Based Wage Making: Money Sitting as a Service

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Ask/Tell > Business, Finance, and Careers > Based Wage Making: Money Sitting as a Service

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Pollyanna: Mar 5, 2005; Milk's on them.

Hyrax Attack! posted:

Aunt and uncle have bought daughter in her mid-40s three houses through the years, none of which are currently lived in.

She's now back at home living in an apt they provide free of charge in a great area, still mooching groceries/laundry/vehicles. This is clearly not up to her standards and she's now trying to get a non-rich relative with a rental house to give her the property for nothing. Fortunately relative has enough sense to be aware of this person's track record and is staying far away.

What does she do to the houses�? :ohdear:

(also

)

# ? Jun 8, 2021 00:22

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# ? Jun 11, 2024 13:46

Blue Moonlight: Apr 28, 2005; Bitter and Sarcastic

Vice President posted:

If at first you don't succeed...
Spoilers, the FTC blocked that attempt too. Wonder if they were furiously working on this to get it done before the 2020 election and covid put the brakes on it.

To be fair, the competitive landscape has changed fairly dramatically since then as same/next day delivery options have flourished.

# ? Jun 8, 2021 00:45

tater_salad: Sep 15, 2007

Someone's mom is going to have a bad time

quote:

My dad died very unexpectedly a few months ago. He had a very small retirement account, he was diagnosed with brain cancer in his late 20s and had been disabled since. The account total was only $30k and I received half.

My step mother announced she plans to retire next year, with a grand total of $60k in savings. That includes the $15k from my dad. She makes around $80k right now, but her job is physically demanding and she is having a difficult time. She called her financial planner who very strongly advised against it, but she is dead set on it. He told her to have at least 6 months living expenses in savings.

She has two children, one is involved, but lives far away and not financially able to help her, one lives pretty close but is mostly absent, and could help her, but probably won't.

I honestly have no idea what to tell her, and I'm afraid I will be stuck picking the ball up.

She has tons of very expensive toys that she pays on monthly, she's also a big fan of "90" days same as cash. She will buy something more expensive or something she doesn't need because she has 90 days to pay it off. They refinanced frequently so there's no equity in the house, there's still a large mortgage, and it would be nearly impossible for her to move at this point and lower her payment. The area she lives in is already rock bottom and she would be making a lateral move to any other home.

I have offered to take over things that my father had a loan on to ease her monthly burden and she either refused or wanted more than what it was worth.

Do I need to protect myself in this situation? I'm not sure how financially responsible I will be for this mess and would appreciate any input. I could theoretically help, but I'm in my mid 20's and I honestly don't want to at this point. Our relationship has turned sour after my father's death, due to things like trying to upcharge me on buying my father's items. She asked double the value for things he had recently purchased that I could purchase new for 1/2 price.

She is very excited about her $60k and doesn't realize she's in a terrible situation. Anything I say about it falls on deaf ears, and I'm done trying to help her see the light. I live in a state with filial laws and I'm not sure that would apply to me since she is not my actual mother. Any sight into my financial responsibility would be appreciated.

Thanks.

hope OP has a spine enough to say "no mom you can't live with me for free"

# ? Jun 8, 2021 14:16

Leon Trotsky 2012: Aug 27, 2009; YOU CAN TRUST ME!*

_{*Israeli Government-affiliated poster}

"And I would have been GWM if it wasn't for you meddling kids!"

quote:

MoviePass actively tried to stop users from seeing movies, FTC alleges

The movie ticket subscription service, which promised customers the ability to see one film in theaters per day for $9.95 a month, officially shuttered (for good) in 2019. However, according to a Federal Trade Commission complaint released Monday, the company actively worked to prevent its customers from seeing movies in theaters.

quote:

MoviePass allegedly did this in three calculated and rather hilariously screwed-up ways.

First, according to an FTC press release announcing the complaint, MoviePass invalidated users' passwords and claimed, falsely, that it had detected fraud related to their accounts. And we're talking about a lot of customers. According to the complaint, MoviePass did this to 75,000 users � many of whom where then locked out of their accounts as "MoviePass's password reset process often failed."

The FTC notes that MoviePass's then CEO Mitchell Lowe, along with the CEO of MoviePass's parent company, "knew of, ordered, or helped execute the password disruption program."

