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bean_shadow posted:I really liked the cast from the last few seasons but then they ended the show and now all that’s left is SVU where Benson is crazier than Stabler ever was. Like I can think of times in vanilla L&O where the cops went off on a suspect or conducted an illegal search, but they always get reamed out by Van Buren or one of the DAs for being huge morons whose fault it is they almost (or occasionally actually) got the case thrown out. SVU they just act crazy with zero consequences.
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Jan 8, 2018 21:34
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There was a throwaway line in SVU about how Stablers method led to confessions being thrown out and convictions overturned. Donal Logues character on SVU was kinda interesting as their liuetenant, since he told the regulars to stop beating up random low level kiddy diddlers and start targeting big picture organizers and pedophile rings. He even came back in a later season to repeat it. It lead to absolutely no change at all.
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Jan 8, 2018 21:42
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There was one guy who was coerced and bullied into confessing for a crime he didn't commit, while the investigator hosed up checking the evidence, so he ended up in jail for nearly a decade - protesting his innocence the entire time. Oh hey turns out he confessed to make the coercion and bullying stop, and a simple check meant the evidence against him didn't match up. He's freed, the detective looks remorseful for a moment and it's business as usual next week when she does the exact same thing. 
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Jan 8, 2018 21:46
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Mr Luxury Yacht posted:Like I can think of times in vanilla L&O where the cops went off on a suspect or conducted an illegal search, but they always get reamed out by Van Buren or one of the DAs for being huge morons whose fault it is they almost (or occasionally actually) got the case thrown out. It was rare, but it was nice in L&O they would actually lose cases at the end of the episode. That's something that only happens in other procedurals to start an episode.
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Jan 8, 2018 21:48
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Columbo had it right by showing the person's plan falling to poo poo but avoided any actual court case. It was purely about the detective unravelling threads.
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Jan 8, 2018 21:50
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"Just one more thing..."
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Jan 8, 2018 22:03
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Law & Order takes. Og was great with briscoe, I still love SVU, but haven't watched much since Stabler left. Ice and Munch were both great. The worst episodes of SVU are definitely the video games/internet are evil episodes. I'm thinking the GTA and Second Life eps in particular, though I'm sure there have to be more. Criminal intent was great, with Dinofrio, and I liked the goldblum episodes too. Not a Logan fan at all, on either show.
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Jan 8, 2018 22:33
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The only bit of Columbo I’ve ever seen aged pretty poorly. I can’t remember the specific details, but it was something along the lines of someone’s time of death or alibi hinging on the fact that they saved a file on their computer at X o’clock. To which Columbo asked “Can’t you change the time on these things?”
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Jan 8, 2018 22:34
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dirksteadfast posted:The only bit of Columbo I’ve ever seen aged pretty poorly. I can’t remember the specific details, but it was something along the lines of someone’s time of death or alibi hinging on the fact that they saved a file on their computer at X o’clock. To which Columbo asked “Can’t you change the time on these things?”
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Jan 8, 2018 23:55
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Columbo is computer dumb, always.  Can instantly tell how old an episode is by the size of the phone though. Or how sick he looks... 
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Jan 8, 2018 23:57
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dirksteadfast posted:The only bit of Columbo I’ve ever seen aged pretty poorly. I can’t remember the specific details, but it was something along the lines of someone’s time of death or alibi hinging on the fact that they saved a file on their computer at X o’clock. To which Columbo asked “Can’t you change the time on these things?” seems perfectly plausible, especially since altering the date modified field on a file is in fact trivially easy
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Jan 9, 2018 00:03
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Chicago PD is the ends justify the means of SVU knocked up a notch. Every once in a while there's a scene where they torture suspect or the main detective ask if they want to execute a criminal because the criminal threatened someones family or something. The excuse for all this is that they're a special team who only deals with the worst criminals.
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Jan 9, 2018 00:42
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dirksteadfast posted:The only bit of Columbo I’ve ever seen aged pretty poorly. I can’t remember the specific details, but it was something along the lines of someone’s time of death or alibi hinging on the fact that they saved a file on their computer at X o’clock. To which Columbo asked “Can’t you change the time on these things?” Please elaborate on how that’s aged poorly?
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Jan 9, 2018 03:58
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Avenging_Mikon posted:Please elaborate on how that’s aged poorly? He copied the .avi around so now he doesn't know when he first downloaded it.
