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AYC posted:What liberal cities do you have other than Detroit? Ann Arbor? Basically any town with a major university in it. Most areas of the state have a slight margin in favor of Republicans but it is disingenuous to say liberals only exist in Detroit and Ann Arbor especially when states like Oklahoma exist 
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Mar 27, 2014 23:01
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Nostalgia4Infinity posted:Basically any town with a major university in it. Yeah, the college towns are more liberal, but its still about population density. Not making GBS threads on any liberals outside of metro Detroit, of course, you are all fighting the good fight.
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Mar 27, 2014 23:03
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Saagonsa posted:I don't think many people would consider rural areas to not be part of modern civilization. Sorry, I guess that was just a bit too much of a cut. Having lived in rural places in a blue state for all of my youth, I'm still a little bitter. BTW, we had neither the net or cable out there, but the former basically didn't exist when I was a kid so whatever.
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Mar 28, 2014 00:29
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DreamShipWrecked posted:Fair enough, I just generally see Michigan as skewed more in that direction because we really only have one city. Yeah, Ann Arbor and all that, but in terms of population it is mostly metro Detroit. Maryland only has Baltimore and the DC Suburbs. The rest of the state is flyover country. Doesn't stop it from being a solidly blue state.
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Mar 28, 2014 00:37
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MaxxBot posted:They look even dumber now because essentially what they're saying is that they support gay rights unless a bunch of angry bigots lash out, then they'll stop. It's because the angry bigots donate money. So they just reversed their stance because of a paycheck. Pretty deplorable.
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Mar 28, 2014 01:11
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AYC posted:Unfortunately we're going to have to deal with bans being stayed over and over again until the issue finally reaches the Supreme Court. On the plus side, gay marriage will likely be legal nationwide before 2020. Gay marriage will likely be legal nationwide before the next presidential election.
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Mar 28, 2014 01:31
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Saagonsa posted:I don't think many people would consider rural areas to not be part of modern civilization.
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Mar 28, 2014 01:48
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Lycus posted:Joking aside, I'd say its more accurately: urban areas = blue, suburban areas = red, rural areas = decreasing political relevance. At the national level, maybe. Statehouses are loving crammed with officials from rural parts. Thank them for the house of representatives being so skewed.
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Mar 28, 2014 02:24
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AYC posted:What liberal cities do you have other than Detroit? Ann Arbor? Kalamazoo is pretty decent I think.
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Mar 28, 2014 02:36
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VirtualStranger posted:Gay marriage will likely be legal nationwide before the next presidential election. I seriously doubt it. I can't imagine it making through the courts that soon.
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Mar 28, 2014 02:52
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Finnin posted:I seriously doubt it. I can't imagine it making through the courts that soon.
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Mar 28, 2014 03:03
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UltimoDragonQuest posted:There will be multiple Appeals Court rulings by the end of this year and there's no reason for SCOTUS to wait. If they don't like the cases that are fartherest along, they can pick one from a lower court like Windsor. I think Windsor made it very clear they want to avoid addressing gay marriage on a national level. It'd take a conveniently timed heart attack from a conservative justice.
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Mar 28, 2014 03:05
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Kennedy is a reliable fifth vote and has built the entire foundation for a national marriage ruling. He wanted to decide the Prop 8 case on the merits instead of bouncing it. Even if he did want to wait, the four liberals can vote to take a case and speed things up. He's not going to side with the right and go back on 18 years of work.
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Mar 28, 2014 03:49
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If anything, Windsor was just them saying they wanted to wait to make a decision. Now's the point of no return, every place that doesn't have a ban has or will have it, and the only thing that could change that is a court ruling. It will be decided by 2020 at the absolute latest, and it will likely be before our next president takes office.
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Mar 28, 2014 03:54
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There are currently 6 states where court rulings have been stayed pending appeal, and there will be many more by the end of this year. I really doubt that the SCOTUS will just ignore that many appeals. When every circuit court in the country is asking them to rule on the same issue, do you really think they'll just ignore it?
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Mar 28, 2014 04:01
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AYC posted:What liberal cities do you have other than Detroit? Ann Arbor? Yes. Washtenaw County in general is pretty drat liberal. Speaking as someone living there, at least. 
