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John Murdoch
May 19, 2009

I can tune a fish.

deep dish peat moss posted:

I took a personal phonecall while around my mom today which reminded me of this whole thing she does.

She spends a lot of time on the phone with her siblings and they talk to each other about everything. I know what they talk about because she absolutely insists on talking to me at least once a week and walking me through every conversation she has had since she last saw me. That's everything from a little bit of small talk with a stranger at the grocery store to embarrassing or dark family secrets that her siblings shared with her. I know every single bit of drama that every single one of my aunts and uncles has ever experienced, I know their medical history and I know my cousins' medical history, I know about their struggles with mental health, I know about all of the fights they get in with their children and half the time I even know what they had for lunch and dinner every day. I have seen each of them fewer than 10 times in my entire life. I also know what comment a woman at the grocery store made about a cracker brand that I've never tried, or what someone said to her about the weather.

So naturally she feels like she has an inalienable right to listen in on her kids' phone calls or private/personal conversations. If you walk away to talk in private she will find reasons to follow you and hover near you. If you close a door she will press her ear against it. In fact, if there's a part she misheard or didn't hear, she will actually ask you about it later, just this tacit outright admission that she was listening and that she feels entitled to ask for clarification about your private conversations that she was eavesdropping on. Not indulging will then often turn into her telling her siblings the entirety of your conversation that she overheard and then them all speculating together on what the part that she missed was, and her recapping that speculation for you later.

Something like 15 years ago I tried several times to explain to her that this is exactly why I never open up to her or talk to her about anything but she couldn't get past denying that she does that for long enough to go "oh ok"

Yyyup. Literally any medical situation I get into big or small (almost always small) is immediate fodder for gossip. My dad will take whatever vague poo poo I say to him on the way home from a doctor's appointment or w/e, garble it up through his own brain, then regurgitate it to her. So she gets an even more distorted and incomplete picture, then regurgitates that form of it to the extended family as if it's literally any of their business.

One year I got a birthday card from an old friend of hers and instead of the usual pat god bless and happy birthday it was a scrawled out rant about all of my faults and how awful I was being because my mom did nothing but complain to this friend about me. It was loving surreal.

Very recently my brother has been going through some poo poo and was around the house and she got offended that he would take his by-phone therapy appointment in the car where he would have absolute privacy instead of in the house where she would 100% find some way to listen in.

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Light Gun Man
Oct 17, 2009

toEjaM iS oN
vaCatioN




Lipstick Apathy
today is apparently my estranged mom's birthday

had therapy like 10 mins after getting that notification so we talked about it awhile and therapist basically backed me up on all of it hell yea

get therapy, mom

bee
Dec 17, 2008


Do you often sing or whistle just for fun?

blatman posted:

isn't that the sort of thing that could have easily got your mom fired?

Yeah. Bur I was 18 at the time and the idea of standing up to her and reporting her wasn't on my radar yet.

ErrorInvalidUser
Aug 23, 2021

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
anyone know the tech support site? i got malfunctioning parents robots i would like to report

Dirt Road Junglist
Oct 8, 2010

We will be cruel
And through our cruelty
They will know who we are
Found some purestrain content for this thread over on NYTimes.

Must I Be Kind to My Money-Grubbing Parents?
A reader who inherited the family business feels conflicted about continuing to support its former owners.

Q: I am the third-generation owner of a family business. The company is struggling now, and I can no longer afford to pay my parents who stopped working 11 years ago but still draw paychecks. Though the company has no legal obligation to pay them, my dad is threatening litigation. I made them an offer that will be burdensome for me to pay, but I’ll do it if it keeps the peace. My dilemma: When people come into the business and ask about my parents — or say: “What great people!” — how should I respond, considering they have put me in financial and emotional peril?

A: Here’s what I know about family businesses: As a young man, my grandfather opened a tiny sporting goods shop and worked ferociously to make a go of it. Eventually, his sons joined him and helped grow the business. When he retired for health reasons, they kept paying him from the income of the business, as they should have. There would have been no income without my grandfather!

So, while I’m sorry for your troubles, I don’t fully understand them. When parents turn over a prime asset (like a business) to their children, rather than selling it to the highest bidder, they may still need compensation to support themselves. You must agree. Why else have you paid them for 11 years?

Family business members can also be lax about formalizing agreements. I assume your parents gave you the company in exchange for the continued paychecks. But for how long? Hitting a rough patch, as you have, may be an argument for belt-tightening or innovation, but not for stopping payments that your parents rely on.

Open the company’s books to them and try to work out a solution together. Maybe they can afford to take smaller payments or forgo them. If they need the money, though, you may have to sell the business. As for customers who ask about your parents: Don’t bad-mouth them! That will only alienate people who want to patronize your business.

Cythereal
Nov 8, 2009

I love the potoo,
and the potoo loves you.
Another one for the oof files.

AITA for not wanting my disabled sister at my wedding?

quote:

The title sounds awful but please read all the way til the end. DO NOT SPEED READ THIS.

My (22f) sister "Anna" (21) is "special need". She has severe autism and while she is verbal most of her communication is "physical" like sign language due to her social discomfort. She does speak around family though and has pretty bad cognitive skills. She can't comprehend boundaries and lives with our parents so they can best watch her.

I am getting married in 3 months. We planned a simple wedding and reception at my fiance "Michael's" parents barn and farm. Since it's all gonna be DIY and we aren't planning anything too expensive, we can do things pretty quickly since flowers, food and decor will be provided by his family.

