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nah posted:“His love for America and its citizens has come through loud and clear” “You weren’t there, it was cool” /beavis
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Oct 29, 2020 14:14
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TheDisreputableDog posted:I’m not directing this at the quoted poster, but I honestly don’t understand why Democrats think that normalizing court packing will result in a different long term beat down than their efforts to normalize simple majority judicial confirmations did? Do people honesty believe the right will never retake the Senate and Executive again, and when they do, they won’t double down, even more brutally, on whatever the left does? 1. literally no one who's suggesting court packing doesn't also think the GOP will attempt to do the same if/when they gain power again. but it's a risk we absolutely have to take at this point. 2. aside from what everyone else has said, there's a practical aspect to do this: if we don't pack the courts, the current insane rightwing SC will continue to gently caress around with our electoral process to the point that it becomes almost impossible for democrats to ever be elected again. it took us EIGHT GODDAMNED YEARS with the most cartoonishly evil republican president in power for us to win back the house, and even then, many states like Ohio, have basically killed any democrat representation.
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Oct 29, 2020 14:15
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Why tell the truth when you can just lie? https://twitter.com/atrupar/status/1321623618346995719?s=20
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Oct 29, 2020 14:17
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Nelson Mandingo posted:Donald Trump and the ghouls that follow him are an existential threat to the United States of America in a way that the neocon ghouls are not. I don't like Joe's reaching across the aisle attempts either, but the enemy of my enemy is my friend, for right now. I never thought I'd look at Bush era Neocon type politicans 15 years later and think "Boy do they have their poo poo loving together and are more grounded in reality in comparison to the rest of their party" but The Tea Party and subsequent MAGA movements really are just that more batshit crazy and vindictive than war mongering tax cutting for the 1% Neocons. It's probably the cult of personality subservience to the literal 1 (aka Trump and his whims) rather than the 1% that pits them against Trump in the long run. That and Trump's platform doesn't include any coherent foreign policy in it, particularly regarding the Middle East, where I believe even Neocon's figure the Jerusalem thing along with the abandoning the Kurds thing was a dumb poo poo move. Neocons are definitely on board with the whole America first thing, I believe their manifesto was called something like Project For A New American Century that espouses a form of looking out for America's interests globally....just not dumbly implemented America First policy that is outright antagonistic towards established allies and cozies up to America's literal ideological enemies.
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Oct 29, 2020 14:19
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nah posted:“His love for America and its citizens has come through loud and clear” He means white men, OP.
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Oct 29, 2020 14:20
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Dick Trauma posted:Why tell the truth when you can just lie? She wasn't lying! There aren't any tapes of Trump talking about personally sexually assaulting women, only tapes about Trump discussing locker room talk 
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Oct 29, 2020 14:20
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Deptfordx posted:I believe that Nicholson is famously, a colossal rear end in a top hat. Personally if not politically. Yeah, years ago I had a friend who had a friend who ran in his circles and if she was telling the truth the guy is a loving monster. Like imagine his character from The Shining x10.
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Oct 29, 2020 14:24
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canepazzo posted:He means white men, OP. Rich white men
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Oct 29, 2020 14:31
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kitten emergency posted:The point of court packing is to make the court less legitimate. The country cannot survive unless the legislature actually functions as a lawmaking body rather than pawning off every politically-difficult task to the courts or the executive. I do not want to cruise past this very clear and good point. The Court has been illegitimate for a long time and maybe the error in the "crafters" vision of what it would be vs what it is but it needs neutering BIG time, we can't just put our heads in the sand and believe that every decision in the country has to be decided by an intentionally skewed political body with lifetime appointed officials. Add to this the insane legal gymnastics that large portions of the Court subscribe to and there's no way we can have anything remotely close to a progressive society here. I don't say this lightly because I think there's some SERIOUS issues we have to tackle (M4A, climate change, reparations, etc) but court packing is the single most important things democrats HAVE to do with their 4 years, because nothing else is possible if you have to battle against a 6-3 court for the next 10-15 years.
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Oct 29, 2020 14:33
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Rookersh posted:The problem, as a few people has mentioned is now that the Republicans have this on the national consciousness, they will court pack once they get back control regardless of whether or not Dems do it. McConnell has already started hinting as much. Eh, I’m not sure I buy the preemptive escalation logic, especially given that the Republicans didn’t drop the bomb when they could have. I still don’t see how this doesn’t end up backfiring, long term.
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Oct 29, 2020 14:37
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TheDisreputableDog posted:Eh, I’m not sure I buy the preemptive escalation logic, especially given that the Republicans didn’t drop the bomb when they could have. I still don’t see how this doesn’t end up backfiring, long term. how would it backfire? they're going to pack the courts to make it majority conservative again? 
