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whitehelm posted:No, if someone gets 9 points but all 4 of their cards are on the table, everyone ties with 0. Oh yeah, that works. Even with the traitors, I think you can still make this relatively safe. If you can agree on someone to be the winner, and they're trustworthy, you can get rid of their cards by having multiple people try to pick it up, and therefore ripping it up. Obviously this is ruined if a traitor is picked or they have one of the dominant cards. Not sure what the odds are like assuming two traitors as we are so far. Of course the traitors could sabotage this by giving the designed player negative points. I guess it depends on how public actions are. One advantage the group has, is this is continuing from the route where they trusted everyone, so they have a good track record so far, and nothing in the rules say you can't show the group what your hand is on your computer, just that they can't operate it. Have everyone show their hands after each round, and anyone who doesn't want to, they're suspicious and the group can take actions to exclude them. Marluxia fucked around with this message at 02:51 on May 5, 2023 |
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May 5, 2023 02:46
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NeoRonTheNeuron posted:Is it just me or is this sequence feeling bad? Yeah, this :/ I dunno, maybe it’ll kick rear end. Hopefully it does. Sheesh, though, couldn’t they have at least picked something other’n a school for Loop 2?
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May 5, 2023 04:15
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I wanted the game to wrap up at this point. I don't want to see an extra game. I hope it gets derailed fast.
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I think part of the feeling of "Gosh darn it, I thought we were getting this wrapped up, not diving into a whole 'nother death game" may be because the Ace route isn't locked, so a player could, by finding the Sheep's Clothing and Second Caw on the other routes, potentially figure out how to get to the "everyone lives" route after just a few routes vs. going through all the 12 "animal" routes like in this LP. Pacing would be inherently tricky if the path to get to the "Cat" route could be a widely varying amount of routes long, depending on the player's luck and ability to put 2 and 2 together. Though since the previous conceit of the multiple routes is that the death game isn't actually happening--it's just a person running mental simulations of what they think will happen, so of course death isn't going to end things and they can go through as many permutations of events as they like--it's possible that this is just going to be a straightforward shot to the end sort of deal. Unless, of course, these current events are part of another mental simulation exercise. Shoot, it could even involve Mouse running the same sort of mental simulations and providing her own "post-mortem" commentary (though not to the same degree, since presumably Mouse doesn't know where all the cards are unless there are some memory/multiple personality shenanigans going on here; I'd guess that it would more be like "I snapped out of my reverie [at the last choice before dying]. I decided that I definitely shouldn't [bad choice], as it would only [bad thing caused by bad choice]") Still, since we've had all the other "animal" routes out of the way, it makes sense for Cat to be a single route on its own. (Perhaps the Joker card?)
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May 5, 2023 06:39
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You do need information from at least three routes to get Aces: You need to have learned Ox/Davis's, Bunny/Gerry's, and Tiger/Zahara's names from each of their respective routes.
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May 5, 2023 06:56
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YEAH I WAS WAITING ON THE CAT But seriously though another death game? 
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May 5, 2023 06:59
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I mean, the previous game was the Zodiac Race; now we're on the game's proper namesake! I'm very curious about what's happening here, in the sense of why: did Brian's accomplice decide to take another go at it? Or did another party hijack the players? Dog's murder suggests that this time the goal may be to cover up the blackmail/corruption scheme, but if so why not just kill Mouse/Snake/Dragon right there? I can accept that the first game's goal was to kill them while making it look like an outcome of the game rather than murder, but they were already missing to the world at large here so this can't have been the easier option. Which suggests the culprit is after something different than Brian's accomplice was, or that the changing situation has changed the goal in some way. Worth noting Cat is either monitoring in real time, or Monkey's in on it. She's the only one who gets a reaction, and a conveniently non-lethal one at that; I could see that being staged to create the illusion that Cat isn't one of the people here. Another thing that supports that conclusion is one of the rule differences: instead of using another's device executing the other person, it executes you. Which, if the one of the contestants is running the game, is a good way to ensure that no one discovers that they have special functions on their own computer.
