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Trying to think of examples in other media that flubbed the landing so hard that it retroactively tainted or even ruined everything that came before. Dexter, though it never hit the heights that GoT did. Sleater-Kinney's last album kind of did that for me. They used to be my favorite band. I think Rise of Skywalker did that for some people but the prequels did it for me and make me regard the OT in a lesser light, namely that they were and always had been perfectly decent kiddie films (which is probably the correct take anyway). Others?
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Jun 13, 2020 18:46
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regulargonzalez posted:Trying to think of examples in other media that flubbed the landing so hard that it retroactively tainted or even ruined everything that came before. Dexter, though it never hit the heights that GoT did. I think it's come up in this putrefying zombie of a thread before, but Dexter's lovely final seasons and ending don't retroactively ruin the good parts of that show because Dexter never relied on an overarching plot -- there were season-long arcs with a main antagonist, but for the most part it was an episodic thriller/drama about an interesting character doing interesting things, and knowing that he ends up in a stupid place for stupid reasons doesn't make it any less fun to see him overcoming the mostly-unrelated challenges of the previous seasons. I think the only one that fits the bill is LOST.
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Jun 13, 2020 22:19
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How I Met Your Mother, definitely
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Jun 13, 2020 22:21
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Phenotype posted:
I checked out of Lost after s1 but I haven't heard anything good about the ending. I also checked out of BSG after Roslyn's cancer was cured -- before that it seemed like an interesting show that was willing to take chances, go places, kill off characters. Anyway, I've heard it has a terrible ending too but not sure if it was bad enough to retroactively ruin the show.
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Jun 13, 2020 22:23
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I started a rewatch of Lost a couple of times now and I always stop after the episode where Juliette and Kate are handcuffed together in the jungle because it's just not going to get any better than that, although Locke running around and blowing poo poo up is a close second.
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Jun 13, 2020 22:38
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I think lost became more exclusionary over time, especially due to the mystical content. This leaves a lot of people who simply just lost interest or got behind or simply could not remember, which I feel muted the disappointment and frustration of the longer fans to outsiders. Game of Thrones was easy to jump into for audiences because the first seasons are COMPELLING drama, and I think this made for easy binging -- accessibility. Even if you missed a season or two, latecomers were able to catch up to the storyline pretty quickly, since alliances could be inferred by house and by relationship with just a bit of extra context. So EVERYONE was looking forward to this big mystery, not just a bunch of nerds with personal theories about polar bears and manhole covers. The books gave it legitimacy. It assuaged a lot of doubts believing that the books would lend structure to the narrative by the end. Wasabi the J fucked around with this message at 22:57 on Jun 13, 2020 |
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Jun 13, 2020 22:54
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regulargonzalez posted:Trying to think of examples in other media that flubbed the landing so hard that it retroactively tainted or even ruined everything that came before. Dexter, though it never hit the heights that GoT did. Sleater-Kinney's last album kind of did that for me. They used to be my favorite band. I think Rise of Skywalker did that for some people but the prequels did it for me and make me regard the OT in a lesser light, namely that they were and always had been perfectly decent kiddie films (which is probably the correct take anyway). Others? the classic modern answer is the original Mass Effect trilogy
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Jun 14, 2020 00:41
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regulargonzalez posted:Trying to think of examples in other media that flubbed the landing so hard that it retroactively tainted or even ruined everything that came before. I was WAY into Star Wars as a kid and the prequels absolutely torched my reverence for the franchise. I watched the new ones, but genuinely didn’t care what happened because my good faith for it died after the prequels. Game of Thrones is especially frustrating because at least you can watch the Star Wars OT or first Matrix and experience a full story. GoT builds and builds and demands a conclusion, even during the “good” seasons. You can’t just “stop while it’s good,” because there are seasons-long threads that should lead somewhere. But where they lead is trash.
