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Yeah, Desecration is a challenge mode for when you find the base game too easy. There are certain unlocks that you can only get via Desecration.
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May 1, 2016 21:25
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ToxicFrog posted:Man. Dredmor has weird rules for what does and doesn't take a turn.
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May 1, 2016 22:21
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Just died in nethack to a nymph that stole my wand of death.
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May 2, 2016 00:37
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Speaking of Desecration, is there any way to keep the Star Child from just teleporting right on top of you and shooting?
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May 2, 2016 03:47
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Your TTYmor bug of the day: picking up an item that you're standing on, and then picking up another item that stacks with it without moving, will crash the game. The MFD isn't properly getting updated until you move; until then, it holds a reference to the item you just picked up and displays it as though it were still on the floor. Stacking it with another object invalidates the reference. Random rear end in a top hat posted:Actually raiding shops CAN be like that (if you've already pissed off the shopkeeper) which I think is why manually picking up an item takes a turn in the first place. The more I think about this the more aggravating it gets. Making all pickups take a turn means that picking up a stack of loot takes N turns (or I need to implement multipickup/multidrop, which I should probably do anyways). It also means that autopickup becomes a deathtrap, since stepping onto a tile may take an arbitrarily large number of turns. In OG Dredmor, shops are always designed such that it's impossible to pick up items by standing on them; you have to use drag and drop, which always takes a turn. Perhaps the answer is to make pickup/drop not take a turn, but make shops use a "display case" or something else that doesn't go through the normal pickup/drop code?
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May 2, 2016 13:04
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Justin_Brett posted:Speaking of Desecration, is there any way to keep the Star Child from just teleporting right on top of you and shooting? it only teleports when you run away from it or try to get behind cover
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May 2, 2016 16:14
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Turn shops into an edge case of vending machines, maybe?
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May 2, 2016 16:28
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Specific command to steal from display cases, perhaps?
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May 2, 2016 17:08
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RPATDO_LAMD posted:Although there are certainly things that can almost instantly kill you. That reminds me of one of the best "what the gently caress?!" moments I've had in ToME. I was playing an Arcane Blade, whose entire gimmick revolves around the ability to trigger spells via melee attacks on a % chance per hit basis. One of the better spells you can cast through melee attacks is called Earthen Missiles, which fires 2-3 rocks at whatever you hit. Using the skill Flurry while dual-wielding let you hit 6 times in a single round for more chances to cast spells, and there are other modifiers that let you attack more per round as well, meaning each time I used Flurry I would average like 4 casts of missiles, which would one shot almost anything I hit with it. It should be noted that spells in ToME have a travel time; some of them are really fast (like lightning and some fire spells) and some are really slow and avoidable (ice shards, earthen missiles), and they don't home in on targets, you fire them at a place and they go there. I hit an elite enemy with a Flurry, triggering 5 casts of Earthen Missiles at him. Right before they hit, he swapped my position with his using a Rogue ability called Switch Place. The missiles all then hit me for a little more than 5x my max hp 
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May 2, 2016 18:46
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If you're playing a character geared towards high movement speed in TOME, it's entirely possible to outspeed your own projectiles, especially the slower moving ones. It is also possible to then kill yourself by walking forward into the projectile you launched a turn ago.
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May 2, 2016 19:08
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TOME also has probably the coolest projectile spell I've every seen. The time wizard class has a spell which fires backwards - you choose the target, and the projectile comes from there, slowly tracking towards you and getting more powerful as it goes. They also have a bunch of really good mobility options, so if you do it right you can kite one or two of them until they become terrifying hellballs of death. (Unlike the anecdotes mentioned, they don't hurt you when they reach you, though, they just disappear.)
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May 2, 2016 21:27
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Yeah, as far as I remember, Temporal Bolt doesn't have a damage cap; it just gains 5% more damage each time it moves, so you can get it up to pretty silly levels if you are careful enough.
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May 2, 2016 22:51
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Mystery Prize posted:Yeah, as far as I remember, Temporal Bolt doesn't have a damage cap; it just gains 5% more damage each time it moves, so you can get it up to pretty silly levels if you are careful enough. There's a sanity check where after a certain number of moves (or turns, I'm not sure which) the bolt despawns automatically. The real reason to use that spell isn't the damage, though, it's that it also shortens the cooldown of one of your other spells by 1-2 turns every time it hits an enemy.