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May 5, 2023 14:20
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Junpei posted:You do need information from at least three routes to get Aces: You need to have learned Ox/Davis's, Bunny/Gerry's, and Tiger/Zahara's names from each of their respective routes. Ox's name isn't explicitly tied to his route, right? It's part of the 'who to group with' decisions, but that can lead to several routes, including Ox's own, or even Mouse's.
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May 5, 2023 17:15
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It's kind of interesting how Dog's token has been replaced with Cat's. Makes one wonder if Cat is going to be playing as well, or it's just simply a replacement to keep the game consistent while it doesn't participate. However, therein lies one problem. If Cat is also participating, it's very likely they will manipulate the game so they are the dominant animal and execute everyone, or become one of the 4 "safe" animals which can take the spot away from someone much more deserving. That is, assuming Cat is also participating as a "replacement" for Dog. Cat never said that they would or would not, so who knows.
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May 5, 2023 17:41
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Weird game. -If someone becomes the dominant animal, but has no copies of their own card (and other players do) then their reward for top scoring is just killing themselves. -Players can give each other cards. But they can’t refuse to take them. So if a front runner had no copies of their own card they could get forced into top scoring against their will. -Players cards are most valuable to themselves, but an even bigger factor is aiming for cards that other people don’t want. -Animals next to Dog have an advantage since he won’t be competing for cards. -Presumably rounds won’t say who took what card. Only that a card was taken (and maybe a different message if it was destroyed due to 2 takers). The Check option is pretty pointless if the game it announced who took what card, hell it seems pretty pointless even without that information. -Presumably amassing a >9 point hand also works for becoming the dominant animal. And I guess an 11 point hand would take priority for dominant animal over a 10 point hand, which in turn would take priority over a 9 point hand? -In theory you want to try to pick up cards for players that you think will score high. Except the mechanics of it don’t really work. -Dominant animal having all cards on the table is one way for all participants to survive, but it’s vulnerable to traitors swiping the cards for the proposed winner. Perhaps a better method is destroying the cards for one player then making them the dominant animal. Sketchie posted:It's kind of interesting how Dog's token has been replaced with Cat's. Makes one wonder if Cat is going to be playing as well, or it's just simply a replacement to keep the game consistent while it doesn't participate. I don’t think the token has changed I think Dogs token always looked like that
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May 5, 2023 19:12
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ZCKaiser posted:Another thing that supports that conclusion is one of the rule differences: instead of using another's device executing the other person, it executes you. Which, if the one of the contestants is running the game, is a good way to ensure that no one discovers that they have special functions on their own computer. To be fair, the tablets were held on your person, which meant you could take them with you and protect them from other people interacting with them. From the description earlier, it sounds like the computers are in static locations. That would mean that anyone could walk into your room, tap the computer, and kill you remotely.
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May 5, 2023 20:44
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It also means that nobody could use Dog's computer for their own purposes since, well, he's already dead.
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May 5, 2023 20:47
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Ah, can we call this the Andrew Lloyd Webber route? After all, a Cat is not a Dog!
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May 5, 2023 21:06
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Dirk the Average posted:To be fair, the tablets were held on your person, which meant you could take them with you and protect them from other people interacting with them. From the description earlier, it sounds like the computers are in static locations. That would mean that anyone could walk into your room, tap the computer, and kill you remotely. quote:I realized I was in another classroom.
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May 5, 2023 21:31
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Mouse: So, what was strapped to my stomach? I lifted up my shirt and took a look. It was... some sort of metal device. If we were to go by precedent, it was probably a device that could kill me. Awesome. Was it even worth trying to get it off me when I already knew the outcome of such an attempt? Probably not. I decided to go check out the computer. Last time it was a tablet. Now a computer? I tried interacting with it, but it was powered down. Great. Well... there was but so much that could be done inside this classroom. At some point, I'd need to move forwards. The computer is a separate object.
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May 5, 2023 22:06
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Elite posted:
The existence of negative points implies to me that you need exactly a 9 point hand.
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May 6, 2023 01:05
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Elite posted:I don’t think the token has changed I think Dogs token always looked like that
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May 6, 2023 03:55
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malkav11 posted:The existence of negative points implies to me that you need exactly a 9 point hand. If you don’t need exactly 9 then negative cards would still be useful for sabotaging someone that you don’t want to win. And it’s not like players need negative point cards to adjust their point totals downwards either, they could SET or GIVE to get rid of cards.
