interviewing: The Land of the Rising Fig

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Arcteryx Anarchist: Sep 15, 2007; Fun Shoe

I think the first time I encountered fizz buzz was on one of those code puzzle websites as like the first or second problem

That was back when those websites were just dinky things for fun instead of the venture funded job listing and interviewing sites they are currently

# ? Feb 26, 2018 01:04

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# ? Apr 27, 2024 05:27

KoRMaK: Jul 31, 2012

Even if you haven't heard of it like, dude, clarify the criteria would ya

# ? Feb 26, 2018 01:15

Pollyanna: Mar 5, 2005; Milk's on them.

place i had an in-person with last week is apparently not very happy with how i did during the technical whiteboarding session, or at least theyre taking way too long to respond

i guess im just not impressive enough? the guy said at the end that i did pretty well so i guess go gently caress myself

# ? Feb 26, 2018 01:21

Pollyanna: Mar 5, 2005; Milk's on them.

[ask] me about getting spooked out of a decent job that was letting people go but was otherwise stable and regretting my decision

# ? Feb 26, 2018 01:28

Shaman Linavi: Apr 3, 2012

Pollyanna posted:

i guess im just not impressive enough? the guy said at the end that i did pretty well so i guess go gently caress myself

from my experience this means nothing. i've been rejected with a "sorry we don't think you can code well" after being told during the whiteboarding that i'm coding well

# ? Feb 26, 2018 01:32

Pollyanna: Mar 5, 2005; Milk's on them.

Shaman Linavi posted:

from my experience this means nothing. i've been rejected with a "sorry we don't think you can code well" after being told during the whiteboarding that i'm coding well

cool poo poo i guess i can go gently caress myself

# ? Feb 26, 2018 01:35

KoRMaK: Jul 31, 2012

Pollyanna posted:

i guess im just not impressive enough? the guy said at the end that i did pretty well so i guess go gently caress myself

lol relax. stewin won't lead to screwin

# ? Feb 26, 2018 01:36

Arcsech: Aug 5, 2008

I did the weirdest interview last week

it was one of those in-browser shared editor things, but instead of having an engineer on the other end there was a recruiter who copied and pasted questions into it. I had 30 minutes to do 3 questions plus one bonus. I went through it really fast because the questions were really easy although if I misinterpreted what they wanted I�d have no way of knowing since the recruiter just had the list of questions and nothing else

they claimed an engineer would review it �in the next couple days� but still haven�t heard back. not exactly the greatest look on this one

# ? Feb 26, 2018 01:42

4lokos basilisk: Jul 17, 2008

I only found out about fizzbuzz because people were mentioning it online, but I have no problems in using the modulus operator in everyday coding life when I need it, so if it ever comes up in an interview, I think it's no problem.

That said, I think I have so far failed every whiteboard interview I have been to. I am not sure because they usually reply with a bullshit answer like "we felt you are not suitable for the position". I guess I am one of those people who fail whiteboards, even though I usually do try to give a good impression of how I am thinking to solve a problem. The stubborn me is just thinking that if the company dropped my process because of a failed whiteboard, I probably would not have wanted to work for them anyways.

# ? Feb 26, 2018 01:47

KoRMaK: Jul 31, 2012

We had someone turn us down because we have stupid rear end watson-Glaser and trimetric or something assessments before you come in for an interview.

Man, do I want that guy to come work here because gently caress yea that poo poo is stupid and I bet he was probably a good programmer.

# ? Feb 26, 2018 01:48

Arcteryx Anarchist: Sep 15, 2007; Fun Shoe

Penisface posted:

I only found out about fizzbuzz because people were mentioning it online, but I have no problems in using the modulus operator in everyday coding life when I need it, so if it ever comes up in an interview, I think it's no problem.

That said, I think I have so far failed every whiteboard interview I have been to. I am not sure because they usually reply with a bullshit answer like "we felt you are not suitable for the position". I guess I am one of those people who fail whiteboards, even though I usually do try to give a good impression of how I am thinking to solve a problem. The stubborn me is just thinking that if the company dropped my process because of a failed whiteboard, I probably would not have wanted to work for them anyways.

