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All this sudden talk about Corregidor is fun because someone made a module for it for Advanced Squad Leader and I bought it on a whim and I'll get to see how its interpreted before I eventually maybe play a campaign game of it 
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Sep 3, 2019 16:47
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Book question: Should I read The War that Ended Peace by Margaret MacMillan or The Sleepwalkers by Christopher Clark or both of them?
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Sep 3, 2019 16:53
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So, I did my thing on Alcock, now I'm researching Brown. My question is basically "what did brown do as a second Lt. before transferring to the RFC?" Alcock joined up and trained with the Public school battalion, and was...gazetted? as a 2nd Lt. in January 1915. (I know gazetted means "made" and this has something to do with some tradition where, I don't know, their name is written down, possibly in The Gazette, but it still throws me slightly.) Brown then is assigned to the Manchester regiment, and arrives on the Western Front in time for the second battle of Ypres. He then ----- is there, apparently sticking around for battle of the somme in some capacity, though hopefully not being involved in Beaumont Hammel. He then - at some point - transfers to the RFC, where he's an observer, and is shot down the last time during the battle of Loos. Maybe Brown managed to get out of the bad bits, but I'm curious because his time serving on the ground could potentially put him in a bunch of horrific spots. Which would be doubly bad as Brown was an American citizen who renounced his citizenship to enlist.
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Sep 3, 2019 17:11
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Nebakenezzer posted:Alcock joined up and trained with the Public school battalion, and was...gazetted? as a 2nd Lt. in January 1915. (I know gazetted means "made" and this has something to do with some tradition where, I don't know, their name is written down, possibly in The Gazette, but it still throws me slightly.) It means there's an official announcement in this that the dude's been made an officer, yes.
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Sep 3, 2019 17:15
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:Book question: I haven't read MacMillan, but you should absolutely read Clark.
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Sep 3, 2019 17:16
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Xiahou Dun posted:You know, considering that big chunks of this are nominally Hawaii before it was even a US state, that is an aggressive amount of only showing white people. Like to the point that it couldn't be accidental, someone was definitely spending effort to white-wash this. I had been avoiding this because it looked bad, but your comment made me check the trailer and lmao.  I'm pretty sure the 1976 version got it better.* That's some impressive four-decade backsliding.For reference, according to census data, there were about 112k white people in Hawaii in 1940 versus about 158k Japanese alone, about 88k other Asians, and about 64k native Hawaiians. I'm sure the naval base and its environs skewed whiter due to military segregation, but even there it's not gonna look like Iowa. *Not that Midway (1976) is a great movie, but at least you get a storyline revolving around a Japanese American character plus Toshiro Mifune chewing scenery as Yamamoto.
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Sep 3, 2019 17:28
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JcDent posted:A lot of people don't know poo poo! It's honestly insane to think of the Germans pulling off a triphibious assault in late 1943 and even more so when you consider that they not only won but held the territory gained until the end of the war. It may be the final lasting German victory aside from maybe the Battle of Garfagnana which when you think about was also the only successful Italian offensive of the entire war 
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Sep 3, 2019 17:34
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I liked the battleship movie. I appreciate the attempts at a tactically intense battle and the variety of weapons used in the attempt to convey a flexible command response to events.
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Sep 3, 2019 17:37
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Jobbo_Fett posted:All this sudden talk about Corregidor is fun because someone made a module for it for Advanced Squad Leader and I bought it on a whim and I'll get to see how its interpreted before I eventually maybe play a campaign game of it Does it include burning $20 million dollars and hiding a silver stash in the tunnels as a mission objective?
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Sep 3, 2019 17:39
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Raenir Salazar posted:I liked the battleship movie. I appreciate the attempts at a tactically intense battle and the variety of weapons used in the attempt to convey a flexible command response to events. The weirdest thing about that movie is that they made a plot point of the aliens not being inherently hostile and the whole thing being a misunderstanding then didn't do anything with it.
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Sep 3, 2019 17:48
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JcDent posted:Googling Corregidor brought me to this There was a movie about this recently called The Great Raid, based on the book Ghost Soldiers. So far as the raid goes, it was well done. Unlike most films it did a pretty credible job of showing you the tactical planning of the raid and how it went off pretty much as they planned it, which is what lead to those lopsided casualty figures. The love story subplot was annoying.
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Sep 3, 2019 17:56
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Nenonen posted:Does it include burning $20 million dollars and hiding a silver stash in the tunnels as a mission objective? Don't have the scenarios on-hand at the moment but I'll check when I do in like 3 weeks.
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Sep 3, 2019 17:59
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P-Mack posted:The weirdest thing about that movie is that they made a plot point of the aliens not being inherently hostile and the whole thing being a misunderstanding then didn't do anything with it. IIRC they are hostile, but they happened to have a fairly well developed rules of engagement. They absolutely struck first at military stuff and we're clearly preparing for an invasion, but might have not been like war crimey about it.
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Sep 3, 2019 18:00
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dublish posted:I haven't read MacMillan, but you should absolutely read Clark.
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Sep 3, 2019 18:11
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Xiahou Dun posted:You know, considering that big chunks of this are nominally Hawaii before it was even a US state, that is an aggressive amount of only showing white people. Like to the point that it couldn't be accidental, someone was definitely spending effort to white-wash this. Never underestimate the sheer lack of knowledge that Americans can bring to bear when recounting parts of our national mythos. 
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Sep 3, 2019 18:41
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Raenir Salazar posted:IIRC they are hostile, but they happened to have a fairly well developed rules of engagement. They absolutely struck first at military stuff and we're clearly preparing for an invasion, but might have not been like war crimey about it. I think there's supposed to be some parallels to the US forces and the aliens, and this is one of them. The aliens also do a dramatic "rescue captured buddy" raid too. Also the foghorn exchange thing.
