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Kaiser Schnitzel
Mar 28, 2006

Schnitzel mit uns






SubG posted:

Last year Two years ago I got the same thing on my Japanese eggplants, and they were caged to keep out critters. When I asked about it in this post, with pics for comparison the suggestion was caterpillars.
Thanks! I looked at some still on the plant and did see some tiny grey caterpillars-Bt time Those are some very pretty eggplants-do you remember what variety they are? I like the light purple ichiban ones I have but I wouldn't mind something a little beefier.


Also, there are definitely squash vine borers in much of my squash. Guess I'm gonna try slitting all the stems tomorrow with a razorblade to try and kill the little bastards?

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Sockser
Jun 28, 2007

Eternal greatness only exists only within my posts.

Sing a song of sorrow in a world where your shitpost has vanished!






GENTLEMEN, BEHOLD!

https://twitter.com/rottentunagames...4152026112?s=21

CORN!!

Shifty Pony
Dec 28, 2004

Up ta somethin'




College Slice

Squirrel ate my first tomato 😑

Kaiser Schnitzel
Mar 28, 2006

Schnitzel mit uns






Shifty Pony posted:

Squirrel ate my first tomato 😑
My squirrels seem to only like fully ripe tomatoes so I have been picking them a few days early and letting them ripen on the counter and it seems to help, though the tomatoes aren't quiiiite as good as fully ripened on the vine ones

Paradoxish
Dec 19, 2003

Will you stop going crazy in there?

Jhet posted:

You can transplant if you want later, but theyíll take a few days to adapt still. You should still be okay for a harvest, but it just will be a couple weeks later. 65-70 days is normal for where I grew up in Wisconsin, and tomatoes donít go in until this weekend there. I wouldnít want to try moving them after the end of June, but during the next few weeks should be fine. If theyíre outside theyíre just going to grow when it hits 70 anyway.

Alternately, you can grow them in the 5 gallon buckets without issue. That should be plenty of space for most tomatoes types, just keep up with watering because they get thirsty and fruit sets better when the water is consistent. Iím guessing you could even move the small plants once the radishes in the middle are pulled, and itíll get started growing big right away with good weather.

Thanks, this is probably what I'll end up doing. Those radishes should be ready to go soon-ish, so I think I'll pick out the best looking survivors and use that space. I usually transplant late May/early June anyway, I'm just used to having bigger, beefier plants by now. Might stick the crappier plants into the 5-gallon buckets so that they don't take up precious raised bed space and just hope for the best.

Drone
Aug 22, 2003

Incredible machine.




A bit late since I purchased my plants this year instead of growing from seed, but hey. I just transplanted three chilis (lemon drop, piri-piri, and habanero) into their final home (fairly large planters on my balcony). One of the plants has really shot up and gotten leggy, but the other two are very short and quite bushy.

Anyway, I'm thinking about doing some companion plants in smaller pots on my balcony as well. For flowers I've read that geraniums and petunias are good, and herbs should be basil, oregano, or chives.

My question on the herbs: most of what I've read seems to be advice for companion planting in the same bed, since the herbs are there to help keep the soil moist. Can/should I plant basil or oregano in the same planter as my chilis, or will that somehow hinder them? Chives I'd probably put in a separate little pot, and the flowers of course would be separate as well.

silicone thrills
Jan 9, 2008





Platystemon posted:

You have to apply the roundup within approximately thirty seconds of stumping the plant, but if you do that, it gets pulled into the roots and prevents resprouting.

Thanks! I'll make sure to bring it out there with me when I finish chopping up those monsters!

On actual edible garden news: My snap peas have three whole flowers on them now. I'm very excited. I swear this has been what feels like the slowest spring ever here. But I guess the temp rarely has gotten above the 60s except for like 3 days in the 80s a few weeks ago that were super out of the norm.

SubG
Aug 19, 2004

It's a hard world for little things.


Kaiser Schnitzel posted:

Thanks! I looked at some still on the plant and did see some tiny grey caterpillars-Bt time Those are some very pretty eggplants-do you remember what variety they are? I like the light purple ichiban ones I have but I wouldn't mind something a little beefier.
Millionaire, a Japanese eggplant hybrid. Super hardy and productive, although in the hottest part of summer they tend to produce eggplants that go from under-ripe and hard as a rock to pulpy and full of seeds in no time flat. As soon as it starts getting cooler in the evenings they (usually) recover and start producing well again.