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May 6, 2023 13:36
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Actually kinda reminds me of Virtue's Last Reward except you don't die if you get negative points.
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May 6, 2023 13:38
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ApplesandOranges posted:Actually kinda reminds me of Virtue's Last Reward except you don't die if you get negative points. I donno, if it was VLR it'd be hosted by an animal avatar who was seemingly the third host of the death game. It's kind of hard to tell if Rooster is still acting, or legitimately angry. He seems at minimum to have been an accomplice to Bowen's murder (probably removed the murder weapon, and possibly the speakers that were used to 'fire' Aaron), if not the killer himself, so this game might be intended to call him out.
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May 6, 2023 15:26
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 [BGM: Ox's Logic]   … Well that was... something? Okay, temperature check real quick? I'm not saying that the Zodiac Race was all that better or anything, but at least it kind of had the air of some sort of “final judgment” thing.  This just feels like we're on a bad game show, right? I mean, am I imagining this? Is it just me? 'Cause I feel like it's incredible how much less authentic this feels. Yeah, uh, I kind of get what you're saying. This seems... different, somehow. I remain unsure if this game is more artistic or less than the one we have faced before. However, whatever the case may be, the truth remains unaltered. We shall have to face this game down head on.  Hey, but we can do that real easily, right? I mean, even I get what we need to do, and I'm not even all that smart. The Cat said if there's a tie in terms of who has the most 'dominant animal' cards, everybody can win.  Which means so long as nobody takes the winner's card, we can all get out alive. ...Right? However, the winner's card will be the easiest way for a winner to get to the needed 9 points, no? Is this not an issue to consider? There's still the cards worth 2 points and 1 point to the winner. Someone can get a total of, um, 24 points without getting a single card of their own. However, things aren't just going to end here, are they? Huh? Horse is r-right... Last time, the Jade Emperor added a rule later on which made me and Ox a traitor. They're probably going to do something like that again! ...But unlike last time, it doesn't sound like there are any items or anything that will let us fix that. A-Are we really going to be alright?  Okay, everybody, listen up. We really don't have time to lose on the typical petty squabbling or banter which constituted much of our time in the last moronic Death Game we were all put into. The rules this time are harsher, and the time limits are tighter. If the cretin behind this game decides to later alter this game from a team effort into a lynching, well, there's not much we can do. Instead, we simply need to establish and follow an optimal strategy. In this case, doing so is not a particularly difficult mission. First off, we need to choose somebody to be a designated 'winner'. For the sake of ease, let's just say that person will be Tiger. She's... like our mascot, no? Then let's go with her. Hell yeah! Now, the cards that will score for Tiger other than Tiger cards are the Mouse, Ox, Bunny, and Dragon cards. Therefore, Mouse, myself, Bunny, and Dragon will be responsible for picking up our own type of card when it appears, and gifting it to Tiger. For the sake of things, Pig and Snake can also pick up their own type of card and gift it to Tiger, as those will be neutral to her score. As for everybody else, your job will be to simply not interfere. Check somebody on a round where there's nothing to do.  On the other hand, if a Tiger card shows up, everybody not assigned a task should try and take it. That will inevitably result in the Tiger card being ripped up. With this method, it's inevitable that Tiger will eventually win without a single Tiger card landing in somebody's hands. Tch. Really just taking control of the group, are you? Please don't do this. We don't have time. Does anyone have any actionable objections to my plan? It seems a sensible enough strategy. I think it makes sense. I see no issues. Great. Then in that case, we've got a plan. So... okay then. Do whatever you want until the two minute warning.And like that, people began to disperse. Class dismissed. Frankly, I wasn't so confident everything would go nearly as cleanly as Ox claimed it would. I was also still confused about so many points. There were a lot of mysteries about, and I could feel myself on the cusp of solving at least a few of them. The key had to lie with the incident surrounding Amadeus Bowen's murder. To get to the bottom of it, I needed to interrogate more people. So, it was just a matter of who to talk to. [BGM: Silence]  What, you didn't think we'd have at least one more route gimmick before the end of the game?  