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Avatar was utter poo poo, glad to hear this might be Actually Good For Real.
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Feb 15, 2019 16:50
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Tormented posted:I'm glad that motorball is in the movie. During my second watch last night, everyone was cheering at that segment. It a crowd pleasure that's for sure. Yeah, same. My prejudice against it being in the movie was mostly because I revered it so much in the manga, with it undeniably being my favorite part through all 9 volumes. But in the film, when Alita takes part in the pick-up game on the street my rear end was fuckin' sold and any doubt I had went out the window haha. So good.
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Feb 15, 2019 18:43
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I have mixed feelings about this movie. Visually, the movie was stunning and seeing all of the different, cool cyborg designs was awesome. Motorball was fun to watch and the fights didn't suffer from shaky cam so you could see what was going on and appreciate all of it. I dunno if it was intended to be this way as an homage to old anime and manga, but the dialogue just felt very stilted and corny to me. For every scene of something cool happening, there was a scene where I rolled my eyes because the character interactions felt so unnatural. I also felt that Alita's facial expressions were off in a lot of cases to the point where they didn't seem like they were matching her actual feelings. I understand the creative decision to go full CGI with Salazar as the base, but it just didn't work. And not because of the whole uncanny valley thing, because I didn't think what they did in Rogue One was nearly as bad as most Star Wars fans; I actually thought her eyes were fine for the most part. This had more to do with her mouth and how it just didn't express things in the way normal people do. Gonna talk about some plot stuff now: Let me preface this by saying that I'm not a long-time Alita fan and haven't finished reading the series, so there may be points I'm missing just out of ignorance. First, I didn't like how they had to give Ido a tragic backstory with a daughter (who of course was named Alita) because that sort of thing has become way too common. I like how in the manga he just named Alita after his recently deceased cat because it was simple and kinda comical. But I guess it makes Ido seem less like of a sexist for wanting a prim and pretty doll in Alita around. Second, I really didn't like how they handled Alita's transition to the Berserker body and Makaku's (or whatever vaguely Russian-sounding name they gave him) arc overall. In the film, Makaku wasn't really shown to be a threat until he got the the grind-cutter fingers, but between him having difficulty beating Alita with that and the finale, he no longer felt like a threat at all because she had the Berserker body and a sword that could cut through anything. The manga showed Makaku to be a threat at all points because he destroyed Alita's original body before getting the grind-cutters and after she got the Berserker body he had the grind-cutter so it wasn't a foregone conclusion that she would win. That brings me to the scene at Kansas. In the manga, Ido brings Alita there and it's Ido that makes an earnest plea to the hunter-warriors to help him track down Makaku. They refuse him, of course, because they try to stay risk-averse for their own survival. Alita then provokes them out of frustration because she thinks they're cowards but also knows that Makaku is a huge threat to them all, but the brawl ensues, then Makaku enters and challenges Alita after killing most of them. In the film, Alita goes to Kansas herself and makes the plea to them, but they don't want to follow a newbie around so she starts a fight. The film made her seem excessively arrogant because she was just picking fights for the sake of it rather than trying to defend herself and Ido. Losing her body then didn't even seem to humble her because Ido then just kinda throws his hands up and goes welp I guess I'll give you this super powerful body you found by deus ex machina and hope you don't destroy the city. I know it's a movie adaptation and shackling yourself to the source material only ends in great disappointment, but the way they weaved in plot points from various points in the manga screwed up motivations and threat levels too much for my liking. It was entertaining - only if you didn't think too hard about what was going on.
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Feb 15, 2019 19:09
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Shoren posted:I have mixed feelings about this movie. Visually, the movie was stunning and seeing all of the different, cool cyborg designs was awesome. Motorball was fun to watch and the fights didn't suffer from shaky cam so you could see what was going on and appreciate all of it. I dunno if it was intended to be this way as an homage to old anime and manga, but the dialogue just felt very stilted and corny to me. For every scene of something cool happening, there was a scene where I rolled my eyes because the character interactions felt so unnatural. The reason why the dialog is corny and sounds 80's is that a good amount of it is rip verbatim from the english translation of the manga. I think it sounds better in Japanese but it is what it is. Like the "I will not stand by in the presence of evil" quote is directly from the motorball arc. It does sound corny as all hell said out-loud.
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Feb 15, 2019 19:25
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Alita isn't corny, she's earnest.