I sent out invites last week and I asked that Anna not come. I told my parents I understood that would mean they may not show up but it was just a heads up. Why no Anna? She has an issue with touching Michael and trying to kiss him. At times when we were at my parents house Anna would try and grab Michael's hands, try to lean in to kiss him or would have a really bad shutdowns if she wasn't allowed to be directly next to him. We've tried speaking to her but there's only so much we can do when she doesn't really understand. I told my parents I just want one day for Michael to be my partner and not Anna's comfort person. They called me selfish and asked how I expected them to agree to something like this. They told me Anna is disabled and may never experience a wedding of her own and while I have Michael for probably the rest of our lives she'll have no one and that Michael and I can be a little more understanding to the reality of her life.

I feel like a total rear end and what they're saying has really gotten to me and I'm starting to question my decision. AITA?

Update: My parents called me letting me know they won't be coming and that it's best I don't bring Michael around anymore since I've "chosen some man over my sister". They told me that Anna wanting to kiss Michael and hug him is normal for a women her age and that she doesn't understand what her feelings mean. I suggested they try to redirect her during the wedding but they said Michael is gonna be family to her and he needs to "get over it". I suggested they watch the wedding via web and they said that's not fair and that they deserve to see things in person. I asked if I could pay for someone with proper credentials to watch her that day while they attention and they asked what I would do when they died and if I'd pawn her off every time. I dropped the unfortunate truth bomb that I don't want to put any more of my life aside for Anna anymore. I did it up until I turned 18. And that Anna is not my life's responsibility and I won't be her keeper. I assured them I'd pay for her care but if she's okay doing this to Michael then I worry for if I ever do choose to have children and what she'd do to them They said I was sick for suggesting she'd do anything to my future children and hung up on me. They sent a lengthy text telling me not to contact them until I could "do the right thing". So thts where we are right now.

PLEASE READ: This is NOT an excuse to talk badly about disabled people's nor is this an opportunity to air out your hatred for them. My sister is not a scapegoat to hate disabled people. She is a human being with feelings, she is not a statistic, she is not evil. Please stop treating my sister as if she's a malicious monster, this debacle is between me and my parents. Leave her out of it, please. I am begging you, I don't want to hear why you think my sister sucks.

Shugojin
Sep 6, 2007

THE TAIL THAT BURNS TWICE AS BRIGHT...


Cythereal posted:

Another one for the oof files.

AITA for not wanting my disabled sister at my wedding?

There is probably a therapist of some kind who could work towards helping Anna control this but it doesn't sound like the parents are interested in this.

Nettle Soup
Jan 30, 2010

Oh, and Jones was there too.

People are always surprised by how articulate my brother is, despite having learning difficulties, but that's because my mum put the effort in. Constantly talked to him and got him signing, which lead to talking, and kept encouraging him to speak. When we got him and were told he would never sit up or walk, the physiotherapist said "gently caress that" and okay he was slow and a couple of years behind other kids, but he walks and hikes and even rides horses.

It happens with so many disabled kids that both physical and behavioural issues that they could get help with or could be trained to deal with and understand (like any normal child) just get ignored under the blanket of "Oh they've got x wrong with them, they can't help it". It's neglect.

Vampire Panties
Apr 18, 2001
nposter
Nap Ghost

Dirt Road Junglist posted:

Found some purestrain content for this thread over on NYTimes.

Must I Be Kind to My Money-Grubbing Parents?
A reader who inherited the family business feels conflicted about continuing to support its former owners.

Q: I am the third-generation owner of a family business. The company is struggling now, and I can no longer afford to pay my parents who stopped working 11 years ago but still draw paychecks. Though the company has no legal obligation to pay them, my dad is threatening litigation. I made them an offer that will be burdensome for me to pay, but I’ll do it if it keeps the peace. My dilemma: When people come into the business and ask about my parents — or say: “What great people!” — how should I respond, considering they have put me in financial and emotional peril?

A: Here’s what I know about family businesses: As a young man, my grandfather opened a tiny sporting goods shop and worked ferociously to make a go of it. Eventually, his sons joined him and helped grow the business. When he retired for health reasons, they kept paying him from the income of the business, as they should have. There would have been no income without my grandfather!

So, while I’m sorry for your troubles, I don’t fully understand them. When parents turn over a prime asset (like a business) to their children, rather than selling it to the highest bidder, they may still need compensation to support themselves. You must agree. Why else have you paid them for 11 years?

Family business members can also be lax about formalizing agreements. I assume your parents gave you the company in exchange for the continued paychecks. But for how long? Hitting a rough patch, as you have, may be an argument for belt-tightening or innovation, but not for stopping payments that your parents rely on.

Open the company’s books to them and try to work out a solution together. Maybe they can afford to take smaller payments or forgo them. If they need the money, though, you may have to sell the business. As for customers who ask about your parents: Don’t bad-mouth them! That will only alienate people who want to patronize your business.

I hate literally everything about this response. Its this sort of manipulative argument with multiple logical fallacies that traps people in horrible family situations. Imagine if the situation were reversed - a boomer wrote in about their family business having a tough time and their children drawing a paycheck without contributing anything. Do you think this rear end in a top hat is going to say 'well you should open your books so that you can all work out a solution together?' :bahgawd:


Cythereal posted:

Another one for the oof files.

AITA for not wanting my disabled sister at my wedding?

Holy poo poo :stonk:

Lieutenant Dan
Oct 27, 2009

Weedlord Bonerhitler

John Murdoch posted:

Yyyup. Literally any medical situation I get into big or small (almost always small) is immediate fodder for gossip. My dad will take whatever vague poo poo I say to him on the way home from a doctor's appointment or w/e, garble it up through his own brain, then regurgitate it to her. So she gets an even more distorted and incomplete picture, then regurgitates that form of it to the extended family as if it's literally any of their business.


My mom once got mortally offended/yell-ey that I didn't want to share the schedule of my entire antibiotic regimen with her when I got dental surgery in my 20's. No she does not live with me. "Why wouldn't you tell me if you don't have anything to hide??"



