|
NTRabbit posted:Because clubs absolutely will force players not to play internationals anymore if the door is opened even a little, as they have always done, by bullying small federations, and putting international retirement clauses into contracts that will keep players out of even the big national teams like Germany, France, Italy, Brazil. If you want international football to continue to exist, this is the way it has to be. But neither of those situations are happening here. The player himself has decided not to play. It has absolutely nothing to do with his current or former club. Basically what you're saying is you're okay forcing players to either do something that they do not want to do, or penalising them for not doing it. How is that in any way fair?
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 17:30
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 15, 2024 15:36 |
|
|
NTRabbit posted:That you see representing your country as a job is really the fundamental problem. No, they're both literally jobs.
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 17:33
|
|
|
The bribes and kickbacks FIFA execs have been getting are proof that the players are underpaid IMO Also is representing your country also an honor? What if you're a Kurd and get called up to the Turkish or Iraqi team? Or from Cascadia and get called up to play in the Trump games?
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 17:37
|
|
|
EvilHawk posted:But neither of those situations are happening here. The player himself has decided not to play. It has absolutely nothing to do with his current or former club. Seriously? It's happened before. That's why the current regulations are in place. Sure it sucks for Matip and Liverpool, but it was the clubs that created this mess by their past actions.
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 17:39
|
|
|
Shroud posted:Seriously? And Liverpool was most definitely one of those clubs guilty of it.
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 17:40
|
|
NTRabbit posted:Why exactly do players need to be paid to represent their country? Sure, they should have their travel expenses covered, kit, other sundries, and the staff should all be paid appropriate wages, but anyone who needs a match fee to encourage them to play for their country has their head buried up their arse. actually no, ignoring some romanticized patriotic duty pulled out of your rear end, people should get paid to do what they do professionally
|
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 17:41
|
|
|
Shoren posted:America pays the men's team and at a higher rate than the women and the women throw a fit about it from time to time. Isn't it the case that in women's football some national associations pay their players throughout the year, not just for matches, since they don't make enough from their clubs to actually train full-time?
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 17:54
|
|
|
Shroud posted:Seriously? But Cameroon didn't even bother calling him up. He said he didn't want to play, they didn't call him up, and now they're just forcing him to not play for Liverpool out of spite. If they had called him up and he had actually refused the call there might be a case for the regulations playing a role here. But the precedent actually being set in this case is that international teams can arbitrarily decide that any player of their nationality, even if they aren't named in the tournament squad, can be banned from club football while the international team plays a tournament. Which is an insanely dumb precedent.
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 17:56
|
|
|
NTRabbit posted:That you see representing your country as a job is really the fundamental problem. The key word in the phrase 'professional footballer' is 'professional.' They sell their labour for monetary reward and jingoistic nonsense about it being a privilege doesn't change that. Sorry if that makes you sad but that is how things work in the adult world.
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 17:58
|
|
|
representing your country in sport is just a typical job and footballers should be insanely well paid for the inconvenience to their selfish bastard lives Trp poster opinions
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:05
|
|
|
Hashtag Banterzone posted:Or from Cascadia and get called up to play in the Trump games? This really explains the problem in a way I think everyone should understand.
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:06
|
|
|
NTRabbit posted:And Liverpool was most definitely one of those clubs guilty of it. you seem very salty about noted perma crock harry kewell not playing for australia because he was injured
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:06
|
|
|
In my experience it is only English people who are against international football. Everyone else loves euros and world cups and it is normally a huge celebration of football in all the countries which take part. I'm sorry the English mindset is so hosed up that you can't enjoy international football.
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:09
|
|
|
oliwan posted:In my experience it is only English people who are against international football. Everyone else loves euros and world cups and it is normally a huge celebration of football in all the countries which take part. I'm sorry the English mindset is so hosed up that you can't enjoy international football. well that doesn't make sense because we are so good at it
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:11
|
|
|
oliwan posted:In my experience it is only English people who are against international football. Everyone else loves euros and world cups and it is normally a huge celebration of football in all the countries which take part. I'm sorry the English mindset is so hosed up that you can't enjoy international football. The tournaments in the summer are great. All the qualifiers and friendlies interspersed throughout the domestic season can gently caress off though.
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:13
|
|
|
vyelkin posted:Isn't it the case that in women's football some national associations pay their players throughout the year, not just for matches, since they don't make enough from their clubs to actually train full-time? Yeah, USSF pays the women's team players a yearly salary, plus match bonuses, and the national team contracts and club contracts are part of the same agreement in ways that aren't really worth going into (but you can read about here if you care: http://www.starsandstripesfc.com/2016/2/4/10916838/most-interesting-uswnt-cba-collective-bargaining-details).
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:14
|
|
|
Jose posted:you seem very salty about noted perma crock harry kewell not playing for australia because he was injured Liverpool posters seem dead-sea level salty about Matip not being allowed to play for them while the ACN is on.
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:16
|
|
|
*trp poster emerges from grimey northern terrace, eyes all squinty because of the bright sunlight. he buys a paper from the corner shop but has to immediately throw it in the bin because it's full of celebratory news about the olympics and they don't even get paid which is wrong*
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:16
|
|
|
Shroud posted:Seriously? Again, this is nothing to do with a player skipping an international callup because he wants a little rest or has a "minor injury". Matip does not want to play international football any more. Why should he be punished when he is not contracted to Cameroon?
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:19
|
|
|
RideTheSpiral posted:*trp poster emerges from grimey northern terrace, eyes all squinty because of the bright sunlight. he buys a paper from the corner shop but has to immediately throw it in the bin because it's full of celebratory news about the olympics and they don't even get paid which is wrong* I certainly only watch football as a convenient way of giving my money to NBC.