Second, MoviePass allegedly launched a "ticket verification program" that didn't work correctly, and, as a result, "blocked thousands of subscribers from using the service."

And, perhaps most outrageously, "MoviePass's operators used 'trip wires' that blocked certain groups of users�typically those who viewed more than three movies per month�from utilizing the service after they collectively hit certain thresholds based on their monthly cost to the company."

quote:

In addition to locking out customers who saw more movies than MoviePass wanted to pay for, the company also allegedly burned the rest of its customers for good measure.

"MoviePass's operators also failed to take reasonable steps to secure personal information it collected from subscribers, such as their names, email addresses, birth dates, credit card numbers, and geolocation information, the FTC alleges," reads the press release. "For example, the company stored consumers' personal data including financial information and email addresses in plain text and failed to impose restrictions on who could access personal data."

MoviePass and its parent company agreed to settle the FTC's allegations, which comes with prohibitions on misrepresenting future businesses and the implementation of better data security.

# ? Jun 8, 2021 14:51

tomapot: Apr 7, 2005; Suppose you're thinkin' about a plate o' shrimp. Suddenly someone'll say, like, plate, or shrimp, or plate o' shrimp out of the blue, no explanation. No point in lookin' for one, either. It's all part of a cosmic unconciousness.; Oven Wrangler

So when I see a deal like this and wonder how they are making money the answer is �they aren�t�

# ? Jun 8, 2021 19:55

Motronic: Nov 6, 2009

But they were making it up on volume. Right? That's how that works?

Oh wait, they were burning VC money. I forgot.

# ? Jun 8, 2021 20:08

Sundae: Dec 1, 2005

tomapot posted:

So when I see a deal like this and wonder how they are making money the answer is �they aren�t�

It was either that or related to the part where they were throwing user information to anyone who wanted it. Ends up, venture capital + they aren't wins the day. :lol:

# ? Jun 8, 2021 20:30

DaveSauce: Feb 15, 2004; Oh, how awkward.

That sort of business model works in other places, where the "use it all the loving time" crowd is subsidized by the "pay for it but rarely use it" crowd. I'm guessing they massively underestimated the amount of use people would get out of it.

Seems like everything after that realization was a desperate attempt at stemming the losses... experimenting with different pricing models, selling customer data, and ultimately throwing up intentional roadblocks to usage.

# ? Jun 8, 2021 20:36

FMguru: Sep 10, 2003; peed on;
sexually

DaveSauce posted:

That sort of business model works in other places, where the "use it all the loving time" crowd is subsidized by the "pay for it but rarely use it" crowd.

Gym memberships are the ultimate example of this.

The difference is that going to the gym is Not Fun for most people and they come up with reasons and excuses to put off doing so - which is the exact opposite of going to the movies.

Another more similar example is memberships in video stores, where you could buy bulk rentals for a discounted fee ($3/movie, or 10 movies for $20). Video stores loved selling those bulk rentals because 1) they got the money upfront and 2) they almost never got used all the way through. The car wash near me sells discounted packs of car wash vouchers for the exact same reason, I'm sure.

# ? Jun 8, 2021 20:48

BMan: Oct 31, 2015; KNIIIIIIFE
EEEEEYYYYE
ATTAAAACK

Moviepass had no relationship with theaters, so they were stuck paying full retail for their customer's tickets. If you watched 2 movies in a month they lost money lol

# ? Jun 8, 2021 20:50

Motronic: Nov 6, 2009

DaveSauce posted:

That sort of business model works in other places, where the "use it all the loving time" crowd is subsidized by the "pay for it but rarely use it" crowd. I'm guessing they massively underestimated the amount of use people would get out of it.

Seems like everything after that realization was a desperate attempt at stemming the losses... experimenting with different pricing models, selling customer data, and ultimately throwing up intentional roadblocks to usage.

Come on......I mean, yeah, sure, that's how this CAN work, but $9.95/mo was never a sustainable price point. This was burning VC money "to gain market share" bullshit.

# ? Jun 8, 2021 20:50

Bird in a Blender: Nov 17, 2005; It's amazing what they can do with computers these days.

