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r u ready to WALK posted:looney tunes show lola is the only canon lola Thanks for this clip. I laughed out loud twice
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Mar 5, 2021 22:40
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Also, personal peeve: when a character says "I never meant for this to happen!" but did things that in absolutely no way made the consequences a surprise, and actually very much at the time was consciously doing the things where that happening would be the expected result.
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Mar 5, 2021 22:45
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it was never meant to be this way!! -- person who had been intentionally trying to make it be that way
Pick fucked around with this message at 22:51 on Mar 5, 2021 |
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Mar 5, 2021 22:49
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"you're as much to blame as i am!" - person who is like way more to blame by any objective standard
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Mar 5, 2021 22:50
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Almost exactly like Spies in Disguise, you can tell there's a version of Raya where Raya herself ever actually did a thing wrong and it got scrubbed, probably in response to bad focus group questions or just focus groups being stupid. "hmm I don't like it when a good character does a bad thing  . good characters should do no bad things." oh well really loving compelling character u got there. however we can't rewrite the entire plot so she'll just get chastised for stuff that in this version she also didn't do which, is like normale: also when Sisu is explaining her siblings giving her the gem as a reason for raya to pass off the gem, it like.. it's weird because physically it's the same action but since the context is completely different, it's almost a nonsequiter. like the same action in two completely different circumstances has different thematic meaning.. just really flaccid-rear end writing. not again actively horrible but like...  it's a checked-box kind of script, it's like a formation you could assemble from jumbling around a screenwriter 101's bullet point list of "things that happen in a story" but, Chinese Room style, not really understanding what those things mean or how they work or to what ends. e: minor complaint: also the movie constantly breaks established rules sort of for no reason randomly, but not in areas where they really "hurt" the film but they don't help either so it's just odd to do it. Like why make the little monkey things turn to stone at the end, we know the chaos things don't go after them. like it doesn't matter but if you break a rule usually there's like a reason to bother having done so. Everything Sisu says is basically someone writing who was like "wouldn't it be funny if someone said [x]??" which is one reason I think a super long development time often isn't good for a film, too much time to stop and think of a "funny" thing for someone to say instead of just whatever they need to say. e: 2 really good things though: 1. there's no room for a romance subplot so they didn't. 2. men are bad so this movie doesn't have any that really matter (genuinely interesting implications wrt marketing) 3. this movie ends with there being more and not fewer dragons (this is good screen writing, and is true of every film) I give it a C+ and will probably never watch it again. Pick fucked around with this message at 23:14 on Mar 5, 2021 |
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Mar 5, 2021 22:53
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Pick why did you do 9 different posts for Raya instead of... one
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Mar 5, 2021 23:07
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I don't think it's possible to make an interesting film the way they make these now, in super committee. There is none of any artist's vision. They couldn't make a troll in central park in their wildest dreams.
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Mar 5, 2021 23:12
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FunkyAl posted:I don't think it's possible to make an interesting film the way they make these now, in super committee. There is none of any artist's vision. They couldn't make a troll in central park in their wildest dreams. Raya was also in a unlucky spot personally because last night I watched The Last Unicorn and Spirited Away with an art friend where we've seen both so many times we could talk the entire way through about creative decisions in both films and yeah, you aren't going to see films like that come out under the Pixar or WDAS pipeline. For sound reasons, in a way--they're designing films that can't really fail--but as a result, you get films within very strict bounds. This is especially unlucky for Raya because the best scenes in the movie are almost exactly like 2 scenes in SA and TLU but not as good  We'd scheduled this movie night before I even recalled Raya was coming out and literally no two worse movies to watch ahead of time if you want to enjoy Raya haha. Pick fucked around with this message at 23:25 on Mar 5, 2021 |
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Mar 5, 2021 23:16
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Macaluso posted:Pick why did you do 9 different posts for Raya instead of... one Well it's 10 now, lol
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Mar 5, 2021 23:37
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Is The Looney Tunes Show uniformly that good? I know that episode where Daffy joins Seal Team Six and liberates Bugs from behind enemy lines exists (and I presume its amazing because how could it not be with that set up) and basically nothing else about the show. Boxman fucked around with this message at 23:58 on Mar 5, 2021 |
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Mar 5, 2021 23:54
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FunkyAl posted:I don't think it's possible to make an interesting film the way they make these now, in super committee. There is none of any artist's vision. They couldn't make a troll in central park in their wildest dreams. Disney hasn’t really made movies that anyone could mistake for the work of an auteur since Walt stopped actively leading them. They try really hard to not make any one animator bigger than the whole, which is why ones that have particularly strong visions (like Bluth or Tim Burton) had to leave to make the world they really wanted Which makes Lilo & Stitch stick out all the more because that movie is unabashedly made in Chris Sanders’ style. Looking at his concept art and 2D works he’s done since, you can see just how direct a translation of his style the finished product is. I kinda wonder how that managed to happen, I assume that early on it was sort of under the radar while Disney made other, bigger things (Atlantis, Kingdom of the Sun/Emperor’s New Groove), and by the time they realized that it might have potential they couldn’t really morph it into a more Disney-fied vision. Even Atlantis, which had character design by Mike Mignola, who is a very distinct artist, still looked more like a Disney movie than Lilo.