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May 2, 2016 23:01
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I'm shooting in the dark but I have a technical that maybe someone here can answer. I went looking for some quick pick up and play roguelikes for a 2012 Macbook Pro I got. I noticed that DoomRL has a OSX version but when I load it up, there are colored lines running across the game window. It's not the Show Grid option in the game doing that because it's on the title screen and it persists even in full screen but the lines only show up in an area and size of the original window screen. Also forcing full screen in the config does nothing and messing with the resolution values there does nothing as well although I admit I didn't try different variables either. I don't think it's the graphics or display conking out because I ran some other stuff like Dungeon Crawl, ToME and Din's Curse with no issues and there haven't been any other graphics anomalies anywhere else with other programs. The OSX version might just be bugged and it never got fixed.
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May 3, 2016 04:33
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I can play DoomRL on my Hackintosh just fine. It's not a laptop, but software-wise it's all pretty standard stuff. The OSX port of DoomRL is pretty much neglected though, yeah. I had to tweak the keybindings by modifying Lua code, for example.
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May 3, 2016 04:46
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ToxicFrog posted:You can get some really good stuff from fountains; in particular, 1/7 fountains are magical, and will restore all stats and raise one (low but positive luck) or all (high luck) attributes permanently. Non-magical fountains have a 4/5 chance of something helpful or harmless happening. yeah i feel like i always get the worst rng most of the time. nymphs aren't too much of a hassle if they steal something like a fake gem. water demons are also really easy to escape from but those loving snakes are just the most annoying pieces of poo poo ever. Rutibex posted:I always drink from all fountains. I want a wish! doctorfrog posted:drink every fountain, kick every sink too chaotic for the thug life also i found an opportunity and i took it this is my contribution to the thread 
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May 3, 2016 14:20
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TooMuchAbstraction posted:I can play DoomRL on my Hackintosh just fine. It's not a laptop, but software-wise it's all pretty standard stuff. I figured as much. Forgot to mention I'm on the latest OS, El Capitan, not that it makes much difference. Oh well. Thanks for your input 
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May 3, 2016 14:26
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TooMuchAbstraction posted:I can play DoomRL on my Hackintosh just fine. It's not a laptop, but software-wise it's all pretty standard stuff. That's how you tweak the keybindings on every version of DoomRL, though? It's the same for the windows and linux releases -- you have a bucket of lua scripts that act as configuration files and configure the game by editing them. 
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May 3, 2016 16:27
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ToxicFrog posted:That's how you tweak the keybindings on every version of DoomRL, though? It's the same for the windows and linux releases -- you have a bucket of lua scripts that act as configuration files and configure the game by editing them. Oh, really? I guess it was so bloody weird that I assumed it wasn't the intentional way of doing things. You shouldn't have to modify anything even remotely resembling code just to customize keybindings.
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May 3, 2016 16:32
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9hotonic posted:also i found an opportunity and i took it this is my contribution to the thread the 'beating a dead rat' of memes...
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May 3, 2016 16:49
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I tried to recharge my spellbook of healing, but it had no effect.
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May 3, 2016 17:12
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TooMuchAbstraction posted:Oh, really? I guess it was so bloody weird that I assumed it wasn't the intentional way of doing things. You shouldn't have to modify anything even remotely resembling code just to customize keybindings. Normatively, you shouldn't, but descriptively, you often need to. This is not unique to roguelikes, but is probably more prevalent there because a great many roguelikes are either one-person projects or open source projects people work on in their spare time, and writing a config file loader is much easier than writing an in-game configuration screen -- especially if you're using something like lua that gets you all the parsing for free. Assuming, of course, that remapping the keys is even possible. In Nethack, for example, there is no way to change the controls other than some very coarse toggles like number_pad.
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May 3, 2016 17:58
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I think I'm starting to give up on Renowned Explorers. It's a lovely game but once you're playing from a position of knowing what the gently caress you're doing, it's really easy to tell when you've been given a suboptimal start and how much you're missing out on, especially given the way a good start can utterly snowball. It's not terrifically balanced in that regard and early on a diceroll can just say 'yep you're hosed' even if you do everything right. e: Apparently I got 100+ hours out of it so it might have been doing a lot right along the way, I guess!
