|
I feel I should advocate a bit more for the flail. It's very easy to get turned off by it cause of how clumsy it feels, but I've done far more than just hold ground with this thing. I've walked forward through the oncomming horde with this thing. It's a bit scary when it gets it's momentum going. I should note I was zealot at the time, but I did not expect it to happen even though I was purposefully pushing my limits further than I felt safe. I think being timid with it really holds it back if I learned anything at all about it. Beyond that, it makes shield enemies in to a funny joke the game likes to tell. Rothelms aren't really a big deal either. Not really. Even when I was getting jabbed mid swing, I was building up so much temp health in the same motions that I didn't find myself caring. Might be a "oh poo poo zealot what are you doing?!" weapon, but overlooking it would be a mistake.
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 01:57
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 28, 2024 19:57 |
|
|
I'm honestly just going to quit out of any future games where the elf has a swift bow equipped in the lobby
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 01:59
|
|
|
Ironbreaker is the perfect learning class because worst case scenario you can pop your ability, hold right click, and revive your entire team
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 02:44
|
|
|
I just wish the spear was available on another class. The speed, reach, dodge and block angle etc make it by far the most compelling weapon in the game for me. Shame it sucks against armour so much but that's probably a fair tradeoff.
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 02:52
|
|
|
Finally got myself to level 300 gear, and have started trying to craft a usable set of useful bounty hunter oranges. What trait to people generally like on the necklace? I am not going to do the health regen one. I was thinking either chance to not use a healing item, or percent extra healing. I got a nice set of passives on the reroll, which I plan to keep.  Also managed to make a volley crossbow I am pretty happy with. 
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 03:00
|
|
|
I always go with +30% healing. It also works with temp health generation.
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 03:30
|
|
|
Fuuka Ayase posted:I feel I should advocate a bit more for the flail. It's very easy to get turned off by it cause of how clumsy it feels, but I've done far more than just hold ground with this thing. I've walked forward through the oncomming horde with this thing. It's a bit scary when it gets it's momentum going. I should note I was zealot at the time, but I did not expect it to happen even though I was purposefully pushing my limits further than I felt safe. I think being timid with it really holds it back if I learned anything at all about it. Beyond that, it makes shield enemies in to a funny joke the game likes to tell. Rothelms aren't really a big deal either. Not really. Even when I was getting jabbed mid swing, I was building up so much temp health in the same motions that I didn't find myself caring. Flail has more style tho so thats super important Xaris fucked around with this message at 03:32 on Apr 23, 2018 |
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 03:30
|
|
|
Flail does really well engaging multiple armored targets with the charge attack, which the falchion can't really do.
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 03:34
|
|
|
Xaris posted:I've been playing a lot of Zealot lately, and yea flail is very good and almost tailored made for him and I don't think it feels clumsy at all. I don't think I'd use it on BH or WHC though. I keep flip-flopping between Flail and Falc every several rounds. They both have pretty much equal horde-slaying potential, in at least you can hold and never take damage with either just fine. I've found Falc works better vs Armored guys and like bosses/CW which makes spamming LMG viable and pairs well with Swift and his Charge buff. Flail does a little better at bashing in shield enemies but the can whiff vs armory stuff.Their push-stab is pretty much equal and I can't tell the difference in terms of effectiveness, and animations/combos are almost the same (swipe swipe bop vs swipe swipe bop bop) so it's the same combo to rock hordes. Big difference between the two is that Falchion Push > Sweep restarts your attack combo so you can Light > Light > Push/Sweep to wreck hordes without leaving an opening with the overhead animation, where Flail's push sweep counts towards combo progression so you come out with the double overhead instead. Cool for skipping directly to "gently caress this Stormvermin" but means you can't bypass your overheads vs hordes without block canceling. Zealot is tanky enough to not care about getting poked a few times while face diving a horde, but for other careers it can hurt.
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 03:44
|
|
|
Filthy Monkey posted:Finally got myself to level 300 gear, and have started trying to craft a usable set of useful bounty hunter oranges. 2 stam/20% health is hands down the best stats a necklace can have for any class, the orange trait is up to you.