Here's a question: Why do so many parents plan on foisting off care of a kid to their other kid? I've read several stories where parents expect their adult child to look after their disabled/special needs sibling after the parents die, then get super mad that the adult kid is like "no, I did not sign up for this".

Oh dear me
Aug 14, 2012

I have burned numerous saucepans, sometimes right through the metal

Lieutenant Dan posted:

Here's a question: Why do so many parents plan on foisting off care of a kid to their other kid?

It's not exactly foisting off, they can hardly do it themselves if they're dead. I imagine they just want their child to be well looked after, and know their other child is the only hope? The situation sucks for everyone really.

PetraCore
Jul 20, 2017

👁️🔥👁️👁️👁️BE NOT👄AFRAID👁️👁️👁️🔥👁️

Oh dear me posted:

It's not exactly foisting off, they can hardly do it themselves if they're dead. I imagine they just want their child to be well looked after, and know their other child is the only hope? The situation sucks for everyone really.
So many times it shouldn't be their only hope, but either their government won't provide adequate care for the disabled or the parents have been raised on the idea that accepting government help is 'shameful charity' and REAL family bootstraps up caregiving 24/7. The saddest outcomes are when it's both.

deep dish peat moss
Jul 27, 2006

Lieutenant Dan posted:

My mom once got mortally offended/yell-ey that I didn't want to share the schedule of my entire antibiotic regimen with her when I got dental surgery in my 20's. No she does not live with me. "Why wouldn't you tell me if you don't have anything to hide??"


I made that post about taking a phone call around my mom on Wednesday and it only took until Thursday for her to ask me who I was talking to and what we talked about, then when I declined to answer she called me by my full first name (which she never does) and said "I'm your mother. I deserve to know." :what: It was literally just a random phonecall out of the blue from a friend I haven't spoken to in 2 years and we were just catching up. there's nothing about that which warrants telling someone in the first place (because there's nothing interesting about it), much less her 'deserving' to be told. Also I'm 34, gently caress off.

When I was growing up my brother and I didn't realize how off she was and we would just tell her that kind of stuff because we hadn't picked up on her using it against us yet and if we didn't things would just get bad for us and we'd be gaslit into thinking it was all our fault and related to something completely different. So there was never really any going against what she wanted, she just got her way on everything all the time. Challenging her on it as an adult has been extremely weird because she doesn't do anything, she just drops it immediately but then holds some great unspoken contempt for us for an indefinite period of time. It's like she realizes that we're immune to the things she used to do when she was upset at us and now she just lets it eat her up and ruin her week.

deep dish peat moss fucked around with this message at 17:05 on Oct 16, 2021

Who What Now
Sep 10, 2006

by Azathoth

Lieutenant Dan posted:

My mom once got mortally offended/yell-ey that I didn't want to share the schedule of my entire antibiotic regimen with her when I got dental surgery in my 20's. No she does not live with me. "Why wouldn't you tell me if you don't have anything to hide??"



Here's a question: Why do so many parents plan on foisting off care of a kid to their other kid? I've read several stories where parents expect their adult child to look after their disabled/special needs sibling after the parents die, then get super mad that the adult kid is like "no, I did not sign up for this".

My wife and I will almost certainly be the ones to take in her special needs brother when her parents die. His disability is pretty mild, he can read (slowly), drive, cook basic meals for himself, he holds down a job, but he can't do things like balance his finances or understand things like contracts, lease agreements, or anything like that. So he needs someone on hand to help explain things he has trouble understanding in ways that he can. And while I love him to death like my own brother now there is a part of me that is not looking forward to having to care for him in my own twilight years. So I have nothing but sympathy for people with relatives that have family with far less manageable disabilities, especially when it's a sibling.

Xlorp
Jan 23, 2008


lovely realization time - beating a 5 yr old child with adhd into cptsd for disobedience requires a fuckton of patience, shadow work, and an all-star partner for them to eventually find some stability.

Absent a convent to join, our home now has the estate name 'Rest Home for the Mentally Bewildered'.

If you're hosed up and you know it, take care of yourself.

Dienes
Nov 4, 2009

dee
doot doot dee
doot doot doot
doot doot dee
dee doot doot
doot doot dee
dee doot doot


College Slice

Shugojin posted:

There is probably a therapist of some kind who could work towards helping Anna control this but it doesn't sound like the parents are interested in this.

no there is only permanent estrangement or having your sister sexually assault your husband on your wedding day, no other options.

deep dish peat moss
Jul 27, 2006

Thinking about the gifting stuff with the holidays coming up -

One of the reasons I was so reluctant to speak to my mom at any point in my life was because she would latch on some tiny thing that you mentioned as if it was her responsibility to solve that problem for you. This mostly manifested as things like if you told her one May that you were thinking about getting bar stools for your kitchen, she would spend the entire year asking you if you had found bar stools, all the while mercilessly crawling through thrift stores looking for bar stools until she found what she considered the perfect bar stools. Once she had an idea, there was absolutely nothing that could stop her. You could see the glint in her eye and follow your bar stools comment with "Please do not buy me bar stools.", and then all year long when she asks you if you've found bar stools you could reply by saying "I've decided I don't want bar stools. Please do not buy me any bar stools. I have found different furniture I like for my kitchen." and she would still spend the entire year hunting for bar stools to give you around Christmas. You could say "yes I found some, thank you" and she would still hunt for bar stools all year long and then give them to you and say "Well now you have extras" or "I just thought you might like them more".

Never at any point would any consideration go into what kind of bar stools you would want, or what color you would want them to be, or whether you would actually want cracked and beat up looking leather in your home. It was based entirely on which ones looked like they were originally the most expensive (by her wild estimation).

