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steinrokkan posted:Nonsense, we all know Enclave exists to, um, control water purification plants, and kill other people who would want to control water purification plants? 200 years of inbreeding on a oil rig will do that to a plan
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Jun 16, 2018 21:26
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Azhais posted:200 years of inbreeding on a oil rig will do that to a plan I thought one of the Fallouts (2?) discussed some kind of rumor of women being abducted for use as baby factories. Am I wrong and just imagined that?
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Jun 16, 2018 21:28
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chitoryu12 posted:The Vault 111 Pip-Boy can open every Vault, so I think as long as you know how to open them you can. But the Vaults can also be sealed from the inside to keep anyone from getting in. i guess this makes the most sense
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Jun 16, 2018 21:32
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It's allowed vaults to tell a wide variety of colorful, sometimes poignant stories, but the core idea (introduced in 2) of vaults as experiments was always dumb to me. I was surprised they toned down that element in FO4. Maybe it was just the smaller number of vaults in general (which is curious in its own right).
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Jun 16, 2018 21:32
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It's pretty dumb, to be honest, but it helps that in the first two games the idea is pretty subdued, and there are no outright oh-so-wacky vaults (iirc). In the 3D games they made the vaults fit the concept of each location being a theme park ride. I agree that FO4 was a bit better, since the experiments seem to have been a little more inspired by historical psychological pseudo-research. And the robot vault in the expansion was actually a really well made diversion. steinrokkan fucked around with this message at 21:38 on Jun 16, 2018 |
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Jun 16, 2018 21:35
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I like the idea because it lets each Vault be a new, weird story. Normally the Bethesda theme park approach doesn't work, but Vaults are intentionally isolated so you can stretch your creative muscles there. It adds more variety to what could otherwise be generic dungeons.
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Jun 16, 2018 21:42
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The vaults are one of the best things about the 3D Fallouts and I wish there were even more of them.
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Jun 16, 2018 22:32
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they pace nicely between earned jump-scares and having to rewind your brain once to process the hosed up narrative they're throwing at you.
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Jun 16, 2018 22:46
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jfood posted:they pace nicely between earned jump-scares and having to rewind your brain once to process the hosed up narrative they're throwing at you. There are jump scares?
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Jun 16, 2018 23:02
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Paulywallywalrus posted:I thought one of the Fallouts (2?) discussed some kind of rumor of women being abducted for use as baby factories. Am I wrong and just imagined that? I'm sure it was there. In any post-apoc setting some nerd writer is hankering to insert this scenario.
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Jun 16, 2018 23:05
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chitoryu12 posted:There are jump scares? my dude have you seen this toilet
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Jun 16, 2018 23:09
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Rinkles posted:It's allowed vaults to tell a wide variety of colorful, sometimes poignant stories, but the core idea (introduced in 2) of vaults as experiments was always dumb to me. ehh. the enclave is basically the CIA/DOD/Pentagon with even less ethics. I can believe they would do that kinda poo poo. i mean there stuff is pretty down to earth compared to umbrella. Dapper_Swindler fucked around with this message at 23:24 on Jun 16, 2018 |
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Jun 16, 2018 23:17
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chitoryu12 posted:There are jump scares? Yeah one of them makes you start hallucinating, a bunch of hosed up not real poo poo appears. The Vaults were awesome, wish there were more of them. poo poo I loved the Metros in 3 too, was always cool learning how to navigate the city from below and then heading topside into God knows what Talon company! The sheer fun of exploring the city is why I think 3 is still my favorite (after Wanderers Edition fixed it anyway), despite all the other objectively terrible parts of it.
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Jun 16, 2018 23:17
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Yes, it's like a lava lamp.
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PittTheElder posted:Yeah one of them makes you start hallucinating, a bunch of hosed up not real poo poo appears. Washington was really well done in 3 I thought, I wish they'd made Boston more like it to be honest, though I did like the verticality of Boston (though not the framerate). I spent a lot of time in there and I still didn't have a very good map of the place, just the sheer amount of space in that tiny map section is impressive and really adds to the game. Dapper_Swindler posted:ehh. the enclave is basically the CIA/DOD/Pentagon with even less ethics. I can believe they would do that kinda poo poo. i mean there stuff is pretty down to earth compared to umbrella. Given what the real US intelligence lot got up to in the 50's and 60's with MKULTRA and poo poo, "that's stupid why would anyone do that" isn't really a criticism of what Fallout's equivalent might do.
