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flyboi posted:But seriously though I'm gonna GORF post for a second although not as long as a GORF post. ----- What to Do About Squadron 42? If we assume the Stretch Goal pledge tracker is accurate, we already see signs of capitulation in a formerly bullish backer base. Given their headcount, they surely have a seven figure monthly burn. And we don't even know what the monthly outflows are for chargebacks. The rapacious new ToS, combined with PayPal's end of refunds on crowdfunding at the end of the month, heightens the risk considerably of a run on the chargebank bank. It's so provocative I still find it hard to believe CIG released it. Nobody knows whether CIG has $50M in the bank or $5M. What we DO know and predicted -- what must be obvious now to Chris & Co -- is that Squadron 42 is not their golden goose. In fact, it looks more and more like a black hole. Chris the Director and Sandi the Actress want it so much more than the market does-- yet how can a $60 PC-only title hope to produce a meaningful return next to the game that sells the promise of "a living breathing universe" so it can sell IOUs for highly fidelitous spaceships for prices as low as $30 and high as $2500? Backers haven't yet understood (and CIG hasn't yet admitted) that the impetus driving persistence is further monetization, with AlphaUEC the spoonful of sugar to help the medicine go down. We've seen so many troubling warning signs for Squadron 42. The uncanny valley Admiral Bishop speech had even loyal backers offering helpful suggestions for reshoots (!!!). The Morrow Tour preview was, in hindsight, a bigger mistake -- seeing as it gave the impression the film, er game, features talking mannequins with photoluminescent teeth who clip through doors and even each other as they spend small dull eternities monologuing at the player yet staring at an empty chair two seats away. The hubris only further reinforces the delusory disconnect on display, with CIG's John Schimmel claiming the game "will kick other games in the rear end!" on an official CIG promo video. It is easy to assume -- and many have -- that the single player game should be a cakewalk. Unburdened as it is with netcode considerations, how hard could it really be? Indeed, Chris has made this very game before several times over his career. Yet the genre he helped popularize -- branching narrative cinematic dogfighting adventures in space -- are not what they used to be. The game is the same, it just got more fierce-- and now Squadron 42 will be up against the very AAA franchise he once claimed his FPS would equal or exceed.  IGN posted:As divisive as the Call of Duty franchise is every year, Call of Duty: Infinite Warfare actually has a lot working in its favor. For starters, since the last IW-developed CoD, the studio has picked up some new blood, including a pair of former Naughty Dog designers, Jacob Minkoff (Design Director) and Taylor Kurosaki (Narrative Director) whose works include the Uncharted series and The Last of Us. (Oh, and it doesn't just have zombies, and it's got Jon Snow as the bad guy.) The trailer for the game may have proven wildly unpopular but this is a title that will sell 13M copies of it's a failure. It's likely to be a lot of fun-- both its single player and (unlike Squadron 42) multiplayer forms. It's shipping THIS November -- for PC and consoles. It started later and it's already all but done -- before Squadron 42 has shown even a hint of real gameplay, before a vertical slice has been seen by anyone, before the mo-cap has finished, before the game has gotten past the Alpha stage. Why am I saying all this? I guess because, more and more, I just find myself questioning the business case for Squadron 42 entirely. It could've been easy -- it should've been easy -- yet Easy left town in 2015, Hard came to replace him in 2016, and Impossible is taking his place next year. And he's not going away. Chris is going to have to make a hard, hard choice here. To commit fully to Squadron 42's completion probably means throwing bad money after worse. If cash grows harder and harder to come by, and the competition delivers something impossible to beat, the money he spends to complete it will come at the expense of the vehicle that flew him so very, very high. The one that most of his financiers wanted. The one that offers him the better chance of continued employment. If they aren't yet doing the cost/benefit analysis on completion of it, somebody needs to-- STAT. And if cash reserves are precious, it's probably time to kill it, or at the very least, put it in long term storage. A Possible Silver Lining: The PS4.5 and Xbox Scorpio will be coming to us by 2017 (I think) and perhaps with some elbow grease and pared down ambitions, Squadron 42 could be retooled for these new fidelitous console platforms and have an easier time recouping its huge expense. If cash permits if, I think Chris should turn complete control over the completion of the project to a Pro (maybe spinning off a seperate dev studio) and get the hell out of their way, with the mandate "Done is right." ----- (These are just my opinions-- many of them speculative. As always, I could be wrong.) G0RF fucked around with this message at 16:26 on Jun 11, 2016 |