Of course she would get upset when you didn't want them. She would then try to pawn them off on a bunch of other people and get upset when they didn't want them, all the while getting increasingly angry that no one was praising her for making such an incredible find, wow, what value

And then of course as a teen or adolescent who didn't have the full perspective on just how weird all of that is, if I ever tried to explain it to someone they would just tell me that I should appreciate that she cares so much and what's the harm in just saying thank you they're nice bar stools and wow she loves you a lot of parents don't love their children that much, because I didn't realize that I had to explain to them that when I was saying she "gets upset" I meant she was being abusive :v:

In summary I guess that was just her "thing" in several ways, she would put absurd amounts of time and energy and effort into something that she decided you wanted, ignore everything you said about you not wanting it, and then blow a gasket when you, surprise, didn't want it. It was like she always wanted to prove that when she did it, it would be so perfect that you'd change your mind about not wanting it, so if you said you didn't want something it was almost like challenging her to prove you wrong.

Edit: Witnessed right now:
She’s mad at my dad because she can’t figure out how to log into her slot machine app on a different device and he doesn’t know either. He’s following her around trying to solve it for her. When she needs help she never asks for help, she gets mad at people until they start doting over her trying to help her, and dad’s a big-time enabler. She's yelling about how she doesn't care anymore and wants him to leave her alone, but he doesn't understand consent or boundaries or when to stop either, so he keeps yelling across their house to ask her a question about how she usually logs in, she yells back that she can't hear him because she's in a different room, so he goes to the room she's in and then she walks out of the room and the cycle repeats. They are both in their 70s. I guess being raised by emotional toddlers explains a lot about my trauma and childhood :sweatdrop:

deep dish peat moss fucked around with this message at 01:01 on Oct 18, 2021

BrigadierSensible
Feb 16, 2012

I've got a pocket full of cheese🧀, and a garden full of trees🌴.

deep dish peat moss posted:

Thinking about the gifting stuff with the holidays coming up -

One of the reasons I was so reluctant to speak to my mom at any point in my life was because she would latch on some tiny thing that you mentioned as if it was her responsibility to solve that problem for you. This mostly manifested as things like if you told her one May that you were thinking about getting bar stools for your kitchen, she would spend the entire year asking you if you had found bar stools, all the while mercilessly crawling through thrift stores looking for bar stools until she found what she considered the perfect bar stools. Once she had an idea, there was absolutely nothing that could stop her. You could see the glint in her eye and follow your bar stools comment with "Please do not buy me bar stools.", and then all year long when she asks you if you've found bar stools you could reply by saying "I've decided I don't want bar stools. Please do not buy me any bar stools. I have found different furniture I like for my kitchen." and she would still spend the entire year hunting for bar stools to give you around Christmas. You could say "yes I found some, thank you" and she would still hunt for bar stools all year long and then give them to you and say "Well now you have extras" or "I just thought you might like them more".

Never at any point would any consideration go into what kind of bar stools you would want, or what color you would want them to be, or whether you would actually want cracked and beat up looking leather in your home. It was based entirely on which ones looked like they were originally the most expensive (by her wild estimation).

Of course she would get upset when you didn't want them. She would then try to pawn them off on a bunch of other people and get upset when they didn't want them, all the while getting increasingly angry that no one was praising her for making such an incredible find, wow, what value

And then of course as a teen or adolescent who didn't have the full perspective on just how weird all of that is, if I ever tried to explain it to someone they would just tell me that I should appreciate that she cares so much and what's the harm in just saying thank you they're nice bar stools and wow she loves you a lot of parents don't love their children that much, because I didn't realize that I had to explain to them that when I was saying she "gets upset" I meant she was being abusive :v:

In summary I guess that was just her "thing" in several ways, she would put absurd amounts of time and energy and effort into something that she decided you wanted, ignore everything you said about you not wanting it, and then blow a gasket when you, surprise, didn't want it. It was like she always wanted to prove that when she did it, it would be so perfect that you'd change your mind about not wanting it, so if you said you didn't want something it was almost like challenging her to prove you wrong.

Edit: Witnessed right now:
She’s mad at my dad because she can’t figure out how to log into her slot machine app on a different device and he doesn’t know either. He’s following her around trying to solve it for her. When she needs help she never asks for help, she gets mad at people until they start doting over her trying to help her, and dad’s a big-time enabler. She's yelling about how she doesn't care anymore and wants him to leave her alone, but he doesn't understand consent or boundaries or when to stop either, so he keeps yelling across their house to ask her a question about how she usually logs in, she yells back that she can't hear him because she's in a different room, so he goes to the room she's in and then she walks out of the room and the cycle repeats. I guess being raised by emotional toddlers explains a lot about my trauma and childhood :sweatdrop:

To add to this, about my parents. Whilst also using your "bar stools" analogy.

Lets say you do the thing your friends are telling you to do. Say a polite "Thanks, I love them. They are great. You have given me a wonderful gift." to placate your parents. But because you don't actually want or need the bar stools, they go straight in the garage up the back out of the way.

Well then you get hounded and bullied and harrassed every time they come round your house and don't see the bar stools prominently displayed.

"Where are those bar stools I got you 10 years ago?" "Sure, you remodelled the kitchen, but you could still use them." "Well if you didn't like them why did you say you did? I wouldn't have been upset. (Yes you loving would have been.) "Well I guess I am a terrible mother/have terrible taste/am a horrible person for giving you something you obviously hate." "Don't worry I won't ever buy you anything again, because you are such an ungrateful brat and seem to hate everything I do for you, even though I work so hard." etc. and so on.

And it becomes yet another passive aggressive hassle/power struggle. All over bar stools that you never wanted and explicitly asked them not to waste their money on.

