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Lungboy posted:Is there a current "best" itx am4 motherboard? It seems to be a trade off between better VRMs (MSI) Vs better audio and USB (asrock). In day to day use I'd guess the latter would be more noticeable, but will the worse vrm setup become an issue in a small case? If you can increase size by a smidge, to Mini-DTX, the https://www.asus.com/Motherboards/ROG-Crosshair-VIII-Impact/ seems to be good according to that buildzoid guy E: picture add 
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Jun 10, 2019 12:02
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SwissArmyDruid posted:You mean you haven't already?! Like, I know the meme is to ride the 2500K because there's nothing meaningfully better, but there has been product that's meaningfully better for a year now. You did not reply to me, but here's where I am at right now: I just checked my order history. Bought my 2500k (€185) in 10/2011 and my gtx970 (€349) in 11/2014. That's like €0,06 per day for the CPU and €0,20 per day for the GPU. They had a good run. It's time. I was going to go for a 8700k, but then the whole Spectre/Meltdown shenanigans surfaced. Then the 9900k was too expensive and too hot. Then Zen2 loomed on the horizon. The CPU will be upgraded first, then I'll see how the RTX Super revisions turn out and decide wether I a) go (almost) all in with a 2080S, b) use a cheaper 2070 or 2070S as a stepping stone or c) stick with the 970 until Ampere details leak and consumer cards on 7mm are confirmed.
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Jun 10, 2019 12:50
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Almost Smart posted:I might splurge and get a 3950x and not have to worry about updating my CPU again until the PS6 and Xbox 3 generation rolls around. considering the upgrade paths AMD is offering, I think you'd be better off the a more moderate priced cpu now and wait a few years to see if it makes sense financially to drop something bigger in there
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Jun 10, 2019 13:46
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2500k's are still running strong if you can get a good overclock on them. The meltdown/spectre mitigations were a huge setback and saw some awful overhead issues and stutter but the retpoline mitigation seems to have sorted all that out thankfully. Going from 4 to 6 cores with only a moderate IPC and clockspeed uplift just wasn't a compelling reason to upgrade, and Zen1 had some very real drawbacks due to the clockspeed penalty. Zen2 is going to get you at least double the core count and higher clockspeeds; its the first midrange processor that actually delivers on doubling of performance that tends to push the old hardware out. Intel was shilling marginal improvements at top dollar and I had no inclination to reward them to reliving the dying days of netburst.
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Jun 10, 2019 13:53
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BangersInMyKnickers posted:considering the upgrade paths AMD is offering, I think you'd be better off the a more moderate priced cpu now and wait a few years to see if it makes sense financially to drop something bigger in there
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Jun 10, 2019 13:56
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BangersInMyKnickers posted:2500k's are still running strong if you can get a good overclock on them. As always it all depends on what you're doing with the computer, and what else is in the system. When I put together my Ivy Bridge system back then I was playing different games, but as it aged I didn't care as much because I wasn't playing stuff where max-CPU was as big a deal (mp FPS w/ graphics set low). Honestly a Sandy/Ivy CPU would still be pretty acceptable for me now. The two big things that pulled me to upgrade with 1st-gen Ryzen were AMD promising to support the socket, and the fact that my old system only had 8 gigs of ram.
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Jun 10, 2019 14:26
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SwissArmyDruid posted:You mean you haven't already?! Like, I know the meme is to ride the 2500K because there's nothing meaningfully better, but there has been product that's meaningfully better for a year now. 
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Jun 10, 2019 14:47
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Add me to the legion of 2500k havers. Mine isn't even overclocked.
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Jun 10, 2019 14:55
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You're just leaving a 30%+ performance boost on the table if you're not overclocking it. Stock clocks on a 2500k are extremely conservative, you can often get upwards of 4ghz on stock voltages alone without goosing it. Put that chip out in pasture in a burning blaze of glory.
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Jun 10, 2019 15:02
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Klyith posted:As always it all depends on what you're doing with the computer, and what else is in the system. When I put together my Ivy Bridge system back then I was playing different games, but as it aged I didn't care as much because I wasn't playing stuff where max-CPU was as big a deal (mp FPS w/ graphics set low). It's funny how Sandy/Ivy bridge processors are some of Intel's all time greatest. Even with mitigations they blow everything else from that time frame out of the water. Hell, I had a 3570k that I just replaced. Looked up some comparison benches and in terms of single core performance, I really didn't gain much with my 2700.
