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FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

Telling carradin to atone for his sins by leading the dwarves to a new prosperity instead of tossing himself in the lava would have been great.

Especially since that would mean shanking bhelen and making harrowmont sad.

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FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

Bogus Adventure posted:

She also ignores how the Dalish manage to avoid having abominations running around willy-nilly.

Also, to be fair to Origins, Wynne has a decent and level-headed voice as a Circle mage who just happens to be a kindly, motherly "abomination" running around and saving the world.

Looks at witherfang

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
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alex314 posted:

There should definitely be a romance option that gets shut down the moment PC gets promoted into position of seniority with their romance target. Like that Yeoman Chambers romance in ME2..

This highlights my point that bioware romances, which tend to be pretty creepy and/or rapey are not exactly a hill you want to die on for being included in things.

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

Cythereal posted:

Queer women are also only acceptable to that strain as long as they're not actually lesbian, and it's portrayed in such a way as to please straight men.

Ah, the pussy galore principle.

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

DoctorGonzo posted:

yeah witcher 3 sold like crap...wait

Witcher 3 did well, bit it has nothing on fifa when comparing its income to its cost to make.

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

Honestly, guns need skill points is a decision that didnt bug me, but holy crud did giving minigames the same treatment annoy the hell out of me.

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

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Yeah, but it's still a gatekeeping stat like persuade. Theres a ton of optional areas/loot/options locked behind those games so I'm pretty much forced to go down that tree to do the entire level because the minigames go bonkers without it later on. It's like how there's no reason not to have persuade skilled up in darn near every game that has it because quests and stuff is behind it.

If its functionally mandatory outside of challenge runs and extreme roleplaying runs why bother including it at all?

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

Cythereal posted:

Also, Bioware's first gay character and same-sex romance for a PC even if they had to axe almost all of it and drat near lost the character thanks to LucasArts.

Huh?

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

Yeah, the bit with your dysfunctional party falling apart at the seems and betraying itself all over was really cool.

And then it falls flat on its face.

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
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In theory yes, but unless you're gaming the system you'll likely fail the relationship check on more of the party given how often getting points with someone causes you to lose them with someone else. Or in the case of the gnome there being a tiny number of them in places you wouldn't think of bringing him without a guide.

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

I play it in 4k fine. :shrug:

It does hilarious things to the skill bar if you make it too long though.

I'd recommend the mod that gives sten a second specialty point so he doesn't suck.

And I like to remove the game auto leveling your party because it's really bad at it. Which does have the side effect of making the game a lot easier.

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

I mean, the big reason to leave them be would be that ea has so much money that almost nothing is stopping them from making as many microtransaction games as they want. So there's pretty much no opportunity cost to diversifying their interests and snapping up a handful of independent developers that do something other than microtransactions. It protects the company so that if "games as a service" ever crashes it still has options for weathering the storm while they find something new

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

Are you implying that there aren't any elves to be seen right now?

Hang on, I can fix this. Gonna go get another bioware dev to quit and have ea announce they're rebooting the project again.

E:Wait, how do you grind in kotor or dragon age 1? The level cap is tiny and everything scales to your level.

FoolyCharged fucked around with this message at 20:36 on Sep 10, 2019

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

chaosapiant posted:

You can hit max level on one play through if you kill threshermaws on foot. Just get them down with the Mako and then snipe them. poo poo tons of XP.

Nope. Max level is locked behind new game+ by the achievement system.

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

Vichan posted:

I loved the friendship/rivalry system because it allowed you to disagree with your companions' respective philosophies while still befriending them in a sense.

The fact that it allowed you to have Anders stick around for the final chapter as a broken shell of a man even if you stick with the templars was worth the price of the game alone.

I couldn't justify sticking with the mages after my first playthrough though. The templars were 100% right.

My favorite thing about dragon age as a series is that it wants really badly to tell a tale of the poor oppressed mages, but then repeatedly shows them as absolutely needing the treatment they get. I remember running a counter fir a while in the recently finished sslp
of origins on how many major plot segments had the problem be caused by a mage and it was hilariously lopsided.