Edit: I think you were raised by my parents. Because the thing about your dad "helping" your mum is drat near identical to the way my parents interact with each other. And also how my dad will spend a week obsessing over and trying to "help" me with a problem that I have already fixed myself, that wasn't a big deal, and that I have told him multiple times that I don't need or want his help. Then get lovely at me when I am not effusively grateful for his solution, which is often either useless or a lot more work than it's worth.

BrigadierSensible fucked around with this message at 01:11 on Oct 18, 2021

Dongsturm
Feb 17, 2012

deep dish peat moss posted:

Thinking about the gifting stuff with the holidays coming up -

One of the reasons I was so reluctant to speak to my mom at any point in my life was because she would latch on some tiny thing that you mentioned as if it was her responsibility to solve that problem for you. This mostly manifested as things like if you told her one May that you were thinking about getting bar stools for your kitchen, she would spend the entire year asking you if you had found bar stools, all the while mercilessly crawling through thrift stores looking for bar stools until she found what she considered the perfect bar stools. Once she had an idea, there was absolutely nothing that could stop her. You could see the glint in her eye and follow your bar stools comment with "Please do not buy me bar stools.", and then all year long when she asks you if you've found bar stools you could reply by saying "I've decided I don't want bar stools. Please do not buy me any bar stools. I have found different furniture I like for my kitchen." and she would still spend the entire year hunting for bar stools to give you around Christmas. You could say "yes I found some, thank you" and she would still hunt for bar stools all year long and then give them to you and say "Well now you have extras" or "I just thought you might like them more".

Never at any point would any consideration go into what kind of bar stools you would want, or what color you would want them to be, or whether you would actually want cracked and beat up looking leather in your home. It was based entirely on which ones looked like they were originally the most expensive (by her wild estimation).

Of course she would get upset when you didn't want them. She would then try to pawn them off on a bunch of other people and get upset when they didn't want them, all the while getting increasingly angry that no one was praising her for making such an incredible find, wow, what value

And then of course as a teen or adolescent who didn't have the full perspective on just how weird all of that is, if I ever tried to explain it to someone they would just tell me that I should appreciate that she cares so much and what's the harm in just saying thank you they're nice bar stools and wow she loves you a lot of parents don't love their children that much, because I didn't realize that I had to explain to them that when I was saying she "gets upset" I meant she was being abusive :v:

In summary I guess that was just her "thing" in several ways, she would put absurd amounts of time and energy and effort into something that she decided you wanted, ignore everything you said about you not wanting it, and then blow a gasket when you, surprise, didn't want it. It was like she always wanted to prove that when she did it, it would be so perfect that you'd change your mind about not wanting it, so if you said you didn't want something it was almost like challenging her to prove you wrong.

Edit: Witnessed right now:
She’s mad at my dad because she can’t figure out how to log into her slot machine app on a different device and he doesn’t know either. He’s following her around trying to solve it for her. When she needs help she never asks for help, she gets mad at people until they start doting over her trying to help her, and dad’s a big-time enabler. She's yelling about how she doesn't care anymore and wants him to leave her alone, but he doesn't understand consent or boundaries or when to stop either, so he keeps yelling across their house to ask her a question about how she usually logs in, she yells back that she can't hear him because she's in a different room, so he goes to the room she's in and then she walks out of the room and the cycle repeats. They are both in their 70s. I guess being raised by emotional toddlers explains a lot about my trauma and childhood :sweatdrop:

:stare: I frequently get the paranoid thought that people in this thread are spying on my life and then posting the stories. It's just too accurate to be a coincidence.

Nobody in my family had an idea of emotional regulation, or any kind of coping skills at all. If they were feeling unhappy or frustrated, they would take it out on someone else. They would prowl around the house looking for a fight. Anyone relaxing was their favourite target. Even today, I still can't stretch out on my couch and relax completely because I'll suddenly panic that someone is going to walk into the room and start a screaming fight with me.

The pretext never mattered, in fact, the flimsier the pretext, the quicker the fight could start.

"What are you doing lying there? You're supposed to be doing thing."
"I'm doing it tomorrow. I can't even do it do today, the shops are shut"
"Get up and do it right now!"
"Leave me alone, I'm trying to relax"
"What did you say to me? How dare you?!?!"

Screaming, physical attacks, doors slamming, etc. Every single time.

Absolute toddler levels of dealing with problems in their life. I blame the enablers more than the lovely people in my life now. Without a cloud of enablers shielding them from consequences, I could at least enjoy watching karma catch up with them.

Dongsturm fucked around with this message at 11:27 on Oct 18, 2021

Alterian
Jan 28, 2003

Here's a fun gift giving story about an aunt:

When my husband and I got married, I had a bridal shower thrown by my mom's side of the family. We don't live in the same city as most of my extended family. I grew up about an hour and a half away in a different city. My husband came to the bridal shower as well mostly because it was out of town and he is good friends with all my female friends that were there.

We both hate getting gifts so the opening of presents part was super awkward for both of us. One of my aunts got us a stand up Kitchen aid mixer. On the surface, that is a pretty nice gift. However, this was not on our registry. We already had the same mixer. In fact, my aunt asked my mom if we would like a Kitchen aid mixer and she told her that we already had one. I'm aware of the weird hosed up games of my family, but my husband wasn't. I was mildly panicking in my head and trying to psychic tell him with my face to not say anything. (I don't really believe in psychics, but you get the idea) Thankfully he didn't blurt out "Oh we already have one of these!" She wanted to see if we would be gracious at accepting such a nice gift even though we already had one. Isn't she such a nice aunt for giving us such an expensive thoughtful gift? All the other relatives got to see how amazing she is! This is sadly one of the few things I actually remember about my bridal shower.