As much talk as there is about how what�s really important is communicating your thoughts and everything and we�re just using this to help us feel out how you solve problems, much like everything in life that uses that talk, 90% of the time all they actually care about is if you do it right and in a period of time with a process they like

# ? Feb 26, 2018 02:04

dividertabs: Oct 1, 2004

FamDav posted:

yeah for any company greater than 50-100 people the implementation of whatever values your company has are going to vary quite a bit team to team. I'd probably ask a list of questions like

"What are your team's primary values?"

"How much would you say those values are shared with other teams? leadership?"

"How often do you ignore those values?"

I wouldn't even ask about the team values; what they supposedly value doesn't (in my experience) correlate well with how decisions are made. I would drop the two questions:

what are the company's primary values? what characteristics are you looking for in a candidate in relation to those primary values?
what's the most impressive thing you've seen out of someone else you've interviewed recently

I'd replace them with:

When you think about your strongest teammates [or reports when interviewing with a manager], what qualities make them successful in your org?

A bad answer is, "resolves issues quickly and without bugs" as the only important quality. A good answer also considers how they impact other developers (e.g. spreading knowledge or improving tooling), especially cross-team impact, and how they contribute to planning + design tasks. They should also be able to speak to how those qualities are measured and rewarded; this helps you figure out what managers encourage, which is more important than what they value.

# ? Feb 26, 2018 02:04

TimWinter: Mar 30, 2015; https://timsthebomb.com

KoRMaK posted:

lol relax. stewin won't lead to screwin

Stealing this.

# ? Feb 26, 2018 02:07

Pollyanna: Mar 5, 2005; Milk's on them.

companies are very hit or miss on whiteboarding

some of them are more interested in your thought process as you do them, others like that one i was talking about seemed to be looking for specific answers which is going to lead to almost 100% rejections

whiteboarding is bullshit and useless tbqh

# ? Feb 26, 2018 02:09

Pollyanna: Mar 5, 2005; Milk's on them.

lancemantis posted:

As much talk as there is about how what�s really important is communicating your thoughts and everything and we�re just using this to help us feel out how you solve problems, much like everything in life that uses that talk, 90% of the time all they actually care about is if you do it right and in a period of time with a process they like

yeah this

people lie, who knew

# ? Feb 26, 2018 02:09

4lokos basilisk: Jul 17, 2008

I am still angry at the one whiteboard where the interviewer told that the code I write would run in a perfect supercomputer without any resource limitations. It's like the exercise itself was setup to be ambiguous as hell, because even though it was a real-world use case, they did not specify any constraints and refused to describe the data structure that I would be pulling/pushing records from. At this point I literally felt this is some children's cartoon level programming, because I could assume that any function I write is automagically correct and will do what I desire in my heart of hearts.

But the office was a cubicle hell, the meeting rooms were named after anime characters, they had a video game corner and I knew that I probably would have to work with insufferable weeaboo tech bros even before the whiteboard had started.

Oh and one of the screening phone calls had to be done at loving 5 am, because the screening department was in Texas, and I thank whichever brain genius thought that this is a smart thing when interviewing a candidate located in Tokyo.

# ? Feb 26, 2018 02:16

Pollyanna: Mar 5, 2005; Milk's on them.

Penisface posted:

I am still angry at the one whiteboard where the interviewer told that the code I write would run in a perfect supercomputer without any resource limitations. It's like the exercise itself was setup to be ambiguous as hell, because even though it was a real-world use case, they did not specify any constraints and refused to describe the data structure that I would be pulling/pushing records from. At this point I literally felt this is some children's cartoon level programming, because I could assume that any function I write is automagically correct and will do what I desire in my heart of hearts.

But the office was a cubicle hell, the meeting rooms were named after anime characters, they had a video game corner and I knew that I probably would have to work with insufferable weeaboo tech bros even before the whiteboard had started.

