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really queer Christmas posted:The gently caress!? How the hell am I just finding out about this armor? Because New Vegas is a wonderful game with many hidden secrets. Better replay it, because you can get this armor at like level 15 or earlier. double nine posted:funny thing is that from a gameplay perspective, it pays to nuke both, since doing so opens up two areas for looting that are otherwise inaccessible and have some neat gear in them. Nuke the world and profit. I really love when games do things like this: there's no real reward for doing the right thing, so the only thing holding you back is your own personal sense of morality and emotional investment in the story.
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May 8, 2018 09:12
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NOT BEING A MONSTER is its own reward (also there are only a few opportunities to get bonus Brotherhood rep?)
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May 8, 2018 09:16
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Raygereio posted:It is. We laugh about it and it is funny, but really all developers use duct-tape solutions or repurposes old code like this. The only reason we have examples like the metro-hat is because Bethesda's games with the toolset are so open and we can look inside and see what's going on. yeah I'm not gonna lie I don't fault them for it; power armour (at least in my experience) works pretty well in the context of the game. nice example of a Bethesda hack panning out. just wish you didn't get the thing in the first hour of the game so todd could have a good e3 sizzle reel, though that's a completely different issue
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May 8, 2018 11:07
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Don't have a problem with the idea of getting Power Armor early but definitely not T-45 quality when there's an early tier of Raider quality existing already
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May 8, 2018 11:30
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StandardVC10 posted:NOT BEING A MONSTER is its own reward
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May 8, 2018 12:07
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StandardVC10 posted:BEING A MONSTER is its own reward FTFY 
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May 8, 2018 12:32
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Nuh uh!
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May 8, 2018 13:06
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StandardVC10 posted:Well I mean there is the whole "you can launch a nuclear attack on either or both of two of the most important factions in the game" thing from Lonesome Road. yeah, but it was the last DLC released that is definitely intended to be completed by characters that have otherwise done everything / beaten the game. i can understand why, at that point, they felt less constrained about altering the core game, but even all that really does is create two "new" zones to explore. IIRC it doesn't blow up locations that you could have previously visited, it's new areas that if you don't nuke, you don't get to access.
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May 8, 2018 14:22
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this is why honest hearts is my favourite dlc, there's just zero bullshit. there's good, there's bad and there's inevitable loss.
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May 8, 2018 14:38
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Generic Monk posted:yeah I'm not gonna lie I don't fault them for it; power armour (at least in my experience) works pretty well in the context of the game. nice example of a Bethesda hack panning out. Man,if the museum was just a set piece and Preston was just one of a few Minutemen captains, how much better would that be? Wouldn't really improve the game that much though.
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May 8, 2018 15:31
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I forget, do the sorrows actually attribute anything supernatural to The Father in the Cave? It's funny that, despite Daniel lamenting their primitive religion, there's actual proof that he's real and helps them.
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May 8, 2018 15:43
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StandardVC10 posted:NOT BEING A MONSTER is its own reward (also there are only a few opportunities to get bonus Brotherhood rep?) And you need that Brotherhood rep to keep Veronica on-side after you pop the Mojave Brotherhood bunker for exterminating a Followers outpost. You'd think that would have been an absolute deal-breaker for Veronica regardless the Wild Child rep, but 
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May 8, 2018 18:14
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Torchlighter posted:Man,if the museum was just a set piece and Preston was just one of a few Minutemen captains, how much better would that be? Wouldn't really improve the game that much though. yeah i don't think it's that much of a crying shame on its own as much as it is emblematic of the game's issues with tonal consistency and maybe pacing
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May 8, 2018 22:36
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frajaq posted:Don't have a problem with the idea of getting Power Armor early but definitely not T-45 quality when there's an early tier of Raider quality existing already I know this isn't the modding thread, but my experience with FO4 is that you are correct and the game is waaaay better when high quality power armor is not super abundant & trivial to repair. Last time I played I used some assembly required and it's such a huge improvement.
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May 8, 2018 22:43
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frajaq posted:Don't have a problem with the idea of getting Power Armor early but definitely not T-45 quality when there's an early tier of Raider quality existing already This is a problem that 4 has in a lot of places, especially with its already small variety of weapons. The 10mm pistol that you get in vault 111 pretty much makes half of the pipe weapons obsolete.