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Feb 15, 2019 19:30
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Yeah, but corny dialogue is also James Cameron's modus operandi. Alita also wasn't just picking fights for the sake of it. A major thing with her character development in the film is she has flashbacks to her past life whenever she engages in combat. That was one of her motivations to become a hunter-warrior, and creates the drama/rift between her and Ido.
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Feb 15, 2019 19:30
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I think the movie did a good job depicting amnesiac Alita as an overly trusting and enthusiastic cheeseball. A lot of the dumb stuff she says is understandable coming from someone who doesn't get people/the world. Hugo directly calls her out on her naivety later in the film. On another note, as impressive as Alita looked in the film, the real standout is Zapan who was also entirely cgi. He was nothing but convincing the entire time and had a serious terminator vibe on the hunt.
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Feb 15, 2019 19:35
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Tekne posted:I think the movie did a good job depicting amnesiac Alita as an overly trusting and enthusiastic cheeseball. A lot of the dumb stuff she says is understandable coming from someone who doesn't get people/the world. Hugo directly calls her out on her naivety later in the film. Zapan's not entirely CGI like Alita. His face is real.
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Feb 15, 2019 19:37
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I mean his cyborg body looks as real as his face on the screen. If they said it was just Ed Skrein in a costume with some digital touch ups I could believe it.
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Feb 15, 2019 19:42
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WETA outdid themselves with this movie imo. The CG was some of the best.
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Feb 15, 2019 19:46
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Shoren posted:I have mixed feelings about this movie. Visually, the movie was stunning and seeing all of the different, cool cyborg designs was awesome. Motorball was fun to watch and the fights didn't suffer from shaky cam so you could see what was going on and appreciate all of it. I dunno if it was intended to be this way as an homage to old anime and manga, but the dialogue just felt very stilted and corny to me. For every scene of something cool happening, there was a scene where I rolled my eyes because the character interactions felt so unnatural. Dammit. Gally was the name of Ido's cat in the books, dammit. I was planning on seeing this movie yesterday but I ended up delaying to Sunday to see it with friends.
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Feb 15, 2019 19:59
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MonsieurChoc posted:Dammit. Gally was the name of Ido's cat in the books, dammit. So? Her original name was Gally and the manga was originally called Gunnm. Both changed, but whatever her original name, Gonzu wonders out loud why Ido would name her after his deceased cat.
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Feb 15, 2019 20:07
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So they changed the origin of Alita's name from the manga? Huh. I thought the movie version worked well. Made it closer to that of Astro Boy's origin, with Dr. Tenma making Astro in in the image of his dead son.
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Feb 15, 2019 20:19
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Shoren posted:So? Her original name was Gally and the manga was originally called Gunnm. Both changed, but whatever her original name, Gonzu wonders out loud why Ido would name her after his deceased cat. I'm agreeing with you, I'm just using her real name.
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Feb 15, 2019 20:19
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MonsieurChoc posted:I'm agreeing with you, I'm just using her real name. Carry on then! 
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Feb 15, 2019 20:55
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Enjoyed the movie, though did't have any knowledge of the manga going in. Seriously considering picking up the first volume on the way home from work. Visually wonderful, and I was impressed how well Salazar came through the CG. I hate when action scenes jump around quickly and are visually difficult to follow, and this movie does a terrific job avoiding that. Biggest surprise was Waltz living. I went in assuming he was dead by the halfway point. Too bad Hugo sucked.
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Feb 15, 2019 21:15
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I saw it! Going in as someone really skeptical from the trailers, I soon found myself not noticing Alita's weird giant eyes so much. The romance with Hugo wasn't as hackneyed as your usual teen sci-fi postapocalyptic dystopia movie, and feels like it fits with the arc of the story. It seems like they mashed together a bunch of the plots of the first 3 books, and the OVA, butit was fine, it hit all the high points - if a bit dense. Like the pacing is really fast, and it seems a bit breathless at times. The scenes lifted frame-to-frame from the manga are all super recognizable and the action is great, with lots of cool cyborg fights. Desty Nova makes some cameos and it ends at a point where it seems to very strongly hint at a sequel, because the main large developed plot doesn't seem to be fully resolved. Overall, I think it was a good adaptation. The only thing I wish it had was a bit of a stronger plot payoff/resolution of the various arcs. It felt a little bit like lurching from one point to another without a strong rising climax/denouement structure. But overall a lot better than most other manga-to-live action adaptations. As someone who followed the comic since he was 14, I mightily enjoyed this movie.