Oh and one of the screening phone calls had to be done at loving 5 am, because the screening department was in Texas, and I thank whichever brain genius thought that this is a smart thing when interviewing a candidate located in Tokyo.

sounds like you dodged a bullet

# ? Feb 26, 2018 02:19

Pollyanna: Mar 5, 2005; Milk's on them.

so many companies are amazingly lovely and have no idea how to hire well

and if they cant hire well they cant operate well

businesses, companies, and corporations should be taxed heavily to support a universal basic income

# ? Feb 26, 2018 02:19

4lokos basilisk: Jul 17, 2008

lancemantis posted:

As much talk as there is about how what�s really important is communicating your thoughts and everything and we�re just using this to help us feel out how you solve problems, much like everything in life that uses that talk, 90% of the time all they actually care about is if you do it right and in a period of time with a process they like

Yeah that's my understanding of what it's supposed to be like and that's cool & good in my book.
If they reject me because I can't code a quicksort on moment's notice and provide time & memory complexities, then I probably was not qualified for the position or they are expecting someone who is not me.

# ? Feb 26, 2018 02:22

KoRMaK: Jul 31, 2012

Pollyanna posted:

whiteboarding is bullshit and useless tbqh

yea but like, I'm trying to only take up 2 hours of your time. Whiteboarding seems like the most efficient way. I also want to interact with you cuz like, you're going to be interacting with me and the team multiple times a day, as a human being and a co-worker

Whats a better way? Honestly open to it because I'm new to this

# ? Feb 26, 2018 02:22

TimWinter: Mar 30, 2015; https://timsthebomb.com

Hey Penisface, what languages can you write in? If I know any of them PM me and we can do a mock interview if you'd like.

HR needs to CYA pretty hard, you want interviewees to walk away thinking A) if the company says yes tomorrow or in six months, it would be a good offer to take and B) any of my friends thinking of applying for a job at the company should do so, especially the good ones.

That means you can't burn bridges with blunt or curt feedback. Not with me though, mother fucker!

# ? Feb 26, 2018 02:24

Pollyanna: Mar 5, 2005; Milk's on them.

KoRMaK posted:

yea but like, I'm trying to only take up 2 hours of your time. Whiteboarding seems like the most efficient way. I also want to interact with you cuz like, you're going to be interacting with me and the team multiple times a day, as a human being and a co-worker

Whats a better way? Honestly open to it because I'm new to this

whiteboarding is efficient for learning how someone thinks and works, and how they communicate, but it's not a test, the idea isnt to get the correct answer and if the person cant come to the "right answer" by the end of the time that should not be a knock against them

Penisface posted:

Yeah that's my understanding of what it's supposed to be like and that's cool & good in my book.
If they reject me because I can't code a quicksort on moment's notice and provide time & memory complexities, then I probably was not qualified for the position or they are expecting someone who is not me.

this x 100, i have used the exact words "expecting someone who is not me" in this regard many times before and if interviewers/hiring managers are so exacting about this poo poo they wont find anyone to hire

# ? Feb 26, 2018 02:28

Pollyanna: Mar 5, 2005; Milk's on them.

interviewers for whiteboarding sessions should have to solve the problems they present in them before they can give them

interview your current employees and if they cant pass your interview process then your interview process sucks

# ? Feb 26, 2018 02:29

Pollyanna: Mar 5, 2005; Milk's on them.

TimWinter posted:

Hey Penisface, what languages can you write in? If I know any of them PM me and we can do a mock interview if you'd like.

HR needs to CYA pretty hard, you want interviewees to walk away thinking A) if the company says yes tomorrow or in six months, it would be a good offer to take and B) any of my friends thinking of applying for a job at the company should do so, especially the good ones.

That means you can't burn bridges with blunt or curt feedback. Not with me though, mother fucker!

yeah i dont trust companies based on their feedback, especially because theyre so reluctant to give any cuz theyre afraid of being (sometimes rightfully) sued for discrimination/poor hiring practices

# ? Feb 26, 2018 02:30

KoRMaK: Jul 31, 2012

Pollyanna posted:

interviewers for whiteboarding sessions should have to solve the problems they present in them before they can give them

interview your current employees and if they cant pass your interview process then your interview process sucks

I did this, my team could.

My questions were pretty general, recursive find and fizzbuzz. If you can't figure your way through those (or haven't done anything similar before) then your development skills are below what we are looking for. They are pretty easy problems to solve, especially in psudeo-code.

# ? Feb 26, 2018 02:34

Pollyanna: Mar 5, 2005; Milk's on them.

KoRMaK posted:

I did this, my team could.