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Jan 9, 2018 04:12
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Iron Crowned posted:It was rare, but it was nice in L&O they would actually lose cases at the end of the episode. That's something that only happens in other procedurals to start an episode. This was the thing that shat me the most about Ally McBeal, and the other 'serious' lawyer-type show that they partnered with occasionally with the Camryn Mannheim. Every week they would use the stupidest, most convoluted, morally suspect, and faddishly trendy argument in court arguing some petty case or other, and yet they would win every week and go down to their bourgie wine bar to listen to Diana Krall. also, whilst I am on Ally McBeal, despite her being an objectively terrible person, who travelled half way across the country to stalk her crush, (who was married), as well as being insanely brittle, joyless, and a major buzzkill, she is supposed to be the one we like and relate to. (This is saying nothing of the body issues her skeletal frame foist on people.) Also the boss was a serial sexual harasser, yet it was always played for laughs, even when the firm was prosecuting someone else for sexual harassment. It is different when he does it, coz he's a main character.
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Jan 9, 2018 06:56
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but the dancing baby
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Jan 9, 2018 07:07
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BrigadierSensible posted:bourgie wine bar Lol
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Jan 9, 2018 08:16
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I only go to working class wine bars.
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Jan 9, 2018 08:50
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FreudianSlippers posted:I only go to working class wine bars. 
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Jan 9, 2018 09:59
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Yeah, Columbo is great. Some episodes sort of go off the rails but I'd say at least 80% of them hold up. Really remarkable thing about that show is how much real talent they got to play to play the suspects. List of Columbo villains actors: Martin Sheen, Faye Dunaway, Janet Leigh, Dick VanDyke, Martin Landau, Sal Mineo, Suzanne Pleshette, Bill Shatner, Nimoy, George Wendt, George Hamilton, Ruth Gordon, Dabney Coleman, Ed Begley... Pretty impressive list really. Here's a list of talent that showed up but didn't always play the killer: https://columbophile.wordpress.com/2016/04/30/25-megastars-you-never-knew-graced-columbo/ loving everybody's been on this show.
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Jan 9, 2018 14:28
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The Dick VanDyke episode is my favorite one. He identified the camera! I was a kid when I watched it and that blew my mind.
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Jan 9, 2018 14:31
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One issue with SVU that I have is the cops constantly smirking about how now the rapist will get raped. Like, your job is cleaning up after the trauma and aftermath of rape; you'd think that wouldn't be something to gloat about.
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Jan 9, 2018 14:32
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There was even an episode where that blew up on them as a guy they put away came for revenge because he thought they had arranged for him to be raped in prison.
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Jan 9, 2018 14:39
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I didn't see much of NYPD Blue when it aired, but I probably enjoyed it more when I went through it recently because it was obviously dated. It was a snapshot of early 90s Guncrime City, complete with bigot cop.
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Jan 9, 2018 14:42
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Volcott posted:I didn't see much of NYPD Blue when it aired, but I probably enjoyed it more when I went through it recently because it was obviously dated. It was a snapshot of early 90s Guncrime City, complete with bigot cop. Imagine thinking one bigot cop was gritty and realistic.
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Jan 9, 2018 14:43
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Absurd Alhazred posted:Imagine thinking one bigot cop was gritty and realistic. Well, if they're all bigot cops there wouldn't have been anyone to tell Sipz to stop being a bigot, and then he wouldn't have stopped doing that. You're talking about a page one rewrite here.
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Jan 9, 2018 14:45
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Volcott posted:Well, if they're all bigot cops there wouldn't have been anyone to tell Sipz to stop being a bigot, and then he wouldn't have stopped doing that. Even a gritty cop show needs a gritty reboot, sometimes. I'll call my people, let's make it happen!
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Jan 9, 2018 14:58
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BrigadierSensible posted:This was the thing that shat me the most about Ally McBeal, and the other 'serious' lawyer-type show that they partnered with occasionally with the Camryn Mannheim. Ally McBeal has always been dated. Both the bosses were horrible sexual harassers, and there’s no way even in the 90s that they’d get away with that poo poo. The non-white characters were stereotypes, from scary Asian sex lady to sassy black best friend. There was always some ridiculous morality message in each case. Honestly, if the show didn’t have that 90s look and the short skirts it could have been made decades before.
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Jan 9, 2018 15:36
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Ally McBeal is one of those shows that was big in it's day, but when it left the air it was if it never existed at all, like Timecop (The scheme in Timecop, not the public-reception of Timecop).
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Jan 9, 2018 15:41
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My favourite thing about Columbo, and the reason I think it is my favourite detective show, is approaching every episode as Columbo being the villain. He often shows up so late into the story after we have gotten to know the antagonist of that week. By the time he makes his apperance we get a much better idea of why a crime was committed (some of which even border into 'I wish they had gotten away with it') and the back and forth between the two leads is genuinely more interesting for it.