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Jun 14, 2020 08:40
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Pattonesque posted:the classic modern answer is the original Mass Effect trilogy Ehhhhh trust me one of the big reasons I decided to spoil myself about GoT's ending was that I went in completely blind to the shitshow that was the ending of ME3, and I got so upset that I think I subconsciously made the vow to myself to always spoil myself about something I cared that much about to prevent that level of anger from ever happening again. But the Extended Cut did do enough to rehabilitate ME3's ending enough to me that, while I still don't like it entirely, I don't let it prevent me from doing replays of the franchise. Plus then Citadel came out and... well, it's just blatant fanservice but somehow done so amazingly well. In addition, ME3 has legitimately what I regard as the franchise's best writing and highest point- Tuchanka. ME3 lets me headcanon (and to some extent mod) to turn it into an ending that I find tolerable. There is no headcanon or re-written ending that lets me escape how terrible GoT was.
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Jun 14, 2020 15:15
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Sky Shadowing posted:Ehhhhh trust me one of the big reasons I decided to spoil myself about GoT's ending was that I went in completely blind to the shitshow that was the ending of ME3, and I got so upset that I think I subconsciously made the vow to myself to always spoil myself about something I cared that much about to prevent that level of anger from ever happening again. ME didn't die until the horrid effort that was Andromeda and even Andromeda had redeeming qualities. It was still poo poo, don't get me wrong, but I can see things they tried to do. I still blame EA for most of the downfall.
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Jun 14, 2020 15:45
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Sky Shadowing posted:ME3 lets me headcanon (and to some extent mod) to turn it into an ending that I find tolerable. There is no headcanon or re-written ending that lets me escape how terrible GoT was. For me this would be the books, since they aren't finished they could contain literally anything. My favourite thing about the last seasons starting with 7 was the 100% accurate spoilers. For a while there was a mix of real and not real, and then suddenly every goddamn thing they predicted turned out to be true suggesting actual knowledge rather than mere inference. Danaerys burning the Tarlys was the moment where it was like "holy poo poo, these are all true" it owned
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Jun 14, 2020 16:54
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Sky Shadowing posted:
Even with the added "gently caress you" ending?
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Jun 14, 2020 17:39
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regulargonzalez posted:I checked out of Lost after s1 but I haven't heard anything good about the ending. I also checked out of BSG after Roslyn's cancer was cured -- before that it seemed like an interesting show that was willing to take chances, go places, kill off characters. Anyway, I've heard it has a terrible ending too but not sure if it was bad enough to retroactively ruin the show. BSG should never count because there is a point in the last season you can pretend the show ends and its perfect. Dexter has a similar argument with season four. Buffy with season five. GOT is in a league of its own because theres no point you can point to and say stop there. You need to ride it out. And it sucks. HIMYM too which is amazing for a sitcom to have an ending that fucks up that much of self contained story.
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Jun 14, 2020 18:25
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Also everyone should watch BSG anyway because it was an excellent show with something to say. The myth arc wasn't the be all and that its ending focussed on it was to its own detriment.
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Jun 14, 2020 18:26
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Koalas March posted:How I Met Your Mother, definitely Having the last season be a huge setup for a divorce a year later remains a really weird move where I don’t know what they were trying to go for
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Jun 14, 2020 18:44
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Lid posted:GOT is in a league of its own because theres no point you can point to and say stop there. You need to ride it out. And it sucks. Maybe Cersei destroying the Sept of Baelor. It was already a season past its prime, and after that point you can just say, wow the Lannisters won huh
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Jun 14, 2020 18:56
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bobjr posted:Having the last season be a huge setup for a divorce a year later remains a really weird move where I don’t know what they were trying to go for They wrote themselves into a corner because Barney and Robin worked but they already knew she had to be with Ted in the end
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Jun 14, 2020 18:57
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Lid posted:Also everyone should watch BSG anyway because it was an excellent show with something to say. The myth arc wasn't the be all and that its ending focussed on it was to its own detriment. BSG is unwatchable now; it does not hold up in the slightest.
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Jun 14, 2020 18:58
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Laterite posted:BSG is unwatchable now; it does not hold up in the slightest. Ha, even with having checked out in S3 or something my first time though this is true. I tried rewatching the first season recently and every character is an exposition machine. It's unwatchable.
