|
I figure since I've finally read through this entire thread I might as well ask Saros to space dorf me. Preferably a ship armed with plasma carronades, survivability optional, but anything fitting the name Thorsson will do in a pinch. The name is because Thor is the god of thunder, y'know? Even though we're the martians this time around.
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 01:11
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 3, 2024 05:26 |
|
|
My thoughts on Mr. Triumvir's offer: WE decide the conditions here, not you If he wants to save his skin so bad, he can consider these 4 points: a) The IC is rather obviously losing this war at this point. You are one of 3 people in the IC who can decide to cut your collective loses and sue for peace before you have nothing to bargain with besides Jupiter itself. b)Saturn is lost to you, and Mars does not intend to leave their brothers behind. Any peace overtures from the IC WILL include the immediate recognization of the Titan Free State's independence with the entire Saturnine system as their territory and all IC property therein transferring to them. c)the first two steps in any peace process are that fleet heading out from Jupiter at this moment turning right around and the siege of Patroclus being lifted. We are quite willing to gurantee your safety on Titan for the duration of talks, and you will be allowed to leave upon the successful conclusion of a tripartiate peace treaty. d)Any nukes that may or may not exist exploding in the harvesters or anywhere else on Titan means that all goodwill granted by the preceding is lost and you will be left to the mercies of the TFS. If no peace overtures from the IC are forthcoming before your forces break, we cannot gurantee your safety. If he doesn't want to try and get us a peace deal, gently caress him, give him the Unconditional Surrunder demand and he can consider the approaching mob over the next two days. Nick Esasky fucked around with this message at 04:43 on Aug 31, 2017 |
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 02:00
|
|
|
Nick Esasky posted:My thoughts on Mr. Triumvir's offer: WE decide the conditions here, not you yeah
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 02:06
|
|
|
Nick Esasky posted:My thoughts on Mr. Triumvir's offer: WE decide the conditions here, not you Yeah, push him
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 02:25
|
|
|
Nick Esasky posted:My thoughts on Mr. Triumvir's offer: WE decide the conditions here, not you This is good start, but I dunno if the TFS would go for it. They're equal partners here, and they really want his head. Crazycryodude fucked around with this message at 02:50 on Aug 31, 2017 |
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 02:44
|
|
|
Crazycryodude posted:This is good start, but I dunno if the TFS would go for it. They're equal partners here, and they really want his head. Equal partners? We got here first sooooo push the bastard
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 02:53
|
|
|
Looks like others already said half of what I was writing. Whether or not it's a bluff* he's getting lynched unless another major player** intervenes, and since negotiations are underway with a guy who owns a fair chunk of the solar system and doesn't want to die, why not make a counter-offer? Capitalists tend to value their life, their wealth and their pride; but priorities are worth considering. * Either the 'insurance' is a bluff or the rest of the Triumvirate are very bad gamblers, because one guy going scorched earth will make lot of people rather irritated and creates a risk that highly irrational things might happen to their business, like their operations being seized by one group on the pretense of preventing others from destroying it out of spite. ** There's still the possibility that he's shopping for the best deal between Martians and Terrans. That incoming carrier fleet could have already sent a group of fighters as expendable flying gas cans to extend the range for one of them to reach Titan; all they have to do is get that guy onboard one of their ships and he becomes untouchable, and they get a bulk discount.. Neither of which is desirable. The relay-race shuttle might not even be necessary since sending infiltrators and fomenting a rebellion might mean Terrans have an actual espionage team on the ground, ready to whisk him away to a safehouse if he agrees to whatever they're asking for. Just spitballing some possible conditions here, and it can't be too unreasonable unless someone who can't be bought has him in handcuffs, but... 1: IC formally recognizes TFS as an independent sovereign entity with territorial ownership of not just "Titan" (as in the offer) but Saturn and all of its satellites. 