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Anti-Hero posted:For NG I completed it on survivor w/~80% of the collectibles found naturally, and it took 38 (!!) hours. On NG+ I'm, again, running survivor and am just finishing up Abby's segment, about to head to the Ellie boss fight and am at 24 hours. It's a drat long game, but I expect you'll save some time by playing on Very Light. Skipping cutscenes won't help much as they mask some insanely long loading times. I finished my first playthrough at about 26 hours, and this time I only need to get far enough to get enough supplements/materials to finish off Abby's upgrades, which I don't think should take me too far into her section.
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Jul 21, 2020 20:46
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Lazy Savior posted:Nick was killed by Owen, and his death seems to not bother Abby in the least.
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Jul 21, 2020 21:05
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thebardyspoon posted:Or die extremely quickly when they don't find rags and alcohol that can be combined into a perfect medkit for bullet wounds or magic workbenches that turn scrap into perfectly functional gun mods. Yes, and it's very mysterious how those medkits will instantly heal any injury, apart from the ones required by the narrative.
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Jul 21, 2020 21:08
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Lord Hydronium posted:If you're talking about the incident that caused Abby to track down Owen at the aquarium, that was someone named Danny. I believe Nick is one of the people killed by Tommy in the interrogation (that Ellie finds in the hotel on Day 1). Ah yes, you are correct. Not sure why I combined Danny and Nick in my head. I guess Nick goes down as another unacknowledged death for Abby, and at least when she dismisses Danny's death at least it's not another of her crew. Thinking back on it, it's weird they don't make a point of having Abby hear about her crew being picked off. Even if you didn't change the events in Abby's chapters, it might have been worth it to have Nora tell Abby about Jordan, Mike and Nick at the hospital (since they died day one, it makes sense news might get out for day 2) or Isaac to mention something day 3 (since by that point all of salt lake crew is either dead, MIA, or currently standing in front of a seraphite at gunpoint).
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Jul 21, 2020 21:29
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Jul 21, 2020 21:48
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One thing I noticed in this game is they retcon what kind of TVs everyone had. If you look at Last of Us 1 there are actually quite a few SDTVs or older looking flat screens whereas in TLOU2 everyone has a modern looking flat screen
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Jul 21, 2020 22:58
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My thoughts for a possible episode 3, based on the ending of 2: Abby has rejoined the Fireflies. She tells them Ellie is alive and probably still living in Jackson. Fireflies say ooh, let’s go and get her brain again and make a cure. Abby explains that even though Ellie is a scrawny girl, she is an insanely dangerous killer and would make absolute mincemeat of them. Fireflies foolishly decide to try anyway.
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Jul 21, 2020 23:14
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BOAT SHOWBOAT posted:One thing I noticed in this game is they retcon what kind of TVs everyone had. If you look at Last of Us 1 there are actually quite a few SDTVs or older looking flat screens whereas in TLOU2 everyone has a modern looking flat screen That was Philly and Lincoln (MA). Seattle's way better off
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Jul 21, 2020 23:19
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morallyobjected posted:That was Philly and Lincoln (MA). Seattle's way better off If that's the case that makes more sense. I'm not from the US so I don't really have a sense of which is more affluent
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Jul 21, 2020 23:31
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Making Lev the protagonist of the next game is the only interesting idea I have
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Jul 21, 2020 23:37
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ShakeZula posted:I finished my first playthrough at about 26 hours, and this time I only need to get far enough to get enough supplements/materials to finish off Abby's upgrades, which I don't think should take me too far into her section. Yeah, I got Abby's upgrades done by I think the second chapter in Seattle Day 1. You'll buzz through it quick.