Drone posted:

My question on the herbs: most of what I've read seems to be advice for companion planting in the same bed, since the herbs are there to help keep the soil moist. Can/should I plant basil or oregano in the same planter as my chilis, or will that somehow hinder them?
I'd worry a little about Italian basil unless you're super aggressive about keeping it hacked back, just because every Italian basil plant I've grown wants to run absolutely wild.

That said, I often alternate Thai and/or holy basil and hot peppers. Thai and holy basil and Capsicum peppers are all plants that like sun, but the peppers always seem to be happier when they're around the 10-12" stage if they're in with some other plants. I'm not sure what the mechanism is--maybe just a little extra foliage to keep the soil around their roots a little cooler?

Anyway, I wouldn't companion plant them with anything that would overshade them, but they do seem to like a little company.

DrBouvenstein
Feb 28, 2007

I think I'm a doctor, but that doesn't make me a doctor. This fancy avatar does.


What's everyone's favorite trellis method for pole beans and peas?

I was originally thinking just a simple frame out of garden stakes and scrap wood I've got, then each bean or pea gets it's own line of twine from the top of the frame down to the ground.

But then I wasn't sure if the beans and/peas prefer a more grid-like trellis? Room to branch out sideways a bit, maybe be more productive?

I've got a little while before I have to get one in there, peas are maybe 4"-6" tall, and the beans maybe just slightly shorter.

B33rChiller
Aug 18, 2011




Pillbug

DrBouvenstein posted:

What's everyone's favorite trellis method for pole beans and peas?

I was originally thinking just a simple frame out of garden stakes and scrap wood I've got, then each bean or pea gets it's own line of twine from the top of the frame down to the ground.

But then I wasn't sure if the beans and/peas prefer a more grid-like trellis? Room to branch out sideways a bit, maybe be more productive?

I've got a little while before I have to get one in there, peas are maybe 4"-6" tall, and the beans maybe just slightly shorter.

I've got long railing planters sat on the edge of the patio, and strung up trellis netting. Peas work really well in there, and when they finish up, I follow them with cucumbers.

Shine
Feb 26, 2007

No Muscles For The Majority


We'd like to try the compost thing, as we toss a lot of trash/scraps/cardboard shipping boxes that seem like they'd be good compost fodder.

For small scale, it sounds like worms are a common option, since a small compost bin/tumbler may not have enough bulk to really get going. On the other hand, we live in Vegas, so we have warm-to-really-hot temperatures for most of the year, so I'm wondering if that would:

1: Murder the worms all summer.
2: Help a 37 gallon'ish tumbler work alright, especially during the 7 months that our daily highs are over 80 (with 5 of those over 90).

Thoughts? We don't need a ton of compost, as we're talking about enough to add to 20'ish grow bags/pots for a perpetual indoor growing season.


Also, potato flowers are really pretty

SubG
Aug 19, 2004

It's a hard world for little things.


DrBouvenstein posted:

What's everyone's favorite trellis method for pole beans and peas?
For beans I used to just improvise whatever using scrap lumber, PVC tubing, plastic netting, and whatever I had on hand. This works fine, my main complaint with this method is that during off seasons the improvised solutions never break down easily for storage except by complete disassembly. So the following year you end up having to re-solve the problem.

Eventually I ended up getting fancy trellises from Gardener's Supply. I just happened to see some at a local nursery and liked the build quality. The original plan was to just replace the makeshift trellis for the cucumbers, because holy poo poo slicing cuke plants produce heavy cukes and lots of them and I wanted something sturdy for them. But then there was scope creep and we ended up replacing all the trellises. The Gardener Supply heavy duty trellis is waaaaaaay overkill for long beans (the kind of pole bean I grow the most) but I regret nothing. It's stable as a rock, gives them plenty of room--the trellis is an A-frame, and I plant so there's a row of beans growing up each leg, and then let them just climb up one side and down the other--and they fold up neatly and stow in the shed when there aren't any beans growing.

For peas I grow them off the ground in a vertical garden and let them hang down. They seem to like it just fine.

Sockser
Jun 28, 2007

Eternal greatness only exists only within my posts.

Sing a song of sorrow in a world where your shitpost has vanished!







