[BOOK SPOILERS] Robert Jordan's Waste of Time -- so cheesy but so good

The Something Awful Forums > The Finer Arts > The Book Barn > [BOOK SPOILERS] Robert Jordan's Waste of Time -- so cheesy but so good

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The Neal!: Sep 3, 2004; HAY GUYZ! I want to be a director

Oh jesus,

all this time when you guys were talking about numbered books I thought the one after Winter's Heart was Knife of Dreams and I kept thinking "these guys are weird, knife of dreams is way less of a slog than winter's heart, surely that's not the one to skip"

I think I deleted Crossroads from my brain. Christ that book was bad.

Good luck dude!

# ? Mar 20, 2020 01:38

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# ? Apr 26, 2024 09:06

awesmoe: Nov 30, 2005; Pillbug

What number was the one with the mat/tuon bit where he meets back up with the army? The mat bits of those books were good

# ? Mar 20, 2020 02:01

Invalid Validation: Jan 13, 2008

awesmoe posted:

All the mat bits are good

Fixed it for you.

# ? Mar 20, 2020 03:36

Old Kentucky Shark: May 25, 2012; If you think you're gonna get sympathy from the shark, well then, you won't.

awesmoe posted:

What number was the one with the mat/tuon bit where he meets back up with the army? The mat bits of those books were good

That's Book 11, Knife of Dreams, the last of the Jordan books.

I would argue that everything but the Elayne and Faile bits of that bit were good, even the Perrin bits. Unfortunately, there's a lot of Elayne.

# ? Mar 20, 2020 12:36

Invalid Validation: Jan 13, 2008

Is there a reason he liked Elayne so much?

# ? Mar 20, 2020 22:43

Khizan: Jul 30, 2013

Old Kentucky Shark posted:

That's Book 11, Knife of Dreams, the last of the Jordan books.

I would argue that everything but the Elayne and Faile bits of that bit were good, even the Perrin bits. Unfortunately, there's a lot of Elayne.

If you remove the Elayne/Perrin/Faile bits, I'm pretty sure the book is like 70% shorter.

# ? Mar 20, 2020 23:00

Vavrek: Mar 2, 2013; I like your style hombre, but this is no laughing matter. Assault on a police officer. Theft of police property. Illegal possession of a firearm. FIVE counts of attempted murder. That comes to... 29 dollars and 40 cents. Cash, cheque, or credit card?

Invalid Validation posted:

Is there a reason he liked Elayne so much?

It suddenly occurs to me that she's everything Harriet/Moghedian wasn't.

edit: Like, I don't think that was it. The thought just happened to spring into my head.

Vavrek fucked around with this message at 23:32 on Mar 20, 2020

# ? Mar 20, 2020 23:28

Anias: Jun 3, 2010; It really is a lovely hat

Vavrek posted:

It suddenly occurs to me that she's everything Harriet/Moghedian wasn't.

edit: Like, I don't think that was it. The thought just happened to spring into my head.

Jordan commented that all of the female characters were influenced by his wife. So elayne and moghedian are Harriet arguing with herself if she should be bold or cautious.

# ? Mar 20, 2020 23:49

The Glumslinger: Sep 24, 2008; Coach Nagy, you want me to throw to WHAT side of the field?; Hair Elf

Still my favorite interview answer

quote:

Question
I was wondering, can you talk about how your lead character would have not one but three true loves, and how does your wife feel about that?

Robert Jordan
Um, when I was much younger, before I met Harriet, I had two girlfriends simultaneously, who arranged my dating schedule between them, who was going to date me on which night. They chipped in together to buy me birthday presents and Christmas presents. You know, they just sort of shared me between them, you know. And they had been friends before, and I am not quite sure whether or not they made the decision they were both going to date me or not, on their own, before they first met me, it just came about. But I figured if I could manage two, surely Rand could manage three. Besides there are mythological reasons to have these three women involved with him.

https://www.theoryland.com/intvmain.php?i=204

# ? Mar 21, 2020 00:01

silvergoose: Mar 18, 2006; IT IS SAID THE TEARS OF THE BWEENIX CAN HEAL ALL WOUNDS

...okay yeah it's mine too, now, holy crap.

# ? Mar 21, 2020 00:04

Invalid Validation: Jan 13, 2008

Perfect

# ? Mar 21, 2020 00:09

Gnoman: Feb 12, 2014; Come, all you fair and tender maids
Who flourish in your pri-ime
Beware, take care, keep your garden fair
Let Gnoman steal your thy-y-me
Le-et Gnoman steal your thyme

The impression I got from the Elayne chapters was that Jordan was trying very hard to have an excuse for Andor falling apart, because leaving it intact would screw up the core idea of forging a broken land together. The initial breaking of the kingdom worked for that, but an orderly succession after the Dragon solved that problem would heal things too well and too soon.

So he had to have a succession crisis, and handled it poorly.