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Jul 22, 2020 00:00
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I'm playing the Hard+ NG+ now (glad I did because I fully explored all of Seattle this time) after beating it on Hard the first time. Wow you get a LOT less ammo on the NG+. There's been multiple times I've just run around without any bullets waiting for Dina to shoot out a clicker because I'm too scared to get close and melee it
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Jul 22, 2020 00:07
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I decided to replay the first game, and drat, it still holds up and that ending still hits hard. There's a lot of things that had more of an impact having played the sequel, and not just the stuff I'd expect; one of the biggest ones was Ellie telling Sam about how she's afraid of ending up alone.  In terms of comparing them, Part II is the winner on gameplay by a mile, but I'm torn on story. I really liked Part II's, but there's a certain straightforwardness and simplicity (in a good way) to TLOU'S that I really appreciate. It's about Joel and Ellie, no more and no less, and everything else in the game revolves around the two of them and their relationship. All of Part II's characters and factions and multiple perspectives makes it more complex and I think gives more to talk and think about, but TLOU feels more unified in a lot of ways.And then there's the ending. When I played it the first time, my immediate gut reaction was "Joel did nothing wrong", and now I can modify that to "okay, maybe he did a little wrong".  I think in the broad strokes he has the right side (or at least, a right side) in the final confrontation - the Fireflies are absolute dicks to him and Ellie, almost letting her drown from the moment they meet, and between their refusal to even wait and see what Ellie thinks about dying, and their immediate treatment of Joel as an enemy, I really can't blame him for defending himself and Ellie. And while he doesn't really ask her wishes either, she's actually alive at the end of his choice to make that decision; Marlene and Jerry, in the Part II flashback seems to be telling herself that Ellie would totally approve (and she'll be with her mom again - interestingly, a belief that Ellie herself does not hold) more to justify it to herself, and it's awfully convenient that Ellie won't be around to put that into question.Having said that, Joel being Joel and having the background he does reacts in the worst way possible - the deaths of all the soldiers are pretty justifiable for the above reasons, but the doctor and Marlene are just straight up murders, and I think show that even a version of Joel that's found someone to care about can still only express himself (at least at that point) with horrific violence. Then there's lying to Ellie, and I don't know if that's the worst crime, but it hits the hardest. The fact that Joel can make the decision to do violence on her behalf, but not even look her in the eye to tell her that, kind of makes the justification feel as hollow as Marlene's. She's alive to make the choice, but by lying to her he doesn't allow her to do that any more than the Fireflies. Part II stuff: And that's what makes everything worse when the truth does come out. Joel kills (and worse) on Ellie's behalf a lot throughout TLOU, and I'm not sure she'd reject him just for that (although with the amount of survivor's guilt she's carrying around, she likely wouldn't be entirely okay with it either). Not even allowing her to process that, though, means that she's got all that to deal with on top of Joel breaking her trust, all at once. I never got around to playing Left Behind, so I guess that'll be the last stop on this TLOU tour. Lord Hydronium fucked around with this message at 03:49 on Jul 22, 2020 |
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Jul 22, 2020 03:45
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I've been listening to the OST and it rules. I think they made a great choice to both keep Gustavo who is fantastic and to have a throughline from the first game as well but also have a second composer doing tracks that sound completely different with a new composer as well (Mac Quayle who did Mr Robot's score). Gustavo's tracks tend to have more emotional weight but Mac's tracks have an intensity to them that completely reflects undercurrents of violence and hate It's on Spotify btw
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Jul 22, 2020 06:35
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Stoatbringer posted:Whew, it's a good job the families of the hundreds of guards, cultists and henchmen that get mown down don't feel the need to seek vengeance. This, paired with the relative ease Ellie criss crosses the country essentially in montages made the world feel smaller in tlou2. The first game is about every grueling inch getting places, this one is about getting to those places and not finding what you expected which is all well and good, just did not have the same impact to be in Jackson one second and Seattle the next and oh the people we're looking for are just hanging out by where we rolled up, don't ya know it.
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Jul 22, 2020 09:43
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Eh, I wouldn't disagree that the transitions from place to place were abrupt, but once you are there every place feels like it happens in realtime. And the first game did that as well. If there was anything about it that didn't work for me it's that it made the timeline sort of confusing.
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Jul 22, 2020 09:51
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Yeah, structure is all over the place. The first game being straight forward and broken into seasons was just.. Stronger.