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Oct 29, 2020 14:39
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Rookersh posted:The problem, as a few people has mentioned is now that the Republicans have this on the national consciousness, they will court pack once they get back control regardless of whether or not Dems do it. McConnell has already started hinting as much. You pass HR1 and HR4 (with a packed court protecting them) and the GOP will never have a trifecta again so this is always a weird avenue to attack the idea. TheDisreputableDog posted:Eh, I’m not sure I buy the preemptive escalation logic, especially given that the Republicans didn’t drop the bomb when they could have. I still don’t see how this doesn’t end up backfiring, long term. Not sure what you mean - the GOP has already packed the court there's no point in them adding seats.
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Oct 29, 2020 14:40
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Yuzenn posted:I do not want to cruise past this very clear and good point. The Court has been illegitimate for a long time and maybe the error in the "crafters" vision of what it would be vs what it is but it needs neutering BIG time, we can't just put our heads in the sand and believe that every decision in the country has to be decided by an intentionally skewed political body with lifetime appointed officials. Add to this the insane legal gymnastics that large portions of the Court subscribe to and there's no way we can have anything remotely close to a progressive society here. This kind of ignores the progressive force for good the Supreme Court was from pretty much the 50s through well, even recently. In fact, it was those major progressive victories that motivated the Federalist Society and this entire multi-decade effort by conservatives to pack the judiciary with ideologues. Is it only illegitimate when it makes decisions you don't agree with, or...?
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Oct 29, 2020 14:41
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Data Graham posted:I also love how absurdly detailed their story is. "We had tracking information on exactly where it was up until 3:44 AM! Then we backtracked through every sorting facility, every truck, every plane, interviewed every handler..." Like dude man, there's a point beyond which your making up details no longer serves to make the story sound authentic and only makes the listener realize "Wait am I hearing an entire segment dedicated to explaining how the dog totally ate the homework because he has been known to eat homework and homework is his favorite food and the first such instance occurred in 2014 when..." The funniest thing to me is they won't name the company aside from "Oh you know the company, it's a big company, you guys!" It's just so made up!
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Oct 29, 2020 14:41
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TheDisreputableDog posted:Eh, I’m not sure I buy the preemptive escalation logic, especially given that the Republicans didn’t drop the bomb when they could have. I still don’t see how this doesn’t end up backfiring, long term. But the Republicans have already won. They own the court. The Democrats have lost. The only way to change that is to change the rules and pack the courts. If the Dems do add four justices then at the very least we'll get some decent rulings out of it for a couple years. If the Republicans double pack it afterwards, so what? We lost nothing and gained in good rulings in the intervening years.
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Oct 29, 2020 14:42
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issuing correction on a previous post of mine, regarding the grifter org The Lincoln Project. you do not, under any circumstances, "gotta hand it to them"
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Oct 29, 2020 14:44
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Kale posted:I never thought I'd look at Bush era Neocon type politicans 15 years later and think "Boy do they have their poo poo loving together and are more grounded in reality in comparison to the rest of their party" but The Tea Party and subsequent MAGA movements really are just that more batshit crazy and vindictive than war mongering tax cutting for the 1% Neocons. It's probably the cult of personality subservience to the literal 1 (aka Trump and his whims) rather than the 1% that pits them against Trump in the long run. That and Trump's platform doesn't include any coherent foreign policy in it, particularly regarding the Middle East, where I believe even Neocon's figure the Jerusalem thing along with the abandoning the Kurds thing was a dumb poo poo move. That's basically how I feel about the neocons. And I haven't forgotten the incompetency and awfulness of the Bush years. So look, I don't like the Neo-cons. They are scum. But I can work with them in mutual self interest for the next few days. The MAGA and Tea Party agenda is pretty much entirely and only about owning the libs and as you say, slave mentality to cults of personality. Governing and the consequences of doing it badly is someone else's fault, if not a problem at all. You can't bargain with a madman.
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Oct 29, 2020 14:49
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Nelson Mandingo posted:That's basically how I feel about the neocons. And I haven't forgotten the incompetency and awfulness of the Bush years. But they're nowhere near as bad as these MAGA chuds. So look, I don't like the Neo-cons. They are scum. But I can work with them in mutual self interest for the next few days. The same rot was present in the neoconservative movement: the gift, incompetence, and denial of reality is just a continuation. Their failures in governance were just overshadowed by their spectacular foreign policy disasters, at least until Katrina and the 2008 Financial Crisis.