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May 8, 2016 00:00
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I think that's less giving up and more 'you played it 100 hours'.
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May 8, 2016 00:07
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Yeah hard to blame a game that is enjoyable that long. I hit 80 hrs and at some point you reach a stage where you are just going for higher and higher scores which comes down to rolling the right treasures, etc., and starts to get pretty unfun. But good until that point...
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May 8, 2016 00:27
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Big Sean posted:Yeah hard to blame a game that is enjoyable that long. I hit 80 hrs and at some point you reach a stage where you are just going for higher and higher scores which comes down to rolling the right treasures, etc., and starts to get pretty unfun. If you're ever on a lark for some gamer shenanigans, look at the negative steam reviews for MGSV. Something like half of them are people complaining it's repetitive, with a play time of over 100 hours.
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May 8, 2016 00:55
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Count Uvula posted:If you're ever on a lark for some gamer shenanigans, look at the negative steam reviews for MGSV. Something like half of them are people complaining it's repetitive, with a play time of over 100 hours. I think you're overstating the argument here. There are a number of games I've played for over 100 hours that didn't get repetitive*, and that's a good quality in a game, the absence of which might be disappointing. I certainly prefer the idea of games that last to the "eh let's just churn out a slightly different version every year" model. * Granted the majority of them are PvP-based, but not all of them.
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May 8, 2016 01:52
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:I think you're overstating the argument here. There are a number of games I've played for over 100 hours that didn't get repetitive*, and that's a good quality in a game, the absence of which might be disappointing. I certainly prefer the idea of games that last to the "eh let's just churn out a slightly different version every year" model. I think once you have played a game for 100 hours, you lose the right to file negative reviews, though. Unless the devs have changed the game somewhere in the latter end of that 100 hours and actively made it into something you no longer enjoy, I guess.
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May 8, 2016 01:54
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TooMuchAbstraction posted:I think once you have played a game for 100 hours, you lose the right to file negative reviews, though. Unless the devs have changed the game somewhere in the latter end of that 100 hours and actively made it into something you no longer enjoy, I guess. Why? A negative review from someone with hundreds of hours is incredibly useful for establishing that they understand the game well enough to criticize it. It's much more informative than someone who played it for 30 minutes and went "eh, not for me."
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May 8, 2016 01:55
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:Why? A negative review from someone with hundreds of hours is incredibly useful for establishing that they understand the game well enough to criticize it. It's much more informative than someone who played it for 30 minutes and went "eh, not for me." That person got at least a hundred hours of fun out of it. Even if they criticize it, it still doesn't change the fact that they enjoyed the game well enough to pour that much time into it, which in my book nets it a recommendation. Especially given how many games are on Steam these days, you don't have to stick with the terrible ones.
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May 8, 2016 02:00
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Tuxedo Catfish posted:Why? A negative review from someone with hundreds of hours is incredibly useful for establishing that they understand the game well enough to criticize it. It's much more informative than someone who played it for 30 minutes and went "eh, not for me." As StrixNebulosa notes, if you've played a game for 100 hours, then you almost certainly liked it for the majority of that period. If you didn't like it, then why did you keep playing it? A person with a 100-hour playtime can certainly give a detailed and in-depth critique of a game, but to leave a negative review (which is equivalent to saying This Is A Bad Game) indicates something screwy is going on either with the player or with the current state of the game vs. how it used to be.
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May 8, 2016 02:06
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I usually disregard all the negative reviews with ridiculous numbers of hours played. If it got repetitive after 100 hours then that's not a reason to write a negative review, it's time to wrap it up, be glad I managed to squeeze out so much playtime out of a game and start playing something else. If it's other complaints I usually consider it to be very specific to the reviewer or a stage I won't ever reach because I have only two games with over 100 hours played, the latter being like 101 or so.
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May 8, 2016 02:13
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lordfrikk posted:I usually disregard all the negative reviews with ridiculous numbers of hours played. If it got repetitive after 100 hours then that's not a reason to write a negative review, it's time to wrap it up, be glad I managed to squeeze out so much playtime out of a game and start playing something else. If it's other complaints I usually consider it to be very specific to the reviewer or a stage I won't ever reach because I have only two games with over 100 hours played, the latter being like 101 or so. Idk, this is a genre where I'm more inclined to ignore opinions of someone with less, simply because they often take that long to get a good feel for what's going on.
