Jimmy we saw before. The old folks thing is the first glimmer of actual giving a gently caress that we see from him. Sure it's a bit patronizing and he's not exactly the grandson they never had but it's an extension of him caring for Chuck. Sure he likes using Chuck's connections but he also does genuinely look after him Well don't get me wrong, I don't think Jimmy was emotionally invested in his client base until he gave elder law a shot, when he couldn't help but feel some compassion. It's unfair to say he's just in it for easy money, though, because he's always worked his rear end off in the series and he's flat broke. Sure, he always wants his check, he lives in a glorified storage room.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 08:23
|
|
|
I'm actually expecting the name change to happen somewhere during the second season. The feel I'm getting is that the broad story of Season 1 is "who is Jimmy McGill, and what happened to him that drives him to become Saul?" (In other words, the phrase they said on the podcast was a big part of their clarifying inspiration: "what problem does becoming saul goodman solve?") Then, perhaps Season 2 will broadly be about transformation itself, the creation of the persona and everything that happens during that process. Maybe I'm wrong about the specifics, but the name change doesn't feel like something that this group of writers would like to use for an end-of-season stinger. And I don't feel like Jimmy's quite at the point where he'd change his name yet. He's deeply hurt that his brother doesn't believe he can go straight, but I would think he still wants to. There's still a sense of pride in him, and he won't become Saul until he abandons it. Ditocoaf fucked around with this message at 08:35 on Apr 1, 2015 |
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 08:30
|
|
|
VagueRant posted:
I got the same feeling. They did the same legs-to-pan-up on Tyrus in Breaking Bad as a not-Gus fakeout. Surprised they didn't have "Pryce" drive up in a sensible Volvo.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 08:33
|
|
|
Hollismason posted:I think it's more brutal that we know that Chuck wins, he does become Slippin Jimmy and changes his name. Chuck will have some sort of very public crazy meltdown and that will be what actually ruins the name. Then Jimmy still can't work with HHM even with Chuck out of the picture. Jimmy loses even when he wins 
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 09:20
|
|
|
Alan Smithee posted:to be fair it's easy to come to that conclusion based on the Slippin Jimmy we saw before. The old folks thing is the first glimmer of actual giving a gently caress that we see from him. Sure it's a bit patronizing and he's not exactly the grandson they never had but it's an extension of him caring for Chuck. Sure he likes using Chuck's connections but he also does genuinely look after him They established pretty clearly that he gives a gently caress in episode #2
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 09:21
|
|
|
Chuck is eviler and less mature version of Walter White. Walter had a loving fit and sabotaged Jessie too when he revealed himself to be an equal, then got over it even if it was also more than partly fueled a self preservation instinct. Chuck loathing and contempt of this concept has made him a cave dwelling hobbit for years.Last Chance posted:Well, we don't know what happens in the post-Cinnabon-apocalypse of Saul's life. I want a goddamn redemption story that takes place then. And I'm fairly sure that we're going to get something like that eventually. He defends himself in court and get off with six months probation, to the shock of the legal world. "What the hell? He went from having a death penalty to six months probation. He's...like the best lawyer ever" roll credits. NutritiousSnack fucked around with this message at 09:39 on Apr 1, 2015 |
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 09:21
|
|
|
Alan Smithee posted:Saul defends Jesse post-Bad after he gets picked up for the nazi incident. The two go into practice after You know, I hadn't even considered that but that would be kind of awesome if Better Call Saul ends in the present era, and actually answers what happened to Jesse Pinkman. Hell, maybe seeing what happened with Walt and the Nazis and hearing Jesse was picked up, combined with the horrible guilt over what he did to him, might be what brings him back to town. I'd be more than cool with that.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 09:47
|
|
|
Blazing Ownager posted:You know, I hadn't even considered that but that would be kind of awesome if Better Call Saul ends in the present era, and actually answers what happened to Jesse Pinkman. That's exactly the kind of thing that I thought BCS would be before it came out, which really made me not want to watch it. I would totally prefer it if no Breaking Bad character ever showed up on this show again from now until the end of its run. It should be its own thing, we don't need to know what happened to Jesse Pinkman since he is not part of BCS. It would be pandering as gently caress if he showed up with like a family or something, not to mention completely unnecessary since the ending he got was more than satisfactory.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 10:00
|
|
|
I've been watching the series since the premier wondering if the Jimmy -> Saul catalyst would show up in season one, I just watched Pimento and welp. I'm curious if we'll see much of Howard now that we know he isn't the arch-schmuck. Poor Saul. Poor Kim. Good show.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 10:16
|
|
|