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Jul 22, 2020 10:09
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I like the more experimental structure of 2LOU tbh It's structured like a palindrome
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Jul 22, 2020 10:11
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I think at one point there was even a flashback within a flashback. Partway through a “4 years earlier” there was a short “6 months earlier” section.
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Jul 22, 2020 10:16
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BeanpolePeckerwood posted:I like the more experimental structure of 2LOU tbh Yeah prologue three days of Seattle, three days of Seattle, epilogue There was a lot of speculation Chris Nolan's Tenet will be a palindrome movie but TLOU2 beat him to it
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Jul 22, 2020 12:09
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You keep using the word palindrome, but I really don't think it means what you think it does. And it certainly doesn't apply to the plot of TLoU2 in any sense.
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Jul 22, 2020 12:11
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Mulva posted:You keep using the word palindrome, but I really don't think it means what you think it does. And it certainly doesn't apply to the plot of TLoU2 in any sense. No, sir, away, a papaya war is on.
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Jul 22, 2020 12:14
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BOAT SHOWBOAT posted:No, sir, away, a papaya war is on. Go hang a salami, I’m a lasagna hog
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Jul 22, 2020 12:54
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I was completely wrong about the ending. When Ellie went to Santa Barbara looking for Abby, I was 100% convinced she was going to finder her, Abby would get all ready for a huge battle, and that Ellie would lay down her weapons and say something along the lines of "let's find the Fireflies, the world needs a cure" As for the actual ending her leaving the guitar is big "I'm able to move on and put this all behind me" slap in the face. That said, she leaves the farm the way she came, which I am not sure is the only way out / way back to Jackson.
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Jul 22, 2020 17:43
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Mulva posted:You keep using the word palindrome, but I really don't think it means what you think it does. And it certainly doesn't apply to the plot of TLoU2 in any sense. Palindrome is not just a word used for literary or grammatical purposes, it can be used to decribe loose and abstract visual relationships, musical sequences, scene sequence relationships, shot structures in film, etc It's a flexible word.
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Jul 22, 2020 18:36
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I'd say the first game is arguably palindrome, in that the conclusion is an inversion of the opening. I'm not sure TLOUII is one. TLOU II's structure is: Prologue -> Seattle Day 1 -> Seattle Day 2 -> Seattle Day 3 -> Seattle Day 1 -> Seattle Day 2 -> Seattle Day 3 -> Epilogue That's not a palindrome. It's a, I dunno, reduplication? In It For The Tank fucked around with this message at 18:48 on Jul 22, 2020 |
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Jul 22, 2020 18:43
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Except the prologue and the epilogue in 2LOU both have 4 parts each composed of roughly the same narrative weight; thematically it has a structure with a fuzzy sort of mirror symmetry. The first game is composed of 5 parts: a prologue and 4 seasons of uneven narrative weight, beginning in summer and ending in spring. It's mainly cyclical in structure, imo
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Jul 22, 2020 19:10
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I forgot until my replay just how much of the first game is Summer. It's like half the game, and I think each subsequent season is shorter than the last from then on. Also I did not have a good memory of individual segments - I remembered the high school being longer, but I might have been mixing it up with the university, because the actual one is just the exterior, a quick trip through the halls, and then the gym boss fight. Same with the dam. Pittsburgh, meanwhile, was a lot longer than I recalled.
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Jul 22, 2020 19:58
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I didn't buy the palindrome thing but I kind of get it now? Like, Ellie's story is descent into bloodlust and hatred and Abby's story is about rising out of that.
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Jul 22, 2020 20:09
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I wouldn't say palindrome just because that's an invitation for pedants to point out how the game is not literally a palindrome  , but yeah there's a clear symmetry in how the plot opens and closes.
