Vermintide 2: Finding Dawri

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Video Games > Vermintide 2: Finding Dawri

Xaris: Jul 25, 2006; Lucky there's a family guy
Lucky there's a man who positively can do
All the things that make us
Laugh and cry

Coolguye posted:

monsters count, yes. i prefer temp health on kill because you will not be triggering as many crits as a pyro does - you are losing the increased crit chance on overcharge, after all.

the deceptive thing about the temp health in general is that since you are shunting 50% of your damage off into your overcharge, you typically have a fair bit of temp health hanging out if you're doing any substantial amount of murder. you can even vent aggressively and not bother it too much precisely because you are shunting even THAT damage over to your overcharge, which will bottom out really fast because you're venting.

also, the boss kill thing gets more helpful on champ/legend because of the 'clears wounds' portion of that skill. That basically means that it resets your downs, so if you're gray after being knocked around by a boss it'll not just make your temp health real it will clear your gray status too.

Yeah I just realized that about crits after the fact. If you arent going to care much about Crits, do you still want a Beam with Crit% and Heat Sink or are there better traits to aim for?

Thanks for the headsup on the boss thing, that soudns useful. I'm gunna give Unchained a shot when I get off work here later.

# ? Mar 20, 2018 17:40

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# ? Apr 27, 2024 08:07

AndyElusive: Jan 7, 2007

Does FatShark know about the Chaos Spawn bug where it endlessly holds onto you and never lets go? A random group I was running vet with yesterday had this happen to the sole surviving Saltz player until the rest of us all died on the ground. poo poo was hosed up but kind of funny.

# ? Mar 20, 2018 17:40

Ammanas: Jul 17, 2005; Voltes V: "Laser swooooooooord!"

AndyElusive posted:

Does FatShark know about the Chaos Spawn bug where it endlessly holds onto you and never lets go? A random group I was running vet with yesterday bumped into it and it did it to the sole surviving Saltz player until we all died. poo poo was hosed up but kind of funny.

Yeah it's in the patchnotes.

# ? Mar 20, 2018 17:41

Coolguye: Jul 6, 2011; Required by his programming!

AndyElusive posted:

Does FatShark know about the Chaos Spawn bug where it endlessly holds onto you and never lets go? A random group I was running vet with yesterday bumped into it and it did it to the sole surviving Saltz player until we all died. poo poo was hosed up but kind of funny.

that's the bug i presume they were referring to in the patch note:

quote:

Fixed an issue when the Chaos Spawn would get stuck while grabbing a player while all other players are knocked out or dead.

Xaris posted:

Yeah I just realized that about crits after the fact. If you arent going to care much about Crits, do you still want a Beam with Crit% and Heat Sink or are there better traits to aim for?

it's still nice because when it triggers you can continue nuking nerds so in the interest of not spending a ton of resources on one specific class i'd say just use your same ol' beam staff and reconsider what's ideal when you're at 300 gear score and 500 scrap kicking around doing nothing.

# ? Mar 20, 2018 17:43

AndyElusive: Jan 7, 2007

Derp. Guess I should learn to read.

# ? Mar 20, 2018 17:44

Night10194: Feb 13, 2012; We'll start,
like many good things,
with a bear.

I think the 1h mace/hammer heavy attack comes out faster than the 2h hammer overhead bonk.

# ? Mar 20, 2018 17:44

Xaris: Jul 25, 2006; Lucky there's a family guy
Lucky there's a man who positively can do
All the things that make us
Laugh and cry

Coolguye posted:

it's still nice because when it triggers you can continue nuking nerds so in the interest of not spending a ton of resources on one specific class i'd say just use your same ol' beam staff and reconsider what's ideal when you're at 300 gear score and 500 scrap kicking around doing nothing.

yeah sure that's fair, i was just curious if something like Thermal Equalizer might be something a little more desirable (or Hunter? idk if that one is trash or not). I'm still finding items around 180-ish so I have a way to go before 300 and will prolly find plenty of poo poo that changes it up

# ? Mar 20, 2018 17:47

Fuuka Ayase: Apr 25, 2017; Literally Hitler

Skypie posted:

Is the level 25 talent for healing under Prowl working now?

As of the previous patch: Hahahahahahahaha.

As of this patch: I'd have to try it but my guess is HAHAHAHAHA.

# ? Mar 20, 2018 17:52

Phlegmish: Jul 2, 2011

This sounds like a good-rear end patch, want to get home and play

# ? Mar 20, 2018 17:52

toasterwarrior: Nov 11, 2011

Oh goddammit, the color contrast bug is still there with Huntsman's active. Should've tempered my expectations; after all, patch log only said they fixed the FoV problem. Admittedly, I kinda thought that was the worse problem with it anyway, but the color bullshit is still annoying.