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 04:23
|
|
|
Node posted:Doomguy Ranger Bardin is so much fun. I recommend everyone try it. Tried it. Its fun. Especially with a Pick. The pick is surprisingly good, nice wide quick attack swings seem to clear hordes.
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 06:53
|
|
|
For necklace, I ended up getting a bunch of red necklaces as my only red items, so they are all 2 stam/20% health, one with natural bond for the tanky classes like ironbreaker and unchained that never use up healing items anyway, one with 30% increased healing ever since I found out it worked on the level 20 talents for temp health and ults that give health like the pyromancer talent. I gave handmaiden a go and the extra 30% dodge distanced combined with the spears reach made for some hilarious kiting with a chaos spawn not being able to touch me at all.
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 07:14
|
|
|
The Flail has extremely good cleave on heavy attacks, so it consistently deals higher damage across multiple targets even if the charged attack actually just deals the same amount of damage on the first target as the light swing. This means that left-click spam works alright when the enemy is trickling in, but when the horde gets thick (models clipping into each other), you should probably start spamming that heavy attack to knock drat near all of them down and get confirmed kills to weather the damage through temp health. Don't forget that your heavies are also uninterruptible if you're using Zealot.
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 08:30
|
|
|
I still kind of love the rapier on Salty. Not even because it's particularly effective, just because I'm addicted to stabbing Stormvermin right in their goddamn eye. I just wish the snapshot wouldn't eat up blessed shot, but still would be effective enough to reliably kill a clanrat in a single shot.
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 08:57
|
|
|
TBF the Rapier synergizes with every single class he has: WHC's insta-kill crit headshots on Maulers and below working with the Rapier's attack speed and low damage, Hunter on your ranged weapon making the Rapier hit much harder as BH, and even more attack speed plus uninterruptible stab spam as Zealot. It's a drat good weapon, only really losing out to Falchion because the latter definitely feels a bit too multi-tool at the moment, if only because armored enemies are very common.
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 09:03
|
|
|
Double Monocle posted:Like.. how do i put this- I like his ability a lot. Especially on legend when we round the corner into a silent stormvermin patrol, you can crack it out and then murder almost the entire patrol with the shotgun, even the shield assholes since they’ll have their back to you. A few Bombs at least give more of a chance against chaos patrols.
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 09:56
|
|
|
Perestroika posted:I still kind of love the rapier on Salty. Not even because it's particularly effective, just because I'm addicted to stabbing Stormvermin right in their goddamn eye. I just wish the snapshot wouldn't eat up blessed shot, but still would be effective enough to reliably kill a clanrat in a single shot. I mean, rapier shot, despite triggering blessed shot, counts as a melee attack so killing something with it immediately resets blessed shot. Also I’ve got a bunch of bonus crit power so this may not be the case for everyone, but a blessed rapier shot for me currently does 6300 to a dummy head, whilst a double charged rapier attack only does 5500ish. Which doesn’t seem like it should be the case but is encouraging me to use the side pistol more!
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 10:01
|
|
|
I'd always been using halberd or 2h hammer for Kruber, but then I got this little beauty. For some reason the 1h sword just clicks for me. Once I figured out you didn't need to fully charge your power attacks, and that you can chain two power attacks into the overhead chop, it all started falling into place. 
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 11:59
|
|
|
Pseudophile posted:I'd always been using halberd or 2h hammer for Kruber, but then I got this little beauty. For some reason the 1h sword just clicks for me. I love the 1h sword on Krubs. The basic combos are Power -> Power -> Push, Swing -> Power -> Power. Always keep in mind that after 2 sweeps, if you make the third attack a normal, it's an overhead chop that's good for bigger dudes. 1h sword is one of the weapons that actually advances the combo as you mix up swings, which makes it pretty versatile.
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 15:08
|
|
|
My big decision about Kruber right now is Merc or Foot Knight. I feel like I got more done as Merc Kruber but I had swapped off the halberd when I made the switch so it could just be that nothing can compare to that weapon and class doesn't really matter. I am still only level 14 so haven't really considered long term build plans though, maybe that will have an impact.