BMan posted:

Moviepass had no relationship with theaters, so they were stuck paying full retail for their customer's tickets. If you watched 2 movies in a month they lost money lol

More like 1 movie a month cost them money. Around here, a first run feature is like $12 or more. Moviepass maybe could've made it work if they charged $20/mo, and worked out some discount price from the big chains to avoid paying full price.

# ? Jun 8, 2021 21:04

FMguru: Sep 10, 2003; peed on;
sexually

Bird in a Blender posted:

Moviepass maybe could've made it work if they charged $20/mo, and worked out some discount price from the big chains to avoid paying full price.

To the extent that they had a business model, it was probably something like this - lose money for a while subsidizing the service while you build an audience, then use that big audience you've cultivated to leverage deals with the theater chains.

# ? Jun 8, 2021 21:08

RocknRollaAyatollah: Nov 26, 2008; Lipstick Apathy

BMan posted:

Moviepass had no relationship with theaters, so they were stuck paying full retail for their customer's tickets. If you watched 2 movies in a month they lost money lol

They also bought movies to distribute, American Animals and Gotti, and MoviePass "members" bought up 25-35% of American Animals tickets and 40% of Gotti's tickets. American Animals is not bad, I saw it at a local, city owned arthouse theater but it wasn't going to be a big money maker. Gotti is possibly one of the worst wide released movies in the last decades, possibly all time, and it bombed. They definitely padded the tickets for Gotti at the least and it was accused they did the same for American Animals.

The parent company of MoviePass definitely wanted to farm the analytics of their service but being a refilling giftcard for movies in this current iteration of movie theaters wasn't the key to locking down that info.

# ? Jun 8, 2021 21:17

GoGoGadgetChris: Mar 18, 2010; i powder a
granite monument
in a soundless flash

showering the grass
with molten drops of
its gold inlay

sending smoking
chips of stone
skipping into the fog

Most business dream of reaching the "Profit" stage

MoviePass didn't even have a plan to reach "???"

# ? Jun 8, 2021 21:21

BonerGhost: Mar 9, 2007

FMguru posted:

To the extent that they had a business model, it was probably something like this - lose money for a while subsidizing the service while you build an audience, then use that big audience you've cultivated to leverage deals with the theater chains.

That was their stated model but given the history of the parent company and the people involved, I think their original plan was plain old investment fraud and maybe money laundering.
https://www.businessinsider.com/moviepass-parent-company-has-new-ceo-2019-9

# ? Jun 8, 2021 21:23

Vice President: Jul 4, 2007; I'm number two around here.

FMguru posted:

Gym memberships are the ultimate example of this.

The difference is that going to the gym is Not Fun for most people and they come up with reasons and excuses to put off doing so - which is the exact opposite of going to the movies.

Another more similar example is memberships in video stores, where you could buy bulk rentals for a discounted fee ($3/movie, or 10 movies for $20). Video stores loved selling those bulk rentals because 1) they got the money upfront and 2) they almost never got used all the way through. The car wash near me sells discounted packs of car wash vouchers for the exact same reason, I'm sure.

One of the local car wash chains around here sells those bulk deals plus "unlimited" monthly wash passes for around $30/month when their cheapest wash is around $8. I'm sure 99% of their sales are impulse buys for people who don't stop to do the math about how often they actually wash their car. It uses your license plate or something so you can't just let all your friends use your pass.

# ? Jun 8, 2021 21:30

bob dobbs is dead: Oct 8, 2017; I love peeps; Nap Ghost

DaveSauce posted:

That sort of business model works in other places, where the "use it all the loving time" crowd is subsidized by the "pay for it but rarely use it" crowd. I'm guessing they massively underestimated the amount of use people would get out of it.

Seems like everything after that realization was a desperate attempt at stemming the losses... experimenting with different pricing models, selling customer data, and ultimately throwing up intentional roadblocks to usage.

wasn't there another service that did this that was owned by a theater and therefore had much better costs and charged 50 bux/mo and made a profit

# ? Jun 8, 2021 21:41

Vice President: Jul 4, 2007; I'm number two around here.

bob dobbs is dead posted:

wasn't there another service that did this that was owned by a theater and therefore had much better costs and charged 50 bux/mo and made a profit

Alamo Drafthouse does a pass and I'm sure they actually thought it through to be reasonable for their very loyal customers and also very profitable.