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Mar 28, 2014 05:34
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rkajdi posted:Maryland only has Baltimore and the DC Suburbs. The rest of the state is flyover country. Doesn't stop it from being a solidly blue state. If you mean "solidly blue" as in "the flyover parts vote blue as well" then no that's not true, the only state I've ever heard of anything like that happening is Vermont maybe? But I don't think that's what you meant; anyway Maryland is a tiny state and Baltimore to the edge of DC and everything in between is a a significant chunk of the entire state and I believe contains well over half the population. That's not even factoring in the smallish cities on the outside of the I-95 corridor like Annapolis and Frederick that are also fairly reliably blue, as well. I guess the only point I'm trying to make is you can't really point to Maryland and say "See that's a really blue state that only has one-ish big city." That's like pointing to Rhode Island and saying that, neither of the states are even big enough to support another metro area the size of the one already there...
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Mar 28, 2014 05:58
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http://www.washingtonpost.com/world...b816_story.html AG Holder just announced that the federal government will recognize the Michigan same sex marriages, despite Michigan not recognizing them at the state level. Same as with the marriages in Utah. I'm no lawyer: is what happened in Michigan and Utah a legal mistake or not? Typically, I notice that when laws are overturned, the ruling is immediately stayed pending appeal. Why did that not happen in those states? I think I remember reading something a few months ago about Utah simply forgetting some basic legal motion, but I can't find anything about what happened in Michigan.
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Mar 28, 2014 15:46
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The judge presiding over the case doesn't have to stay his or her ruling if he or she doesn't believe the loser has a reasonable chance of winning on appeal. I think that's what happened in Michigan, though I could be wrong.
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Mar 28, 2014 15:58
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Sweeney Tom posted:If anything, Windsor was just them saying they wanted to wait to make a decision. Now's the point of no return, every place that doesn't have a ban has or will have it, and the only thing that could change that is a court ruling. It will be decided by 2020 at the absolute latest, and it will likely be before our next president takes office. Don't we have a case at a circuit court yet to be finished this year and off to SCOTUS next year? There's so many I figured one would have made it that far by now. Edit: 4th circuit hears Virginia's case in May. Deuce fucked around with this message at 16:16 on Mar 28, 2014 |
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Mar 28, 2014 16:10
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CaptBushido posted:If you mean "solidly blue" as in "the flyover parts vote blue as well" then no that's not true, the only state I've ever heard of anything like that happening is Vermont maybe? I meant solidly blue as in both senators and all but one rep are Democrats, plus the state has always gone blue presidentially since I was a kid (1984, what the hell were we thinking?). Also, I have to laugh at people calling Frederick blue. Hagerstown trended more blue last time in the representitives race, while managing to push a bunch of the supposedly racists elements in the north end of the county (Thurmont, Cascade) into a different district. If you can't get your voters out to beat down a Moonie loon in the election, that's not that reliably blue. Flyover parts of all states are a mess. My point was that every state gets sketchy when you get away form the urban areas and start dealing with "independent-minded" people. Blue states just have the population in urban areas to outvote those people and tell them to gently caress off.
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Mar 28, 2014 16:19
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rkajdi posted:My point was that every state gets sketchy when you get away form the urban areas and start dealing with "independent-minded" people. Blue states just have the population in urban areas to outvote those people and tell them to gently caress off.
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Mar 28, 2014 17:03
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Zoran posted:The judge presiding over the case doesn't have to stay his or her ruling if he or she doesn't believe the loser has a reasonable chance of winning on appeal. I think that's what happened in Michigan, though I could be wrong. This is correct and one of the circuit justices dissented on the stay as well stating that the supreme court's ruling for the Utah case didn't actually present a salient test and wasn't binding for this situation.
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Mar 28, 2014 17:47
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AYC posted:I think Windsor made it very clear they want to avoid addressing gay marriage on a national level. It'd take a conveniently timed heart attack from a conservative justice. I thought the only reason they bounced the issue with Windsor is because they really didn't want the standing issue become precedent.
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Mar 28, 2014 18:28
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hangedman1984 posted:I thought the only reason they bounced the issue with Windsor is because they really didn't want the standing issue become precedent. We can't know for sure. But Kennedy openly said at oral arguments he thought maybe they'd been too hasty in taking the Prop 8 case and should dismiss it as 'improvidently granted' (i.e. "we shouldn't have granted cert, pretend we didn't, the lower court ruling stands but with no precedential value outside the circuit") and wait a year or two. He then voted to hear the merits instead of dismissing it on standing though, so who knows. I think that overall the nation will be better off with this year of everyone ruling the same way so that the Supreme Court confirms the victory with a capstone opinion instead of leading the way, but obviously it's not me who's rights are being held in abeyance for a year so it's easy for me to say that.
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Mar 28, 2014 18:33
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How does Kennedy justify saying they should DIG the case and then voting to reach the merits? Or does he mean "maybe it was improvidently granted but I'm not gonna say so explicitly"?