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:20
|
|
|
Maybe he is contracted through his contract with Liverpool. It's like jury duty I'm afraid and Liverpool weren't going to win the prem anyway.
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:21
|
|
|
RideTheSpiral posted:*trp poster emerges from grimey northern terrace, eyes all squinty because of the bright sunlight. he buys a paper from the corner shop but has to immediately throw it in the bin because it's full of celebratory news about the olympics and they don't even get paid which is wrong* Are you suggesting Olympians are there against their will? I'm pretty sure(with the exception of North Korea) they are not. No one is against working for free. What people are against is working for free(or any salary whatsoever) against their will.
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:23
|
|
|
Some people itt have seen United Passions a few too many times. I'm sorry I want ticket and broadcast money to go to the players and not to Chuck Blazer's cat apartment.
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:23
|
|
|
EvilHawk posted:Again, this is nothing to do with a player skipping an international callup because he wants a little rest or has a "minor injury". Matip does not want to play international football any more. Why should he be punished when he is not contracted to Cameroon? this isn't complicated. 1. there is a general assumption that players want to play for their country 2. most people around the world like international football and want to see their team do well 3. club teams do not want their players to play international football 4. FIFA wants to promote international football because it is important 5. regulations are therefore in place to stop clubs abusing their power and therefore depriving small nations of their star players 6. boo hop matip obviously should have done his paperwork or whatever
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:24
|
|
|
EvilHawk posted:Again, this is nothing to do with a player skipping an international callup because he wants a little rest or has a "minor injury". Matip does not want to play international football any more. Why should he be punished when he is not contracted to Cameroon? Because as soon as you let that happen, clubs will start writing international retirement clauses into contracts, and those players will have to be let off under the same loophole. Clubs only have themselves to blame, they're the ones that made the rule necessary.
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:25
|
|
|
RideTheSpiral posted:*trp poster emerges from grimey northern terrace, eyes all squinty because of the bright sunlight. he buys a paper from the corner shop but has to immediately throw it in the bin because it's full of celebratory news about the olympics and they don't even get paid which is wrong* In my day we worked a 12 hour shift down t'pit, then cleaned ourselves off and played for our country. All for the Queen. We didn't even want to be paid.
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:26
|
|
|
jyrka posted:Are you suggesting Olympians are there against their will? I'm pretty sure(with the exception of North Korea) they are not. No one is against working for free. What people are against is working for free(or any salary whatsoever) against their will. anyone who has to play for their country 'against their will' is a giant baby
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:26
|
|
|
Are players not salaried employees of their clubs? Like, presumably they still get paid through the summer break like teachers. So they should already be being paid by their clubs during international duty and the national team pays the club for them like having a consultant or whatever come and work for you. But I have no idea.
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:28
|
|
|
CAF could also just move their continental tournament to the offseason like a normal federation
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:32
|
|
|
NTRabbit posted:Liverpool posters seem dead-sea level salty about Matip not being allowed to play for them while the ACN is on. I think it's mostly cause we thought we'd got away with it when he wasn't included in their final squad. The news coming right before he was supposed to be playing against man U certainly didn't help
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:35
|
|
|
NotJustANumber99 posted:Are players not salaried employees of their clubs? Like, presumably they still get paid through the summer break like teachers. So they should already be being paid by their clubs during international duty and the national team pays the club for them like having a consultant or whatever come and work for you. But I have no idea. That's an interesting way of looking at it. Where it falls apart this time is that Matip nor Liverpool want him to "consult" Cameroon.
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:38
|
|
|
RideTheSpiral posted:anyone who has to play for their country 'against their will' is a giant baby what if you don't agree with what your country or the national team represents?
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:42
|
|
|
agreed imo if a Palestinian player was forced to play for israel he should just suck it up and deal with it.
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:47
|
|
|
dex_sda posted:what if you don't agree with what your country or the national team represents? then don't play for them 27 times and then sort of retire
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:47
|
|
NotJustANumber99 posted:Are players not salaried employees of their clubs? Like, presumably they still get paid through the summer break like teachers. So they should already be being paid by their clubs during international duty and the national team pays the club for them like having a consultant or whatever come and work for you. But I have no idea. why does it make a difference if they get paid 12 million on january first once a year or 1 million a month?
|
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:47
|
|
|
UnlimitedSpessmans posted:agreed imo if a Palestinian player was forced to play for israel he should just suck it up and deal with it. yeah this is exactly how it works idiot
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:47
|
|
|
UnlimitedSpessmans posted:agreed imo if a Palestinian player was forced to play for israel he should just suck it up and deal with it. Most Palestinians don't have Israeli passports hth
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:49
|
|
RideTheSpiral posted:representing your country in sport is just a typical job and footballers should be insanely well paid for the inconvenience to their selfish bastard lives yes? exactly? especially when they are the ones responsible making the insane amount of money for the federations? "football is a cool job so they should have to do it for free if some guys running their national sport federation say so"
|
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:50
|
|
|
big crush on Chad OMG posted:Most Palestinians don't have Israeli passports hth guess every day is a school day
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:51
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 15, 2024 15:36 |
|
|
RideTheSpiral posted:this isn't complicated. This list doesn't make sense. 1) Matip does not want to play for his country (not that it's his country of birth to begin with). 2) Irrelevant. 3) Irrelevant, Liverpool or Shalke did not force Matip into this decision. 4) Irrelevant. 5) Irrelevant, see point 3). 6) is possibly relevant and does depend whether Matip formally informed Cameron prior to the 35 man squad being announced. NTRabbit posted:Because as soon as you let that happen, clubs will start writing international retirement clauses into contracts, and those players will have to be let off under the same loophole. What are you basing this off of? When has this ever happened? Or are you just trying to make poo poo up to back up your argument.
|
|
#
?
Jan 18, 2017 18:53
|
|