# ? Jun 8, 2021 22:03

StormDrain: May 22, 2003; Thirteen Letter

Vice President posted:

One of the local car wash chains around here sells those bulk deals plus "unlimited" monthly wash passes for around $30/month when their cheapest wash is around $8. I'm sure 99% of their sales are impulse buys for people who don't stop to do the math about how often they actually wash their car. It uses your license plate or something so you can't just let all your friends use your pass.

I wonder what their cost is for a car wash on a per car basis though? It's probably closer to a dollar than eight dollars. Most people probably don't even go thru it more than once a month to begin with, so you either make $7 on them for a single wash or $26 if they go through 4x a month. That's the fattest scenario, they lose profit per wash if it's closer to $6 cost per wash but likely guarantee more income.

# ? Jun 8, 2021 22:38

KYOON GRIFFEY JR: Apr 12, 2010; Runner-up, TRP Sack Race 2021/22

I think VP was saying that it's BWM for the customer.

I have been tempted, in that it would be nice to wash my car 1x a week, but I know I wouldn't be disciplined about doing it.

# ? Jun 8, 2021 22:42

Enos Cabell: Nov 3, 2004

KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:

I think VP was saying that it's BWM for the customer.

I have been tempted, in that it would be nice to wash my car 1x a week, but I know I wouldn't be disciplined about doing it.

I signed up for the $30/mo unlimited washes at a place that is on my drive home from work. I park on a campus with a thousand trees and no covered parking though, so it gets used 1-2x a week so far.

# ? Jun 8, 2021 22:55

Leon Trotsky 2012: Aug 27, 2009; YOU CAN TRUST ME!*

_{*Israeli Government-affiliated poster}

quote:

Are car insurance prices monthly, 6 months, or yearly?

I am in my mid 20's and only have had a car for the last 4 years. My friend used to say that I had really good car insurance prices because I paid $317 per month. I used to pay $268 per month, but it slowly went up and I just kept it because I thought it was a good deal. My other friends were saying they paid $600 for insurance and I just figured out that they meant for 6 months. I asked him to see a bill and his bill was for about $600 and my bill is $317 so I don't know if he is right or not. My dad says that insurance costs are usually done per year. Am I paying a good rate or not? It's been 4 years and I have only had some minor tickets and my friend had a car accident so I could see him having to pay that much per month and he is bullshitting me. My car is a Dodge Challenger 2016 and I am a white male using my parents address and zip code.

quote:

20 years old. $23,000 in savings and no debt. Is this good enough to semi retire?

I don't have loans because my mom paid for my first year of college and then I dropped out to pursue an online career in art. I live with my parents and live very frugally. My monthly costs are only around $200. I have $15,000 from my grandparents and made about $8,000 from waitressing and art in the last year. If I invest in stocks or bitcoin, can I get passive income to cover my $200 in expenses and any other costs will be covered by art? I researched and most people say you need a lot more but most people also have kids and much more extravagant lifestyles. I will have no kids and plan to keep a frugal lifestyle.

Thank you.

quote:

Am I able to afford to live in Denver? Car broke down and nowhere to go.

Hi everyone, I'm in a bit of a strange predicament. I was driving across country to visit family after leaving my job and my truck broke down in Denver. I ended up leaving all my stuff in Denver and catching a flight back to my hometown. I don't really have anywhere to be. I have around 6k in savings and maybe thinking I should stay. I've lived in Colorado before as a ski bum and I love it here.

I'm looking to break into the IT industry and have been looking at apartments/jobs online trying to see if I can afford to start living here. Eventually I need to come back for my truck and stuff so I was looking for any advice. I have 6-7 years in customer service and 3 years of college but not completed.

quote:

I'm a pretty cheap person and not afraid to work a lot to stabilize my income and rent. Unfortunately most of my buddy's are gone from co or living in Vail area.

quote:

I think I could last 6 months or so on my current finances in Denver.

quote:

I agree that I shouldn't move with a job lined up. But once I fly back in less than a week I need to make a decision. I plan on selling my truck to once it's fixed hoping to get at least 5k from it

# ? Jun 8, 2021 23:04

Vice President: Jul 4, 2007; I'm number two around here.