2: IC acknowledges guilt of wrongdoing against the people of Titan and pays reparations for its unfair wage/labor practices, policies that led to poor living conditions, actions of its employees, etc. 3: Mars requires some totally reasonable concessions, like replacing the moon that got blown up. 4: Triumvirdude takes responsibility for his actions, which may require a criminal trial if that is determined necessary; waits in Martian custody until: 5: After the chaos settles down, the Titan state's representatives present their demands for amends (beyond 1&2) to settle the issue and not seek retribution for other injustices committed by the honcho the company. Whatever that involves is up to them. Maybe they want infrastructure+ships+terraformers to colonize half the galaxy and/or liberation of oppressed workers in the Jupiter sphere. Maybe they want their bourgeois flayed alive. A lot of people are out for blood so not everyone is gonna be happy with just a mountain of money and some additional contrition, so it might be difficult to convince the leaders of the rebellion to accept, but the more levelheaded ones with an eye for the future of their nation will convince the rest that revenge hurts them in the long run; especially when the alternative is literally a king's ransom that gives everyone a better life. Effectively this is unconditional surrender in return for persuading Titans to let one dirtbag keep his life in exchange for basically everything else, on top of paying back what he stole from them. Which only works if Titan agrees to that condition, as well because it is probably a good idea to start treating them like a country (and an ally) by giving them a seat at the table when determining what to do with their criminals. There may be pro-Mars sentiment, but it's better if they are 100% independent with formal self-governance and someone the people agree should represent them, and then join if that is the consensus of their people, so the less-obvious Terran agitators can't argue that it was a unilateral and illegitimate annexation. Or rig the adrenaline-driven "let's all hurry up and vote right now on which side we want to rule us, before people calmly discuss what we actually want" election.
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 03:00
|
|
|
Honestly the TFS directly joining the Martian Federation and getting annexed might be counterproductive in the long run, our main focus is on terraforming Mars and if they start paying Martian taxes and get drafted by the Martian military to mainly benefit a planet 90% of them will never even set foot on, all that good will could rapidly evaporate. I'd rather have a very friendly quasi-vassal state with its own government that we're just total bros with. Sure, sign treaties breaking down our borders and unifying our currency and whatever to make it like they're basically a Federation member, but don't actually annex them. Let them have their own priorities and local government. Like a Space EU, except not poo poo.
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 03:05
|
|
|
United Space Sovereignties of maRs.
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 03:13
|
|
|
Warsaw Pact... In SPACE
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 03:14
|
|
|
If we want a replacement moon that isn't Titan, how about Rhea? I'm pretty sure it had a PDC on it, so maybe it's a viable outpost spot for Mars to aid in the protection of the TFS from any future IC related aggression. And we can set up a repair station there eventually so that the TFS doesn't have to deal with the uncomfortable situation of Martian warships looming over its home. I kind of like the idea of giving the guy an out though. It's bad form to back someone too far into a corner. They might do something...reckless. We are not completely heartless though. lets at least continue negotiating for a surrender.
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 03:21
|
|
|
Prototyping the Space Warsaw Pact with Titan will be a really good trial run for how to deal with our extrasolar colonies, too. Trying to centrally administer them forever is very emphatically not gonna go well as literally every empire in all of history has found. Best to already have a framework in place for dealing with people that should be independent but have interests roughly aligned with us and want to stay friends.
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 03:22
|
|
|
Veloxyll posted:If we want a replacement moon that isn't Titan, how about Rhea? We're towing Europa to Mars as part of reparations and making friends with all the sentient Space Dolphins that live inside.
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 03:23
|
|
|
Crazycryodude posted:We're towing Europa to Mars as part of reparations and making friends with all the sentient Space Dolphins that live inside. As someone who has LP'd both Sword of the Stars', let me just say gently caress SPACE DOLPHINS
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 03:28
|
|
|
The Liir are real and strong and they're my friend, and they're gonna help us beat up Earth and meet their Space Whale cousins 
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 03:29
|
|
|
You do NOT want to meet their space whale cousins. Also I hope I'm not the only one who really wants us to actually replace our moon with another moon
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 03:34
|
|
|
right, i amended my post a bit to make three things clear. a)TFS gets their independence/ownership of Saturn + everything around recognized as part of the IC suing for peace, quite unnegotiable. I personally think they can be bought around to the idea of letting Mr. Triumvir go if it means not having to fight any more Battles Of Titan/freaking Jupiter + getting all their other possible demands met. b)Mr. Triumvir does not get to leave Titan alive until such point as we actually have a peace treaty signed thats agreeable to both Mars and the TFS. c)The gurantee of his safety does not apply if he does not produce IC peace overtures before the angry mobs break in his doors.