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May 8, 2018 23:03
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I think (and I'm mostly just reiterating Hbomberguy points) that getting power armor and decent weaponry early on is just fine in concept, it's just that Bethesda doles out 10mm ammo and fusion cores like candy, so it's not much trouble to be in power armor 24/7 and use the 10mm starter pistol consistently until the mid game. In a situation where ammunition is more scarce, I welcome and support Fallout 4's decision to give you power armor in the first real mission. It's like they only halfway fixed the degradation system from 3. Not quite truly balanced, yet.
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May 8, 2018 23:40
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Keeshhound posted:This is a problem that 4 has in a lot of places, especially with its already small variety of weapons. The 10mm pistol that you get in vault 111 pretty much makes half of the pipe weapons obsolete. a baller homage to fallout 1 in all regards then
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May 9, 2018 00:00
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You might be thinking of the sequel. Fallout 1 doesn't have any small guns weaker than the 10mm pistol (aside from the BB gun, which is more of an easter egg).
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May 9, 2018 00:33
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And F2 only has the pipe rifle which does the same damage as 10mm pistol But is single-shot. F4 has the pipe weapons as a whole drat category of guns thanks to the gun modifying system
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May 9, 2018 00:36
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I always got the impression that the pipe weapons were not really meant to be used by the player much- they're to give something weak to raiders to make them easier to kill. Same thing Bethesda did in FO3 with the Chinese Pistol and .32 pistol, which are strictly worse than the 10mm pistol you start with. It also means that they can have lovely guns which will not implode the in-game economy when looted, which is something FNV did not do particularly well.
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May 9, 2018 00:48
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The only people who care about not breaking the economy are the hardcore players who already set guidelines for themselves to keep to a role. What I'm saying is give me all your thermic Lance's and super sledges I want my Medicine Stick.
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May 9, 2018 01:05
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Valtonen posted:And F2 only has the pipe rifle which does the same damage as 10mm pistol But is single-shot. I think the intent is for pipe rifles to be super duper ultra customizable to make you consider using them. The end result was that they're loving garbage no matter what and by the time you unlock all of their customization options you don't even remember your 10mm anymore.
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May 9, 2018 01:12
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Play Fallout 4 with horizon, and upgrades and swapping mods between guns suddenly will feel meaningful.
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May 9, 2018 01:22
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I just modded out level requirements for perks and made myself all sorts of bullshit, dumb as gently caress pipe guns. was pretty awesome, totally recommend.
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May 9, 2018 01:44
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Just make another loving fallout 2 please.
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May 9, 2018 02:48
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Pipe guns have a niche early on when you can get suppressors for them but not the 10mm yet, and if you're taking rifleman perks and slapping on a decent receiver they (slightly) outdamage it. A silenced bolt-action is one of the best sneaky weapons you can have for probably the first 10+ levels. Pipe revolvers are complete garbage, though.
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May 9, 2018 03:09
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im using some weapon mod called equilibrium that makes the .32 weapons more useful, and generally everything more useful for some purpose or other.
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May 9, 2018 07:09
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No matter if you're using pipe weapons or 10mm, whatever you're carrying is rendered obsolete once you hit 3k caps and can buy the Overseer's Guardian and a couple hundred. 45 rounds. That equates to about the first few hours or so. Once you're running around with OG, it's a completely different game, regardless difficulty slider selection entirely. If you end up speccing into demolition expert and picking up Spray 'n' pray (or a better explosive gun) after that, combat becomes even more hilariously one-sided. It's only if we're going to pretend we are talking about a hypothetical playthrough where the designers didn't spoonfeed you one of the most optimal weapon/legendary effect combinations possible that we can entertain pipe/10mm guns as a possibility. So, if you want to call them viable, you're essentially in a position where you have to choose how hard you're going to hamstring yourself to make that viability real yourself. Bethesda clearly gave no fucks about reigning in player options to serve difficulty preservation at all, and that's nothing new in and of itself. Look at Alchemy or Restoration cheeze in MW, or freaking Chameleon in Oblivion. Hell, in Oblivion you could even eschew Chameleon entirely, in favor of a suit of like 95% damage reflect,and some combination of Reflect Magicka/Absorb Magicka/Resist Magicka, thereby becoming functionally invulnerable to almost all forms of damage. What's new in F4, IIRC, is how fast you can reach comparably OP levels of power on a new character. The game effect abuse I described in MW and Oblivion at least took a while to get going. Given that potentially accelerated power creep, the time spent developing the different pipe weapon combinations would've been put to better use pretty much anywhere else, IMHO. Lookin' at you, settlement building UI. aniviron posted:I always got the impression that the pipe weapons were not really meant to be used by the player much- they're to give something weak to raiders to make them easier to kill. Same thing Bethesda did in FO3 with the Chinese Pistol and .32 pistol, which are strictly worse than the 10mm pistol you start with. It also means that they can have lovely guns which will not implode the in-game economy when looted, which is something FNV did not do particularly well. This does make a bit of sense, though. They could've achieved the same effect by either making un-modded weapons almost worthless, or just adding in more non-humanoid enemies in place of raider spawns, or something similar. Although, the game does kind of throw caps at you in the form of purified water, so I guess it's kind of moot either way.
