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Lunchmeat Larry posted:as Carl Beijer points out, no capitalist should have a problem with this; while an extreme result, this is just where rubber meets track on state protection of market principles. The customer freely entered into a contract that stipulated that he could be removed from the flight; he chose to remain trespassing on private property and the police did their job. Someone else noted that since he was already boarded and the flight was not oversold, United might not have had a contractual right to boot him. Sure enough a couple of hours later a news story popped up where United clarified the flight was not overbooked. Which makes me wonder if their lawyers were watching their public statements for the inevitable lawsuit. Flight crews have incredible latitude for refusing passengers, but it's possible they don't have the ability to kick a flyer just because an United employee needs that seat. Maybe the carriage contract is missing an Oxford comma.
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Apr 12, 2017 14:09
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Krispy Kareem posted:Someone else noted that since he was already boarded and the flight was not oversold, United might not have had a contractual right to boot him. Sure enough a couple of hours later a news story popped up where United clarified the flight was not overbooked. Which makes me wonder if their lawyers were watching their public statements for the inevitable lawsuit. United's CEO is currently going with the "The passenger was asked to leave during the process of boarding" line, because United's CoC appears to stipulate that you cannot bump a passenger after they have completed boarding. Obviously the rub here is that United's CEO is implying that "sat down with your luggage on the plane, waiting to take off" is somehow "still in the process of boarding".
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Apr 12, 2017 14:14
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MikeCrotch posted:United's CEO is currently going with the "The passenger was asked to leave during the process of boarding" line, because United's CoC appears to stipulate that you cannot bump a passenger after they have completed boarding. Probably because they say "the boarding process is complete" when they close the door.
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Apr 12, 2017 15:04
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Atlas Obscura had a neat article on how failed fast food chains manage second acts. http://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/fast-food-failures If you ever wondered what happened to Kenny Rogers' Roasters, it went Malaysian. Subjunctive posted:Probably because they say "the boarding process is complete" when they close the door. Well thank goodness you can't kick the passenger off once the plane has departed. You're probably right, but that's United definition of 'boarding' and a court could easily redefine that to being allowed a seat on the plane. Just because it's in a contract doesn't make it legal. It's just political grandstanding, but Chris Christie is now talking about banning overbooking. That won't happen, but there's precedent for this kind of poo poo making new laws. The Passenger Bill of Rights only came about after a couple of airlines left flyers stuck on tarmacs for 8 hours. So it would be in United's best interests to drag this story from the news cycle as quickly as possible.
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Apr 12, 2017 15:28
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Krispy Kareem posted:Well thank goodness you can't kick the passenger off once the plane has departed. Oh, I don't think of it as legitimate, just that it's likely the definition they're trying to use. Surprised the CoC doesn't define "boarding", actually.
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Apr 12, 2017 15:31
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Subjunctive posted:Oh, I don't think of it as legitimate, just that it's likely the definition they're trying to use. Surprised the CoC doesn't define "boarding", actually. I heard on NPR yesterday that by law the airline is required to give you cash for a forced bumping, though they try to weasel out of this (if you voluntarily bump or accept the coupon offer, though, you're stuck with those). I don't know if would have changed the doctor's mind about getting off the plane when asked, I was just thinking that's good information for people to know.
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Apr 12, 2017 16:29
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Would moving off when asked count as voluntary?
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Apr 12, 2017 16:52
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Subjunctive posted:Would moving off when asked count as voluntary? No, that's the forced bump. Voluntary is when they ask for any passengers willing to give up their seats in exchange for vouchers.
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Apr 12, 2017 17:53
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Subjunctive posted:Would moving off when asked count as voluntary? Probably. Though from now on I think that might be being looked at.
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Apr 12, 2017 17:53
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Once you're on the plane, wouldn't that also mean you can kiss your luggage goodbye for a day or two? Or would that be an issue you'd face even if you were stopped at the gates because of overbooking?
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Apr 12, 2017 18:02
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davidspackage posted:Once you're on the plane, wouldn't that also mean you can kiss your luggage goodbye for a day or two? Or would that be an issue you'd face even if you were stopped at the gates because of overbooking? I think losing your luggage is an issue you face regardless of what happens https://www.luggageforward.com/mishandled-baggage/ Oh look... virgin is at the bottom again.
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Apr 12, 2017 18:13
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davidspackage posted:Once you're on the plane, wouldn't that also mean you can kiss your luggage goodbye for a day or two? Or would that be an issue you'd face even if you were stopped at the gates because of overbooking? Your luggage should be waiting for you when you arrive the next day. But yeah, you're not seeing it for at least a day if not longer. If you get bumped at the gate you might get your bags off the plane, but that would require a level of customer service and dedication not consistent with overbooking in the first place. There are rules against planes taking off where the flyer and the luggage aren't matched for obvious reasons. Those rules are null when it's an airline creating the disconnect.
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Apr 12, 2017 18:14
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"Capitalism and reguation cannot coexist, it is inconsistent with these abstract principles!" - a modern 'philosopher' selling his book
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Apr 12, 2017 18:20
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girl pants posted:I am completely terrified of flying so this is pretty much how I get through flights anyway.
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Apr 12, 2017 22:04
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Meh. The "dress like an adult" battle was lost when people started wearing sweat pants everywhere.
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Apr 13, 2017 01:20
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MikeCrotch posted:I'm really intrigued as to how bad the US flying experience is. I'm used to flying on Ryanair, which isn't exactly pleasant and you get the cattle car feeling when you are packed in, but it least it feels brusque and efficient as opposed to actively lovely like a lot of people are insinuating about US airlines. It's actually not that bad like 99% of the time. I used to fly 100 times per year and have my luggage delayed maybe once and had a flight canceled for non-weather related reasons maybe once as well.