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Jun 16, 2018 23:40
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PittTheElder posted:I loved the Metros in 3 too, was always cool learning how to navigate the city from below and then heading topside into God knows what Talon company! What the gently caress is wrong with you. The lovely DC map with its arbitrary barricades and terrible connecting tunnels was the worst part of 3.
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Jun 17, 2018 00:18
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steinrokkan posted:What the gently caress is wrong with you. Lots of things probably, but I find it undeniable that the 'dungeony' parts of Fo3 were it's best parts, especially because exploring them brought you to other new places to explore. Technically it was a brilliant way to break up the zones as well. And if you were genuinely lost the pipboy map would show you exactly where to go anyway, the city was not hard to get around. And honestly I found that far more compelling than most of NV and Fo4's not actually all that interesting NPCs. Exploring in NV was particularly irritating, since so much of it was just open desert. Oh look a big scorpion I can shoot from miles away. As a more general complaint, I really hate that the games force you to be the hero who somehow decides pretty much everything that will go down in the wasteland. The world is much better if it's moving around and doing it's thing while you just explore it.
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Jun 17, 2018 00:27
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The Enclave is a shadowy piece of the government that is the only surviving piece of said governing body and willy nilly calling their leader the President. Of course they're gonna view everything else as subhuman and in need of eradication. I'm just surprised the Enclave only has one area, the Oil Rig and its survivors, and that there weren't any other sections that buried themselves as the bombs flew. The Brotherhood were military, but I'm expecting other outfits that went into their own little weird cultures. Fallout's the story of how dumb the US was in thinking it didn't really need preparations for a nuclear war.
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Jun 17, 2018 00:29
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PittTheElder posted:Lots of things probably, but I find it undeniable that the 'dungeony' parts of Fo3 were it's best parts, especially because exploring them brought you to other new places to explore. Technically it was a brilliant way to break up the zones as well. And if you were genuinely lost the pipboy map would show you exactly where to go anyway, the city was not hard to get around. Other than the "theme park" disconnect between many of the areas, the only real issue I had with the Capital Wasteland was the reliance on the metro system to navigate DC. I'm not a big fan of mandatory dungeons just to reach new areas.
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Jun 17, 2018 00:42
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PittTheElder posted:Lots of things probably, but I find it undeniable that the 'dungeony' parts of Fo3 were it's best parts, especially because exploring them brought you to other new places to explore. Technically it was a brilliant way to break up the zones as well. And if you were genuinely lost the pipboy map would show you exactly where to go anyway, the city was not hard to get around. I'll take exploring open environments over shooting waves of trash mob ghouls in copy pasted subway stations, thank you very much. Also you can ignore the main quest, if you think that somehow improves the game.
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Jun 17, 2018 00:49
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Fallout New Vegas' map sucks because it constantly and arbitrarily decides where you're allowed to go with invisible walls everywhere  basically all the bethesda games do this and it's dumb
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Jun 17, 2018 00:54
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chitoryu12 posted:Other than the "theme park" disconnect between many of the areas, the only real issue I had with the Capital Wasteland was the reliance on the metro system to navigate DC. I'm not a big fan of mandatory dungeons just to reach new areas. I was okay with it in 3 but I despise the endless urban bullshit of Boston. Give me NV all day as long as I've got something to in between hikes.
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Jun 17, 2018 00:57
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Your Computer posted:Fallout New Vegas' map sucks because it constantly and arbitrarily decides where you're allowed to go with invisible walls everywhere This is the dumbest poo poo, there is a portion of the map that guides you along scripted story progression quests, which is good, and necessary for first time players. If you are an advanced player, you can very easily ignore this and go wherever. If anything FO4 and 3 are terrible in that they offer you virtually no guidance in the form of map features, and as a result rely entirely on enemy scaling to keep the PC interested. Hell, t's impressive how much more memorable and intuitive to navigate the NV map is contrasted to the unstructured clusterfucks of FO3 and 4. steinrokkan fucked around with this message at 01:00 on Jun 17, 2018 |
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Jun 17, 2018 00:57
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Your Computer posted:Fallout New Vegas' map sucks because it constantly and arbitrarily decides where you're allowed to go with invisible walls everywhere What is an example? I felt it was a pretty open map save for the boundaries of the map edge.