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 15:47
|
|
|
I got an executioner's sword called 'The Unstoppable' and with the extra cleave on merc Kruber it just murders pretty much everyone...unstoppably, plus the guillotine noise on a headshot is pretty satisfying! It's a shame his ranged options are so poo poo compared to everyone else's, although I do enjoy the repeater. Seriously, the blunderbuss is like the grudgeraker, but much worse; the repeater is OK if ammo limited, the handgun is only good at one very niche thing; while Bardin gets the drakefire pistols which can do everything with unlimited ammo, Saltz gets the volley crossbow, the elf gets...all the bows...and sienna I don't need to mention. Rabelais D fucked around with this message at 15:57 on Apr 23, 2018 |
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 15:53
|
|
|
terrorist ambulance posted:I'm honestly just going to quit out of any future games where the elf has a swift bow equipped in the lobby I've been continually ending up in pugs where I, Foot Knight w/ Handgun (and 12 bullets), am picking off 3-4x the number of specials than the Waywatcher over the course of the map. But hey, swift-bowing into pinky waves gets the green circles... Redundant posted:My big decision about Kruber right now is Merc or Foot Knight. I bull-rushed a rat ogre into the river on Fort Brachsenbrücke and that kinda sealed the deal for me.
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 15:55
|
|
|
terrorist ambulance posted:I'm honestly just going to quit out of any future games where the elf has a swift bow equipped in the lobby. This is the correct reaction. Swift bow is garbage and I have yet to meet any elf that was using it prove me wrong
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 16:01
|
|
|
I tried to make Doomguy Bardin work but even with double crit items I cannot get Scrounger to activate more than once or twice a run. The same build with Kruber's blunderbuss gives me more ammo than I know what to do with, but the grudgeraker just refuses to crit as if it's actively trying to spite me.
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 16:07
|
|
|
terrorist ambulance posted:I'm honestly just going to quit out of any future games where the elf has a swift bow equipped in the lobby How do you tell bows apart?
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 16:43
|
|
|
Mystic Mongol posted:How do you tell bows apart? swiftbow has big curly-qs at the end of its stave, longbow does not, hagbane has a glowing arrowhead.
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 16:51
|
|
|
Perestroika posted:I still kind of love the rapier on Salty. Not even because it's particularly effective, just because I'm addicted to stabbing Stormvermin right in their goddamn eye. I just wish the snapshot wouldn't eat up blessed shot, but still would be effective enough to reliably kill a clanrat in a single shot. Rapier is either his best weapon, or his second best weapon depending on how you view it. It's one of the better weapons in the game, and is up there with Glaive/Halberd for sure.
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 16:53
|
|
|
Any elf is probably going to be shooting arrows constantly as they wait for the game to start.
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 16:53
|
|
|
Found my fourth red yesterday...and it's a loving hagbane. Maybe some day they'll buff it again. Foehammer posted:I've been continually ending up in pugs where I, Foot Knight w/ Handgun (and 12 bullets), am picking off 3-4x the number of specials than the Waywatcher over the course of the map. But hey, swift-bowing into pinky waves gets the green circles... Same, but honestly, the handgun is just a good special killer, better than longbow. Though you're right about some pubbies not being on the ball at all. I'm always surprised that a lot of them seem to have an encyclopedic knowledge of the location of every book while simultaneously lacking any sort of situational/environmental awareness. Phlegmish fucked around with this message at 16:59 on Apr 23, 2018 |
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 16:55
|
|
|
When I started playing on recruit when the game came out I ran into a weird number of level 1 pubbies who had apparently already looked up and memorized the location of every book in the game before even starting, but had failed to pick up on the “how to play” bit while they were doing that important research some of them were loving windmill grimmers even
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 16:58
|
|
|
Rainuwastaken posted:I tried to make Doomguy Bardin work but even with double crit items I cannot get Scrounger to activate more than once or twice a run. The same build with Kruber's blunderbuss gives me more ammo than I know what to do with, but the grudgeraker just refuses to crit as if it's actively trying to spite me.  fashion), so it's at a default like 1 in 20 hits to proc. Which is ok because you can buttstroke a horde for 20 hits killing them and when it does crit it'll fill your ammo from 0 to 12.