I was very excited about all my corn sprouting up, and I had maybe 15 sprouts when I went out and looked this morning
But by the evening, something had eaten like half of them. Basically just sprout clippings laying in the bed. No holes dug in the bed, so I'm thinking it was birds yanking them out?
Anything I can do to prevent this while the plants are setting up? Or should I just way overseed and hope for the best?

CancerCakes
Jan 10, 2006

WORST WIZARD, THUNDERDOME
LOSER


I had a bird land 3 m away from me, look me in the eye and then rip up a container of seedlings I had just put in, then fly away. gently caress birds. If you have a cloche, net, chicken wire anything to discourage the birds that might work. Scarecrow? Stand in your veg patch waving a rake and screaming? All good options.


I am interested in the vertical pea garden, any pics?

eggyolk
Nov 8, 2007



First post in this thread. I had issues with Robins rooting around in my planter beds so I put up some bird netting. So far it's worked great. I live in zones 5-6 so when it gets cold again I'll wrap some plastic over these to extend the growing season.



While building the second bed cover a huge bumble bee managed to climb inside and get stuck. Fortunately he figured it out after a few minutes and climbed out after buzzing around like a maniac.

CommonShore
Jun 6, 2014

A true renaissance man



Pillbug

Shine posted:

We'd like to try the compost thing, as we toss a lot of trash/scraps/cardboard shipping boxes that seem like they'd be good compost fodder.

For small scale, it sounds like worms are a common option, since a small compost bin/tumbler may not have enough bulk to really get going. On the other hand, we live in Vegas, so we have warm-to-really-hot temperatures for most of the year, so I'm wondering if that would:

1: Murder the worms all summer.
2: Help a 37 gallon'ish tumbler work alright, especially during the 7 months that our daily highs are over 80 (with 5 of those over 90).

Thoughts? We don't need a ton of compost, as we're talking about enough to add to 20'ish grow bags/pots for a perpetual indoor growing season.


Also, potato flowers are really pretty

This year I'm using a bunch of random shipping boxes as planters and/or ad hoc planter liners, and the plan is to just compost them at the end of the season.

I'll report as we go, but it's working well so far.

B33rChiller
Aug 18, 2011




Pillbug

I saw something yesterday, which I thought the garden goons would appreciate. A hummingbird flew up and took a drink from the lavender and rosemary plants. I had no idea they could sip from such tiny flowers! The bees have been loving thosse flowers, but it amazed me to see a hummingbird do the same.

Kaiser Schnitzel
Mar 28, 2006

Schnitzel mit uns






Spent 2 hours yesterday doing emergency surgery on 15 of my ~30 squash plants. It looks like 100% of them have squash vine borers. Found more unhatched eggs too, and removed those where I could.

I read about injecting Bt into the stems and I'm going to try that on the other half. I mounded more dirt over all my surgery wounds and watered well, but I'm worried my surgery might be just as fatal as the vine borers.

Quoting all my own advice that I ignored about how much squash vine borers suck and make growing summer squash impossible here.

Kaiser Schnitzel posted:

They were so bad for me one year I just gave up growing summer squashes. Normal caterpillar pesticides work in theory, but once they are inside the vine they donít get to the worn. You can slit the vines open with a razor blade and kill the caterpillar inside but thatís super tedious. Floating row covers apparently work, and starting your squash earlier is supposed to help. Winter squash like pumpkins donít have hollow vines and so they are immune.

Kaiser Schnitzel posted:

If the squash vine borers donít get Ďem

Kaiser Schnitzel posted:

How much space do butternut squash/pumpkins really need? Can anyone tell me how floating row covers work and how to use them? They are apparently the only real defense against squash vine borers here.

Jhet
Jun 3, 2013


Surgery sounds dreadful. Did you use cloth over it or did you do like I do and run out of time and say that youíd get to it later?

Kaiser Schnitzel
Mar 28, 2006

Schnitzel mit uns






Jhet posted:

Surgery sounds dreadful. Did you use cloth over it or did you do like I do and run out of time and say that youíd get to it later?

It was actually sort fo satisfying to hunt those little fuckers down, but I don't want to make a habit of it. It's in my front yard so I didn't want to do row covers. I'd intended mind to start spraying with Bt when they started blooming but I forgot

SubG
Aug 19, 2004

It's a hard world for little things.