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May 8, 2016 02:24
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StrixNebulosa posted:That person got at least a hundred hours of fun out of it. Even if they criticize it, it still doesn't change the fact that they enjoyed the game well enough to pour that much time into it, which in my book nets it a recommendation. Especially given how many games are on Steam these days, you don't have to stick with the terrible ones. You're underestimating the number of brokebrain gamers who will continue to play a game forever without getting any enjoyment from it.
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May 8, 2016 02:28
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In my opinion it's totally possible to give something a negative review after 100 hours, because in my opinion a good review is one that tries to be as objective as possible and liking something or not is subjective. I like specific mechanics, and if I encounter those mechanics I'm likely to play a game a very long time, but that doesn't make me blind to potential problems that the majority of players might encounter or that go counter to established good design. I played Unlimited Saga for over 100 hours but I'd never recommend it to anyone else and I can identify a huge range of bad factors about it. I played FTL for over 100 hours, but I don't suddenly consider it unreservedly good and I'm not suddenly blind to the fact that winning the game is effectively a laundry list of requiring X or Y. The problems I've had with Renowned are stuff I've identified ever since I first played it, I've just reached the point where getting better scores is now a matter of blind luck rather than skill, and that's getting to me.
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May 8, 2016 02:46
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There are lots of games that are fun to learn but not fun to master, where their flaws only become apparent when you reach a certain plateau of skill. If you're someone who really enjoys mastery, you often only find this out when it's too late. This is not "brokebrained" or some other dumb poo poo, it's a natural consequence of games being built as short-term, consumable entertainment. e: And that's fine when you're talking about something like Undertale or whatever where the point is to tell a story, showcase a single cool game mechanic and be done with it, but in a traditional roguelike it kind of sucks, because the genre is very oriented towards mastery. Tuxedo Catfish fucked around with this message at 03:04 on May 8, 2016 |
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May 8, 2016 02:58
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Okay: if a 100+ hour review concludes with "I don't recommend it", I expect the reviewer to explain why it didn't work for them. If the cited problem is repetition (getting bored) or that a recent patch changed everything about the game, then I don't know how well I'd trust that review. I mean, what I'm looking for in a review is a recap of how the game plays + what the reviewer thought worked/didn't work about the game. That helps me figure out if I want to check out the game. The hours played ties into that - ten minutes isn't a good shake for most games. 100+ immediately tells me that something about this game was compelling enough for that specific person to get them to stick with it for that long, be it genuine enjoyment or if they're brokebrained. (Which still begs the question why that game?) ...The more I think about it, though, Stelas has a point - I couldn't easily recommend Shin Megami Tensei: Strange Journey despite the hours I've poured into it due to the frustrating dungeon design, and to that end - if it ever came to Steam (ha, in my dreams) I'd have to give it a not recommended, then I'd have to spend the whole review explaining that while I personally love banging around fiendish mazes, the average gamer doesn't, and they should probably go play SMT: Nocturne or the Persona games instead, as those are more "fun" overall.
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May 8, 2016 03:12
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On Steam in particular I also have grossly inflated times played due to forgetting to shut things off all the way, idle time while I alt-tab to do other things since I used to be able to play a game until I had a problem to deal with, or in a few cases, a game that stays 'active' when I'm done with it (Odallus did this for ages; I eventually figured out that I had to momentarily stop and restart my antivirus after the game or Steam would think I was playing it literally forever). edit: it's Odallus that did it, actually Prism fucked around with this message at 03:46 on May 8, 2016 |
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May 8, 2016 03:39
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My only 100+ hour game I had little fun in was Civ4. Way too much time trying to mod the game to suit my taste. Got the expacs over time and still had little fun with it. Problem is the number of ways to play that sort of game, new stuff gets introduced, and having serious issues with how to play it. It was my first time with the genre and newer games filled in the gaps that was lacking.
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May 8, 2016 03:58
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I've sunk 50+ hours in Rogue. Easily a good 30 into Rogue Survivor. Probably about 100 into all Roguelikes all up. I enjoy the games that I can play indefinitely.
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May 8, 2016 04:00
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