StormDrain posted:

I wonder what their cost is for a car wash on a per car basis though? It's probably closer to a dollar than eight dollars. Most people probably don't even go thru it more than once a month to begin with, so you either make $7 on them for a single wash or $26 if they go through 4x a month. That's the fattest scenario, they lose profit per wash if it's closer to $6 cost per wash but likely guarantee more income.

Given the entire west coast is in unprecedented drought times, if they can afford to offer unlimited car washes and still make money overall balancing the people who will use the unlimited pass to the fullest and (arguably the majority of people) who buy the unlimited but fail to use it enough to get the full value.. then the car wash is making too much money and the city should charge them way more for water. :capitalism:

# ? Jun 8, 2021 23:08

Leon Trotsky 2012: Aug 27, 2009; YOU CAN TRUST ME!*

_{*Israeli Government-affiliated poster}

quote:

How to capital gains taxes work if I don't gain anything on crypto?

If I have $4k in crypto and it is worth the same amount when I sell it, willI owe any capital gains taxes? My intuition says I don't owe any taxes but I just want to make sure.

quote:

quote:
No. Capital "Gains" refers to the gain you make on an investment. If you bought for $4k and sold for $4100, you would owe capital gains taxes on the $100 in profit. That rate is determined by your income level.

Are you sure? That doesn't make sense.

quote:

https://www.irs.gov/taxtopics/tc409

quote:

Extremely confused about how interest on my Amex card works

I had an extended chat with their customer support but I still don't get it. They told me my APR is ~18% - my balance hovers between $1500 and $4500, with around $1600 getting added to the total every month. Yet they told me I'm only paying $63 monthly in interest on average. How can it be that low? 18% of the low end of $1500 is still $270.

quote:

quote:
Credit cards use an annual percent rate. Your rate is for the entire year.

This is an Amex card and not a credit card. Is it the same?

quote:

18% APR. annual percent rate. So to get your monthly charge multiply your balance by .18 then divide by 12.

quote:

Side comment: Can you just get your balance to zero one month and then work to keep it that way every month? That way you don't pay interest. Otherwise if you spend more than you can pay that will never work. Basically, if it happens once, ok, hopefully not again. But I'm just saying I hope you aren't thinking to plan paying interest every month.

quote:

Anime to watch with my Mom.

Preferably something with little to no fan service. We have already watched Death Note (which she really enjoyed), Demon Slayer, and are currently watching Monster. She likes mystery/detective/police types of shows, but I like to watch slice of life and I think she might get bored of a typical SoL so that is why I am searching for suggestions. Thank you.

quote:

I would be willing to import anything, but it will probably need dubs. As much as I hate to use dubs. I could pay up to $300 all costs included for a good one that will get my mom more into anime and respect it.

quote:

If you go a little above budget, you can get the .hack//sign season for about $340 all inclusive.

https://solarisjapan.com/collections/anime/products/hack-sign-dvd-box-limited-pressing

quote:

Youko senkai or saga of tanya the evil its pretty dark i guess but family friendly in terms of fan service and also hunter x hunter im pretty sure doesnt have any or minimum fan service

# ? Jun 8, 2021 23:24

StormDrain: May 22, 2003; Thirteen Letter

Vice President posted:

Given the entire west coast is in unprecedented drought times, if they can afford to offer unlimited car washes and still make money overall balancing the people who will use the unlimited pass to the fullest and (arguably the majority of people) who buy the unlimited but fail to use it enough to get the full value.. then the car wash is making too much money and the city should charge them way more for water.

Car washes collect, filter, and reuse their water. Environmentally more friendly than washing at home.

# ? Jun 8, 2021 23:28

FateFree: Nov 14, 2003

I imagine washing your car every week is bad for your car

# ? Jun 9, 2021 00:08

sleepy gary: Jan 11, 2006

If you wash your car too often you strip it of its natural oils which just causes it to produce even more oil.

# ? Jun 9, 2021 00:22

Sirotan: Oct 17, 2006; Sirotan is a seal.

Bird in a Blender posted:

Moviepass maybe could've made it work if they charged $20/mo, and worked out some discount price from the big chains to avoid paying full price.

MoviePass, before Helios and Matheson Analytics acquired them in 2017, was charging $30-$40/mo in most markets and was still losing money.