Unlike Ox's route, however, we're actually going to end up speaking to everyone at some point, so really you just get to pick what order you talk to people in. For the LP, we'll just go from the top – no need to complicate things.  Ox prosecuted Mr. Morris. He should have a thorough grasp of the case. I decided to find him and talk about his perspective on all of this. ... [BGM: Ox's Logic]   How certain am I that Aaron Morris is the culprit? Before all of this, I'd say 100%. And now? ...Perhaps 95%? It's only 5% lower? Look, the possibility of a grand conspiracy is certainly present, I'll grant you. But I also oversaw a lot of the evidence, looked through it myself. According to your story, the Chief of Police might have been trying to give this case a decisive edge, but it's not like he didn't have good reason. He may have wanted to prevent the bit about the knife coming out, but it was also pretty clear who the killer had to be. None of the people involved had much of a connection before this, so the possibility of accomplices is minimal. A whole cavalcade of evidence points to Aaron Morris. And it's impossible for anyone else to have done it. But that's the thing though. Isn't it kind of suspicious just how obvious Morris was? Wouldn't he have hidden it better? He couldn't have known he'd be found out so quickly. Okay, but there are still things he could have done better. Like, why send that delayed text to Snake? Doesn't that speed up the process of everybody realizing Bowen was missing? The biggest mistake you're taking in all of this is taking Snake and Tiger's testimonies for granted. A reasonable person with knowledge of the schedule would probably know to be wary that you might be seen through the waiting rooms. However, he couldn't have expected that Snake would have been such a vigilant watcher, and not just look on his phone or sit in a position that wouldn't give him a constant view of the room. Nobody could have. He couldn't have anticipated Rooster barging into the office like that. He couldn't have anticipated Bunny finding the body so quickly. Snake seeing nobody in the office would reinforce his dumb story about Bowen being out of the office when Morris entered. He would've written it off as Bowen having left the office at some point, probably when Sheep went to get breakfast on the first floor as usual. Bowen going 'missing' would be a lot broader. And he still had the stolen master card, so he could come back at a later date to dispose of the body, not just leave it in the safe like that. I guess when you put it like that, it makes more sense... Face it Mouse, we got the right man the first time. He had the motive. He was the one who could've stolen all of the money out of the safe. He had the bills found in his car! He did it. … ...And if you did get the wrong man? If you had a hand in the execution of an innocent person? Would you be able to admit it? What are you talking about? Of course I'd admit it, why wouldn't I? Just... think about it. What do you mean? Obviously there's a lot going on right now. I don't want to add more to your pile. But I think that's a question that maybe you should consider, when you have more time. … ...Okay. I will.[BGM: Silence]  With everything settled, I left Ox to himself. Tiger was another key witness in the incident... She probably had some insights worth discussing. I paid her a visit in the classroom she was lounging in. … [BGM: Queen of the Jungle]  That old thing? Ugh, I really wish people would quit asking me about it. I mean, I get it, I know it was important. But my memory's really not the best, you know? Well, you don't need to run down the whole thing. I just have a few questions for you. Alright, shoot. … ...I feel dumb about what I'm about to ask now. What? Mouse, don't say that! Believe in yourself! I'm sure you're going to ask a great question! Okay then. Are you sure you didn't see anyone else enter Bowen's office? Of course! What are you talking about? I definitely would've mentioned something like that to the police. Figured. But you would've seen it, right? If someone did enter? No, totally. I was reading a magazine they had laid out, but it was like... light reading. I was directly facing the door window. And when Bowen's office door opens, it swings all the way out to cover the window. Honestly a bit of a design flaw, if you ask me. But, anyways, I definitely took note every time that happened. What about the outside window? Were you looking through that? No, why? Is it relevant? Probably not. I guess I just wanted to ask. Alright then. Anything else? One other thing. You waited until the cops were already in the building before you left the waiting room, right? Uh huh. So... why'd you do that? I don't know. I had nowhere else to be that day. Wasn't told to leave. I guess that makes sense. ...That's about it. Great! Hope that helped! Thanks for indulging me. No problem! Honestly, anything to take my mind