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Feb 16, 2019 03:00
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i will say the pacing of the first 20 or so minutes was crazy fast. like we get Ito finding Alita in the scrap yard in the evening and the next morning Alita goes from cautious to surrogate daughter by the end of the day. It makes sense on Ito's end because he's got a daughter-shaped hole in his heart but it was just a little unnatural how quickly Alita fell into that role. and then a couple days later she was a hunter-warrior killing the gently caress out of all sorts of people. she also literally fell for the first cute boy to look her way but she's a teenager so i let that one slide.
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Feb 16, 2019 03:23
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DC Murderverse posted:she also literally fell for the first cute boy to look her way but she's a teenager so i let that one slide. It's a self-solving problem.
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Feb 16, 2019 03:48
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DC Murderverse posted:i will say the pacing of the first 20 or so minutes was crazy fast. like we get Ito finding Alita in the scrap yard in the evening and the next morning Alita goes from cautious to surrogate daughter by the end of the day. It makes sense on Ito's end because he's got a daughter-shaped hole in his heart but it was just a little unnatural how quickly Alita fell into that role. and then a couple days later she was a hunter-warrior killing the gently caress out of all sorts of people. Alita is a blank slate at the start. Kind of makes sense that she'd quickly take on the role of whatever comes at her first, soaking in everything with how naive she is from her memory loss. Fortunate for her, she fell into the kindness of Ido and not Chiren or whoever else with malicious/criminal intent. And her 300 year old history of being an URM elite ultra mega soldier inherently made her drawn to violence/action, fast becoming a hunter-warrior. teagone fucked around with this message at 04:03 on Feb 16, 2019 |
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Feb 16, 2019 04:01
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fishing with the fam posted:Too bad Hugo sucked. Agreed, but he's basically the gender-swapped version of the hot girlfriend character with a little more agency than average. Men aren't all that used to having to identify with that kind of thing.
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Feb 16, 2019 04:02
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DC Murderverse posted:i will say the pacing of the first 20 or so minutes was crazy fast. like we get Ito finding Alita in the scrap yard in the evening and the next morning Alita goes from cautious to surrogate daughter by the end of the day. Kids grow up so fast these days.
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Feb 16, 2019 04:06
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I liked the characters and the action, but the movie forgot to have an ending. Don't bait me into a sequel, movie. Gimme an ending.
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Feb 16, 2019 05:40
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I have no familiarity with the source material, but I enjoyed the movie quite a bit, and it gave me huge Xenogears vibes, which I'm a big fan of. I'm not a big comic/manga person, but I liked the setting enough that I may pick them up. what is the best way to read them on an ipad?
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Feb 16, 2019 05:58
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Megasabin posted:what is the best way to read them on an ipad? Comixology -- I believe you can actually get a month free trial for unlimited and read the whole first series. Worth noting that the original run ends at volume 9 because the author thought he was gonna die. He didn't, then picked it up again with Last Order which re-writes 3/4 of volume 9 and proceeds from there. NmareBfly fucked around with this message at 06:08 on Feb 16, 2019 |
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Feb 16, 2019 06:06
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Watched it. Movie was alright, made some decent changes from the source material to make the story flow better. Still not a fan of the big eyes.
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Feb 16, 2019 06:08
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BeanpolePeckerwood posted:Agreed, but he's basically the gender-swapped version of the hot girlfriend character with a little more agency than average. Men aren't all that used to having to identify with that kind of thing. That's what I liked about their relationship. Alita is the biggest bad rear end in whatever room she walks into, so she isn't going to be impressed by someone being strong or macho and protective. Instead she falls for the cute boy who is nice to her, and commits fully because she is decisive about everything. Basically reversing the gender roles. Plus her scenes with him were some of the best character building moments and opportunities to show off her expressiveness. I also liked the relationship with Ido. He is obviously motivated by fatherly instincts, but she rejects the surrogate daughter role for most of the movie. From the outset she is suspicious that he is a murderer, and later pushes back against him trying to be protective or withholding information from her. It is only after he has proven that he can be fatherly through trust and supporting her fighting rather than more traditional paternalism that she calls him dad. Despite being thrown into the relationship on uneven footing to begin with she exerts her will and defines how it is going to be.
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Feb 16, 2019 07:08
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Moon Atari posted:That's what I liked about their relationship. Alita is the biggest bad rear end in whatever room she walks into, so she isn't going to be impressed by someone being strong or macho and protective. Instead she falls for the cute boy who is nice to her, and commits fully because she is decisive about everything. Basically reversing the gender roles. Yeah, to tell you the truth I kind of liked it, too.