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

Ginette Reno posted:

It's a complicated issue because on the one hand there are examples of societies living without Templars and doing fine. Tevinter is one example, but also the Ancient Elves and Avvar both live with and embrace spirits and they do fine and aren't overrun by demonic influences.

On the other hand, Tevinter and the Ancient Elves nearly destroyed the world with their magical excesses, so even though they didn't get overcome by Demons they still did a lot of bad poo poo with magic.

If I'm not mistaken though Solas' personal quest implies that Spirits turn into Demons because they're shaped by the expectations of people who interact with them and that if people were taught not to fear spirits there might be less demons and thus less possessions.

It's kind of telling that your defense of mages is that some are just plain Jane abominations enslaving the weak, portraying themselves as gods, and ruling with with a cruel, iron fist instead of being abominations(tm) with demons.

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

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PetraCore posted:

Okay, here's the thing with Tevinter - it's always pointed to in-universe as 'this is what free mages would be like', but that's bullshit. Tevinter existed long before the Chantry and Andraste as a conquering mageocracy. The Chantry briefly upended that social structure, then it reasserted itself, with the recent descendants of magically-inclined nobility once again taking the reigns as soon as they found a bullshit justification for why it was totally in line with their own personal Chantry doctrine.

'The problem in Tevinter is mages are free' is propaganda and bullshit, the problems in Tevinter go a lot deeper with that, starting with the fact that it's built on the backbone of slavery and the literal blood of slaves. Blaming Tevinter on magic completely ignores the class problem going on there, and tbh in-universe is I think deliberately used by the other feudal countries of Thedas to divert attention from the abominations their own nobility are getting up to, like the fact that Fiona was literally owned as a child sex slave in Orlais, the fact that a noble's son could just swoop in and kidnap a bunch of women at a wedding to rape, the fact that the loving Great Game grinds up lower-class Orlesians like meat in the bullshit politics of their 'betters', to the point where teenaged Celene ordering all her household's servants killed except for the one she was kissing seemed like a reasonable, necessary move in the Game for her.

Like, if you take mages out of the equation entirely, you just end up with... Orzammar, where golems started being made from volunteers, but then were made from criminals and casteless as they were killed by boiling lyrium and encased in undying bodies so tightly controlled that they can't even speak or take any action without a direct order. Or how about the fact that once the technology for that was lost, that people thought a good alternative would be just using the literal flesh of the casteless to make golems? The fact that even with both those things gone, the casteless are still branded at birth and considered lower than vermin by proper society, for the crime of... not having a caste? Being distantly descended from criminals? Having to steal to live because nobody will actually feed you otherwise?

Tevinter isn't a case of 'look how evil mages are when not oppressed', it's an example of 'the people on top always treat the people on the bottom as pawns and objects, only this time they have literal magic'. It's not like non-noble, non-human mages have a great time in Tevinter.

Well yeah, most everyone else is also evil(woo! Grimderp!), but the point is that it is a LOT harder to find the good mages than good non mages. The only real groups that aren't shown where mages run amuck on the regular are splinter side groups the games dont really explore.

Like to go back to my original point in origins:
Jowan breaks every rule ever, including blood magic, BEFORE he finds out that they want to tranquil him for some reason. And then in the mage tower it turns out it wasn't just Jowan doing blood magic, but half the freaking tower: who also go full abomination.

Jowan then poisons eamon because the only friend a crazy blood mage has is the crazy despot. Meanwhile Conner the abomination is on the verge of destroying the town, and will do so without intervention.

On the dalish side of things, the local mage elder has out of vengeance cursed innocent men to a werewolf curse which threatens to destroy his entire clan

Flemeth is an eldrich horror. And her daughter is little better, just much weaker.

The tevinter mages you meet are currently enslaving people because it's tevinter's national sport.

The warden mage in the DLC keep is a blood mage that summoned demons currently running amuck all over the keep.

And so on.

Meanwhile your examples of good mages are:
Irving
Wynn
The rare mage PC that isnt running around mind controlling people and spewing blood

And that's it? I really cant think of any other positive mages.