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Jun 10, 2019 15:21
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Lube banjo posted:If you can increase size by a smidge, to Mini-DTX, the https://www.asus.com/Motherboards/ROG-Crosshair-VIII-Impact/ seems to be good according to that buildzoid guy That does sound very interesting, but i'm guessing it's going to be very pricey, and are there any SFF cases for DTX boards? e: it looks like my intended case, the Core 500, will happily take DTX boards, so it's just down to how much of a premium it is over the B450-I. Lungboy fucked around with this message at 15:39 on Jun 10, 2019 |
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Jun 10, 2019 15:36
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BangersInMyKnickers posted:You're just leaving a 30%+ performance boost on the table if you're not overclocking it. Stock clocks on a 2500k are extremely conservative, you can often get upwards of 4ghz on stock voltages alone without goosing it. Put that chip out in pasture in a burning blaze of glory. Got my 2500k @ 4.5 but even at 4k which is supposedly totally GPU bound, the minimums suck pretty bad and I can barely netflix/youtube in HD and play a game at the same time. Cores are just pegged all the drat time.
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Jun 10, 2019 15:54
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BangersInMyKnickers posted:You're just leaving a 30%+ performance boost on the table if you're not overclocking it. Stock clocks on a 2500k are extremely conservative, you can often get upwards of 4ghz on stock voltages alone without goosing it. Put that chip out in pasture in a burning blaze of glory. I am apparently very bad at overclocking and have never been able to get an overclock to be stable. Got a Cooler Master Hyper 212 Plus when I did the build in 2011, and the last time I really tried again in 2015 I got a Cryorig H7. It still just gets too hot and throttles, eventually crashes, and I just got tired of loving with it.
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Jun 10, 2019 16:09
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Seamonster posted:Got my 2500k @ 4.5 but even at 4k which is supposedly totally GPU bound, the minimums suck pretty bad and I can barely netflix/youtube in HD and play a game at the same time. Cores are just pegged all the drat time. You get the same problem on some of the more modern CPUs with low core counts. Even the 9400 and 9600 CPUs have stuttering on certain titles like Farcry. You just need to pick one task for good performance.
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Jun 10, 2019 16:09
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Seamonster posted:Got my 2500k @ 4.5 but even at 4k which is supposedly totally GPU bound, the minimums suck pretty bad and I can barely netflix/youtube in HD and play a game at the same time. Cores are just pegged all the drat time. Only a few more weeks friend! Wait it out!
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Jun 10, 2019 16:10
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While core count limitations matter, the bigger thing that tends to hold back Sandy/Ivy systems is that most people bought 1333mhz ram, which in hindsight turned out to be a really stupid idea.
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Jun 10, 2019 16:20
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I was never able to get a stable overclock on it.
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Jun 10, 2019 17:11
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The only logical upgrade for a 2500k is the 2600k.
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Jun 10, 2019 17:22
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K8.0 posted:While core count limitations matter, the bigger thing that tends to hold back Sandy/Ivy systems is that most people bought 1333mhz ram, which in hindsight turned out to be a really stupid idea. I picked up 2200mhz ram at some point but my i5-3550 still ends up having troubles when paired with a 1080ti on a couple games that really prefer more cores (hey metro exodus you kinda ran poorly at 1440p depending on what was going on even on medium sometimes) I finished the game anyway but am definitely feeling the CPU being old now on some things
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Jun 10, 2019 17:23
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APUs have leaked, kinda meh  https://videocardz.com/newz/amd-ryzen-3-3200g-and-ryzen-5-3400g-specs-and-pricing-leaks-out e: ah, i forgot, these are still Zen+ so yeah. same dies as before with better binning it seems. Cygni fucked around with this message at 19:00 on Jun 10, 2019 |
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Jun 10, 2019 18:52
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Cygni posted:APUs have leaked, kinda meh are 3200g and 3400g just refreshes? i mean those L3 caches are not like the others.
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Jun 10, 2019 19:05
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Gamecache? The what? Also they look like refreshes indeed with just PCIE3 support.
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Jun 10, 2019 19:10
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Good gravy seeing those caches next to Intel is wild. Didn't they confirm a while back that the 3000 APUs were a Raven Ridge based, not Picasso? Maybe I'm just thinking of the mobile chips.
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Jun 10, 2019 19:20
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Sininu posted:Gamecache? The what? It's CPU cache, and you use it to play games, therefore it's now GameCACHE(tm).