Later, it was returned behind the scenes. I don't even remember if we got something else from her or what.

OMFG FURRY
Jul 10, 2006

[snarky comment]
being terrified of my mother's emotional outbursts growing up was my natural state of being for a long time. going no contact with her for a few years gave me time to actually come to understand what 'normal' adults actually act like, and when i have recently tried to reconnect, and finding that she hasn't changed at all and still has literal temper tantrums of stomping around and slamming doors, the episodes have become hilarious in their absurdity.

and its a weird feeling because of its ridiculousness but at the same time terrifying for a different reason because this is my mother and she is acting like a god drat four year old

OMFG FURRY fucked around with this message at 11:15 on Oct 18, 2021

Ghost Leviathan
Mar 2, 2017

Exploration is ill-advised.
Dealing with my mother gets hilarious now because she's so terrible at communicating that even when I actively want to help her with something I have to ask at least three times to get a straight answer on what she wants me to actually do. She really just expects people, or at least her kids, to read her mind and know what she wants.

Ghostnuke
Sep 21, 2005

Throw this in a pot, add some broth, a potato? Baby you got a stew going!


I have so much more space in my house after going NC. I went through and threw away/sold all the poo poo (so much >_<) that I was obligated to display or use, even though I hated it. It was very liberating.

Rutibex
Sep 9, 2001

by Fluffdaddy

OMFG FURRY posted:

being terrified of my mother's emotional outbursts growing up was my natural state of being for a long time. going no contact with her for a few years gave me time to actually come to understand what 'normal' adults actually act like, and when i have recently tried to reconnect, and finding that she hasn't changed at all and still has literal temper tantrums of stomping around and slamming doors, the episodes have become hilarious in their absurdity.

and its a weird feeling because of its ridiculousness but at the same time terrifying for a different reason because this is my mother and she is acting like a god drat four year old

it feels really weird to me that my parents never seem to change at all. i am a completely different person than i was 10 years ago, but they always stay exactly the same and never change

deep dish peat moss
Jul 27, 2006

Ghost Leviathan posted:

Dealing with my mother gets hilarious now because she's so terrible at communicating that even when I actively want to help her with something I have to ask at least three times to get a straight answer on what she wants me to actually do. She really just expects people, or at least her kids, to read her mind and know what she wants.

My big reckoning with this was Christmas 2020. I was living with my parents because pandemic rent prices are bonkers. I have an ipad that I bought exclusively for drawing. My mom is also an artist - she hates technology in general but I handed her my ipad and pencil and opened up Procreate once and she sat there for 45 minutes drawing and marveling about how intuitive and easy to use it was and how cool it was and rambling on about different things she could use it for. So I thought - hell, I'll get her an ipad and apple pencil for Christmas.

My parents already had two Android tablets which they use exclusively for playing slot machine apps, so come Christmas day when she opened this and saw a tablet and got confused I explained that I know they already have tablets that they use for that stuff, so I was hoping they would use this one purely for productive/creative things (art/music/etc) since I saw how much she liked drawing on mine.

Over the next week or two, she would occasionally barge in my room and start ranting about how much she hated the iPad, how confusing it was, how it made no sense and how she didn't know why I bought it for her, how she wishes I hadn't given it to her, how it's all dumb and stupid and makes no sense and how it upsets her every time she looks at it. This was actually when I had the revelation that she has never in my entire life asked for help with anything at all - when she needs help, she does this. She gets angry and rants about how upset and angry she is and expects everyone to crowd around her to soothe her and fix whatever is bothering her. For the first 30+ years of my life I thought she just legitimately hated everything I did for her :v:

Side note: I was working a consulting job at the time where my job was essentially to teach boomer small business owners how to manage their ecommerce website - a ton of them do this, they don't know how to ask for information they need and instead they get angry at everything until someone addresses their tantrum by bending over backwards to help them. I have since quit this job because after I started to recognize all of this in my mom, I got extremely rude with clients and started calling them out on their lovely behavior, which was making work hell for me.

So I told her "I would love to teach you anything you need to know to use it, but I don't know what your questions are - you'll need to ask me questions about the parts that are confusing. What do you want to do with it that you can't figure out how to do yet?" because this usually helped wrangle clients into actually telling me what was wrong.

Her response was to walk away while yelling about how much she hated technology and then never bring it up again. She gave the iPad to my dad who uses it to dual wield slot machine apps and play two at a time now.

Edit: Ughhh this probably explains her things with giving gifts too. When we tell her we don't want something or don't like something she gave us, she thinks it means we need help figuring it out.


BrigadierSensible posted:

Edit: I think you were raised by my parents. Because the thing about your dad "helping" your mum is drat near identical to the way my parents interact with each other. And also how my dad will spend a week obsessing over and trying to "help" me with a problem that I have already fixed myself, that wasn't a big deal, and that I have told him multiple times that I don't need or want his help. Then get lovely at me when I am not effusively grateful for his solution, which is often either useless or a lot more work than it's worth.

Dongsturm posted:

:stare: I frequently get the paranoid thought that people in this thread are spying on my life and then posting the stories. It's just too accurate to be a coincidence.