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Mar 28, 2014 18:57
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People who don't live in a hip city center = sketchy 
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Mar 28, 2014 19:17
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Nostalgia4Infinity posted:People who don't live in a hip city center = sketchy because when I think "hip city center" I think "Detroit".
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Mar 28, 2014 19:38
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Kem Rixen posted:That's really not true, I can use my home state of Massachusetts as an example. The rural areas in Western MA are deep blue but some of our mill cities, Lowell, Fall River, etc can end up swinging one way or another. Backing Scott Brown in one election then voting against him in another. These aren't small cities either, places like Lowell have a population of 100k people. It's a mistake to lump urban as automatically blue and rural as automatically red since that isn't always the case. Massachusetts is one of like three states where a majority of white men voted for Obama. It's not a typical place.
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Mar 28, 2014 22:41
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Midnight tonight (GMT) things are officially a-go in England and Wales.
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Mar 28, 2014 23:22
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Alchenar posted:Midnight tonight (GMT) things are officially a-go in England and Wales. Britannia may rule the waves, but sea to shining sea means America. (Congratulations on achieving more equality. Hopefully we colonists can stop being an embarrassment soon.  )
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Mar 29, 2014 04:09
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Nth Doctor posted:Britannia may rule the waves, but sea to shining sea means America. Whats that quote about America always doing the right thing...after exhausting all other options?
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Mar 29, 2014 07:53
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hangedman1984 posted:Whats that quote about America always doing the right thing...after exhausting all other options? "you can count on Americans to do the right thing - after they have tried everything else" - Winston Churchill
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Mar 30, 2014 01:51
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Bill Schuette does something right.
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Apr 1, 2014 01:55
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10th Circuit will hear the OK case April 17, and the UT case Apr 10. Judges are Kelly Jr (appointed by Bush Sr), Lucero (Clinton), and Holmes (Bush Jr).
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Apr 1, 2014 05:09
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In an issue that just won't die, a bible-belt state's House and Senate actually PASSED an Arizona style segregation bill, and who's governor is likely to sign it. Betcha you'll never guess which!quote:
The ACLU reacts: quote:The law could allow individuals and businesses to bring challenges against what they view as substantial government burdens against religion, including challenging existing nondiscrimination laws. Legislatures across the country, including in Georgia, Idaho, Maine, and Ohio, have rejected similar measures. On February 26, 2014, Governor Jan Brewer vetoed Arizona’s version. Bills are still pending in Missouri and Oklahoma. “Even though the Mississippi legislature removed some of the egregious language from Arizona’s infamous SB 1062, we are disappointed that it passed this unnecessary law and ignored the national, public outcry against laws of this nature,” said Eunice Rho, advocacy and policy counsel with the ACLU. “We will continue to fight in state legislatures across the country to ensure that religious freedom remains a shield, not a sword.” And the Human Rights Campaign: quote:While efforts had previously been made to allay concerns about the scope and breadth of the legislation, the version passed tonight is far-reaching and should be vetoed by the governor. Human Rights Campaign (HRC) State Legislative Director Sarah Warbelow issued the following statement: “While there were many efforts to correct the clearly problematic elements of this legislation, the bill still has the effect of making LGBT people strangers to the law. Before Mississippi has had the opportunity to robustly discuss the lived experiences of LGBT people, this bill would hollow out any non-discrimination protections at the local level or possible future state-wide protections. Just as we’ve seen in other states, this bill is bad for business, bad for the state’s reputation, and most of all, bad for Mississippians. Governor Bryant must veto the measure.” The state GOP will cry left and right to tell you that it's totally not meant to target the https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uvcNZ-KOEcg
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Apr 2, 2014 20:29
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As much as I hate my home state of Georgia sometimes, at least I can say we're not Mississippi.
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Apr 2, 2014 20:41
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hangedman1984 posted:at least we're not Mississippi. That's pretty catchy, you should get in touch with the state tourism department.
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Apr 2, 2014 20:57
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Let's spell Mississippi! M-O-T-H-E-R-F-U-C-K-E-R-S I had no idea that the bill was even introduced in Mississippi. Hopefully it fails miserably and is made an example of, but I worry that it will embolden other states to follow suit if it passes successfully.
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Apr 2, 2014 20:58
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DreamShipWrecked posted:Let's spell Mississippi! M-O-T-H-E-R-F-U-C-K-E-R-S Eagerly awaiting the first 'No Baptists' signs.
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Apr 2, 2014 21:47
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