CancerCakes posted:

I am interested in the vertical pea garden, any pics?
The vertical garden is basically a stack of 1' x 8' troughs on a pier of 4 x 4s. Here's the peas:



It's a little difficult to read the topology from a photo, but they're all coming down from the trough in the upper right, hanging down, and then a bunch of them are clasping each other with their runners and trying to climb up, making (most of) the vines have a sort of J shape.

It's getting too hot for the peas and the squirrels have been at them, so there's some yellowing leaves, mostly from some of the shorter vines/plants that didn't really get established. But the longer vines are doing well, although I think they're going to be less happy if the heat keeps up.

And since I'm posting pics anyway, here's a bit of a surprise:



Got a sprout from a hunk of CSA box ginger that looked like it was too dried out to use. Put it in some soil a couple months ago (right around the start of the lockdown) but it's just decided to sprout sometime since Friday. Feeling around with my fingertips it feels like the rhizome has grown by maybe 50%. So that's cool.

And yesterday spotted the first ripe Sichuan peppercorn of the season:



Total Sichuan peppercorn harvest is still going to be tiny because the plant is still small, but it's looking pretty robust this year and is putting out a cluster of peppercorns on every branch.

Arrgytehpirate
Oct 2, 2011

I posted my food for USPOL Thanksgiving!





SubG posted:


And yesterday spotted the first ripe Sichuan peppercorn of the season:



Total Sichuan peppercorn harvest is still going to be tiny because the plant is still small, but it's looking pretty robust this year and is putting out a cluster of peppercorns on every branch.

That looks cool.

Itís been 22? 23? days since I planted my radishes. I pulled one on Sunday and despite being extremely leafy the radish bit was tiny.

After doing some more research I think I both planted them too deep and in too rich a soil. Iíll give them another week and see what happens.

If not what the hell do I do with a bunch of radish tops?

Oh and I need to deal with some sluts and go buy tomato cages.

Kaiser Schnitzel
Mar 28, 2006

Schnitzel mit uns






Arrgytehpirate posted:

That looks cool.

Itís been 22? 23? days since I planted my radishes. I pulled one on Sunday and despite being extremely leafy the radish bit was tiny.

After doing some more research I think I both planted them too deep and in too rich a soil. Iíll give them another week and see what happens.

If not what the hell do I do with a bunch of radish tops?

Oh and I need to deal with some sluts and go buy tomato cages.

Radish tops are great in a salad. Best part of a radish imo-sort of peppery like arugala. You could probably throw them in a pot of greens or stir fry or something too.

Paradoxish
Dec 19, 2003

Will you stop going crazy in there?

Drone posted:

A bit late since I purchased my plants this year instead of growing from seed, but hey. I just transplanted three chilis (lemon drop, piri-piri, and habanero) into their final home (fairly large planters on my balcony). One of the plants has really shot up and gotten leggy, but the other two are very short and quite bushy.

Anyway, I'm thinking about doing some companion plants in smaller pots on my balcony as well. For flowers I've read that geraniums and petunias are good, and herbs should be basil, oregano, or chives.

My question on the herbs: most of what I've read seems to be advice for companion planting in the same bed, since the herbs are there to help keep the soil moist. Can/should I plant basil or oregano in the same planter as my chilis, or will that somehow hinder them? Chives I'd probably put in a separate little pot, and the flowers of course would be separate as well.

Be careful with oregano if you haven't grown it before. It's not quite as bad as mint, but it will take the gently caress over if you give it a chance. I've had bucket/pot oregano send out runners and establish itself in neighboring pots. I've got some oregano on my back porch and I've already had to cut it back a few times. You can plant it with other things if your planter is large enough, but you need to make sure that you don't end up with a giant bed full of nothing but oregano.

Harry Potter on Ice
Nov 4, 2006
Someone on the internet doesn't like me





SubG posted:

Total Sichuan peppercorn harvest is still going to be tiny because the plant is still small, but it's looking pretty robust this year and is putting out a cluster of peppercorns on every branch.

Where did you get the seeds? I'm so envious! I had a hard time finding some. So cool

Eeyo
Aug 29, 2004



Arrgytehpirate posted:

That looks cool.

Itís been 22? 23? days since I planted my radishes. I pulled one on Sunday and despite being extremely leafy the radish bit was tiny.