# ? Mar 20, 2018 17:59

Skypie: Sep 28, 2008

Fuuka Ayase posted:

As of the previous patch: Hahahahahahahaha.

As of this patch: I'd have to try it but my guess is HAHAHAHAHA.

This was my expectation as well so lol

# ? Mar 20, 2018 18:04

Helion: Apr 28, 2008

The day may yet come when I tire of Indiana Jonesing Chaos Warriors with Saltzpyre's F.

Today is not that day.

# ? Mar 20, 2018 18:06

Coolguye: Jul 6, 2011; Required by his programming!

Helion posted:

The day may yet come when I tire of Indiana Jonesing Chaos Warriors with Saltzpyre's F.

Today is not that day.

may it never come, friend o/

# ? Mar 20, 2018 18:07

Too Shy Guy: Jun 14, 2003; I have destroyed more of your kind than I can count.

Helion posted:

The day may yet come when I tire of Indiana Jonesing Chaos Warriors with Saltzpyre's F.

Today is not that day.

It somehow manages to be the most satisfying thing in a game full of extremely satisfying things. I get a perverse joy out of turning around for a second to see my idiot team bouncing off of a Chaos Warrior, blowing him away, and then turning back to whatever it was I was doing.

# ? Mar 20, 2018 18:15

Nehru the Damaja: May 20, 2005

Holy moly when do I get the drat blueprint for Axe & Shield? The game has seen fit to give me the same junk for 12 levels but no blueprint so I can just craft The Correct Dwarven Weapon.

# ? Mar 20, 2018 18:19

Real Cool Catfish: Jun 6, 2011

All the staffs are viable and fun, except the conflagration staff�s circle explosion seems anemic for the amount of heat it builds up.

Whereas lobbing a charged fireball from the fireball staff down a corridor of rats gets the job done, since it pierces through and kills the whole lot of them.

# ? Mar 20, 2018 18:22

AndyElusive: Jan 7, 2007

I wonder if they'll nail the bug where your mouse curser shows up on screen while you're in a mission.

Usually pressing escape to bring up the menu and then exiting it quickly gets rid of that one though so it's a real minor issue.

# ? Mar 20, 2018 18:26

Coolguye: Jul 6, 2011; Required by his programming!

when escape doesn't work, tab does

# ? Mar 20, 2018 18:28

Ra Ra Rasputin: Apr 2, 2011

Beam staff feels even better this patch then before, especially if you didn't like recasting the beam over and over until it rolled crit, heatsink will keep you cooled off just fine if your firing into a horde but it won't be too noticeable against a single enemy.

I'm finding the 2% career resource on crit to be a strong option on beam staff right now over heatsink, let's me fire off pyro ult every 5 seconds, just have to aim it a bit into the sky so it doesn't go into the back of a teammates head.

For sienna's staff options, I'd rank them from strongest to weakest as:
Beam staff >> Bolt staff >>>>> Fireball staff >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> conflag and flamestorm

# ? Mar 20, 2018 18:31

Taffer: Oct 15, 2010

Nehru the Damaja posted:

Holy moly when do I get the drat blueprint for Axe & Shield? The game has seen fit to give me the same junk for 12 levels but no blueprint so I can just craft The Correct Dwarven Weapon.

11 or 12, I just got it last night. I forget which it was cause I blitzed through a few.

# ? Mar 20, 2018 18:33

Coolguye: Jul 6, 2011; Required by his programming!

Ra Ra Rasputin posted:

I'm finding the 2% career resource on crit to be a strong option on beam staff right now over heatsink, let's me fire off pyro ult every 5 seconds, just have to aim it a bit into the sky so it doesn't go into the back of a teammates head.

just fwiw this works fine for the initial flight but the ricochets after that are still just as likely to incinerate a teammate as ever

# ? Mar 20, 2018 18:34

Helion: Apr 28, 2008

I think one of the secrets of this little subgenre, whatever you want to call it, is that quite a lot of fun happens as the emergent consequence of sub optimal play.

# ? Mar 20, 2018 18:36

Propaganda Hour: Aug 25, 2008; after editing wikipedia as a joke for 16 years, i ve convinced myself that homer simpson's japanese name translates to the "The beer goblin"

Oddly enough the patchnote I'm most excited for is the missing Subtitle fixes.

I hope Fatshark eventually add a hearing impaired event subtitle system like Left 4 Dead does.

# ? Mar 20, 2018 18:41

toasterwarrior: Nov 11, 2011

Propaganda Hour posted:

Oddly enough the patchnote I'm most excited for is the missing Subtitle fixes.