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Oct 29, 2020 14:52
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I think it's safe to say that the public reaction to the actions taken at Ferguson and Standing Rock demonstrate that state violence against protesters is already very normalized with the American people. The big difference now is that the media isn't helping to sell it. I expect that to change after Biden wins and the narrative can no longer be crafted to make it look like these protests are about Trump and the cops aren't being told from the top down that the press are enemies. I would be super happy to be wrong about this tho. nah posted:You're also not going to accomplish anything meaningful without them. There will be no leftist revolution This seems really nihilistic. Why do you think it is impossible for meaningful change to be made in this country through the electoral process without appealing to the likes of the Lincoln project and John Kasich? The NYT put out an article (They Did Not Vote in 2016) interviewing non-voters and their concerns seem to be around the fact that they have to work three jobs and they have noticed that this remains true no matter who is in office. According to the article, they also did a study that showed low wages is the primary concern for non-voters (I cannot verify this as their own link to the study goes to an article behind their paywall). Would it not be a better strategy to try and engage them by making their lives better than giving refuge and political voice to the same people who have tried very very hard to ensure that things continue as they are today? tl;dr Pablo Nergigante posted:issuing correction on a previous post of mine, regarding the grifter org The Lincoln Project. you do not, under any circumstances, "gotta hand it to them"
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Oct 29, 2020 14:53
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Grayly Squirrel posted:This kind of ignores the progressive force for good the Supreme Court was from pretty much the 50s through well, even recently. In fact, it was those major progressive victories that motivated the Federalist Society and this entire multi-decade effort by conservatives to pack the judiciary with ideologues. The Warren Court is the only time the Court was consistently a force for good and yes of course an institution is illegitimate when it makes bad decisions (especially when those bad decisions are incredibly poorly reasoned). Do people think this is some kind of "gotcha" when someone can identify good from bad? Roberts (and the other conservatives) gutted the Voting Rights Act without even a constitutional reasoning after Congress overwhelmingly re-upped preclearance. This allowed the southern states to close hundreds of polling locations and steal several elections.
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Oct 29, 2020 14:53
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copy posted:This seems really nihilistic. Why do you think it is impossible for meaningful change to be made in this country through the electoral process without appealing to the likes of the Lincoln project and John Kasich 'Liberals' will betray the left rather than allow things to change in a way that meaningfully reduces the fortunes of the rich . The pattern here is the same as in the UK. TheDisreputableDog posted:Eh, I’m not sure I buy the preemptive escalation logic, especially given that the Republicans didn’t drop the bomb when they could have. I still don’t see how this doesn’t end up backfiring, long term. You know Mitch would have done it if he needed to and could. Harold Fjord fucked around with this message at 14:56 on Oct 29, 2020 |
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Oct 29, 2020 14:54
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Mr Interweb posted:1. literally no one who's suggesting court packing doesn't also think the GOP will attempt to do the same if/when they gain power again. but it's a risk we absolutely have to take at this point. The courts have already been packed. Thanks to Mitch the courts effectively shrunk during the latter parts of Obama's presidency and then got packed with new people (many of questionable qualifications at best) once Trump was in office.
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Oct 29, 2020 14:54
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Yuzenn posted:I do not want to cruise past this very clear and good point. The Court has been illegitimate for a long time and maybe the error in the "crafters" vision of what it would be vs what it is but it needs neutering BIG time, we can't just put our heads in the sand and believe that every decision in the country has to be decided by an intentionally skewed political body with lifetime appointed officials. Add to this the insane legal gymnastics that large portions of the Court subscribe to and there's no way we can have anything remotely close to a progressive society here. This is it, the role of the Supreme Court as a high-falutin neutral arbiter of legislation and a judicial check had already been made redundant when it became a partisan plaything. Packing the court is simply the logical extension of this, transforming it into a vestigial office and a ceremonial rubber-stamp akin to the Queen's Assent in the UK.
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Oct 29, 2020 14:55
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TheDisreputableDog posted:Eh, I’m not sure I buy the preemptive escalation logic, especially given that the Republicans didn’t drop the bomb when they could have. I still don’t see how this doesn’t end up backfiring, long term. In addition to what others have said, this is factually incorrect. The Republicans artificially reduced the number of SCOTUS justices to keep it at 8 for the last eleven months of Obama's term, which is no less court-packing than adding justices would be. They openly talked about keeping it that way when it looked like Clinton was a lock to win. They did the same thing with the federal judiciary as a whole once they took back the Senate. They have already court-packed, and will 100% absolutely do so again if we ever allow them to. (edit: on the Lincoln Project thing - the best possible analogy, which I think we've all seen before, is that it was still the right decision to ally with Stalin to fight Hitler, even if Stalin was a monster, everyone knew it, and everyone knew that he'd be the next enemy up. Still the right choice.) Sarcastro fucked around with this message at 14:57 on Oct 29, 2020 |
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Oct 29, 2020 14:55
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https://twitter.com/AP/status/1321809927942397954 Baron is pretty good with the cyber.
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Oct 29, 2020 14:57
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TyrantWD posted:https://twitter.com/AP/status/1321809927942397954 How long until we find out the GOP chairman spent it on fancy hotel rooms and high class prostitutes? I give it 2 months.