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Jun 11, 2016 09:16
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I agree with removed)
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quote:You acknowledge and agree that the Game and the pledge items delivered to you may differ in certain aspects from the description of the Game and those pledge items that was available on the Website at the time of your Pledge. quote:However, you acknowledge and agree that delivery as of such date is not a firm promise and may be extended by RSI since unforeseen events may extend the development and/or production time. Accordingly, you agree that any unearned portion of your Pledge shall not be refundable until and unless RSI has ceased development and failed to deliver the relevant pledge items and/or the Game to you. Under the new TOS, any pledge item and indeed any aspect of the entire game can differ from what was described to you when you bought it, any delivery date is now indefinite and at the sole discretion of CIG. Note the wording of these two clauses: you cannot get a refund unless they completely cease development and don't deliver the game and/or pledge items. And on top of that the game and any pledge item can differ in any aspect to what was described. By my reading of this they could possibly claim they do not have to deliver any individual pledge item at all as long as they still deliver the game and the game they deliver does not even have to be what was promised! That means they could even try to say any alpha version they currently have fulfills the TOS, we're done here no refunds you got the game and/or your pledge item, the game just differs from how we described it, you agreed to this.
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Jun 11, 2016 09:17
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So can we openly call it a scam now? edit and where is Derek for the ELE, this is his legals' weekend
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Jun 11, 2016 09:17
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Nellistos posted:So can we openly call it a scam now? No bones about it, it's pretty obviously so. There's not even a faintest hint of reasonable doubt left, which is honestly a good part of what CIG was floating on.
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Jun 11, 2016 09:19
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Agree. Enough with the "romanticism". Oh "mismaaaanagement". Uhh a "dreamer". lol
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Jun 11, 2016 09:21
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Dante80 posted:
Funny for being such a diehard fan her Cult ID is pretty drat high. I thought she'd have been with them since the beginning or something. Mine is in the early five digits and even that was post Kickstarter.
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Jun 11, 2016 09:24
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lazorexplosion posted:Under the new TOS, any pledge item and indeed any aspect of the entire game can differ from what was described to you when you bought it, any delivery date is now indefinite and at the sole discretion of CIG. When cig first started denying refunds because a "sizeable portion of the game was delivered" a bunch of us said they're just gonna pepper some content into the alpha and call it a complete game A sizeable part of their tos is dedicated to ways you can't get your money back and too bad if you gave it to them. Something you will never see in any game. Not to the extent where they state by accepting these terms you cannot sue us. They've been setting up backers for major disappointment and are protecting themselves from the backlash. gently caress cig.
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Jun 11, 2016 09:26
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Matlock Birthmark posted:Ha ha, oh my god that new TOS. No wonder they shoved 2.4 live. :5:
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Jun 11, 2016 09:26
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Sandi: "Sorry guys, was probated what happened during the weekend?"