# ? Mar 21, 2020 00:18

silvergoose: Mar 18, 2006; IT IS SAID THE TEARS OF THE BWEENIX CAN HEAL ALL WOUNDS

Gnoman posted:

The impression I got from the Elayne chapters was that Jordan was trying very hard to have an excuse for Andor falling apart, because leaving it intact would screw up the core idea of forging a broken land together. The initial breaking of the kingdom worked for that, but an orderly succession after the Dragon solved that problem would heal things too well and too soon.

So he had to have a succession crisis, and handled it poorly.

You mean he had to have a succession crisis, and for it to have been handled poorly?

# ? Mar 21, 2020 00:20

Gnoman: Feb 12, 2014; Come, all you fair and tender maids
Who flourish in your pri-ime
Beware, take care, keep your garden fair
Let Gnoman steal your thy-y-me
Le-et Gnoman steal your thyme

silvergoose posted:

You mean he had to have a succession crisis, and for it to have been handled poorly?

No, I mean that he handled the succession crisis poorly. The core concepts were sound, but he didn't use them well.

# ? Mar 21, 2020 00:21

Mat Cauthon: Jan 2, 2006; The more tragic things get,
the more I feel like laughing.

The Glumslinger posted:

Still my favorite interview answer

https://www.theoryland.com/intvmain.php?i=204

Big sub energy.

# ? Mar 21, 2020 00:25

Vavrek: Mar 2, 2013; I like your style hombre, but this is no laughing matter. Assault on a police officer. Theft of police property. Illegal possession of a firearm. FIVE counts of attempted murder. That comes to... 29 dollars and 40 cents. Cash, cheque, or credit card?

Anias posted:

Jordan commented that all of the female characters were influenced by his wife. So elayne and moghedian are Harriet arguing with herself if she should be bold or cautious.

Yeah, that's what he said, but I'd heard Harriet always claimed Moghedien was the closest, or had the most aspects of her, something like that. Actually digging for a quote, however, led me to this interview:

Theoryland, a good site posted:

Dragonmount
What is your reaction to Robert telling people that all of the major female characters are partially based off of you? Doesn't that worry you a bit?

Harriet McDougal Rigney
No, it doesn't worry me. I am immensely flattered by it. And a bit amused. The cross wife who says, "you forgot to take the garbage out again": Is this REALLY Moghedien? Goodness!

From the same interview:

quote:

Dragonmount
Do you ever call your husband Robert instead of his real name?

Harriet McDougal Rigney
Only on book tour.

Dragonmount
Even if you're mad at him?

Harriet McDougal Rigney
When I'm mad at him I call him a word that begins with A, with a lot of asterisks in it, or Warrior God, Perfect in Every Way. It is my contention that these mean the same thing...

# ? Mar 21, 2020 04:03

ConfusedUs: Feb 24, 2004; Bees?
You want fucking bees?
Here you go!
ROLL INITIATIVE!!

Vavrek posted:

Yeah, that's what he said, but I'd heard Harriet always claimed Moghedien was the closest, or had the most aspects of her, something like that. Actually digging for a quote, however, led me to this interview:

From the same interview:

# ? Mar 21, 2020 04:36

VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE: Aug 1, 2004; whoa, what just happened here?; College Slice

Show runners with cabin (or real) fever so now they're talking about how they're doing the show.

https://www.wotseries.com/2020/03/22/show-runner-rafe-judkins-does-an-ama-on-instagram/

# ? Mar 23, 2020 20:54

silvergoose: Mar 18, 2006; IT IS SAID THE TEARS OF THE BWEENIX CAN HEAL ALL WOUNDS

drat. So excited.

# ? Mar 23, 2020 21:14

VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE: Aug 1, 2004; whoa, what just happened here?; College Slice

silvergoose posted:

drat. So excited.

To be fair he might be delirious

# ? Mar 23, 2020 21:17

Eh! Frank: Mar 28, 2006; Doctor gave me these, I said what are these?
He said that they'll cure an existential type disease

VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE posted:

Show runners with cabin (or real) fever so now they're talking about how they're doing the show.

https://www.wotseries.com/2020/03/22/show-runner-rafe-judkins-does-an-ama-on-instagram/

Awww, I was really excited about Lucy Lawless until he said that was for another show

I really want her on the show now. She'd be a perfect Aes Sedai since she doesn't age irl

# ? Mar 23, 2020 21:30

VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE: Aug 1, 2004; whoa, what just happened here?; College Slice

Eh! Frank posted:

Awww, I was really excited about Lucy Lawless until he said that was for another show I really want her on the show now. She'd be a perfect Aes Sedai since she doesn't age irl

Moghedien, get her out of character.

# ? Mar 23, 2020 22:15

calandryll: Apr 25, 2003; Ask me where I do my best drinking!; Pillbug

Well she did play a demon in Ash vs Evil Dead. So definitely some kind of Black Ajah.

# ? Mar 23, 2020 22:20

Invalid Validation: Jan 13, 2008

Would have to be a main character since she steals every show she�s in.