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Jun 10, 2019 19:23
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wargames posted:are 3200g and 3400g just refreshes? i mean those L3 caches are not like the others. APUs are a generation behind the CPUs so they're going from original recipe Zen on 14nm to Zen+ on 12nm this gen. EDIT: vvv  vvv
Mr.Radar fucked around with this message at 20:15 on Jun 10, 2019 |
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Jun 10, 2019 19:31
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https://twitter.com/VideoCardz/status/1138152770895273986 https://twitter.com/VideoCardz/status/1138155745223028737 repiv fucked around with this message at 19:48 on Jun 10, 2019 |
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Jun 10, 2019 19:45
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welp, bye bye Q3 bonus, you will be used well.
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Jun 10, 2019 20:12
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With those RAM speeds and such a huge cache it actually has a chance at beating the 9900KS even when both are overclocked. This should be interesting! When are we getting the first Zen 2 benchmarks?
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Jun 10, 2019 20:20
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So in order to get the most out of Zen 2 I'll have to buy very fast and very expensive RAM?
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Jun 10, 2019 20:21
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spasticColon posted:So in order to get the most out of Zen 2 I'll have to buy very fast and very expensive RAM? Only if you have an application that would actually benefit from a 3950X running at full tilt (and which you're not already throwing a Threadripper or EPYC at). Stickman fucked around with this message at 20:57 on Jun 10, 2019 |
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Jun 10, 2019 20:23
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spasticColon posted:So in order to get the most out of Zen 2 I'll have to buy very fast and very expensive RAM? That tweet came right after the one about the 3950X release date so it's probably talking about that specifically. A 16-core CPU with a dual-channel bus needing very high memory clocks for best results isn't exactly surprising.
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Jun 10, 2019 20:24
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You could also buy cheap RAM and overclock it
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Jun 10, 2019 20:29
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Stickman posted:Only if you have an application that would actually benefit from a 3950X running at full tilt (and you're not already throwing a Threadripper or EPYC at). Oh okay. I'm probably still going to get a 3700X for gaming but I'm going to wait for benchmarks. But If the 3700X isn't much faster than the 3600X in gaming benchmarks I might just get a 3600X. I don't do streaming so do I need those extra cores/threads?
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Jun 10, 2019 20:30
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spasticColon posted:Oh okay. I'm probably still going to get a 3700X for gaming but I'm going to wait for benchmarks. But If the 3700X isn't any faster than the 3600X in gaming benchmarks I might just get a 3600X. I don't do streaming so do I need those extra cores/threads? Or is Cyberpunk 2077 going to need a 8C/16T chip to run it at 60fps? If you're budget sensitive then the 3600X is likely to be the sweet spot, and spend the money that you saved on more GPU. This applies double if you're intending to play at 4K or anything higher than 1440p.
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Jun 10, 2019 20:32
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Twerk from Home posted:If you're budget sensitive then the 3600X is likely to be the sweet spot, and spend the money that you saved on more GPU. This applies double if you're intending to play at 4K or anything higher than 1440p. I still have a GTX1070 I'm still happy with so I would probably put that money towards more RAM or a bigger SSD.
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Jun 10, 2019 20:32
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The next gen consoles are going to be 8C/16T Zen2 parts so your build will be below the baseline in a year-ish if you go 6C/12T.
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Jun 10, 2019 20:34
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Videocardz is tweeting out basically the entire presentation right now  https://twitter.com/VideoCardz/status/1138168405461262338 https://twitter.com/VideoCardz/status/1138167811082280960 https://twitter.com/VideoCardz/status/1138167180015603716
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Jun 10, 2019 20:39
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repiv posted:The next gen consoles are going to be 8C/16T Zen2 parts so your build will be below the baseline in a year-ish if you go 6C/12T. I know that. I also know that consoles will lock 1-2 of their CPU cores for the OS/streaming/background tasks thus leaving 6-7 cores for games. But like I mentioned, I'm waiting for benchmarks to see how it shakes out.
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Jun 10, 2019 20:42
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repiv posted:The next gen consoles are going to be 8C/16T Zen2 parts so your build will be below the baseline in a year-ish if you go 6C/12T. Consoles are also likely to be at a lower TDP and not top bins. If they ship consoles with something identical to a 3700X or higher I’d be pretty surprised.
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Jun 10, 2019 21:01
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The amount of L3 on the 3900X almost looks like a typo
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Jun 10, 2019 21:01
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