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Jun 11, 2016 09:26
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Star Citizen - Terms Of Scam
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Jun 11, 2016 09:27
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Scruffpuff posted:Does everyone need to be loving stupid to get a job at CIG? Is that part of the interview? So let's wind the clock back some 12 years when Half-Life 2 released. You're running and gunning, and you hit one of the game's scripted sequences. You're never taken out of character, and you're allowed to roam freely around. A good example is when you get to the hideout with Barney, the doctor, and Alyx. They go into this whole scripted conversation sequence and you're free to walk around the lab and gently caress around. But interestingly enough, during some stages, if you're close enough to the characters, they would actually turn their heads to look at you while they were talking. So even though the sequence was scripted, there was that little sense of presence included - track where the player is, and make sure the NPC characters face the player if and when it's appropriate, and talk to him. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lqYqyHBTZjg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yQRUz9MTxiA
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Jun 11, 2016 09:29
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I suggest we refer to CIG as Company Using Nefarious Terms of Service, CUNTS for short.
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Jun 11, 2016 09:29
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As fate would have it, I just now stumbled upon the official theme song of this new TOS: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TLJYyEfuhDE
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Jun 11, 2016 09:30
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Turd Burglar posted:When cig first started denying refunds because a "sizeable portion of the game was delivered" a bunch of us said they're just gonna pepper some content into the alpha and call it a complete game That's exactly what I was thinking too. Minimum (legally) viable product!
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Jun 11, 2016 09:30
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I must say that it has been an amazing ride these passed few years on the internet where "Trolling" and the concept of a troll has become "You don't like a thing, you must be trolling." We've come a long way, folks.
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Jun 11, 2016 09:37
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Streetroller posted:So up until about 2 hours ago when I read the new ToS I was supporting Star Citizen. Whale cum
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Jun 11, 2016 09:40
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It seems to be the general trend. And I dislike a lot of things that people like, like sports. I'm a true internet scumsuck!
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Jun 11, 2016 09:41
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PSA: Read carefully your Terms Of Service before agreeing to them. https://forums.robertsspaceindustries.com/discussion/332430/psa-read-carefully-your-terms-of-service-before-agreeing-to-them 
Nellistos fucked around with this message at 09:46 on Jun 11, 2016 |
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Jun 11, 2016 09:41
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Nellistos posted:PSA: Read carefully your Terms Of Service before agreeing to them. No commando they have plenty of money left
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Jun 11, 2016 09:46
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Nellistos posted:PSA: Read carefully your Terms Of Service before agreeing to them. Whoa, curveball! Shitizens are totally fine with never receiving the game they paid for. This draconian new TOS is totally reasonable. Nothing but drama. Furthering Derek Smart's agenda. In other news, I'm putting all my savings into schadenfreude futures.
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Jun 11, 2016 09:46
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Whales trying to grow wings in the TOS RSI Forums topic . Yeah, don't visit if it affects you, although i do not think it stands a chance.
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Jun 11, 2016 09:49
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This is the first tos for a game I've ever read through I looked up some other games tos and no other game I found looks anything like that It's groundbreaking tos development
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Jun 11, 2016 09:49
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ManofManyAliases posted:The Dragonfly will likely be flyable this year. The Drake pipeline has been completed so we're going to see the Caterpillar this year as well.  You go CIG!
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Jun 11, 2016 09:51
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SelenicMartian posted:I suggest we refer to CIG as Company Using Nefarious Terms of Service, CUNTS for short. I suggest we don't, but nice acronym all the same.