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Jun 14, 2020 19:03
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Lid posted:BSG should never count because there is a point in the last season you can pretend the show ends and its perfect. Dexter has a similar argument with season four. Buffy with season five. That was a writers' strike thing, they weren't sure if they were going to be able to finish the season so they made that episode into a backdoor finale. I'll agree it doesn't hold up as well as it used to but it's already 17 years old at this point. I wouldn't recommend watching past the first 2/3 of the second season though. This is still cool:  
Captain Splendid fucked around with this message at 19:25 on Jun 14, 2020 |
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Jun 14, 2020 19:23
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The best episode of Battlestar Gallactica is the one where Feeney picks up a cylon and takes it to a costume party with Wolfman Jack.
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Jun 14, 2020 20:44
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Lid posted:HIMYM too which is amazing for a sitcom to have an ending that fucks up that much of self contained story. What was the deal with How I Met Your Mother? I never watched it, but I read something about it when it ended, like, it was set in present-day when he's married to their mother and most of the show is a flashback where he's telling an incredibly-long story about how they got together? But then the end goes back to the present-day and he divorces her and went to go be with Cobie Smulders? I don't see how that messes up years of sitcom storylines.
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Jun 14, 2020 21:22
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Phenotype posted:What was the deal with How I Met Your Mother? I never watched it, The frame story is Ted, the dad, narrating how he met his children’s mother as a younger man. But the show ran for years, focusing on numerous of Ted’s relationships, none of which with The Mother. His relationship with Cobie Smulders recurs multiple times, until she gets engaged to NPH. The last season finally introduces the Mother, and the last episode reveals that the Mother dies of some terminal disease prior to the “present” of Future Ted. Cobie Smulders’ marriage also fails, and the show ends with Future Ted proclaiming his love for her one more time. Nobody was happy. The show set up the Mother and the Barney/Robin relationship for years, then undid all of it in 22 minutes, pissing off everybody.
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Jun 14, 2020 22:34
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Phenotype posted:What was the deal with How I Met Your Mother? I never watched it, but I read something about it when it ended, like, it was set in present-day when he's married to their mother and most of the show is a flashback where he's telling an incredibly-long story about how they got together? But then the end goes back to the present-day and he divorces her and went to go be with Cobie Smulders? I don't see how that messes up years of sitcom storylines. The big issue was they spent multiple seasons explaining why the Cobie character and Ted didn't work as a couple and it wasn't anything anyone wanted at that point. But they had filmed the ending very early on in case they were canceled and ran with it anyway.
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Jun 14, 2020 22:34
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Xealot posted:The frame story is Ted, the dad, narrating how he met his children’s mother as a younger man. But the show ran for years, focusing on numerous of Ted’s relationships, none of which with The Mother. His relationship with Cobie Smulders recurs multiple times, until she gets engaged to NPH. drat. Sounds like an abrupt heel turn at the end with no foreshadowing.
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Jun 14, 2020 22:36
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All these posts and no book or dead writer. voted no stars.
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Jun 14, 2020 22:37
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Lid posted:BSG should never count because there is a point in the last season you can pretend the show ends and its perfect.
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Jun 14, 2020 22:37
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Phenotype posted:What was the deal with How I Met Your Mother? I never watched it, but I read something about it when it ended, like, it was set in present-day when he's married to their mother and most of the show is a flashback where he's telling an incredibly-long story about how they got together? But then the end goes back to the present-day and he divorces her and went to go be with Cobie Smulders? I don't see how that messes up years of sitcom storylines. They decided early on that he would end up with Robin some time after his wife died (who is dead by present day, which is why he is telling them the story and she is nowhere to be seen). Because of this, they filmed a scene with the kids reacting to it, and then a bunch of other reaction shots (so the kids aging wouldn't be an issue). He and Robin were on and off for a lot of the show, and then Robin and Barney were as well. The entire last season is over the course of the weekend of Robin and Barney's wedding, and Ted meets his future wife (who they made into basically a perfect character). Then in the last episode time progresses a bunch and we see her eventually die and Robin and Barney get divorced after like a year. Basically, they had wrapped up both relationships with full character arcs and then pretended none of that growth happened and actually Robin was always "the one" to him. Not sure it matters, but spoilers cause other people were doing it.