I hope Fatshark eventually add a hearing impaired event subtitle system like Left 4 Dead does.

Man, that poo poo was useful for everyone. A subtitle popping up can still draw attention to itself in the middle of some ongoing crisis, which can be very useful when the subtitle is something like "OH poo poo HOOKRATS"

# ? Mar 20, 2018 18:45

Coolguye: Jul 6, 2011; Required by his programming!

my joke answer is that if that happens, i'll lose the only thing i'm undisputably godlike at in game (hearing ambushes starting and yelling them out in time for people to circle the wagons - for whatever reason the quiet chittering doesn't register to most people)

my real answer is that that'd be awesome but one of fatshark's biggest ongoing problems is subtitling and localization so i'd be very surprised if they ever managed to get all of that working in a sane way.

# ? Mar 20, 2018 18:49

Owl Inspector: Sep 14, 2011

Kanos posted:

This argument is really tiresome every time it crops up. There's a whole bunch of reasons why you can't go "who gives a poo poo about balance, it's co-op lol". Here's a few off the top of my head:

In a co-op environment it feels good when everyone contributes relatively equally to a win and it feels bad when you're kind of trailing along not doing much while the overpowered characters do all the work and you're largely redundant. I've been leveling my elf in champion as waystalker and every time I get paired with a Sienna I feel really bad for whoever the hell our party members are because they're not going to get to really fight anything short of a boss or a finale because we're going to mow down any hordes at range and F any specials between the two of us. We'll win the map, but they're not really playing the game.
It means that the playerbase as a whole begins to form a "meta" where certain classes are desirable and certain classes are regarded as garbage, and if you happen to like the playstyle or aesthetic of one of the "garbage" classes you're going to run into a huge amount of whining and bitching and even being kicked if you ever happen to want to play a quick round because you're playing "suboptimally".
This is the most important one. Poor balance has really bad knock-on problems for the game as a whole. The idea is that the game is meant to be challenging to the players. If certain classes/abilities/weapons are heavy outliers in power and warp the way players approach the game in some way, that challenge begins to break down. As an example, let's take the fact that it's currently trivially easy to generate shitloads of temporary health. This means that the power of attrition as a way to kill the party is heavily diminished, meaning that to ensure that the party is seriously threatened the AI director has to be tuned in a much swingier manner, which leads to "bullshit" stuff like the game spawning 3 disabler specials and a stormvermin patrol during a boss. This also applies to poor class balance. Do you tune the game's difficulty around somebody running Foot Knight/Ironbreaker/Pyromancer/Bounty Hunter? That would make it extremely difficult for a party running Mercenary/Ranger/Battle Wizard/Witch Hunter Captain because they don't have anything approaching the power of the first party. But if you tune it for the second party, then the first party gets to breeze through with little effort thanks to their immensely powerful abilities and passives. Attempting to maintain a rough parity of balance means that the game's difficulty curve can be controlled and smoothed much better for a better experience for everyone involved.

Balance absolutely matters in non-competitive games.

Quoting this so I can find this whenever it�s inevitably brought up again, and adding that poor balance tends to destroy variety and lead to a homogenized experience in any game with enough difficulty to pressure you into it

there�s no clearer example of this than the way each of the wizard�s staffs became the weapon you would see in every single map as it became the most overpowered thing in the game across balance patches�first beam, then bolt, then fireball. It was extremely dull seeing that bolt staff in every single game autoaiming the entire map to death by the time it got nerfed. Once fatshark finally got staffs under control, you�d see pretty much every staff used equally because there was actually a reason to use all of them and the game really benefited from it

# ? Mar 20, 2018 18:53

Owl Inspector: Sep 14, 2011

The subtitles feel like they were based on a really early script and then never updated. Less than half of them match the line word for word, most of them sort of just relate it in spirit, and some of them aren�t even in the same zip code

They should totally keep the bug where characters speak in other characters� voices though

# ? Mar 20, 2018 19:02

Nehru the Damaja: May 20, 2005

Taffer posted:

11 or 12, I just got it last night. I forget which it was cause I blitzed through a few.

That can't be true because I just hit 12 and still have no pattern for it.

Either that or the blacksmith patterns aren't given out in a fixed order.

# ? Mar 20, 2018 19:05

Cowcaster: Aug 7, 2002

Nehru the Damaja posted:

That can't be true because I just hit 12 and still have no pattern for it.

Either that or the blacksmith patterns aren't given out in a fixed order.

i could've sworn that the last blueprints for a character were given out at 12, along with unlocking the last career

# ? Mar 20, 2018 19:06

ChickenWing: Jul 22, 2010

It'd be neat if they changed beamstaff to escalate damage the longer it stays on target to give it its own sort of niche as a dedicated bosskiller, with the fireblast as a secondary panic button to give you time to swap over to melee.

