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Snowman_McK posted:Even Muslims... i've quit responding to you because you are stirring poo poo for argument sake. im waiting for you say something that isn't snark or hyperbole.
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Mar 4, 2018 03:59
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temple posted:i've quit responding to you because you are stirring poo poo for argument sake. im waiting for you say something that isn't snark or hyperbole. Dude, you said 'even muslims have divisions' which is true, but also obvious from even a cursory glance at the history of Islam dating right back to 632AD. Like, is the idea of Muslims not being a monolithic, homogenous mass controversial in your head? What in history, both recent and less recent, has given this impression?
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Mar 4, 2018 04:04
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Snowman_McK posted:gently caress, I want to rewatch Elysium now. If you poke around, there's a bunch of amazing concept art for it, really worth looking at. I bet in a few years there's going to be a marvel cinematic universe film where the Fantastic Four assemble to battle Doctor Doom and his fiendish plot to take over the world by providing everyone with universal healthcare. Tragically, that will mean denying one poor American boy a hovering wheelchair. He'll be defeated with the help of a plucky Pharma CEO and the five will open an urgent care clinic in Latveria that has like super stretchy bandaids or something. E: Disney please hire me I have a million of these and assuredly I hold absolutely no principles Sinding Johansson fucked around with this message at 05:36 on Mar 4, 2018 |
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Mar 4, 2018 05:34
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Snowman_McK posted:Dude, you said 'even muslims have divisions' which is true, but also obvious from even a cursory glance at the history of Islam dating right back to 632AD. Pretty much the mainstream American conservative view of Muslims?
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Mar 4, 2018 07:09
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Much as i'd love to see the thread tear itself apart over who is or is not an islamaphobe I thought id throw an interesting perspective on the film to be looked at/savaged by this thread. https://lareviewofbooks.org/article/quasi-duo-fantasias-straussian-reading-black-panther/
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Mar 4, 2018 07:37
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Sinding Johansson posted:I bet in a few years there's going to be a marvel cinematic universe film where the Fantastic Four assemble to battle Doctor Doom and his fiendish plot to take over the world by providing everyone with universal healthcare. Tragically, that will mean denying one poor American boy a hovering wheelchair. He'll be defeated with the help of a plucky Pharma CEO and the five will open an urgent care clinic in Latveria that has like super stretchy bandaids or something. "MUHAHAHAHA, I will heal all your poor people for very little/no charge!" "This guy is diabolical"
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Mar 4, 2018 08:25
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AnEdgelord posted:Much as i'd love to see the thread tear itself apart over who is or is not an islamaphobe I thought id throw an interesting perspective on the film to be looked at/savaged by this thread.
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Mar 4, 2018 09:21
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temple posted:zizek is garbage Yeah, not a very hot take when it's the same reading that the production team is giving in official statements. (Erik is the hero, T'Challa is the villain, vibranium-spoon, etc)
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Mar 4, 2018 09:32
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Snowman_McK posted:Weird that you typed this about a film where a revolutionary black leader is stabbed in the heart. By his cousin. I mean the film starts and ends with the king of Wakanda killing a pretender who thinks more needs to be done to intervene in the world's injustices. BP wanted to save him. Killmonger choose his death.
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Mar 4, 2018 09:33
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Zizek is real, and strong, and he's my friend. That article is both correct and totally pedestrian. Oh well, a man's got to make a living.
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Mar 4, 2018 09:35
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XboxPants posted:Yeah, not a very hot take when it's the same reading that the production team is giving in official statements. (Erik is the hero, T'Challa is the villain, vibranium-spoon, etc) Clearly his mistake was pointing out that Black Panther is a film that doesn't threaten white people. BravestOfTheLamps fucked around with this message at 10:01 on Mar 4, 2018 |
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Mar 4, 2018 09:57
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This dumb loving movie is going to be the most politically divisive movies of the year. The Infantilizing of society is real.