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 04:44
|
|
|
Just gonna say Space Communism is starting to sound more like Space Stalinism. And I have grave concerns about it filtering down into Space Juche. If we're going the power to the people route do it the democratoc way. If we're going the control route be authoritian but not insane.
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 04:50
|
|
|
Gridlocked posted:Just gonna say Space Communism is starting to sound more like Space Stalinism. And I have grave concerns about it filtering down into Space Juche. Terran informant spotted
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 05:22
|
|
|
Push for a complete surrender, have SB and hell every ship we've got generate loads of ECM around the harvesters as a failsafe and send teams onboard to search for bombs. Plus have the harvesters themselves dump any fuel and open up every hatch so they're not filled with air. Basically gently caress the triumvir and let's show the TFS that we're on their side. (Again)
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 06:39
|
|
|
Crazycryodude posted:Honestly the TFS directly joining the Martian Federation and getting annexed might be counterproductive in the long run, our main focus is on terraforming Mars and if they start paying Martian taxes and get drafted by the Martian military to mainly benefit a planet 90% of them will never even set foot on, all that good will could rapidly evaporate. I'd rather have a very friendly quasi-vassal state with its own government that we're just total bros with. Sure, sign treaties breaking down our borders and unifying our currency and whatever to make it like they're basically a Federation member, but don't actually annex them. Let them have their own priorities and local government. Like a Space EU, except not poo poo. Basically, they will be making all their own decisions until they decide they're better off trading a small amount of that independence for a greater degree of safety/stability, i.e. Saros gets tired of micromanaging 7+ factions in a sandbox sim game with an interface that makes Eve Online seem straightforward and easy in comparison. Gridlocked posted:Just gonna say Space Communism is starting to sound more like Space Stalinism. And I have grave concerns about it filtering down into Space Juche.
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 06:59
|
|
|
I change my vote to unconditional surrender, if we can get his family and the families of any other IC leadership aboard the refineries 
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 09:31
|
|
|
Mars does not negotiate with terrorists! Unconditional surrender surges late to win 22 to 12.
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 11:14
|
|
|
Can we still do non stupid poo poo with re: minimising risks to the harvesters.
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 11:39
|
|
|
Unconditional surrender with conditions as per nickesasky We'll promise that the TFS won't hang, draw and quarter him, and that's it. He should feel lucky to get out of this alive. If he blows the harvesters we declare open season on him and all his colleagues and let the mob at em. Also seconding vent and secure harvesters.
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 12:19
|
|
|
Saros posted:Mars does not negotiate with terrorists! Well, we do negotiate with terrorists, but only in good faith.
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 13:17
|
|
|
We don't negotiate with terrorists. Freedom fighters, on the other hand...
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 14:00
|
|
|
We negotiate with whoever the hell we want to and make up whatever justifications we feel the need for, much like everybody else.
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 14:03
|
|
|
The defense of Saturn is happening on Discord right now.
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 15:56
|
|
|
Saros posted:
 Looks like I didn't die. Scoop me up and shove me in another 
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 16:07
|
|
|
Saros posted:Done. You are 97th in line and we are currently passing the 80th Goon for placement. *moves little fighter minis on a board with a stick * The enemys gate... is down. Also. Press the attack to get an unconditional surrender
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 16:37
|
|
|
Maybe we can push an unconditional surrender along, fluff wise. The IC rep will understand that from a business position, we can't give up all our leverage and our gains just to get him out alive. That just isn't good business sense, we need an unconditional surrender. However, he could help HIMSELF by making that surrender sooner rather than later, and accompanying it with a public broadcast about how he's doing it because he has seen it is the will of the people, and he is not one to stand in the way of progress, etc. He's trying to blow smoke up the wrong asses, he needs to convince the people of Titan that he should be left alive, not us. And then assure him that if he doesn't surrender, well... 