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Mar 6, 2021 01:47
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Boxman posted:Is The Looney Tunes Show uniformly that good? It's weirdly like Toon Seinfeld. Porky is affable and optimistic and Speedy runs a pizza shop. It's good stuff.
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Mar 6, 2021 02:46
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JazzFlight posted:Looool, based on this thread I finally did watch Cool World tonight. Yikes, that’s a mess. I liked... the backgrounds a lot? Maybe that’s about it. 
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Mar 6, 2021 02:51
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Boxman posted:Is The Looney Tunes Show uniformly that good?
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Mar 6, 2021 03:16
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I'm always happy to watch this again when it's posted
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Mar 6, 2021 03:32
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DC Murderverse posted:Disney hasn’t really made movies that anyone could mistake for the work of an auteur since Walt stopped actively leading them. They try really hard to not make any one animator bigger than the whole, which is why ones that have particularly strong visions (like Bluth or Tim Burton) had to leave to make the world they really wanted Lilo was an afterthought to the studio and being made on the other side of the country didn't hurt. I saw Raya. Very pretty. I enjoyed all the characters... yes even the con-baby... but Benedict Wong's character was particularly good. Yeah in the end it's a "collect magic items and save the world" film but I liked it.
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Mar 6, 2021 03:46
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Ghost Leviathan posted:The biggest difference I notice is that fanart Lola is blankly doe-eyed while canon Lola looks in control. Looney Tunes Show Lola is a real base breaker. I love her and think she's hilarious, but I totally understand why others dislike her. And yeah, they basically turned old Lola into Tina and then gave Lola a whole new personality. Space Cadet Omoly fucked around with this message at 04:16 on Mar 6, 2021 |
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Mar 6, 2021 03:59
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Zero One posted:Lilo was an afterthought to the studio and being made on the other side of the country didn't hurt. I’d like to imagine that the first time Michael Eisner watched it they were screening it after they had to change the ending b/c of 9/11 and at the end he turns to someone and says “wait we made that? How the gently caress did that happen?” and got furious demanding to know who was responsible until someone pointed out that Stitch was testing through the roof with children, at which point he got dollar signs in his eyes. RIP Disney’s Orlando studio. It was so cool when it was a working studio that you could tour from Disney/MGM.
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Mar 6, 2021 04:13
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DC Murderverse posted:Disney hasn’t really made movies that anyone could mistake for the work of an auteur since Walt stopped actively leading them. They try really hard to not make any one animator bigger than the whole, which is why ones that have particularly strong visions (like Bluth or Tim Burton) had to leave to make the world they really wanted I didn't say auteur! I mean, in the sense that these things can be picked apart and someone there can say, this person drew this background or animated this character or wrote this or staged this or whatever, little ways the art feels alive or like a quilt made by people are flattened out by overtesting and reliance on the REAL false auteur, the "brain trust." You can tell certain animators drew things certain ways, you can tell don bluth was drawing the fox or the hound or that brad bird drew krusty sometimes, so forth. Or like specifically, in the telling of a story, an interesting one will be shaggy and have bumps and twists and turns, almost as their entire point. Life doesn't always work out like you expect, and I hear you telling me about it! But in their stated routine of trying to tell the "perfect" story, the stories are getting flat and starting to resemble each other. The ending to Coco was the same as monsters inc! It had the same "deep crying" shot as inside out and probably some others. It feels like nobody on staff is getting the opportunity to tell the best story they could, with the possible exception of monsters university. Nobody "writes" them. Everybody writes them!