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Mar 4, 2018 10:21
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Snowman_McK posted:They invoked the problems themselves, then avoided them for most of the movie. The product of a very real world problem is a villain, and the film is structured in a way that never treats him any different. The possibility of speaking to Erik is never entertained, nor is the possibility of redeeming him. T'Challa's mother tries to silences him. How would you structure the film to treat Erik differently? The movie ends with a chance to redeem himself, and Erik makes his choice with regards to bondage. T'Challa's mum tries to silence him because she thinks he's an outsider, again speaking to the theme of isolationism.
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Mar 4, 2018 11:57
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Yaws posted:This dumb loving movie is going to be the most politically divisive movies of the year. The Infantilizing of society is real. *I haven't checked that thread in a while but I'm 100% loving certain that y'all managed to find a way to argue about politics in there; like don't even play.
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Mar 4, 2018 12:42
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BrianWilly posted:It's going to be as "politically divisive" as something like Wonder Woman or The Last Jedi*. Y'all need to stop projecting the microcosm of the internet -- and then specifically this one single subforum -- onto the real world. The amount of people coming away from this film arguing that it should've done more to promote the violent destruction of hegemonic capitalism is going to be completely negligible. Yeah, as Zizek points out, basically everyone from liberals to alt-righters likes it.
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Mar 4, 2018 13:23
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How well-known was Black Panther outside of comics fandom before this movie? I always thought of Black Panther as a C-list hero. He never had a movie or cartoon show, just some guest appearances on the Avengers cartoons. I don't think anyone outside of the fandom knew who he was. He was, I think, on par with Doctor Strange, which is why I expected this movie to make under $700 million.
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Mar 4, 2018 15:10
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Kurzon posted:How well-known was Black Panther outside of comics fandom before this movie? I always thought of Black Panther as a C-list hero. He never had a movie or cartoon show, just some guest appearances on the Avengers cartoons. I don't think anyone outside of the fandom knew who he was. He was, I think, on par with Doctor Strange, which is why I expected this movie to make under $700 million. This exact same argument could be made for Iron Man before 2008.
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Mar 4, 2018 16:09
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They made a blockbuster out of Rocket Racoon. Marvel's brand is turning lead into mounds of gold
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Mar 4, 2018 16:12
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Kurzon posted:How well-known was Black Panther outside of comics fandom before this movie? I always thought of Black Panther as a C-list hero. He never had a movie or cartoon show, just some guest appearances on the Avengers cartoons. I don't think anyone outside of the fandom knew who he was. He was, I think, on par with Doctor Strange, which is why I expected this movie to make under $700 million. He had the BET animated show around 2010 that was directly adapted from Hudlin’s run, but hardly anyone remembers that, to be fair.
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Mar 4, 2018 16:50
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https://lareviewofbooks.org/article/quasi-duo-fantasias-straussian-reading-black-panther/#!quote:The strong ethical impact of Killmonger’s last words immediately ruin the idea that he is a simple villain. What then follows is a scene of extraordinary warmth: the dying Killmonger sits down at the edge of a mountain precipice observing the beautiful Wakanda sunset, and T’Challa, who has just defeated him, silently sits at his side. There is no hatred here, just two basically good men with a different political view sharing their last moments after the battle is over. It’s a scene unimaginable in a standard action movie that culminates in the vicious destruction of the enemy. These final moments alone cast doubt on the film’s obvious reading and solicit us to deeper reflection. Zizek is a fan y'all
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Mar 4, 2018 18:44
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from the comments. quote:David Graeber's critique of superheroes, in Super Position: Superheroes are never allowed to actually change the world, to improve things, to do things. They just preserve the status quo from threats. The only ones who try to build and change are the villains. In superhero world, wanting to preserve this system is something born out of altruism, ethics, solidarity and so on; while the only reason why anyone would ever try to disrupt the system is due to sociopathy, violence, greed etc. So superhero stories are structurally conservative, more than thematically. gohmak fucked around with this message at 22:01 on Mar 5, 2018 |
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Mar 4, 2018 18:51
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people have pointed that out in comics. its makes the villains drive the stories and thus makes them interesting.