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Sep 3, 2019 19:21
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wdarkk posted:I think there's supposed to be some parallels to the US forces and the aliens, and this is one of them. The aliens also do a dramatic "rescue captured buddy" raid too. Also the foghorn exchange thing. Makes me wonder if the whole movie was meant to be a stealth reference to the Millennium Challenge.
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Sep 3, 2019 19:34
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Raenir Salazar posted:I liked the battleship movie. I appreciate the attempts at a tactically intense battle and the variety of weapons used in the attempt to convey a flexible command response to events. Also drifting in a battleship.
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Sep 3, 2019 20:09
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The weirdness of the alien rules of engagement is one of my favourite things about that movie. After the scene where they drift in a battleship
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Sep 3, 2019 20:12
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Fangz posted:The weirdness of the alien rules of engagement is one of my favourite things about that movie. I love that everyone celebrates at the end like it's all over and the aliens can't just come back whenever they want with more ships and less restraint. It's kind of trying to make an imperialism analogy but not trying hard enough to actually get all the way there. That weirdness is why it stuck in my brain in the first place so maybe it's actually good?
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Sep 3, 2019 20:20
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Does anyone go "You sank my battleship"? Also what kind of naval task force was this that was operating a BB in 2012? Per the documentary Under Siege, the last USN battleship was decommissioned in 1992
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Sep 3, 2019 20:36
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zoux posted:Does anyone go "You sank my battleship"? You haven't seen the movie? Go see it. they get a bunch of old people to restore the Missouri to combat status
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Sep 3, 2019 20:50
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P-Mack posted:I love that everyone celebrates at the end like it's all over and the aliens can't just come back whenever they want with more ships and less restraint. Weren't they trying to start a Milton Bradley Cinematic Universe with Battleship? Maybe the aliens were going to come back in Hungry Hungry Hippos?
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Sep 3, 2019 20:56
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Not in a million years, so tell me what the movie says a ship lain down in 1940 brings to the fight that a modern carrier group can't Would an Iowa class even be a match for a Ticonderoga?
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Sep 3, 2019 20:58
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The aliens throw up a force field between themselves and the rest of the Navy. Once that goes away they get clowned pretty handily.
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Sep 3, 2019 21:08
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The submarines sneak under the force field, right?
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Sep 3, 2019 21:10
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zoux posted:Not in a million years, so tell me what the movie says a ship lain down in 1940 brings to the fight that a modern carrier group can't EMP pulse wrecks the Tic’s computers! What now little missile cruiser? What now! Uh... does anyone recall how to shoot the big guns?
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Sep 3, 2019 21:13
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LingcodKilla posted:EMP pulse wrecks the Tic’s computers! What now little missile cruiser? What now! RAMMING SPEED Also I would hope that the US surface fleet is EMP hardened.
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Sep 3, 2019 21:16
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zoux posted:RAMMING SPEED Look it’s a really big EMP. Also a cruiser would not win a ramming match with a battleship.
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Sep 3, 2019 21:19
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In the movie the Iowa's main asset is resilience against the aliens' peg-missile things. Given that they seem similar to semi-armor piercing ammunition that might actually work.
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Sep 3, 2019 21:24
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Isn't it also a thing with the aliens' rules of engagement? That the aliens considered the more modern ships as hostile already but fail to recognise the Missouri as a threat until it gets close enough to launch a broadside?
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Sep 3, 2019 21:28
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Battleship is an exceptionally silly movie and honestly I can't hate it.
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Sep 3, 2019 21:29
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LingcodKilla posted:Look it’s a really big EMP. Also a cruiser would not win a ramming match with a battleship. According to the documentary series The Last Ship, a Burke ramming a latin american Iowa-class battleship will cause both of them to explode in a spectacular fireball. Also, aliens in Battleship did nothing wrong.
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Sep 3, 2019 21:35
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oh my god I forgot how incredibly stupid and incredible this scene was https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMdKnZKOhwk
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Sep 3, 2019 21:36
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LingcodKilla posted:Also a cruiser would not win a ramming match with a battleship. You just need to mount a poo poo-ton of spar torpedoes on the cruiser.
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Sep 3, 2019 21:37
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Gervasius posted:According to the documentary series The Last Ship, a Burke ramming a latin american Iowa-class battleship will cause both of them to explode in a spectacular fireball. *has a look of ever-increasing horror slowly expand across his face*
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Sep 3, 2019 21:40
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Taerkar posted:*has a look of ever-increasing horror slowly expand across his face* Yeah, it sounds stupid, and it is stupid and the show knows its stupid and rolls with it. After really mediocre first season it embraces stupidity and becomes a great dumb show to be honest.
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Sep 3, 2019 21:43
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Acebuckeye13 posted:oh my god I forgot how incredibly stupid and incredible this scene was Whose loving alien nephew was put in charge of the invasion of earth. Also what passage in Art of War advocates battleship drifting. Why is Lt. Tim Riggins commanding a battleship.
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Sep 3, 2019 21:44
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Gervasius posted:Yeah, it sounds stupid, and it is stupid and the show knows its stupid and rolls with it. After really mediocre first season it embraces stupidity and becomes a great dumb show to be honest. The commercials for it made it seem like a discount Tom Clancy show.
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Sep 3, 2019 21:44
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Acebuckeye13 posted:I've got some bad news. Did they cast Nick Jonas as Dick Best? Am I understanding this correctly? As silly as it may be I find that kind of upsetting.
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Sep 3, 2019 21:58
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