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 17:07
|
|
|
I only discovered this weekend (by doing it reflexively, of course) that right-clicking while carrying a barrel lets you punch enemies out of the way. Made that last bit of Empire in Flames a lot more fun when I can linebacker shove chaos chumps while running through the cellar and across the square.
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 17:12
|
|
|
Phlegmish posted:Found my fourth red yesterday...and it's a loving hagbane. Maybe some day they'll buff it again. I know it's not the murderbow it used to be but it still has its uses as a really solid ranged CC option for the elf. On Champ+ it's basically a handicap for yourself to see if you can CC from range and not murder your pals 
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 17:26
|
|
|
Coolguye posted:swiftbow has big curly-qs at the end of its stave, longbow does not, hagbane has a glowing arrowhead. It bothers me that the Red Shortbow skin from V1 is one of the variety of Longbow skins now.
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 17:47
|
|
|
Fishstick posted:This is the correct reaction. Swift bow is garbage and I have yet to meet any elf that was using it prove me wrong What's the beef with it, specifically? I understand lack of zoom is pretty much a dealbreaker for Handmaiden and Shade, but for Waywatcher? That class has adjustable zoom levels for all the bows and virtually no ranged falloff. Unless you're consistently headshotting bosses, the tradeoffs that the Swiftbow offers seem quite reasonable.
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 17:52
|
|
|
Real Cool Catfish posted:I mean, rapier shot, despite triggering blessed shot, counts as a melee attack so killing something with it immediately resets blessed shot. Also I’ve got a bunch of bonus crit power so this may not be the case for everyone, but a blessed rapier shot for me currently does 6300 to a dummy head, whilst a double charged rapier attack only does 5500ish. Which doesn’t seem like it should be the case but is encouraging me to use the side pistol more! Yeah the rapier's synergy with BH is incredible. You should be able to easily pop a lethal cap into a Nurgle Raider at close-to-close-ish range and capping Clanrats or Fanatics is cake. You lose absolutely nothing because your Shots CD resets and you get the gameplay benefit of a fast kill at some distance and the deep satisfaction of Indiana Jonesin' some sucker with that sweet sound design and visuals. I will never stop using Rapier as BH so long as this interaction exists. Plus, though I haven't tested this myself, it is still a crit delivered by your "melee weapon," is it not? It consumes Shots to gain a crit, but it's "melee," which is why it resets Shots on kill. Thus it also activates Swift Slaying, yes? So I'm going to make a BH who doesn't take Crit Chance on any of his gear. Shots gives me all the critting I need at range. Shots abuse with Rapier sidearm will keep my Swift Slaying flowing for melee. And I can devote a couple more gear slots to other power-ups this way! Rabelais D posted:I got an executioner's sword called 'The Unstoppable' and with the extra cleave on merc Kruber it just murders pretty much everyone...unstoppably, plus the guillotine noise on a headshot is pretty satisfying! It's a shame his ranged options are so poo poo compared to everyone else's, although I do enjoy the repeater. Yeah I love Anime Buster Sword Merc Kruber too! Paced Strikes alleviates the slow swing problem, as does massive Crit Chance from talenting and being Merc combined with Swift Slaying. Bonus cleave from being Merc is great, as you say. And you get to then apply your superhuman Crit Chance to some truly fat crit modifiers (x2.6, x2.2, x2 on first three targets in light sweeps, x2.4 on heavies). That whole package blends hordes as well as Halberd IMO - without having to bother with block-cancel tomfoolery - and then your heavy strike rips up Stormvermin, Chaos Warriors, and Bosses (heavy strike damage profile = Glaive second strike). I personally prefer +15% Power during Paced Strikes to really take it up a level, as that passes a breakpoint such that all 600 HP hits in a sweep kill a Champion Slaverat, and +3% Power per Adjacent Enemy just to pile on. I wouldn't Executioner Sword as the other Krubers but it meshes so well with what Merc has to offer. Speaking of the repeater, though, when Kruber is not kosplaying as Guts, he's fun as Kommando Kruber. This is Huntsman with Repeater Handgun, an