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 16:53
|
|
|
Crazycryodude posted:We're towing Europa to Mars as part of reparations and making friends with all the sentient Space Dolphins that live inside. I actually did the math on this... 1,000,000 of our current technology tugs (AO Eberswalde) pulling an object the mass of Europa (4.799x10^19 Metric Tons) travelling from Jupitor's average orbit to Mar's average orbit (about 551,000,000 km) would require about 34,936,910 years; and consume 8.128*10^12 liters of fuel which equates out to about 4 billion metric tons of unrefined Sorium. Nevets fucked around with this message at 17:28 on Aug 31, 2017 |
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 17:26
|
|
|
 Voting is over. You waffle and delay the Triumvir while all assets desperately begin to try and trace his location and get a fix on any insurance nukes. 30 April, 1851hrs  The fleeing enemy ships slow and come to a halt as instructed. The commander opens a line to the fighters and seems to be feeling out a way to surrender.  With the threat to the Harvesters the SB snoopship accelerates insystem. The commander informs you of his intent to land a team and then attempt to jam any detonation code.  You inform the TFS of the threat and the Harvesters lumber towards Saturn in an attempt to use the planets bulk to screen any signal. You watch in mild horror as millions of liters of refined sorium and everything volatile on board the enormous platforms is dumped overboard into space. 30 April, 2108hrs   An hour passes and the fighting continues, the enemys 58th Mobile infantry surrenders to your troops and the TFS wreaks havok on the IC reserves. 1 May, 0023hrs  Three more hours pass, the Triumvir remains silent but his ships are apparently asking to surrender to the TFS. Apparently they are largely crewed by locals and would rather defect than become Martian prisoners. There are no objections from the senior officers around Titan so Cathode Raymond places a call to an ecstatic TFS heirachy. 1 May, 0306hrs  Fighting drags on with no sign of any harversters going up in a ball of fire. Another IC unit surrenders and the rest are falling apart. 1 May, 1523hrs Twelve hours pass and preparations continue frantically for turning around the Martian fleet to full combat readiness.  The section of the IC frontline collapses and Free State fighters are in amongst the HQ units. It's not a pretty sight. 1 MAy, 2123hrs  The fleet continue to close with the Terran ships dropping off the Mars DSTS as they move outsystem. The TFS informs you they will shortly be able to reactivate captured DSTS systems and track the local area for you.  The rout on the ground continues. Nobody ahs any idea of the location of the Triumvir and you have not heard from him since the call. 1 May, 2314hrs  Having read the manuals and figured out what most of the buttons do the captured IC fighters with volunteer crews head for the IC reinforcements from Uranus. 2 May, 0144hrs  The net is closing rapidly with forces from all three sides converging on Titan.  Its getting messy down on the ground.  Another six hours pass as everyone continues to close and the IC ground forces continue to collapse. 2 May, 2059hrs  Your fighters come into range and prepare to target the enemy missile cruiser.  The TFS brings its DSTS back online and starts tracking threats. Here's a comparison of what you see and what they see. The Second Battle of Titan is about to begin! Saros fucked around with this message at 18:00 on Aug 31, 2017 |
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 17:48
|
|
|
Looks like the BC force is gonna rendezvous with the Uranus force first, they're heading for some empty point in space instead of Titan right now. Buys us a little more time, hopefully.
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 17:52
|
|
|
Kommando posted:Huzzah!  Fleet status: Everyone is rearmed in one fashion or another. MIssile loadouts are pretty haphazard but should do the job. 
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 17:58
|
|
|
How are we on damage? Did the Koshkins get new engines?
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 18:15
|
|
|
The Koshkins are being worked on frantically but are not yet ready, same for all the ships under construction by the TFS. All the Martian ships listed above have been patched back to 100%, the real cripples are en route to Neptune.
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 18:22
|
|
|
Can I also be placed in another fighter Saros? If it's not too much trouble could said ship be renamed "Nickel Ogre" for ease of identification in my sudden but inevitable death for the future of Mars.
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 18:26
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 3, 2024 05:26 |
|
|
Saros posted:Done. You are 97th in line and we are currently passing the 80th Goon for placement.
|
|
#
?
Aug 31, 2017 18:27
|
|