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Jan 9, 2018 15:42
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BrigadierSensible posted:This was the thing that shat me the most about Ally McBeal, and the other 'serious' lawyer-type show that they partnered with occasionally with the Camryn Mannheim. My wife liked the Drop Dead Diva show which was about as ridiculous as Ally McBeal in terms of legal logic. Like at one point they successfully argued that a character wasn't legally an adult until the hour of their birth and not the day. Which I'm pretty sure has never been a thing. Do lawyers watch legal shows? It has to be like a programmer watching Sandra Bullock in The Net.
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Jan 9, 2018 15:45
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SEX BURRITO posted:Ally McBeal has always been dated. Both the bosses were horrible sexual harassers, and there’s no way even in the 90s that they’d get away with that poo poo. The non-white characters were stereotypes, from scary Asian sex lady to sassy black best friend. There was always some ridiculous morality message in each case. Honestly, if the show didn’t have that 90s look and the short skirts it could have been made decades before. Here's the absolutely crazy thing: Lucy Liu's role was a watershed moment in representing Asian women on television. It was actually progressive 
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Jan 9, 2018 15:47
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VideoGames posted:My favourite thing about Columbo, and the reason I think it is my favourite detective show, is approaching every episode as Columbo being the villain. He often shows up so late into the story after we have gotten to know the antagonist of that week. It was also quite clever in that, unless I missed something, a lot of episodes dealt with crimes arising from middle classes wanting more of something they already had, were spurred by jealousy, etc, rather than something which was done to survive. Factor in that the criminals always tried to cover things up, or planned it to be done that way, and it avoided the tang of Columbo harassing someone who didn't deserve it, or that his actions were out of proportion. That show just clicks together.
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Jan 9, 2018 15:50
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Also you never meet his wife! It was the precursor to Vera Peterson and Maris Crane!
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Jan 9, 2018 16:00
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Gaunab posted:Chicago PD is the ends justify the means of SVU knocked up a notch. Every once in a while there's a scene where they torture suspect or the main detective ask if they want to execute a criminal because the criminal threatened someones family or something. The excuse for all this is that they're a special team who only deals with the worst criminals.
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Jan 9, 2018 16:04
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I don't really get all the SNL hate to be honest. It's aged pretty damned well for a show built largely around the topical issues of the day. The shows have always been uneven quality wise but when edited into "best ofs" with the fat trimmed, or down to an hour like CC used to do, most of it is pretty classic. Several of the musical performances are seminal as well.
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Jan 9, 2018 16:15
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Columbo is a good example for episodic TV. There is no real continuity, you don't see Columbo's wife, and you don't learn his first name because all of that stuff is completely irrelevant to the premise which is him foiling some rich prick's alibi. Look at Doctor Who. That show's technically episodic but more and more it went up it's own rear end with it's continuity. Everyone is connected, and everything is leading up to a big mystery, and poo poo you forgot about years ago is suddenly crucial. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wtPZ96oHH-4 The Netflix-mentality that a show can be one long glob can lead to creators not sweating when individual episodes end up weak since they believe only the long-term story matters more, and less the minute-to-minute stuff. Luke Cage got really sloppy as it had the title-character on the brink of death in three cliffhangers in a row.
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Jan 9, 2018 16:25
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Inspector Gesicht posted:Ally McBeal is one of those shows that was big in it's day, but when it left the air it was if it never existed at all, like Timecop (The scheme in Timecop, not the public-reception of Timecop). The one that always sticks out to me is Murphy Brown, which I've never really seen a lot of, but which won loads of awards and was on TV for 10 years. Who remembers it outside its feud with Dan Quayle nowadays? For that matter, who even remembers Dan Quayle?
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Jan 9, 2018 17:07
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Wheat Loaf posted:The one that always sticks out to me is Murphy Brown, which I've never really seen a lot of, but which won loads of awards and was on TV for 10 years. Who remembers it outside its feud with Dan Quayle nowadays? There was a crossover with Seinfeld, and my 5th grade teacher was her painter's cousin (according to Wikipedia, he committed suicide some time back)
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Jan 9, 2018 17:14
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Avenging_Mikon posted:Please elaborate on how that’s aged poorly? Shame on me for posting and running. I believe in the episode Columbo was the only one to bring up the easily changed time stamp, all the other law enforcement didn’t even consider it. It was just an example of people not understanding computers, albeit not an egregious one. Though I’m sure there are procedurals airing right now that still have someone saying dumb things about computers.
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Jan 9, 2018 17:15
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