My questions were pretty general, recursive find and fizzbuzz. If you can't figure your way through those (or haven't done anything similar before) then your development skills are below what we are looking for. They are pretty easy problems to solve, especially in psudeo-code.

fair nuff for fizzbuzz and recursive poo poo, it makes sense in those cases. i guess im talking more about more generalized questions like, "heres this data and functionality we want to see, design a database schema and explain why"

# ? Feb 26, 2018 02:36

PokeJoe: Aug 24, 2004; hail cgatan

that seems like a reasonable question if you claim to have database experience on your resume

# ? Feb 26, 2018 02:41

Pollyanna: Mar 5, 2005; Milk's on them.

PokeJoe posted:

that seems like a reasonable question if you claim to have database experience on your resume

this is why i am considering taking it off and tbqh i am way way more useless than my resume suggests, same with chef and docker

my resume is basically a list of "stuff ive had to do" rather than "stuff im good at"

# ? Feb 26, 2018 02:42

Pollyanna: Mar 5, 2005; Milk's on them.

im gonna rework my resume soon to be more realistic and id love some feedback on it

# ? Feb 26, 2018 02:43

PokeJoe: Aug 24, 2004; hail cgatan

you can always create separate sections like "experienced with" and "familiar with" or something if your resume is sparse otherwise

# ? Feb 26, 2018 02:44

Pollyanna: Mar 5, 2005; Milk's on them.

PokeJoe posted:

you can always create separate sections like "experienced with" and "familiar with" or something if your resume is sparse otherwise

probably a good idea

# ? Feb 26, 2018 02:46

Pollyanna: Mar 5, 2005; Milk's on them.

ngl i kinda want to simply take that offer that i got recently because i just want this anxiety over job hunting to be over with and i dont think i can take any more rejection

# ? Feb 26, 2018 02:47

PokeJoe: Aug 24, 2004; hail cgatan

uh aren't you unemployed? definitely take that job if you don't have anything else

# ? Feb 26, 2018 02:49

Pollyanna: Mar 5, 2005; Milk's on them.

PokeJoe posted:

uh aren't you unemployed? definitely take that job if you don't have anything else

im not 100% sure its a good fit tho, its all startup-y and i would prefer a larger, more stable company

then again i dont know what im talking about so maybe its my best bet. any advice? is it best to take it?

# ? Feb 26, 2018 02:52

PokeJoe: Aug 24, 2004; hail cgatan

you can always keep looking for a different job if you take it. the difference is that you'll have a paycheck and be able to prove that you are currently employable. do you have any interviews lined up for this larger, more hypothetical company? i don't know your exact situation but if you've been searching for a while with no luck, you'll have better luck searching while employed.

# ? Feb 26, 2018 02:59

Pollyanna: Mar 5, 2005; Milk's on them.

PokeJoe posted:

you can always keep looking for a different job if you take it. the difference is that you'll have a paycheck and be able to prove that you are currently employable. do you have any interviews lined up for this larger, more hypothetical company? i don't know your exact situation but if you've been searching for a while with no luck, you'll have better luck searching while employed.

ive got a couple technical whiteboarding/online sessions with two other larger companies scheduled, and im really interested in them - i dont want to commit to anything yet without seeing if i am a good fit for either or both of those two

# ? Feb 26, 2018 03:04

Pollyanna: Mar 5, 2005; Milk's on them.

like is that out of line or something

# ? Feb 26, 2018 03:46

Achmed Jones: Oct 16, 2004

Pollyanna take the job. go ahead and still interview with the other companies. if you get a better offer, bail on the job you took. it�s not ideal but it�s also not a big deal.

take the job, stop freaking out about every aspect of every interaction you have, and keep on keepin on

it�s really simple. you need a job. you have an offer. don�t shoot yourself in the foot.

# ? Feb 26, 2018 06:00

Symbolic Butt: Mar 22, 2009; (_!_); Buglord

Achmed Jones posted:

stop freaking out about every aspect of every interaction you have, and keep on keepin on

I sympathize with Pollyanna, this is really hard

# ? Feb 26, 2018 06:09

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# ? Apr 27, 2024 05:27

qhat: Jul 6, 2015

I can advise that loving a company out of your labour to take a significantly better position elsewhere is a perfectly acceptable route to six figure lifestyle.

# ? Feb 26, 2018 07:20

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