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Oct 29, 2020 14:58
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smoobles posted:How long until we find out the GOP chairman spent it on fancy hotel rooms and high class prostitutes? I give it 2 months. 2 weeks
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Oct 29, 2020 14:58
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Courting nonvoters while doing things to piss off actual voters is a strategy that doesn’t tend to work out very well. The good thing about this election is there are a lot of people who didn’t vote before who are energized to vote for Biden and the party didn’t have to do anything to push moderates to the right. The focus for the progressive movement should be to keep those new voters blue and bring them further to the left.
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Oct 29, 2020 14:58
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TyrantWD posted:https://twitter.com/AP/status/1321809927942397954 https://twitter.com/HectorofTexas1/status/1321810590118092802 I don't even think that's hacking, that's just being phished 
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Oct 29, 2020 14:59
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Court packing isn't an end goal folks, its part of a process of basically making the GOP unelectable by simply enforcing voting rights and accessiblity and the like. If you can do it it means you can also do a whole bunch of other poo poo like VRA and DC and the like which would massively increase peoples ability to vote.
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Oct 29, 2020 14:59
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Kale posted:I never thought I'd look at Bush era Neocon type politicans 15 years later and think "Boy do they have their poo poo loving together and are more grounded in reality in comparison to the rest of their party" but The Tea Party and subsequent MAGA movements really are just that more batshit crazy and vindictive than war mongering tax cutting for the 1% Neocons. It's probably the cult of personality subservience to the literal 1 (aka Trump and his whims) rather than the 1% that pits them against Trump in the long run. That and Trump's platform doesn't include any coherent foreign policy in it, particularly regarding the Middle East, where I believe even Neocon's figure the Jerusalem thing along with the abandoning the Kurds thing was a dumb poo poo move. I had a different idea about Bush Jr's administration. At the time what was so upsetting was they REALLY had their poo poo together and were very competent. It was all for bad things, but they were good at it. Even though 9/11 happened on their watch and probably due to their negligence they were able to capitalize on it and get most of the country on their side. I thought Bush's response and speeches were bullshit and downright silly, but they worked on most people. Imagine Trump on 9/11. Aside from what we know for sure like that he would have bragged about how he now had the tallest building in the city (lie) at Ground Zero and then go on to say "I take no responsibility. Everyone dies. It was only two buildings, and the Pentagon is filled with the deep state trying to ruin me so who cares? Bin Ladin did me a favor if you really think about it! But make sure to vote me for next time because this terror attack just shows you how terrible Al Gore's America would be!"
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Oct 29, 2020 14:59
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Rea posted:https://twitter.com/HectorofTexas1/status/1321810590118092802 I mean, that's how the DNC hack happened too, phishing is a pretty effective and common tactic to compromise a target.
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Oct 29, 2020 14:59
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smoobles posted:How long until we find out the GOP chairman spent it on fancy hotel rooms and high class prostitutes? I give it 2 months. Yeah, gonna say 2 months myself. The fact that they claim they were "hacked" with a straight face is laughable as all hell.
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Oct 29, 2020 15:00
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Catpetter1981 posted:The fact that the Lincoln Project neocon ghouls support Biden is an indictment of Biden rather than a commendation of the Lincoln Project. Guess we better not vote for Biden and instead live in a country that removes the wombs from brown women without asking. Ho hum.
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Oct 29, 2020 15:00
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nah posted:What da...you actually WANT to see that happen?? You're sick dude  (from an old Oglaf storyline, which is extremely NSFW)
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Oct 29, 2020 15:01
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The most frustrating Trump voter line right now is “we need to give him a chance!” like the last 4 years didn’t happen and he didn’t have complete control of Government, and even then just kind of does whatever.
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Oct 29, 2020 15:01
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Even if the end result of court packing is simply that the judiciary becomes more representative, that's still a win. Basically any change to the status quo is an improvement both politically and in principle.
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Oct 29, 2020 15:01
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TyrantWD posted:https://twitter.com/AP/status/1321809927942397954 "hackers" Sure, got it *wink* e: unless they're paying invoices in bitcoin or some poo poo like that, I don't see how this isn't easily traced, but then also I'd believe any level of incompetence when it comes to Trumpists ReidRansom fucked around with this message at 15:06 on Oct 29, 2020 |
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Oct 29, 2020 15:02
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Angry_Ed posted:2 weeks 2 days.
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Oct 29, 2020 15:09
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Mr Interweb posted:a sudden terrifying realization just occurred to me. fun fact: the 2022 midterms are the terms up of senators that got in in the 2010 "gently caress the aca" red wave AND re-elected in 2016 alongside trump, so there's 22 republicans to 12 democrats  gray is "being elected in 2020 and only serving 2 years" and dark reds are "pat toomey and richard burr are retiring", so not wildly implausible the dems hold steady or possibly even gain a seat or two
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Oct 29, 2020 15:11
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