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Apr 13, 2017 14:07
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Air travel in the U.S. is fine. It's probably the best example of deregulation out there with flights being both cheaper and safer than when the government was in charge. It's just not fun. And most of that is because of poo poo on the ground. How airport security can be both draconian and lax at the same time boggles the mind.
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Apr 13, 2017 15:36
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Krispy Kareem posted:Air travel in the U.S. is fine. It's probably the best example of deregulation out there with flights being both cheaper and safer than when the government was in charge. It's just not fun. And most of that is because of poo poo on the ground. How airport security can be both draconian and lax at the same time boggles the mind. I made it through security wearing a jacket that had braid scissors for fishing. That includes the backscatter machine.
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Apr 13, 2017 15:55
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Gumbel2Gumbel posted:I made it through security wearing a jacket that had braid scissors for fishing. That includes the backscatter machine. I got my carry on randomly picked for a hand-search once. I could see into my bag over the TSA agent's shoulder and almost had a heart attack when I realized I had a big balisong knife in there from a camping trip the previous weekend. The TSA agent literally moved it out of the way in his search and didn't pay it any attention at all.
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Apr 13, 2017 17:09
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Brought a pair of 8" shears through security once by accident, but they always catch the bottle of sunscreen.
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Apr 13, 2017 17:22
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A few years ago Homeland Security decided to test the TSA by trying to sneak explosives and weapons past the security checkpoints. Out of 70 tests, the TSA only stopped them 3 times. http://www.cnn.com/2015/06/01/politics/tsa-failed-undercover-airport-screening-tests/
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Apr 13, 2017 17:36
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Krispy Kareem posted:Atlas Obscura had a neat article on how failed fast food chains manage second acts. Thank goodness, something that isn't airplane chat. I always liked Will Sasso for his Kenny Rogers impressions on MadTV https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-bRq88zMk3M https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=if27InJBtEI
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Apr 13, 2017 17:51
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BloodBag posted:Thank goodness, something that isn't airplane chat. I always thought Will Sasso deserved a bit more success. 
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Apr 13, 2017 18:00
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whiteyfats posted:I always thought Will Sasso deserved a bit more success. There were like three to four comedians in the entire run of MadTV who deserved to have a career, and Will Sasso definitely was one of them.
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Apr 13, 2017 18:07
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Everyone on that show was actually funny when they weren't on that awful show
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Apr 13, 2017 18:18
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SHY NUDIST GRRL posted:Everyone on that show was actually funny when they weren't on that awful show That show shat all over SNL simply because their skits were tight and short for the most part and didn't get by on celebrity names weekly. SNL is, and has been, great with a premise for a skit and then they realize they need to stretch this poo poo for about 3 minutes past when it stopped being funny. Very few old SNL bits bear the re-watching. And I'm going all the way back to the original cast when Dan Akyroyd was doing Fred Garvin: Male Prostitute. I have to say, the news with Colin Quinn was some of the most painfully unfunny poo poo I've ever suffered through.
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Apr 13, 2017 18:41
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there wolf posted:Brought a pair of 8" shears through security once by accident, but they always catch the bottle of sunscreen.
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Apr 13, 2017 18:51
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Colin Quinn loving sucks.
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Apr 13, 2017 19:04
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SHY NUDIST GRRL posted:Everyone on that show was actually funny when they weren't on that awful show I liked that show!  It was way better than SNL was at the time.
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Apr 13, 2017 19:07
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McPhearson posted:A few years ago Homeland Security decided to test the TSA by trying to sneak explosives and weapons past the security checkpoints. Out of 70 tests, the TSA only stopped them 3 times. http://www.satirewire.com/news/march02/screeners.shtml
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Apr 13, 2017 19:07
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whiteyfats posted:I liked that show! At least when MadTV had something painfully unfunny, it was over in a minute or two, there were times when the SNL sketches were halfway to being some kind of Tim and Eric anticomedy.
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Apr 13, 2017 19:11
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They can both be bad
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Apr 13, 2017 19:18
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SHY NUDIST GRRL posted:They can both be bad Fight me irl
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Apr 13, 2017 19:22
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BloodBag posted:That show shat all over SNL simply because their skits were tight and short for the most part and didn't get by on celebrity names weekly. . Once they got rid of the original cast they gravitated towards the same tired Serial Character bits like Swan or Stuart that had infested SNL during Molly Shannon's tenure. Regardless, Colin Quinn can suck a dick. He's like a more boring hybrid of Adam Carolla and Mike Rowe.
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Apr 13, 2017 19:36
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Norm MacDonalds news was god tier.
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Apr 13, 2017 21:02
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whiteyfats posted:Fight me irl What's your address bitch!!!! I probably just don't like sketch comedy. I hate Tim and Eric, but like most of Eric's music videos
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Apr 13, 2017 21:16
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MadTV beat the poo poo out of SNL's nineties "we're still relevant here's a one-hit wonder you'll forget about in three weeks and Adam Sandler doing the same routine he's done in every movie he's ever done" garbage. Also greatest musical guest: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CwO33oUawM8
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Apr 13, 2017 21:29
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This entire argument is a waste of time because In Living Color was better than both of them.
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Apr 13, 2017 21:33
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there wolf posted:This entire argument is a waste of time because In Living Color was better than both of them. Yep.
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Apr 13, 2017 22:01
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there wolf posted:This entire argument is a waste of time because In Living Color was better than both of them. Which was a transitional fossil of MadTV. There was also the Chicano themed comedy of Culture Clash (which if you were lucky you would catch on a Saturday afternoon randomly), and the failed attempt to capture MTV's The State (The Edge??) Which aired once or twice on Saturday at like 11pm.
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Apr 13, 2017 22:39
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