# ? Mar 23, 2020 22:38

ConfusedUs: Feb 24, 2004; Bees?
You want fucking bees?
Here you go!
ROLL INITIATIVE!!

Eh! Frank posted:

Awww, I was really excited about Lucy Lawless until he said that was for another show I really want her on the show now. She'd be a perfect Aes Sedai since she doesn't age irl

Myrelle or Moghedian are my choices.

# ? Mar 23, 2020 22:38

Comrade Blyatlov: Aug 4, 2007; should have picked four fingers

Oooo, she would make a great Myrelle

# ? Mar 23, 2020 23:00

VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE: Aug 1, 2004; whoa, what just happened here?; College Slice

They do need to play up the Forsaken a bit though--in the books you get more views of them as bumbling squabbling malcontent incompetents, but to normal people they're still terrifying as gently caress. The scenes of like, the Black Ajah or Darkfriends groveling in front of some of them aside, Morgase's arc kicking off in book 5 is loving like, unreal.

I'd like to see more of that, though not, that, specifically.

# ? Mar 23, 2020 23:30

Anias: Jun 3, 2010; It really is a lovely hat

Yeah some entirely show canon pov from the forsaken being competent in securing whatever goals they choose seems good.

In particular ishamael has a good day clips from the time when he was loose could be amazing.

# ? Mar 23, 2020 23:49

The Glumslinger: Sep 24, 2008; Coach Nagy, you want me to throw to WHAT side of the field?; Hair Elf

VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE posted:

They do need to play up the Forsaken a bit though--in the books you get more views of them as bumbling squabbling malcontent incompetents, but to normal people they're still terrifying as gently caress. The scenes of like, the Black Ajah or Darkfriends groveling in front of some of them aside, Morgase's arc kicking off in book 5 is loving like, unreal.

I'd like to see more of that, though not, that, specifically.

Yeah, there first 3 books basically introduce multiple foresaken like 10 pages before they get murdered by Rand

# ? Mar 23, 2020 23:52

Comrade Blyatlov: Aug 4, 2007; should have picked four fingers

Rand is like a murder elemental

He seriously has no idea what he's doing

# ? Mar 24, 2020 00:00

VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE: Aug 1, 2004; whoa, what just happened here?; College Slice

Also props to the one guy who managed to fish out that Geofram Bornhald is in S1.

# ? Mar 24, 2020 00:26

Brolander: Oct 20, 2008; i am but a vessel

dudes answers on IG were heartening. maybe this wont suck, if we ever see the dang thing with all this Emergency.

should we establish a spoiler policy for this thread, at least a warning in the title if nothing else? The TV show will be bringing more and more newbs in

# ? Mar 24, 2020 00:34

Johnny Joestar: Oct 21, 2010; Don't shoot him?

...
...

it'd probably be good to put notable spoilers under tags for sure. maybe some minor details like character names and all that wouldn't need to be covered up.

# ? Mar 24, 2020 00:38

silvergoose: Mar 18, 2006; IT IS SAID THE TEARS OF THE BWEENIX CAN HEAL ALL WOUNDS

VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE posted:

Also props to the one guy who managed to fish out that Geofram Bornhald is in S1.

I mean he's kind of essential to Perrin's entire book 1 story?

# ? Mar 24, 2020 02:54

VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE: Aug 1, 2004; whoa, what just happened here?; College Slice

silvergoose posted:

I mean he's kind of essential to Perrin's entire book 1 story?

There was some speculation that Eamon Valda being announced so early and Geofram hadn't that the roles had been combined.

But Bornhalds and Perrins arc really goes all the way through ToM, so

Though the actor for Geofram really would be one and done for Season 1, of course

# ? Mar 24, 2020 03:03

Comrade Blyatlov: Aug 4, 2007; should have picked four fingers

Surprise! It's actually Ramsay and Roose Bolton!

# ? Mar 24, 2020 03:18

VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE: Aug 1, 2004; whoa, what just happened here?; College Slice

Sean Bean is probably available, just saying

# ? Mar 24, 2020 03:33

Comrade Blyatlov: Aug 4, 2007; should have picked four fingers

I thought he was Yamcha in the next live-action Dragon Ball

# ? Mar 24, 2020 03:50

VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE: Aug 1, 2004; whoa, what just happened here?; College Slice

Guy also teased the first appearance of Aiel in the series being surprising or shocking.

What are our options here

# ? Mar 25, 2020 00:57

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# ? Apr 26, 2024 09:06

JavaJesus: Jul 4, 2007

My main guess is that Egwene will get one or more Dreams early on, letting us see or possibly even hear from one of the Wise Ones. Also possible is Aviendha, but the only real way I can see that working is a side story with her (like The Expanse show did for Avasarala during the events of the first book) so I feel like that's less likely than something they can work into the early story of the main cast.

# ? Mar 25, 2020 01:34

The Something Awful Forums > The Finer Arts > The Book Barn > [BOOK SPOILERS] Robert Jordan's Waste of Time -- so cheesy but so good

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