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Jun 11, 2016 09:52
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Streetroller posted:About $3000 (From RSI directly, not gifted) You need to do this fast, CIG will be going out of business at some point soon-ish. The clock is ticking. One of your best bets is to use the new TOS as justification, make a fuss in public, contact polygon who wrote this Some Star Citizen backers who claim full pledge refunds are getting their money back quoting quote:In an interview with Polygon this week, Cloud Imperium founder Chris Roberts said that refunds are being given out. "We don't publicize it, but when people reach out to us and talk to us in a rational manner, in most cases we've refunded them," he said. "We don't want people to be part of the project if they're not happy." Contact every other gaming media that has published positive or negative coverage of the "game". Start a blog with screenshots of your interactions with customer support, if you find a contact number, phone them record the calls if that's legal in your area. Don't delay, push push and keep pushing, if you make enough of a fuss refunding you in full makes economic sense for them (don't accept a low ball offer). Push paypal hard before their cut off date, try your bank, credit card, read Derek's refund advice too, think he made a post on it. AP fucked around with this message at 10:09 on Jun 11, 2016 |
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Jun 11, 2016 09:53
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Im gonna call cigs refund policy the "no take backsies" clause And their you can't sue us agreement the "no take backsies times infinity" clause
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Jun 11, 2016 09:53
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Turd Burglar posted:This is the first tos for a game I've ever read through We've seen it change right in front of us several times now, this is the most open TOS development in gaming history
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Jun 11, 2016 09:56
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I realize no media outlet will want to be the first to pull the trigger on this, they much prefer to wait until they can smell blood in the water and the amount of toxicity journalists face at the hands of any game fandom is real. One doesn't need to imagine how much worse SC's fanbase is, we've seen them lash out at people multiple times. But I still can't wait to see if some consumer protection watchdogs decide to make this into news.
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Jun 11, 2016 10:00
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I made a Frontier account to better keep track of the SC thread fun and lol just lol No other thread has something like this as far as I can tell.
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Jun 11, 2016 10:01
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Skellybones posted:I made a Frontier account to better keep track of the SC thread fun and lol just lol Yeah, that was Frontier responding to SC backers singing up to the forums and complaining about the thread, and DSs participation in it. Funnily enough, the thread has not been affected in any way by that disclaimer..XD
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Jun 11, 2016 10:03
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Skellybones posted:I made a Frontier account to better keep track of the SC thread fun and lol just lol YOU SHOULD ALL BE GLAD THAT FRONTIER DOESN'T BAN YOU ALL FOR PROMOTING DIRECT COMPETITION TO ELITE:DANGEROUS!
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Jun 11, 2016 10:04
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Funny how these dickheads hide behind ITS A PLEDGE< SO ITS NO REFUNDABLE< then those fuckhead cronies advertise a SALE ITEM on the website the SAME loving DAY
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Jun 11, 2016 10:05
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ManofManyAliases posted:I'm not going to spellchcek on an internet forum, even more that it is a comedy forum and I'm running around - busy - in between posts. If it comes out right - great. If not, I'm sure people will get over it. 
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Jun 11, 2016 10:07
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ManofManyAliases posted:The Dragonfly will likely be flyable this year. The Drake pipeline has been completed so we're going to see the Caterpillar this year as well. 
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Jun 11, 2016 10:07
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Nice to see the desperation setting in and the sandbags piling high ready for the flooding.
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Jun 11, 2016 10:11
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It's a hovercar.
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Jun 11, 2016 10:12
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Kakarot posted:Funny how these dickheads hide behind ITS A PLEDGE< SO ITS NO REFUNDABLE< then those fuckhead cronies advertise a SALE ITEM on the website the SAME loving DAY "You cannot get a refund from a product purchase under the old TOS unless the 'release date not known' +18 months has elapsed." "If you do not accept the new TOS, you invalidate your signing of the old TOS and therefore cannot get a refund." "By accepting the new TOS, we've pushed back the refund date indefinitely." Also, a new way of thinking is being born in front of my very eyes. Despite the original release date for Star Citizen was, and always will be, November 2014, because they (the TOS') never explicitly say this (apparently) that means that the game has never had a release date and therefore the TOS actually refers to: Heat death of the universe (Billions of billions of years from now) + 18 months.
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Jun 11, 2016 10:13
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ManofManyAliases posted:If it comes out right - great. If not, I'm sure people will get over it. 
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Jun 11, 2016 10:16
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lmao if these dumbass gaming "journalists" don't write a piece on this slimy tos change. you suck rear end and don't deserve to make a living doing what you do
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Jun 11, 2016 10:16
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no wonder they pulled out from e3, they wanted as little scrutiny from media as possible for the next little while and managed to time it perfectly
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