Hearing stuff like this so often in this thread is mind blowing because I spent my entire life around exactly zero people who understood or could relate to any of this, since it's not "abusive" on the surface. I even spent time in therapy not properly explaining it to my therapist and asking them to help me better manage my mood and not get upset with my family so often, and I minimized the crazy parts enough that the therapist I had at the time went along with it. Solidarity, goons :unsmith::respek::unsmith:

deep dish peat moss fucked around with this message at 17:52 on Oct 18, 2021

Ghost Leviathan
Mar 2, 2017

Exploration is ill-advised.
Came to mind when I was talking with my brother about he took a class on how to communicate effectively in the workplace, and he brought up that it's basically doing the opposite of everything our mother does. More funny in our case now given the easiest thing to do is just shrug and walk away and she gives up on getting people to help her because everyone else on the planet is a helpless child.

blatman
May 10, 2009

14 inc dont mez


i've been meaning to ask this question here for awhile and honestly i've written/deleted it so many times that I don't remember if i've even posted it yet but here it goes:

did anyone elses parents randomly rearrange every single thing in their room several times a year when they were growing up? like bed moved, all the clothes in the dresser/closet shuffled around, shelves emptied and refilled in a different order? is this a thing normal people do? it always felt like a massive violation of my personal space but I could never adequately explain why it felt so awful to walk into what was ostensibly my space and find it had completely changed

life is killing me
Oct 28, 2007

blatman posted:

i've been meaning to ask this question here for awhile and honestly i've written/deleted it so many times that I don't remember if i've even posted it yet but here it goes:

did anyone elses parents randomly rearrange every single thing in their room several times a year when they were growing up? like bed moved, all the clothes in the dresser/closet shuffled around, shelves emptied and refilled in a different order? is this a thing normal people do? it always felt like a massive violation of my personal space but I could never adequately explain why it felt so awful to walk into what was ostensibly my space and find it had completely changed

I'd say that's not normal, and in fact it's extremely invasive and creepy. There's no good reason I can think of to do that--it's like if you just went to a friend's house while they were gone and moved all their poo poo around in their space...that would feel weird and wrong, am I right? It should have felt like that for your parents but it clearly didn't or they overrode it because what the actual gently caress

Everett False
Sep 28, 2006

Mopsy, I'm starting to question your medical credentials.

It is not a thing normal people do. It was absolutely a violation of the sanctity of your space, and probably done deliberately to emphasize that it wasn't really yours.

Dirt Road Junglist
Oct 8, 2010

We will be cruel
And through our cruelty
They will know who we are
Flashbacks to coming home to find my parents had gotten mad I’d borrowed something and forgot to return it, so they tossed my room looking for it, and forced me to clean everything up as punishment. Happened more than once.

And they wonder why I still pay for a storage unit and won’t let anyone touch my poo poo when I move until after I’ve packed it myself.

blatman
May 10, 2009

14 inc dont mez


thank you goons, part of me is relieved to know that it's abnormal and also horrified that the responses were basically identical varieties of :wtc:

Light Gun Man
Oct 17, 2009

toEjaM iS oN
vaCatioN




Lipstick Apathy
yeah that's hosed up. when I was a kid my mom and I would do this stupid dance where I wouldn't wanna clean my room, so she'd do it while I was gone, and I'd come back and be like well now I don't know where anything is and will have to drag everything out to find anything, thus making a new mess.

deep dish peat moss
Jul 27, 2006

blatman posted:

i've been meaning to ask this question here for awhile and honestly i've written/deleted it so many times that I don't remember if i've even posted it yet but here it goes:

did anyone elses parents randomly rearrange every single thing in their room several times a year when they were growing up? like bed moved, all the clothes in the dresser/closet shuffled around, shelves emptied and refilled in a different order? is this a thing normal people do? it always felt like a massive violation of my personal space but I could never adequately explain why it felt so awful to walk into what was ostensibly my space and find it had completely changed

My mom did this often enough that it was an everyday anxiety as I was coming home from school. I would come home to things like all of my personal journals/notebooks scattered across my bed open to pages that I wrote negative things about her on. She would play innocent and talk about how I know how much it stresses her out when things aren't neat and orderly so she went in to help me out and to clean up and organize and she just ran across some things that she definitely didn't look at but they looked important so she put them on my bed so that I can put them away.

It gave me an enormous anxiety of ever leaving anyone alone in my room/home because I am terrified they are going to rifle through it top to bottom. I got so paranoid about nothing I did being private/secret/personal that when I first started working, despite working overnights in a different city than she lived in, I was always anxiously vigilant on my smoke breaks because I was afraid she would drive by and see me smoking.

deep dish peat moss fucked around with this message at 19:42 on Oct 18, 2021

Imagined
Feb 2, 2007
When I was 16-17 I spent a lot of my free time trawling thrift stores for vintage clothes I thought were cool or fun. Bell-bottoms, jeans, ironic t-shirts, military surplus, fluffy "pirate shirt" style 60-s tuxedo shirts, etc. Well, I spent the summer between 11th and 12th grade with my dad in another state, and while I was gone my grandmother/adopted mother took it upon herself to throw away all those kind of clothes that I hadn't taken with me. Didn't ask me or even tell me she was going to do that, just did it. She always hated anything I did that could be perceived as in any non-conformist by the standards of someone born in 1940 -- so no piercings, tattoos, or long/colored hair. If it was up to her I'd have dressed like I was going to church every single day and bought all my clothes at Montgomery Ward. If she lived to be 1,000 years old she'd have never understood why anyone would want to deliberately look "weird" or artfully disheveled -- in her words "like a wooly booger".

The funny thing is that she assumed that me and the skater/goth kids who dressed like me were the "bad" kids who drank, had sex and did drugs. When in reality we the biggest dorks and did nothing bad, meanwhile we knew the clean-cut "preppy" kids she wanted me to look and act like were the actual partiers running around getting teen pregnant. While the skater kids were playing Magic: the Gathering and Vampire the Masquerade and playing videogames.