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Mar 6, 2021 04:17
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Space Cadet Omoly posted:Looney Tunes Show Lola is a real base breaker. I love her and think she's hilarious, but I totally understand why others dislike her. And to be fair, Space Jam Lola technically had a personality beyond “girl” (she was tough and could run circles around the boys) but she was still kind of a walking stereotype regardless. Ideally I’d kind of like if the Lola in the sequel was more of a happy medium between that and the Looney Tunes Show version. Also to be fair, Lola had like 5 scenes total in the first movie and most of them are short Larryb fucked around with this message at 05:03 on Mar 6, 2021 |
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Mar 6, 2021 04:19
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DC Murderverse posted:Even Atlantis, which had character design by Mike Mignola, who is a very distinct artist, still looked more like a Disney movie than Lilo. To be technical Mignola didn't actually work on the film, the animators just took inspiration from his work.
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Mar 6, 2021 04:21
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holy cow this is amazing
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Mar 6, 2021 04:39
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Sisu is sadly just the bastard child of elsa and poochie
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Mar 6, 2021 05:20
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Space Cadet Omoly posted:Looney Tunes Show Lola is a real base breaker. I love her and think she's hilarious, but I totally understand why others dislike her. I watched some clips from this and was like “wow this VA is doing a spot on Kristen Wiig impression” and just found out it was her doing the voice.
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Mar 6, 2021 05:35
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My spouse was very demoralized when our daughter said her favorite film was the one "with the Unicorn and the butterfly" and after some testing it involved an ocean and a bull made of fire. I'd watch the last unicorn every day if I could. They're . . . less enthusiastic.
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Mar 6, 2021 08:08
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Barudak posted:Space Jam is a really weird movie that I enjoy its finale being a payoff that in a sense only works because Michael Jordan is an absolute poo poo in real life so it feels so, so very authentic. I don't know sports, what's this about?
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Mar 6, 2021 08:13
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Ccs posted:The framing of her in the actual movie is also not as, i dunno, staged for the male gaze as that fanart. That's why i was so taken aback when I thought it was an official frame from the film. It would be fitting if all the usual conservative loudmouths got their Twitter feeds filled with Lola Bunny furry porn.
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Mar 6, 2021 08:58
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paradoxGentleman posted:I don't know sports, what's this about? Michael Jordan is an absolute headcase who was a tremendous and degenerate gambler and invented mean things other people said about him to psych himself up to destroy them. He told a teammate he didn't want a christmas gift from them unless that box contained some talent. The man is self-serious and deeply egotistical and not a good spouse either. So the ending of Space Jam where the dude who spent 8 hours yelling and humiliating the guy playing his body double for a tv commercial until the dude was sobbing mess can for even a briefest moment allow himself to look slightly foolish and do something someone else suggested that he ridiculed earlier is a genuine lesson the real Michael Jordan never learned.
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Mar 6, 2021 09:08
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So Raya was pretty fuckin' cool. I'm not gonna analyze the plot, but it was gorgeous. The effect I was wowed at most was at the end when the lake/river is being refilled and just the way that Sisu really looked like Awkwafina. I know basing a character model on the actor is nothing knew, but this is like James Woods as Hades level of recognition. Good shots of food! The scallions being chopped look great an so did the several stews. That can't be easy to animate.
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Mar 6, 2021 11:10
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paradoxGentleman posted:I don't know sports, what's this about? This is not the right thread, but The Last Dance is a very good documentary. It's about sports, of course, but like a lot of ESPN's documentary output, the subject matter is so interesting and everything is so well-done that it might draw you in regardless (I've watched god knows how many hours about sports I give less than a gently caress about). It's on Netflix.