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Jul 22, 2020 20:13
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Coffee And Pie posted:Making Lev the protagonist of the next game is the only interesting idea I have Abby makes contact with you know who They say yo we got a cure but we need to sacrifice someone whose immune. You know anyone like that Abby makes grinch face
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Jul 22, 2020 21:25
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Mods please change title to “lost fingat”
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Jul 22, 2020 21:26
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BeanpolePeckerwood posted:Except the prologue and the epilogue in 2LOU both have 4 parts each composed of roughly the same narrative weight; thematically it has a structure with a fuzzy sort of mirror symmetry. Can you elaborate on this? I can roughly see how you could divide the prologue and epilogue (really, it's more of a coda and an epilogue) into four parts, although those four parts are wildly varied in length and scope, but it seems like a stretch to call them symmetrical or to say they have the same narrative weight. Happy to hear your thoughts though.
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Jul 22, 2020 21:51
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I'm waiting for someone to post the clip of George Lucas saying [about ep 1] that "its like poetry, it rhymes"
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Jul 22, 2020 22:32
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Alan Smithee posted:Mods please change title to “lost fingat” 
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Jul 22, 2020 22:52
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In It For The Tank posted:Can you elaborate on this? I can roughly see how you could divide the prologue and epilogue (really, it's more of a coda and an epilogue) into four parts, although those four parts are wildly varied in length and scope, but it seems like a stretch to call them symmetrical or to say they have the same narrative weight. Happy to hear your thoughts though. Sure! This is just how I see it, and why the structure of the game is compelling to me. You definitely don't have to agree. Unless I'm mistaken, The Prologue's four playable parts consist of [Joel's ride in] -> [Ellie's patrol] -> [Abby's encounter with the horde/Joel] -> [Ellie's trek to the lodge] The Epilogue's four playable parts consist of [Ellie & Dina in Wyoming] -> [Abby & Lev in Santa Barbara] -> [Ellie encounters Abby in Santa Barbara] -> [Ellie's return to Wyoming] These are both punctuated with cutscenes that stitch them together into direct narratives. Between the Prologue and Epilogue we have the bulk of the game, an indirect funnel + inverse-funnel tension narrative of six parts bisected into two halves, both regularly interspersed at precise moments with playable flashbacks or dream/nightmare sequences. This is a rather audacious structure for an interactive narrative, regardless of the relative complexity of the themes being explored (and yes they are deceptively complex while still retaining influencial characteristics of various classic exploitation media)...and it would similarly be very audacious for a film to structure itself this way. Films that demonstrate narrative via non-linearity or 'achronology' are often some of my absolute favorites, prominent examples would be: The Tree of Life Persona Hiroshima Mon Amour Point Blank Blue Valentine Closer The Godfather part II Battle of Algiers Mulholland Dr. Eternal Sunshine Exotica You Were Never Really Here Dunkirk Manchester By The Sea Irreversible Solaris Memento and yes, lol, even Citizen Kane Additionally, now that I think on it, 2LOU's structure bears a striking resemblance to The Tree of Life in particular...especially the criterion cut released last year. But I think in the end the dev's intention was to adhere closer to something with a genre conceit like The Godfather part II, especially since the original TLOU was already adding to, expanding upon, and subverting a specific genre, much like Coppola's rather meticulous adaptations of Puzo's more shallow airport fiction. I dunno, this kind of thing in televisual media just tends to excite me. BeanpolePeckerwood fucked around with this message at 00:46 on Jul 23, 2020 |
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Jul 22, 2020 23:27
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Whatever rocks your pants I guess, I thought it was smashing a bunch of trite bullshit together to hammer the obvious point and pad out the run time. e: But again, not giving a poo poo about vast swaths of the characters predisposes me to be harsh to the narrative, which I objectively have to say is polished mediocrity. Mulva fucked around with this message at 00:13 on Jul 23, 2020 |
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Jul 23, 2020 00:09
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What do you think is "trite" about the narrative?
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Jul 23, 2020 00:25
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There is no filler in 2LOU, only flesh. There is nothing to pad. Padding is literally not applicable.
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Jul 23, 2020 00:44
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Whenever someone calls something trite, U know you are about to have your mind blown by a serious brain dude.
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Jul 23, 2020 00:55
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