Imagined fucked around with this message at 19:40 on Oct 18, 2021

blatman
May 10, 2009

14 inc dont mez


deep dish peat moss posted:

My mom did this often enough that it was an everyday anxiety as I was coming home from school. I would come home to things like all of my personal journals/notebooks scattered across my bed open to pages that I wrote negative things about her on. She would play innocent and talk about how I know how much it stresses her out when things aren't neat and orderly so she went in to help me out and to clean up and organize and she just ran across some things that she definitely didn't look at but they looked important so she put them on my bed so that I can put them away.

It gave me an enormous anxiety of ever leaving anyone alone in my room/home because I am terrified they are going to rifle through it top to bottom. I got so paranoid about nothing I did being private/secret/personal that when I first started working, despite working overnights in a different city than she lived in, I was always anxiously vigilant on my smoke breaks because I was afraid she would drive by and see me smoking.

poo poo this might be why my mom kept bugging me to start journaling

joke's on her, I kept a journal on a floppy disk labeled "doom wads 6"

edit: post above this one I feel you there, clothes I liked would get "ruined in the wash" constantly, even if I was washing them myself and placing them directly into the drawer after they were dried. I was also heavily encouraged to dye my hair but it had to be frosted tips so I wouldn't look like a gangster (lady i'm white, huge glasses and spent my time programming while listening to trance there's no hair color in the galaxy that could make me gangsta)

blatman fucked around with this message at 19:45 on Oct 18, 2021

deep dish peat moss
Jul 27, 2006

The last time I let her help me move (in my 30s), I had just gone through a breakup and was thinning out my stuff, a whole lot of everything I owned was being thrown away and I planned on buying new things. When she showed up (unprompted) to help me pack the truck and saw so many garbage bags and so many things in/near the dumpster, she flipped out and started incoherently babbling about how unacceptable that was and how I needed to take all of that stuff with me. I said no, then walked out the door to take something to the dumpster. When I got back inside I saw that she had been ripping open all the garbage bags and dumping them across the floor, insisting that I needed to let her sort through them to determine what was garbage and what wasn't. This caused a big stir during which I pleaded with her to let me be an adult and to let me make my own decisions about my own property. Not angry yelling or anything, like literal verge-of-tears begging her to just one time in my life let me make my own decisions about things that she has nothing to do with.

She was so upset by this that she stormed out, drove away and disappeared for 4 hours. It wasn't until she was gone that I realized that she had taken my wallet, phone, keys, and cigarettes with her and left me with nothing to do except sit on the floor in a packed-up apartment and drink water straight from the tap.

life is killing me
Oct 28, 2007

deep dish peat moss posted:

The last time I let her help me move (in my 30s), I had just gone through a breakup and was thinning out my stuff, a whole lot of everything I owned was being thrown away and I planned on buying new things. When she showed up (unprompted) to help me pack the truck and saw so many garbage bags and so many things in/near the dumpster, she flipped out and started incoherently babbling about how unacceptable that was and how I needed to take all of that stuff with me. I said no, then walked out the door to take something to the dumpster. When I got back inside I saw that she had been ripping open all the garbage bags and dumping them across the floor, insisting that I needed to let her sort through them to determine what was garbage and what wasn't. This caused a big stir during which I pleaded with her to let me be an adult and to let me make my own decisions about my own property. Not angry yelling or anything, like literal verge-of-tears begging her to just one time in my life let me make my own decisions about things that she has nothing to do with.

She was so upset by this that she stormed out, drove away and disappeared for 4 hours. It wasn't until she was gone that I realized that she had taken my wallet, phone, keys, and cigarettes with her and left me with nothing to do except sit on the floor in a packed-up apartment and drink water straight from the tap.

JFC what the gently caress

Imagined
Feb 2, 2007

life is killing me posted:

Rejected Parents: JFC what the gently caress

blatman
May 10, 2009

14 inc dont mez


deep dish peat moss posted:

The last time I let her help me move (in my 30s), I had just gone through a breakup and was thinning out my stuff, a whole lot of everything I owned was being thrown away and I planned on buying new things. When she showed up (unprompted) to help me pack the truck and saw so many garbage bags and so many things in/near the dumpster, she flipped out and started incoherently babbling about how unacceptable that was and how I needed to take all of that stuff with me. I said no, then walked out the door to take something to the dumpster. When I got back inside I saw that she had been ripping open all the garbage bags and dumping them across the floor, insisting that I needed to let her sort through them to determine what was garbage and what wasn't. This caused a big stir during which I pleaded with her to let me be an adult and to let me make my own decisions about my own property. Not angry yelling or anything, like literal verge-of-tears begging her to just one time in my life let me make my own decisions about things that she has nothing to do with.

She was so upset by this that she stormed out, drove away and disappeared for 4 hours. It wasn't until she was gone that I realized that she had taken my wallet, phone, keys, and cigarettes with her and left me with nothing to do except sit on the floor in a packed-up apartment and drink water straight from the tap.


life is killing me posted:

JFC what the gently caress

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skooma512
Feb 8, 2012

You couldn't grok my race car, but you dug the roadside blur.

blatman posted:

i've been meaning to ask this question here for awhile and honestly i've written/deleted it so many times that I don't remember if i've even posted it yet but here it goes:

did anyone elses parents randomly rearrange every single thing in their room several times a year when they were growing up? like bed moved, all the clothes in the dresser/closet shuffled around, shelves emptied and refilled in a different order? is this a thing normal people do? it always felt like a massive violation of my personal space but I could never adequately explain why it felt so awful to walk into what was ostensibly my space and find it had completely changed

My mom did this. She would wait till I was away at school or even work and poo poo would just be turned around.

I mean, it was nice, but everytime this happened I asked her to please not do this. She eventually got the hint, and either didn't find or didn't mention the poo poo I had stashed in there lol.

But yeah, really infuriating how the second I was away my poo poo was just completely up for grabs. Bored? Sure, just go ahead and rearrange someone else's room without their permission.

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