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Mar 4, 2018 18:59
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BrianWilly posted:It's going to be as "politically divisive" as something like Wonder Woman or The Last Jedi*. Y'all need to stop projecting the microcosm of the internet -- and then specifically this one single subforum -- onto the real world. The amount of people coming away from this film arguing that it should've done more to promote the violent destruction of hegemonic capitalism is going to be completely negligible. Star Wars has mostly incoherent politics and is a massive cultural phenomena, being beloved by people from all over the political spectrum. It’s an interesting movie series to talk about re: politics so of course it came up.
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Mar 4, 2018 19:13
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i am the bird posted:Star Wars has mostly incoherent politics and is a massive cultural phenomena, being beloved by people from all over the political spectrum. It’s an interesting movie series to talk about re: politics so of course it came up. Well the prequels I think retroactively make the original trilogy politically coherent which is why nerdists (ideological nerds) hate them so much
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Mar 4, 2018 19:18
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One of my favorite tropes (is it a trope?) is where after the good guy beats the bad guy, they both have a powered down heartfelt talk in some lonely, wide-open area, but something about the way Black Panther did it was lame
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Mar 4, 2018 21:07
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Jeb! Repetition posted:One of my favorite tropes (is it a trope?) is where after the good guy beats the bad guy, they both have a powered down heartfelt talk in some lonely, wide-open area, but something about the way Black Panther did it was lame Having the villain kill themselves was a downer that undermined a lot of it for me.
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Mar 4, 2018 21:19
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I Love Loosies posted:BP wanted to save him. Killmonger choose his death. He chose to succumb to a wound BP inflicted on him. An unambiguously mortal wound. The possiblity of saving, redeeming or convincing him was never entertained until after he'd been defeated. He wasn't interested in saving him. Seedge posted:How would you structure the film to treat Erik differently? The movie ends with a chance to redeem himself, and Erik makes his choice with regards to bondage. T'Challa's mum tries to silence him because she thinks he's an outsider, again speaking to the theme of isolationism. Have any attempt to do anything other than stop/kill him before he's stabbed in the heart. Also, that's a generous reading of the mother's actions. I'm pretty sure she suspects his lineage as much as T'Challa does. Jeb! Repetition posted:One of my favorite tropes (is it a trope?) is where after the good guy beats the bad guy, they both have a powered down heartfelt talk in some lonely, wide-open area, but something about the way Black Panther did it was lame In this case it smacked of 'now that I have asserted my dominance in a violent fashion, there is no longer hate between us...you know, since I won.' That magnaminity didn't show up in any earlier scene. TheKingofSprings posted:Having the villain kill themselves was a downer that undermined a lot of it for me. The villain allowed himself to succumb to a wound the hero inflicted on him. Don't shift blame. BravestOfTheLamps posted:Yeah, as Zizek points out, basically everyone from liberals to alt-righters likes it. That only leaves 'everyone to the left of American liberals'
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Mar 4, 2018 22:19
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Killmonger was party to a Panther-involved stabbing
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Mar 4, 2018 22:37
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Kurzon posted:How well-known was Black Panther outside of comics fandom before this movie? I always thought of Black Panther as a C-list hero. He never had a movie or cartoon show, just some guest appearances on the Avengers cartoons. I don't think anyone outside of the fandom knew who he was. He was, I think, on par with Doctor Strange, which is why I expected this movie to make under $700 million. I'd say he was well bellow Strange in the comics, since Strange often showed up in Avengers/F4 comics. Just hit $501 million domestic, $897 million total http://www.boxofficemojo.com/news/?id=4376&p=.htm quote:It was yet another monster weekend for Disney and Marvel's Black Panther as the superhero feature became the third fastest film to ever reach $500 million domestic. Meanwhile, the weekend's new wide releases came up just a bit short of Mojo's pre-weekend forecast with Fox's Red Sparrow taking runner-up position behind Black Panther and MGM's Death Wish landing in third. It's also Oscar Sunday, which means we'll end this recap with a brief look at this some of year's nominees and how they stack up at the box office.