E: I guess the Danish intro also has merril before she goes off the deep end?

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
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chaosapiant posted:

I have literally never heard anyone disparage BG2. Even when it came out it won RPG of the year in PC Gamer (beating Diablo 2) and everyone agreed it was an instant classic.

I never got to it because I could never get more than an hour or two into BG1. Therefore it must be a bad game because the plot set up is so bad I never actually booted it.

Of course I also think diablo 2 was bad, so...

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

Well, considering I just did that...

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

Oh dear me posted:

The groups I listed - ie most of Dragon Age society - are also constantly vulnerable to armed monitors and bodily and lethal punishments if they get too sassy, they just have to work or starve, as well.

I'm not saying Circles are good. I would not have volunteered for a Circle when young. I just don't think mages are the most oppressed people in Thedas, and I wish one could support some peasant rebellions, for a change.

I mean, origins has two to three peasant revolts depending on your origin. The alienage origin and throwing the tevinter slavers out are both peasant revolts and you get one from the other side in awakening.


NikkolasKing posted:

Anders is a fantastic character because people liked to pretend that Awakening Anders and DA2 Anders are totally different when in reality DA2 Anders is a very logical development. Awakening Anders was full of resentment at the injustice he and other Mages suffered, too. He hated the Templars. But he was too much of a selfish coward to do anything a bout it.

In the recent lp that finished I finally noticed just how many sinister undertones they gave Anders in awakening. Take for instance the first time you meet him. He's sitting alone in a room with his guards dead and the only defense you ever get from him or anyone else is "uhhh this isnt what it looks like." Sure, theres a dark spawn invasion going on and it's possible that they did, in fact, kill the templars with Anders as the lucky survivor, but the game very much leaves it open that he murdered them or stood back and watched them die.

He's like moridin, people ignore a lot of his bad poo poo because he makes them laugh and has a kitty.

FoolyCharged fucked around with this message at 11:10 on Oct 31, 2019

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

Oh dear me posted:

Those victims are city elves, who the game does acknowledge are oppressed, but the game places all the emphasis on their species, not the feudal system. The human servants in the game are not portrayed as victims, and actual peasants are essentially invisible.

Fair point. The revolt in awakening does get into that, but it also has the optimal solution of murdering the nobles inciting it(Because the peasants can't be angry in the midst of an orc invasion on their own?) and talking the crowd out of it so it never reaches an actual revolt for most players.

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

It is kind of hard to figure out which one sucks the most with how much face sucking is in the newer ones

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

I mean, if you personally kill the archdemon loghain gets confused about how he thought that bringing him along for that was the entire point. You don't know the person who strikes the killing blow will die at that point, but the odds of him dying in the battle are pretty high.

Alistair has a much simpler reason to oppose it. He doesn't want the man who killed his dad, branded him and outlaw, and tried to murder both himself and his surrogate father repeatedly to have any shred of redemption.

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
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Glenn Quebec posted:

But they never bothered to account for it?

I think Bioware's rapid decline could have been slowed quite steadily if the marketing guys and execs understood that and knew it was ok. Trying to turn everything into a bunch of choices that carry over and have weight across 300 hours of gameplay was just a terrible idea. And then they kept trying to do it.

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
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Glenn Quebec posted:

Oh yeah it was marketings fault that they couldn't pull through on their cool as heck concept they did with their other game, Mass Effect.

You mean the games that got routinely criticized for undermining your choices in previous games? (i.e the rachni in ME3, Perpetually angry Conrad in 2, all the people who died getting replaced with stand ins that oftentimes change little more than a snippet of dialogue, and so on) It was marketing fluff in Mass Effect and it was blindingly obvious marketing fluff responding to ME with Dragon Age

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

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The best thing about dao's graphics these days is setting the resolution to 4k and watching the quick bar trip over itself in confusion.

Of course the text doesn't scale for 4k so you need a mod for the game to be playable.

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
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Everyone describing DAOs combat as sluggish confuses me, because outside of boss mobs the game is rocket tag, even on nightmare. Especially when mages on either side are involved.