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Mar 6, 2021 14:48
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Fartington Butts posted:So Raya was pretty fuckin' cool. I'm not gonna analyze the plot, but it was gorgeous. The effect I was wowed at most was at the end when the lake/river is being refilled and just the way that Sisu really looked like Awkwafina. I know basing a character model on the actor is nothing knew, but this is like James Woods as Hades level of recognition. It was the first Disney studio film in a long while where I didn’t get drawn in by the emotional elements but it was technically very impressive. They have shown they absolutely dominate water and fog/cloud effects. If I could pin it on anything I think it was just Raya and Sisu’s exuberance was just too over the top for me. They were constantly too excited for everything and it just killed my interest in them as characters. Also while there were some nice bits with it the baby and monkeys were overplayed and needless. This film did make me immediately go order chili paste/oil to go make some soups.
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Mar 6, 2021 15:23
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Wonder Woman is canon to Space Jam apparently: https://io9.gizmodo.com/space-jam-2-has-relocated-lola-bunny-to-wonder-womans-t-1846416072
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Mar 6, 2021 17:11
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PierreTheMime posted:It was the first Disney studio film in a long while where I didn’t get drawn in by the emotional elements but it was technically very impressive. They have shown they absolutely dominate water and fog/cloud effects.
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Mar 6, 2021 17:12
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Larryb posted:Wonder Woman is canon to Space Jam apparently: Of course. Space Jam has always been canon.
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Mar 6, 2021 17:20
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JazzFlight posted:The interesting thing is that when I watched the trailer, I was prepared to enjoy a lot of the action scenes, but when I saw the final film, I wasn't really engaged with them? Maybe it's because the movie doesn't really want anyone to get hurt since the message is about trust and understanding. If you give your hero a deadly sword, you can't really have her land any strikes. I think it would have worked better if she had a non-lethal weapon. Totally agree. I didn’t touch on that but yeah this also nuked my expectations. Also the Druun existed as a basic narrative device and had no background/motivation so I couldn’t get invested in the struggle. Battles/escapes against unintelligent formless blobs just don’t do it for me. I know it sounds like I’m down on the movie—I still enjoyed it and loved the setting, but the issues take it from an A to maybe a B- for me.
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Mar 6, 2021 17:20
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I haven't seen it yet Ideally when there's a protagonist who gets accused of doing something wrong, there should be at least some portion of the audience who thinks she did, at least in an ambiguous way
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Mar 6, 2021 17:23
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I liked Raya on the whole, I'd say it's a solid 8, but there's definitely a part of me that's disappointed in something: the worldbuilding. There's a portion of the movie that I thought would be an amazing setting for a show, game, comic, etc... (it's the beginning of the "6 years later" time period where the world is post-apocalyptic and she's traveling through the desert.) I love the setting and the amount of work put into making each land/tribe unique and interesting... and then it kind of collapses into what can fit into a feature-length movie with no opportunity to flesh anything out. Out of the 5 nations, only Talon and Fang really exist anymore, so there's no interesting exploration of what the other countries' surviving towns are like. After the movie ends, everything's back and better than ever since the dragons are revived and the world is united, so you can't really do a spin-off movie/comic unless you invent new villains I guess. It felt like tasting a drop of liquid from an Avatar: The Last Airbender soda can.
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Mar 6, 2021 17:36
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JazzFlight posted:I liked Raya on the whole, I'd say it's a solid 8, but there's definitely a part of me that's disappointed in something: the worldbuilding. There's a portion of the movie that I thought would be an amazing setting for a show, game, comic, etc... (it's the beginning of the "6 years later" time period where the world is post-apocalyptic and she's traveling through the desert.) I loved Raya and I'm hoping for any animated series a la Tangled on Disney Plus.
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Mar 6, 2021 18:19
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hiddenriverninja posted:I loved Raya and I'm hoping for any animated series a la Tangled on Disney Plus. Yeah this would be great if they put that amount of effort into it. Then again I’d take world-building shows about just about any property other than Frozen. I guess technically Tangled was also Frozen world-building?
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Mar 6, 2021 18:31
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Macaluso posted:Pick why did you do 9 different posts for Raya instead of... one I am trying to make up for how tragically few posts there are about a Disney release. (it was because there was a comedic timing angle to it before I decided it was too spoilery)
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Mar 6, 2021 19:49
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