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Mar 5, 2018 01:19
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got back from my 3rd viewing. a point that gets missed is that t'challa saw killmonger as being a colonist. and t'challa wanted to end things with killmonger but his hand was forced. the rest of the tribes dropped their weapons but killmonger won't. t'challa was sympathetic but killmonger wanted domination then and there. its a tragedy but its warning to revolutionaries that turn on their own to expedite their goals.
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Mar 5, 2018 03:33
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temple posted:got back from my 3rd viewing. a point that gets missed is that t'challa saw killmonger as being a colonist. and t'challa wanted to end things with killmonger but his hand was forced. the rest of the tribes dropped their weapons but killmonger won't. t'challa was sympathetic but killmonger wanted domination then and there. its a tragedy but its warning to revolutionaries that turn on their own to expedite their goals. Killmonger keeps fighting down in the tunnel/hanger, the tribes drop their weapons on the surface. Neither saw the other.
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Mar 5, 2018 03:39
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temple posted:got back from my 3rd viewing. a point that gets missed is that t'challa saw killmonger as being a colonist. and t'challa wanted to end things with killmonger but his hand was forced. the rest of the tribes dropped their weapons but killmonger won't. t'challa was sympathetic but killmonger wanted domination then and there. its a tragedy but its warning to revolutionaries that turn on their own to expedite their goals. I'm glad to see that people will still only talk about Killmonger so that they can implicitly justify T'Challa being the hero. The movie doesn't warn, or threaten, the powers that be. BravestOfTheLamps fucked around with this message at 07:14 on Mar 5, 2018 |
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Mar 5, 2018 07:12
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BravestOfTheLamps posted:I'm glad to see that people will still only talk about Killmonger so that they can implicitly justify T'Challa being the hero. aka why hasn't wakanda solved racism?! temple fucked around with this message at 13:56 on Mar 5, 2018 |
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Mar 5, 2018 13:37
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temple posted:aka why hasn't wakanda solved racism?! That's easy: Wakanda is a xenophobic state that is developing into a pro-establishment state under T'Challa. I'm not criticizing the film for what it isn't, but for what it is: a reactionary superhero film in the line of Dark Knight Rises.
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Mar 5, 2018 16:55
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BravestOfTheLamps posted:That's easy: Wakanda is a xenophobic state that is developing into a pro-establishment state under T'Challa. an cia agent attempted to overthrow a sovereign african state, export their resources, and dominate the world. wakanda is not the enemy here.
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Mar 5, 2018 17:08
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Barry Convex posted:He had the BET animated show around 2010 that was directly adapted from Hudlin’s run, but hardly anyone remembers that, to be fair. They're gradually adding all of the episodes from that show for free watching online, too. https://www.bet.com/video/betexclusive/2018/marvel-black-panther-animated/episode-101-black-panther-vs-captain-america.html EDIT: IIRC Koala's March shared that in TGRS and I bookmarked it to watch later.
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Mar 5, 2018 17:19
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temple posted:an cia agent attempted to overthrow a sovereign african state, export their resources, and dominate the world. wakanda is not the enemy here. Killmonger taking power was done through Wakanda's own entirely legitimate channels.
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Mar 5, 2018 18:14
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The only way to stop a bad guy with CIA clearance is a good guy with CIA clearance.
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Mar 5, 2018 18:16
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Pretty sure it's slightly less than legitimate when you commit an act of treason to get the backing of the military which is how he gets in in the first place.
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Mar 5, 2018 18:24
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temple posted:an cia agent attempted to overthrow a sovereign african state, export their resources, and dominate the world. wakanda is not the enemy here. Trying to obscure the plot to the point of arguing that Killmonger is working for the benefit of the CIA is a bit silly. T'Challa is the one aligned with CIA's agenda of stopping third-world revolutionaries.
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Mar 5, 2018 18:29
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