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

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Lord Cyrahzax posted:

If Tranquilizing everyone at birth or executing every kid that shows signs of magic appeals to you, that’s the “source”

The Templars only ever seem to exacerbate the problems they’re supposed to prevent, imo. Their terror tactics, threats, and prisons only make the Circle mages desperate and vulnerable in a way the societies that have respected places for mages (see Rivain, the Avvar, and the Dalish pre 3-only retcon) don’t. The solution is to train them while treating them like people

In DAO the dalish zone is entirely caused by a mage turned abomination. In DA2 you get a blood mage let loose by her dalish clan as a party member. Plus theres the whole remnants of a society ruled by mages presenting as gods thing.

They're... not exactly the poster child for mages should be free.

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

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CottonWolf posted:

Male dwarf noble. I think that gives the most interesting start.

Yeah, but gorim is so broken everyone picks that for physical characters.

Go for a dual wielding warrior dwarf commoner.

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

Actually, I've changed my mind. You know what you should do class wise? Be an archer warrior. Nobody's ever run that one.

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

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NikkolasKing posted:

I don't think Cailan was pretending. He was a sheltered prince but he doesn't seem to have been a bad person given he was the one and only person supporting the Grey Wardens without having to be compelled to.

I think he even mentions being kept away from them and sounds absolutely sincere in his desire to know how things are going.

It's also funny to watch Duncan awkwardly tell him the alienage is a shithole, we'll talk about it after the battle.

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

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One of her early conversations is about how she used girl appeal to lure templars to their death her mother. I would say it does.

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

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If memory serves theres a mod manager on nexus to install most of them. Was it me2 that had the comical hijacking of the DLC installer to make the game install them for you?

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

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Dao ultimate is still on steam.

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

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I cant speak for the sequels, but in origins 2-handed warriors get a ludicrously slow attack rate. Having a haymaker class is fine, but the speed was so slow enemies died before it could connect and they didnt smash big targets near hard enough to compensate.

E: I remember watching the inquisition OP and all the big fights were just the PC flying all over for forever because nothing did any damage to the point of comedy. I couldn't actually imagine playing that repetitive mashing against hp sacks

FoolyCharged fucked around with this message at 01:30 on Mar 22, 2020

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

Cheating at a raffle? I sentence you to 1 year in jail! No! Two years! Three! Four! Five years! Ah! Ah! Ah! Ah!
Somebody call for an ant?

Ainsley McTree posted:

It’s a silly line friend, no need to fight

Like hell we don't!
*Walks up and then aggressively crabwalks into place to make the animation work*

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

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ilitarist posted:

You need something like reapers for ME2 to work.

You get a villain that is just evil and can't be reasoned with. You have interactions of all kinds of people and get the drama and stories from that. Asking for ME without reapers is like asking for Walking Dead without Zombies. Zombies don't actually do that much but their presence gives context to everyone else.

No BioWare character-focused game manages to survive for half an hour without some sort of world destroying unstoppable force. DA2 tried and people didn't like it.

The reapers literally have gently caress all to do with me2 for 99% of the game and it was better for it.

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

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Dont forget about the inability to withdraw consent even if they initially had it either.

FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

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Admiral Ray posted:

The Qun loving SUCKS but they are right about mages and the Fade, gently caress magic.

drat straight. I remember in the DAO lp that ran here I had a running counter of the number of major plot events caused by mages vs total major plot events.

It did not paint a pretty picture. It's really funny how much bioware wanted you to side with the poor, oppressed mages when the actual game events suggest the opposite.

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FoolyCharged
Oct 11, 2012

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Skippy McPants posted:

People who complain that Anders is different weren't paying attention in Awakening. His world view back then was just as warped and myopic. The only thing Justice did was give Anders the drive to intact his terrible ideas.

Seriously, am I the only one who remembers the bit in Awakening where he praised Tivinter because it was a society where Mages weren't oppressed? He's like the Ferelden equivalent of a Tankie.

Ok, but.. he had a kitty!

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