After doing some more research I think I both planted them too deep and in too rich a soil. Iíll give them another week and see what happens.

If not what the hell do I do with a bunch of radish tops?

Oh and I need to deal with some sluts and go buy tomato cages.

What type of radish is it? Like it's definitely a spring radish and not a winter radish right?

SubG
Aug 19, 2004

It's a hard world for little things.


Harry Potter on Ice posted:

Where did you get the seeds? I'm so envious! I had a hard time finding some. So cool
I got this one as a sapling. It started out as basically a twig with literally like two leaves. The year after it was transplanted it produced maybe ten peppercorns. This past year the harvest (harvest number three) went into a 16 oz delitainer and only filled it about 1/3 of the way--so enough for a couple bowls of mapo or whatever but not much more. It's going to be several years before it's actually taking care of my Sichuan peppercorn needs, but it's still a cool plant to have in the garden.

Before getting this guy I'd tried germinating seeds from a dozen different sources but never had any luck.

Captain Mediocre
Oct 14, 2005

Saving lives and money!



Kaiser Schnitzel posted:

It was actually sort fo satisfying to hunt those little fuckers down, but I don't want to make a habit of it. It's in my front yard so I didn't want to do row covers. I'd intended mind to start spraying with Bt when they started blooming but I forgot

I'm pretty squeamish with this sort of thing which isn't a good trait in a gardener. I've gotten over a lot of it but this kind of bug surgery is beyond the pale for me. I think I'd give up on Squash forever after encountering that.

Platystemon
Feb 13, 2012



Spice plants are cool.

One thatís on my list that I almost picked up before the pandemic is Tasmannia lanceolata.

People say ďuse it as a black pepper substitute in savoury dishesĒ. Do not do this. It isnít terrible when used like that, but its true potential is unlocked in desserts. Put it on ice cream, in puddings, or, especially, on cheesecake.

The spice is unreasonably expensive, so Iím getting a bush of my own.

guri
Jun 14, 2001


SubG posted:

I think the only real failures that I have to report from their seeds is holy basil.
Funny -- I've also not been able to get holy basil from Kitazawa to sprout but have had no problem with it from Baker Creek.


Kaiser Schnitzel posted:

Do any of those asian greens tolerate long, hot, humid, gulf coast summers? Much as I love all the summer vegetables, I miss greens during the summer.
For summer greens I highly recommend kangkong/water spinach, molokia/Egyptian spinach, and (as mentioned) Malabar spinach. I've grown mainly the first two for the past several years in my somewhat tropical climate and they do amazing. Amaranth has also done great.


Does anyone follow any of the KNF (Korean Natural Farming) methods? I brew a lot of makgeolli at home so have plenty of water from washing rice and recently started trying to do the LAB stuff (a lacto ferment from fermented rice water mixed with milk then left to further ferment). I'm not super deep into a lot of permaculture or other hardcore gardening methods but among the things LAB is apparently good for is the compost pile. I'm not sure if it was a coincidence or the mixture I added or what but I dumped some into both my mostly finished compost bin and my ongoing on and in both cases the breakdown of materials accelerated greatly. It was really interesting.

guri
Jun 14, 2001


SubG posted:

And yesterday spotted the first ripe Sichuan peppercorn of the season:



Total Sichuan peppercorn harvest is still going to be tiny because the plant is still small, but it's looking pretty robust this year and is putting out a cluster of peppercorns on every branch.
Nice! The tree I planted last year ended up dying but during walks around my work during breaks I found several nearly forests of the stuff so I've been gathering the leaves. During my last visit I noticed that the trees were also starting to fruit. The fresh green buds are really an amazing citrusty spice explosion.

Jhet
Jun 3, 2013


Platystemon posted:

One thatís on my list that I almost picked up before the pandemic is Tasmannia lanceolata.

It looks like it has M/F plants, so you need one of each to get the fruit. That's a pretty cool looking bush though.


guri posted:

Does anyone follow any of the KNF (Korean Natural Farming) methods? I brew a lot of makgeolli at home so have plenty of water from washing rice and recently started trying to do the LAB stuff (a lacto ferment from fermented rice water mixed with milk then left to further ferment). I'm not super deep into a lot of permaculture or other hardcore gardening methods but among the things LAB is apparently good for is the compost pile. I'm not sure if it was a coincidence or the mixture I added or what but I dumped some into both my mostly finished compost bin and my ongoing on and in both cases the breakdown of materials accelerated greatly. It was really interesting.