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Jun 17, 2018 00:58
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Paulywallywalrus posted:What is an example? I felt it was a pretty open map save for the boundaries of the map edge. feels bad to climb on top of a hill, see the other side and then be stopped from just walking across due to an invisible wall. steinrokkan posted:Hell, t's impressive how much more memorable and intuitive to navigate the NV map is contrasted to the unstructured clusterfucks of FO3 and 4.
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Jun 17, 2018 01:15
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Your Computer posted:Fallout New Vegas' map sucks because it constantly and arbitrarily decides where you're allowed to go with invisible walls everywhere I think its more on the awful quest pointer that basically all their games use now. The quest pointer has some bad effects, like when it tells you the fastest path is over the mountain with the invisible wall. I doubt they could ever get rid of it now either.
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Jun 17, 2018 01:34
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Stop being snowflakes and play the game normally, nerds.
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Jun 17, 2018 01:45
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How do you even play video games "normally"? With your hands? Like a moron?
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Jun 17, 2018 02:11
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Poniard posted:How do you even play video games "normally"? With your hands? Like a moron? I think he means "use noclip when you come across an invisible wall"
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Jun 17, 2018 02:13
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I don't know if maybe things were different for others, but when I played Fallout 3 I very quickly cleared the metro tunnels through normal play, and travelled through them often enough afterward that they pretty much never respawned the ghouls, quickly making the metro a completely safe and very quick way to get around.Your Computer posted:Fallout New Vegas' map sucks because it constantly and arbitrarily decides where you're allowed to go with invisible walls everywhere Honestly if invisible wall remover isn't on your mod list, your mod list is wrong.
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Jun 17, 2018 02:28
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Your Computer posted:thanks for sharing your opinion, steinrokkan It was about time somebody started making sense.
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Jun 17, 2018 03:05
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Stop trying to speedrun your 8th playthrough so that you are trying to climb over hills that you shouldn't be climbing over?
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Jun 17, 2018 03:08
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Is it against Todd's vision to not climb the mountain?
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Jun 17, 2018 03:29
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Tenzarin posted:I think its more on the awful quest pointer that basically all their games use now. The quest pointer has some bad effects, like when it tells you the fastest path is over the mountain with the invisible wall. I doubt they could ever get rid of it now either.  It has nothing to do with trying to go fast or being efficient, it's the complete opposite. I know I can climb that hill so I'm gonna, quests be damned! Fallout New Vegas in particular wants to funnel you into roads, mountain passes etc. to see the stuff they placed there, but I just want to go wherever I feel like going. Cyberpunkey Monkey posted:Stop being snowflakes and play the game normally, nerds. e: explains why some people hate them so much though. If you try to play a Bethesda game "normally" (i.e. just going from story quest to story quest) then you're probably gonna hate it because hoo boy is that not their strength Your Computer fucked around with this message at 03:33 on Jun 17, 2018 |
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Jun 17, 2018 03:29
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Your Computer posted:Definitely not the case for me (first reaction: "There are quest pointers?") How would you ever complete 90% of Bethesda quests without them?
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Jun 17, 2018 03:33
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Your Computer posted:e: explains why some people hate them so much though. If you try to play a Bethesda game "normally" (i.e. just going from story quest to story quest) then you're probably gonna hate it because hoo boy is that not their strength So what IS their strength? Cause it sure as hell isn't wandering through the thousand identical office buildings. Also in NV it actually is engaging to follow the thread, because the developer put thought and effort into making it interesting.
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Jun 17, 2018 03:34
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Rinkles posted:How would you ever complete 90% of Bethesda quests without them? I don't 
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Jun 17, 2018 03:35
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Rinkles posted:How would you ever complete 90% of Bethesda quests without them? I remember making maps on paper in Morrowind and sending an angry email to Bethesda about their liberal use of terms like "north" and so on.
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Jun 17, 2018 03:36
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lol, imagine playing these games for the sake of "exploration"
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Jun 17, 2018 03:37
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Your Computer posted:I don't I can respect that
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Jun 17, 2018 03:38
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steinrokkan posted:lol, imagine playing these games for the sake of "exploration"
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Jun 17, 2018 03:39
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