# ? Mar 20, 2018 19:08

Nehru the Damaja: May 20, 2005

Cowcaster posted:

i could've sworn that the last blueprints for a character were given out at 12, along with unlocking the last career

I mean...

# ? Mar 20, 2018 19:11

DeathSandwich: Apr 24, 2008; I fucking hate puzzles.

Really W/R/T the wizard and heat management (or lack thereof when you get higher level) my thought is this:

-Change the trait that gives -4 overheat on crit to -50% heat generation for 4 seconds on crit.

-Change the "clear all heat on using active" talents to only remove half or 1/3rd heat.

Those two changes would give her ways to manage heat without completely trivializing it. The beam staff crit change goes a long way to bringing her back in line, but there's still more work to be done to get her balanced in my opinion. The bolt staff with -heat on crit still functionally has infinite ammo so long as you aren't missing targets in it's current state.

# ? Mar 20, 2018 19:18

Zephro: Nov 23, 2000; I suppose I could part with one and still be feared...

If I end up playing with friends who are late to the rat fighting party, is there any way for me to lower my hero power so that we can do recruit/vet together without my characters being overpowered for the difficulty? I'm guessing no, at least for the portion of HP that comes from levels, right? And presumably there's no way to deliberately craft low-level weapons?

# ? Mar 20, 2018 19:22

Too Shy Guy: Jun 14, 2003; I have destroyed more of your kind than I can count.

Come to think of it, I'm surprised they didn't cap Hero Power on the lower difficulties.

# ? Mar 20, 2018 19:24

Owl Inspector: Sep 14, 2011

Zephro posted:

If I end up playing with friends who are late to the rat fighting party, is there any way for me to lower my hero power so that we can do recruit/vet together without my characters being overpowered for the difficulty? I'm guessing no, at least for the portion of HP that comes from levels, right? And presumably there's no way to deliberately craft low-level weapons?

Equip your power level 5 templates, although on recruit if you�re level 20+ you�re going to be at the power cap anyway

# ? Mar 20, 2018 19:26

Zhulik: Nov 14, 2012; The Montreal Star

Too Shy Guy posted:

Come to think of it, I'm surprised they didn't cap Hero Power on the lower difficulties.

They did! I think it's 200/400 for recruit/veteran and no cap beyond that.

# ? Mar 20, 2018 19:26

atelier morgan: Mar 11, 2003; super-scientific, ultra-gay; Lipstick Apathy

Zephro posted:

If I end up playing with friends who are late to the rat fighting party, is there any way for me to lower my hero power so that we can do recruit/vet together without my characters being overpowered for the difficulty? I'm guessing no, at least for the portion of HP that comes from levels, right? And presumably there's no way to deliberately craft low-level weapons?

My solution to this has been playing a bad class with weird weapons and focus on support/keeping everyone alive

# ? Mar 20, 2018 19:28

Zephro: Nov 23, 2000; I suppose I could part with one and still be feared...

Ah cool, didn't realise there were caps on the difficulties. That'll help, I guess, thanks (and yeah, I'm gonna use the level 5 weapons)

# ? Mar 20, 2018 19:29

SuperKlaus: Oct 20, 2005; Fun Shoe

I was thinking what Shade needs is for her active to break all aggro and grant a damage buff for the duration rather than the current break-stealth-with-one-fat-strike model. This game is one where earth-shaking burst damage is not useful 95%+ of the time because it's a game of dealing with huge enemy counts and most special threats don't require eye-popping multipliers to go down. As stands her active is useless outside of boss fights and maaaaybe Chaos Warriors. If it gave her three or five seconds of ham time wherein she is invisible to enemies and reaping a more modest damage boost, it could still allow her to mulch bosses and Chaos Warriors but would no longer be borderline useless the rest of the time.

# ? Mar 20, 2018 19:33

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# ? Apr 27, 2024 08:07

Too Shy Guy: Jun 14, 2003; I have destroyed more of your kind than I can count.

Zhulik posted:

They did! I think it's 200/400 for recruit/veteran and no cap beyond that.

Oh, that's good to know. I'm still at the phase of the game where I forget to turn the difficulty down when I go to level a new character.

Does the keep open up as you progress through the game? I was loving around last night and figured out how to get on top of the little hut by the target dummies, which got me up above the forge and the water wheel. From there I made it up to the upper keep balcony and the outdoor toilets, but didn't see any way further up than that. Did I figure out how to get somewhere cool or are the blocked doorways going to open up anyway once I beat more missions?

# ? Mar 20, 2018 19:34

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