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Feb 16, 2019 12:18
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God this movie is so loving good, I'm gonna be genuinely angry if we never get a sequel
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Feb 16, 2019 17:33
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I particularly loving love everything they did with Alita's personality. She's a much less subtle character than in the manga, but the result is that she's a lot more fun to watch. Like, the whole bit from the trailer where she's giving Hugo her heart and it looked like a cliche love story bit? In the full movie that's basically a comedy bit, with Hugo just kind of staring at her going "  put your goddamn heart back" and then she's literally like "yeah that was a little intense sorry"
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Feb 16, 2019 17:55
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Also: "well, that looks fatal" made me laugh like goddamn Rich Evans
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Feb 16, 2019 17:56
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LORD OF BOOTY posted:Also: "well, that looks fatal" made me laugh like goddamn Rich Evans Mahershala Ali was loving great. Waltz too. Didn't care much for the dude who played Hugo. Jennifer Connelly was also meh.
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Feb 16, 2019 18:01
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I thought she was Demi Moore until I saw Connelly's name in the credits. 
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Feb 16, 2019 18:12
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I have one big beef with this movie, though, and it's a really weird one that I'm not sure people who aren't familiar with the manga will understand. All that stuff in the flashbacks is a HUGE loving spoiler for fairly recent manga material. If I'm remembering correctly, the whole thing about Alita having been an anti-Zalem guerrilla doesn't get revealed until Chronicle of the Mars War, and it's a pretty goddamn big reveal. The movie, meanwhile, just kinda casually drops it near the end, which is fine for the movie in a vacuum but might make the sequels sort of awkward if they get far enough.
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Feb 16, 2019 18:33
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I liked it! I also wanna see more of RoboDog Bounty Hunter.
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Feb 16, 2019 18:51
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Not a dog lover??? I HATE THAT.
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Feb 16, 2019 19:29
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LORD OF BOOTY posted:I have one big beef with this movie, though, and it's a really weird one that I'm not sure people who aren't familiar with the manga will understand. Lol no, not like that and not as you claim
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Feb 16, 2019 19:35
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Saw it last night in our biggest and best IMAX theater, in 3D, and it's quite an amazing spectacle. I went in not knowing anything about the manga and only the basic premise of the film and I had a blast watching it. I do think it might not have had the same impact in a small theater without seat-shaking bass and IMAX or similarly enhanced theaters are the way to go. I was expecting a slow build up to the battles but the film pretty much jumps right in. Despite this, the pacing feels right and doesn't feel like action overkill like pretty much every Marvel film where the final 1/3rd of the films are bloated with action. Also unlike Marvel films (sorry, but this is going to draw lots of comparisons to them) the fight/battle sequences are superbly directed and incredible fun and satisfying to watch. I also thought the tone of the film was perfect, even without having ever read source material I could tell it was treating it with respect and authenticity, and it didn't feel the need to have the comedic moments undermine it (again, like Marvel). However this is another instance where as the afterglow from the spectacle wears off, the film falls apart a little when I'm given a chance to reflect on it. The most obvious and noted issue is the lack of an ending. The film banks too hard on two things: 1: A sequel despite the fact that it may never happen, and 2: [/spoiler]prior knowledge of this universe, what it was like before the battle, what the battle was about, a solid understanding of what the city of Zalem is (we never even see it), and some explanation of who Nova is and what his motivations are. We only get glimpses of Zalem, here him speak through other characters, etc. He is the main antagonist and he is not even confronted in the film at any point.[/spoiler] Now, obviously if a sequel does get made, it will address everything in number 2, but even if it does get made, all of these gaps make for a very incomplete movie.
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Feb 16, 2019 19:49
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Alan_Shore posted:Lol no, not like that and not as you claim I might be getting it mixed up with teratoma shenanigans (which are definitely a thing from Mars Chronicle). If I'm wrong and the whole terrorist thing isn't supposed to be a spoiler for quite that late, then yeah, disregard.
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Feb 16, 2019 20:02
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Also, honestly? I'm okay with how they handled Zalem and Nova. Like, I think this movie's actually structured pretty cleverly: there's a bunch of subplots all running in parallel that get resolved fully, with Alita and Hugo's relationship probably being the main one, and the "big plot" of Nova's stuff and Zalem's nature exists to tie them all together. It's a pretty remarkable way to turn an episodic chunk of comics into a cohesive single narrative, honestly.
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Feb 16, 2019 20:20
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