# ? Jun 9, 2021 00:34

Spring Heeled Jack: Feb 25, 2007; If you can read this you can read

Fancy new car wash in my area offers $30/month unlimited washes. This includes use of their vacuums and such post-wash.

If I was a teen or something into cars I could see how this would be enticing. I currently don�t have a place to wash my car at my house so I�m stuck hitting the automatic or manual washes up when I can.

# ? Jun 9, 2021 00:34

Residency Evil: Jul 28, 2003; 4/5 godo... Schumi

sleepy gary posted:

If you wash your car too often you strip it of its natural oils which just causes it to produce even more oil.

That�s why I wax my car without washing it.

# ? Jun 9, 2021 00:34

silence_kit: Jul 14, 2011; by the sex ghost

Residency Evil posted:

That�s why I wax my car without washing it.

I coat my car with olive oil

# ? Jun 9, 2021 00:47

BMan: Oct 31, 2015; KNIIIIIIFE
EEEEEYYYYE
ATTAAAACK

silence_kit posted:

I coat my car with olive oil

you have to bake the car to make the oil polymerize

# ? Jun 9, 2021 00:53

DarkHorse: Dec 13, 2006; Vroom vroom, BEEP BEEP!; Nap Ghost

Using soap destroys the protective finish

sleepy gary posted:

If you wash your car too often you strip it of its natural oils which just causes it to produce even more oil.

This explains the oil slick at my parking spot

# ? Jun 9, 2021 01:03

Vice President: Jul 4, 2007; I'm number two around here.

The dealer laughed at me when I insisted on raw denim instead of their overpriced paint protection extra but who's laughing now as I never have to wash my car.

# ? Jun 9, 2021 01:08

Ham Equity: Apr 16, 2013; The first thing we do, let's kill all the cars.; Grimey Drawer

The difference between MoviePass and Club AMC or whatever is that the marginal cost of letting someone watch a movie that isn't sold out for Club AMC is zero; the marginal cost for MoviePass was considerably more than that, and the movie theaters had zero incentive to cut them a deal.

# ? Jun 9, 2021 01:44

Lowness 72: Jul 19, 2006; BUTTS LOL; Jade Ear Joe

Vice President posted:

The dealer laughed at me when I insisted on raw denim instead of their overpriced paint protection extra but who's laughing now as I never have to wash my car.

Just have to throw it in the freezer every few months to de-stinkify it.

# ? Jun 9, 2021 01:44

notwithoutmyanus: Mar 17, 2009

Leon Trotsky 2012 posted:

redditiots on taxes

Goddamn I deal with this all the time. I've made a shitload off crypto - increasingly more in the bank - but likewise have had to pay a shitload in taxes. Sadly my business partner was for a while equivalently naive.

# ? Jun 9, 2021 01:50

Residency Evil: Jul 28, 2003; 4/5 godo... Schumi

Thanatosian posted:

The difference between MoviePass and Club AMC or whatever is that the marginal cost of letting someone watch a movie that isn't sold out for Club AMC is zero; the marginal cost for MoviePass was considerably more than that, and the movie theaters had zero incentive to cut them a deal.

Movie theaters report every ticket sale to movie studios and then pay film rental on ticket sales at whatever percentages film rent is negotiated at. Some movies (Star Wars specifically, for example), will have even more onerous restrictions on things like passes/etc for movie theater employees.

-My sister in Hollywood.

# ? Jun 9, 2021 02:10

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# ? Jun 11, 2024 13:46

Ham Equity: Apr 16, 2013; The first thing we do, let's kill all the cars.; Grimey Drawer

Residency Evil posted:

Movie theaters report every ticket sale to movie studios and then pay film rental on ticket sales at whatever percentages film rent is negotiated at. Some movies (Star Wars specifically, for example), will have even more onerous restrictions on things like passes/etc for movie theater employees.

-My sister in Hollywood.

My understanding from my days as a projectionist was that movie theaters pay the first X tickets to the studios, and then the rest goes to the theater. X is higher for films likely to be more popular (Marvel movies, Star Wars). This was twenty years ago, though.

# ? Jun 9, 2021 02:36

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Ask/Tell > Business, Finance, and Careers > Based Wage Making: Money Sitting as a Service

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