off-meta choice. If you take both +5% Crit Chance options from gear, your Crit Chance is 20% (Huntsman aura is 5%...right?). Then Scrounger, naturally. You have 48 shots x 2 shots per crit x .2 Crit Chance = 19.2 more shots, and then those shots give 7.68 more shots on average, and those give 3, and basically the end result here is nearly 4 more 8-shot magazines for your use, which goes a long way towards keeping you sustained. This presumes all shots hit, but also does not account for penetration allowing a shot to yield more crits. Also doesn't account for whenever you land a headshot and get Huntsman refunds. I've tried this and it does work out about like the math would suggest. I don't have unlimited ammo by any means but I can sustain myself firing on hordes and specials between finding pickups. What you gain is, first and most important, the lizard-brain pleasure of early-modern-machine-gunning your enemies. Second, it seems genuinely strong at spraying into hordes, where penetration gets more rolls for Scrounger and the odd lucky headshot refund. I have also found it perfectly satisfactory against bosses, as you can dump two full magazines during a Prowl without needing the fast reload talent or Attack Speed. It suffers at special sniping versus a longbow or handgun because it seems to need to click most things twice but I personally accept that tradeoff and acknowledge this is an "off-meta choice" for a reason. If you're good at headshots (I'm not) that levels the playing field a ton, besides giving you ammo sustain. Anyone looking for an exciting new way to kill with ol' Kruber on not-Legend difficulty ought to give the repeater a spin (see what I did there?). Math suggests that due to the 25% Crit Chance achievable on Merc he too could have a good time with Scrounger on a repeater, but I think it's much better suited for Huntsman due to the extra magazines to start and synergies with Prowl and Huntsman talents. (Talents I'm currently trying: +1 Stamina because reload speed and spread reduction both seem low-impact for repeater, ammo refund from bosses for more sustain and I don't know what the crit talent does exactly, 2 ammo on headshots, THP on kills, 20% Power during Prowl. Melee weapon is 1h Mace for its stamina, dodging, good horde cleanup power post-machine-gunning, and great anti-SV / CW heavy strikes.)
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 17:53
|
|
|
Too Shy Guy posted:I only discovered this weekend (by doing it reflexively, of course) that right-clicking while carrying a barrel lets you punch enemies out of the way. Made that last bit of Empire in Flames a lot more fun when I can linebacker shove chaos chumps while running through the cellar and across the square.  After 187 hours, I had no idea
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 17:54
|
|
|
Magitek posted:What's the beef with it, specifically? I understand lack of zoom is pretty much a dealbreaker for Handmaiden and Shade, but for Waywatcher? That class has adjustable zoom levels for all the bows and virtually no ranged falloff. Unless you're consistently headshotting bosses, the tradeoffs that the Swiftbow offers seem quite reasonable.
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 17:55
|
|
|
Magitek posted:What's the beef with it, specifically? I understand lack of zoom is pretty much a dealbreaker for Handmaiden and Shade, but for Waywatcher? That class has adjustable zoom levels for all the bows and virtually no ranged falloff. Unless you're consistently headshotting bosses, the tradeoffs that the Swiftbow offers seem quite reasonable. About the only thing it's good for is blanketing waves of clanrats, which everybody can already do. People take swiftbow because they want to have a million ammos but it doesn't do anybody a whole lot of good.
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 19:11
|
|
|
|
| # ? Apr 28, 2024 19:57 |
|
|
Magitek posted:What's the beef with it, specifically? I understand lack of zoom is pretty much a dealbreaker for Handmaiden and Shade, but for Waywatcher? That class has adjustable zoom levels for all the bows and virtually no ranged falloff. Unless you're consistently headshotting bosses, the tradeoffs that the Swiftbow offers seem quite reasonable. Try to kill a Stormvermin or special with it. aka The Things That Force Lost Runs. now realize you could oneshot headshot a stormvermin with the longbow. it is The Worst, and completely and actively nullifies any reason to have a WW on the team.
|
|
#
?
Apr 23, 2018 19:40
|
|