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Jun 14, 2020 22:38
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The weirdest thing was having Bob Saget do the older Ted's voice. Your voice doesn't change that much as you age.COMPAGNIE TOMMY posted:Maybe Cersei destroying the Sept of Baelor. It was already a season past its prime, and after that point you can just say, wow the Lannisters won huh Not a bad call since it set up so many great possibilities and the show runners completely hosed up on the follow through. And that sequence is just perfect with the music and everything.
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Jun 15, 2020 00:32
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Bell_ posted:This, but Season Two. But then you miss the first four episodes of season 3, including the Adama Maneuver and Tigh’s character development, which are maybe the best things that happen in the show.
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Jun 15, 2020 01:38
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remember when at the end of BSG they land on earth and all the characters go "oh hey cool, let's all split up to the ends of the earth and never see one another again" and then the kid they spent all that time trying to save lives juuuust long enough to pump out a few kids before dying as "a young woman" because they threw all the penicillin and spaceships and poo poo away? that owned
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Jun 15, 2020 03:46
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I remember some characters literally conversing about how actually humanity reset to now and it what we thought was the future is actually the present WHHHOOOOAAAAAAA And they're walking around in like a busy as street. Am I misremembering?
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Jun 15, 2020 09:44
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Most important, of course, was the ominous montage of ASIMO and AIBO robots set to Jimi Hendrix 
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Jun 15, 2020 11:51
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Wasabi the J posted:I remember some characters literally conversing about how actually humanity reset to now and it what we thought was the future is actually the present WHHHOOOOAAAAAAA None of it was the future - the Twelve Colonies were entirely separate from Earth. It was established that the Thirtheenth Tribe travelled to Earth, but they never gave a timeline for it. When they get to Earth its like 50 000 years ago, and its implied that they gave us language and writing. And yeah, it ended with a pair of kinda-angels wandering around present day New York. I'll go to bat for almost any part of BSG you care to name, but even that was a bit much.
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Jun 15, 2020 12:22
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The last season of BBC's Sherlock was so loving it bad it made its die-hard fans retroactively realize the show has always been dogshit and all its detractors were right.
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Jun 15, 2020 13:53
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Strom Cuzewon posted:None of it was the future - the Twelve Colonies were entirely separate from Earth. It was established that the Thirtheenth Tribe travelled to Earth, but they never gave a timeline for it. When they get to Earth its like 50 000 years ago, and its implied that they gave us language and writing. I can't believe I still remember this poo poo after so many years, but there were two Earths. Earth 1 was some random rear end planet that the 13th tribe settled on and then nuked itself. Earth 2 was our planet. God created the same humans independently on Earth and on Kobol through evolution. And IRC they didn't just give us language and culture, actually all modern humans decent from Hera(?) and she was the mitochondrial eve. It was all a convoluted mess that made almost zero sense.
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Jun 15, 2020 15:24
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Sankara posted:The last season of BBC's Sherlock was so loving it bad it made its die-hard fans retroactively realize the show has always been dogshit and all its detractors were right. What was it that made season...4 I think? So much worse? Was it Sherlock having a weird psychopath sister who murders people but is the victim and the people are swiftly forgotten or Moriarty being offhandedly definitely dead or John's wife being an amazing superspy but then dying almost comically? Or everything?
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Jun 15, 2020 16:40
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An insane mind posted:What was it that made season...4 I think? So much worse? Was it Sherlock having a weird psychopath sister who murders people but is the victim and the people are swiftly forgotten or Moriarty being offhandedly definitely dead or John's wife being an amazing superspy but then dying almost comically? Or everything? All of it, really.
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Jun 15, 2020 17:08
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Sankara posted:The last season of BBC's Sherlock was so loving it bad it made its die-hard fans retroactively realize the show has always been dogshit and all its detractors were right. If only. I've come home today and my wife has season 2 on.
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Jun 15, 2020 18:05
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It started out good and then very quickly jumped up its own butt and ended up being a "real-world" Dr Who with stupid plots that were clearly made up as they went along. Shows like this work best when they stick to neat, self-contained stories. The BBC doesn't have the budget to make "If we don't X then the world will end" plots look convincing
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Jun 15, 2020 19:00
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