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May 9, 2018 07:39
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chitoryu12 posted:There also doesn't seem to be any backlash against paid expansions like what Fallout, The Elder Scrolls, and The Witcher 3 use to expand the story and worldspace. So I don't think paid content will ever go away, but there may be more caution from major developers against exploitative payments. I also don't think mobile games where you have to pay to do more than the bare minimum to qualify as a game will go away because those games are made by unscrupulous developers shoveling out addictive and simple games for cheap. That's actually starting now. When it was stuff like Gearbox's excellent Borderlands expansion packs nobody complained, but with half of the 'expansions' for FO4 being crafting packs that aren't new content, or are minimal content, there's backlash coming.
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May 9, 2018 07:58
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Liquid Communism posted:That's actually starting now. When it was stuff like Gearbox's excellent Borderlands expansion packs nobody complained, but with half of the 'expansions' for FO4 being crafting packs that aren't new content, or are minimal content, there's backlash coming. yeah, there's backlash coming, if by backlash you mean they keep making money with creative club for essentially zero cost
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May 9, 2018 08:01
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corn in the bible posted:yeah, there's backlash coming, if by backlash you mean they keep making money with creative club for essentially zero cost I'm not sure how that's working out for them. It seems like most of the 'purchases' on CC are people picking up stuff when it's free.
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May 9, 2018 08:05
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What's everyone's favorite method of gaming fallout for massive early game advantages? For 3 it's as simple as playing operation anchorage at level 2. Hilariously powerful weapons and armor + 5 bonus sets of power armor to sell once the dust clears. For New Vegas I repair and sell the 8 or so energy weapons sitting around on ghoul corpses at repconn launch site.
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May 9, 2018 08:16
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sneak by the cazadors (with a school stealth boy if necessary), get to the atomic wrangler, gamble them dry. Hello int impant level 1, steal all the stuff from the von graffs and sell it to the gunrunners, and buy some delicious toys with the caps.
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May 9, 2018 08:19
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Imo you’re a fool if you don’t spec into strength/agility and immediately tunnel vision to pickmans blade before you even join up with the minuteman and then just go solo stealth murder machine
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May 9, 2018 08:32
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Savescum my way down to Navarro, spend the rest of my time pretending I opened the battle mech folder on my hard drive.
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May 9, 2018 09:03
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Riatsala posted:What's everyone's favorite method of gaming fallout for massive early game advantages? Not doing that stuff since I figure out that exploiting that kind of stuff just makes me enjoy the game less. It also means I'll feel obligated to always do that stuff as soon as possible on a new character because I'm gimping myself otherwise. I prefer to just do whatever as I please.
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May 9, 2018 09:52
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I installed FO2 with the Restoration Project the other day and for the first time ever it actually works for me. As if FO2 wasn't gigantic enough already. It's pretty loving awesome.
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May 9, 2018 10:02
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Riatsala posted:... There's a fan patch to "restore" the armor degradation to power armor you get from Operation Anchorage and I've always wondered why the hell anyone would ever want to do that.
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May 9, 2018 11:33
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Riatsala posted:For New Vegas I repair and sell the 8 or so energy weapons sitting around on ghoul corpses at repconn launch site. Do a bit of Lonesome Road and sell or equip the overpowered gear you can find in there. If you're not on Hardcore mode, just unlock ED-E and let him kill everything while you hide.
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May 9, 2018 14:09
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Liquid Communism posted:That's actually starting now. When it was stuff like Gearbox's excellent Borderlands expansion packs nobody complained, but with half of the 'expansions' for FO4 being crafting packs that aren't new content, or are minimal content, there's backlash coming. That's not exactly what I was talking about. I meant the more traditional expansion packs where like Dead Money or Far Harbor, where they add actual expansions to the story and game world instead of just charging for features that should have been in the game from the start.
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May 9, 2018 14:16
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