Saul single handedly argues down every charge using a little known clause called.. The Constitution. The judge orders both HHM and Cinnabon to pay damages and reparations of 12 billion dollars each. Everyone in the courtroom stands up and applauds as a single bald eagle flies into the court room to perch upon a statue of lady justice, who then comes to life and elects Saul as Attorney General of the United States.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 11:38
|
|
|
Cimber posted:Which is why Jimmy takes the Saul persona. Ok Chuck, you think the law is so holy or sacred? I am going to make a loving mockery of everything you hold dear. Never forget that, criminal misdeeds aside, Saul is a really good lawyer. A lot of what he gets done for folks doesn't involve trickery or law breaking, just a solid grasp of the law and human behavior. Even as Saul he takes his job seriously.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 12:05
|
|
|
Shbobdb posted:Jimmy is gonna do the "S'all good, man . . .. errr, Saul Goodman" again during next week's wolfcry segment.. That will be early in the episode and he'll change his name shortly thereafter to further disown his brother. I think everybody pretty much figured there would be an S2 but there is no guarantee of an S3, so having him change his name as the closer for S1 makes the most sense. With the prestige of being a tie-in to Breaking Bad with most of the same people involved and ratings on par with or better than every season of Breaking Bad except for 5B, I think we're guaranteed to see as many seasons as the Saul crew want to make. I'm hopeful that we won't get any of the typical "will this show be renewed" worrying and just see renewals either at the beginning or the end of each season's airing. It'd be one thing if there wasn't enough meat on the bone, but they've made Jimmy/Saul an even more interesting character, surrounded him with a good supporting cast, and have done at least one full season of him before he even becomes the title character. So yeah, I can't pin down when they're going to pull the trigger on the switch from Jimmy to Saul (though my guess is that will be the crux of season 2), but season 3 seems like a lock to me.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 12:43
|
|
|
Hakkesshu posted:That's exactly the kind of thing that I thought BCS would be before it came out, which really made me not want to watch it. I would totally prefer it if no Breaking Bad character ever showed up on this show again from now until the end of its run. It should be its own thing, we don't need to know what happened to Jesse Pinkman since he is not part of BCS. It would be pandering as gently caress if he showed up with like a family or something, not to mention completely unnecessary since the ending he got was more than satisfactory. I don't get this line of thinking. Yeah, I'd say leave Jesse's end of storyline alone because it was perfect, but this is a Breaking Bad prequel, having the other characters appear (even if it is just at the very end, with the last scene of this show becoming the first scene of Saul in BB or something similar) is part of the point! I think right now they are doing a great job of tying the two together. We've seen Tuco and Mike extensively, hopefully Badger or Pete will pop up at some point, and a Walt or Jesse reveal would be a great season or series ender. But the show also stands on its own, and has me invested in these characters as their own story outside the opera of BB. But not wanting to cross the two at all seems nuts, they have created a whole world here and intermingling the two shows to create a bigger picture is part of the fun.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 13:15
|
|
|
Ishamael posted:I don't get this line of thinking. Yeah, I'd say leave Jesse's end of storyline alone because it was perfect, but this is a Breaking Bad prequel, having the other characters appear (even if it is just at the very end, with the last scene of this show becoming the first scene of Saul in BB or something similar) is part of the point! There is a fine line between having various BB characters show up to advance the story and showing up and becoming a trite gimmick. Having Tuco appear was well done. Seeing Walter randomly crossing the street would seem a bit forced. BCS can stand on its own too feet and does not need to constantly remind its viewers that its a spinoff.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 13:20
|
|
|
Digiwizzard posted:It should be noted that Chuck's cowardice is so bad that it's pathological. All of that bottled up contempt, jealousy and guilt towards Jimmy is literally driving Chuck insane. Now I wonder if, after this blowout, will Chuck just up and get better?
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 13:22
|
|
|
Rupert Buttermilk posted:Now I wonder if, after this blowout, will Chuck just up and get better? Well he's going to need to do something about food and supplies now. Either he finishes getting better quick or he's going to have to brave the outside on his own for long enough to set up other arrangements.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 13:30
|
|
|
Lumberjack Bonanza posted:Well he's going to need to do something about food and supplies now. Either he finishes getting better quick or he's going to have to brave the outside on his own for long enough to set up other arrangements. Was about to say he should just order stuff online, but...oops. Must suck being a shut-in who can't use the Internet.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 13:35
|
|
|
|
| # ? Jun 5, 2024 16:19 |
|
|
I bet Hamlin could continue enabling Chuck's delusion and help him get food and stuff.
|
|
#
?
Apr 1, 2015 13:47
|
|