I don't follow KNF methods, but I did dump a lot of yeast and bacteria into my compost on a regular basis. They are both spoilage methods, and the lactic acid won't really change your pH a whole lot as there's too much buffering. The microbes when they expire also make great food for more microbes, so it's not surprising that you get a boost when adding it. It's like adding a "compost starter" pouch to your pile, or a septic system starter. Plenty of LAB are both aerobic and anaerobic, so they continue to work great in compost.

Also, the added moisture may have been really beneficial. Too dry and the stuff breaks down slower.

LogisticEarth
Mar 28, 2004

Someone once told me, "Time is a flat circle".


Sockser posted:

I was very excited about all my corn sprouting up, and I had maybe 15 sprouts when I went out and looked this morning
But by the evening, something had eaten like half of them. Basically just sprout clippings laying in the bed. No holes dug in the bed, so I'm thinking it was birds yanking them out?
Anything I can do to prevent this while the plants are setting up? Or should I just way overseed and hope for the best?

Not sure if this is the same problem as you, but I've had bad problems with sow bugs this year snipping off a lot of seedlings. Lost most of my spinach, beans, and even some started cucumber plants. They just come in and "chop" down the seedlings like they were trees. I'm going to put out some diotomaceous earth and see if that helps.

Fitzy Fitz
May 14, 2005




LogisticEarth posted:

Not sure if this is the same problem as you, but I've had bad problems with sow bugs this year snipping off a lot of seedlings. Lost most of my spinach, beans, and even some started cucumber plants. They just come in and "chop" down the seedlings like they were trees. I'm going to put out some diotomaceous earth and see if that helps.

They go for beer traps if you want to try that. I haven't been able to tell if de has made an impact on ours, but we have so many that that's not surprising. They're the bane of my seedlings every year.

Fitzy Fitz fucked around with this message at 16:09 on May 26, 2020

OSU_Matthew
Aug 23, 2010


Gun Saliva

Missed out on planting my garden last year due to being nights at work, but over the weekend we ordered several starters from the local farmerís market and got the garden cleaned up, weeded, tilled, and planted!



Planted super sweet hundreds, hillbilly heritage tomato, 2x bell peppers, jalapeŮo peppers, and ground cherries. Going to see if we can find some snow peas and beans for the last two slots. We also have some garlic volunteers from previous years and a 3 year old Rhubarb that should be ready to harvest from this year!



While weeding, I found a black walnut tree some squirbos had planted:



Found an older photo from when I built the garden in 2016:



Itís not much, but Iím just excited and happy to have it

SubG
Aug 19, 2004

It's a hard world for little things.


guri posted:

Funny -- I've also not been able to get holy basil from Kitazawa to sprout but have had no problem with it from Baker Creek.
Yeah but gently caress Baker Creek.

I just did another round of surface sowing Thai and holy basil seeds this weekend. We'll see if they do better with the temperature more summer-y.

And not directly related to that, but the tomatoes are just getting ready for transplant. Did the first round this weekend, plan on waiting a couple days to see how they do before trying with the others. Anyway, I just use little plastic pots for starting seeds, and sometimes I'll start out with new potting soil or whatever, but this year since all of the nurseries were closed I just used soil from the raised beds. And when I was sorting through the potential transplants this weekend I discovered several volunteer basil plants nestled in among the tomatoes. Which is kinda funny because I haven't gotten any in the beds themselves. Nurturing a couple of other volunteers (there's a volunteer bitter melon that's way bigger and more vigorous-looking that the ones I intentionally planted this spring) but haven't noticed any other volunteer basil.

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Rubicon
Dec 16, 2005
Al bisogno si conosce l'amico

First time owning a house, so first time to try growing my own food. I ordered some asian radishes from Amazon and am hoping to make some Kimchi out of them, but the seeds are growing differently from each other.

Most of them look like this: (we've been getting a crazy amount of rain, which is why it looks so swampy next to the bed.)



Two of them look like this:



Which looks closer to what I was expecting.

What did I get in that seed packet?

After finding and reading this thread, I've ordered two varieties from Kitazawa, but feel like it might be a bit late to start new ones from seed. I'm in Zone 7.

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