off this situation. First time? Cute. This time? Kind of infuriating. I'm trying to keep my cool, but yeesh, it's not easy. Sometimes it feels like my emotions are just moving my body for me. ...You need to go to anger management. What are you talking about? What you just said? It's not healthy. In fact, it's a really bad sign. You should seek help. Ah, it's fine. No big deal. No, it is a big deal. You need to get it checked out. Uh, well, if you say so, I guess I could think about it. Don't think about it. Do it.And with that, my time with Tiger came to a close. ...Bunny was the actual cop on the scene, right? He ought to have some insights for me. I paid him a visit. … [BGM: Lucky Foot]   You wanna ask questions about the incident? I don't quite know how that'll help this specific situation, but sure, fire away!Bunny stood nonchalantly, leaning against a wall. He was tossing a small globe up in the air with his left hand. From what I could tell, I guess he was left-handed. I guess one of the things that stands out to me is just how quickly you were able to find Bowen's body. Yeah, being able to recover it so quickly was rather impressive. ...But I'm wondering specifically how you were able to find it. It's really not that big of a mystery. First things first, when I heard about the missing person, I asked around to get an idea of the situation. I talked with Tiger, who was sitting near the scene, about when he was last seen. And she gave me the very useful tip that she hadn't seen him leave his office. I knew the office was empty, that's why Sheep had called me... but with a witness telling me that the man should have still been in there, I thought it wise to really look around in there. When I saw the safe, saw that it was body-sized, well... I just had to check it out. And how did you open it? I borrowed the master keys from Sheep. 'Master keys'? Yeah, they could lock and unlock pretty much anything in the building. Including the safe. With them, you don't need to know the safe's passcode. Seems pretty irresponsible to let those also access the safe. I guess Bowen trusted Sheep. Alright then. I guess that all adds up. You pass. I pass? Well, good for me. Good for you.  ...So, I heard about everything Dog said from Snake and Dragon. Oh? Yeah, they kind of explained that situation to the group. That's nice. ...I suppose you think I'm pretty scummy, huh? I mean, I'm sort of complicit in the whole 'corrupt police force' thing, yeah? Dog... wasn't lying about all that. It's pretty bad. They do blackmail you. I've been trying to help things from the inside, but... ...I'm pretty much trash, huh? It depends. What does that mean? At the moment, yeah, you're looking pretty bad. But I don't think you can ever stray so far off the path that you can't get back on it. You say you've been trying to help from the inside? Then if you actually, you know, help from the inside, I think you can still turn things around. But that's – I'm not saying it's going to be easy. I'm saying that if you want to not be trash, that's what you've got to do.And just like that, I walked away from him. ... I still couldn't fit Dragon into the puzzle. For that reason alone, I needed to talk to her. She didn't look all too pleased to see me. [BGM: Eyes of the Dragon]   Don't you have better things to do? ...Whatever, ask away. Thank you, Dragon. Yeah yeah, just get on with it. I mean, to put it simply, are you sure you have no connection to all of this? No connection at all? If I knew, I'd tell you, okay? Although... okay, actually, I do know. You do?! Yeah, I heard something from Dog during our 'stay' at his dungeon. Apparently, I used to run by his bar pretty frequently around the time of the incident. Really? Yeah, and once he said that, I realized that I did recognize him. He was right. I was a semi-regular customer of his, a while back. But, uh, his place was usually the end of my bar crawls, not the start of 'em. I hardly remember anything from that time. But I mean, that's a connection! That's gotta be why you were brought! So then... something important must've happened there. You think I don't know that, dickwad? Ever since Dog told me that, I've been focusing. Thinking. Something must've happened one of those nights, something, but... Ugh, it's just not coming to me. I think there's a chance I saw something, saw somebody. But... despite my best efforts, its not coming to me. Hmm... But... maybe somebody doesn't know that. Huh? Forget it. Tch. This whole thing's bullshit. It is. Still, I'm probably dealing with this better than you all. After all, I'm used to living in danger. Because you're a gang leader, right? Pretty much. ...You should really quit that. Oh really? Thanks. I didn't think of that. I'm serious. Give me one good reason why I should stop. For your gang's safety. My gang's safety? How are they going to be more safe when I'm not leading them? Maybe you should tell them to quit it as well? That'd go over real well. I'm just saying, you've got a lot of influence. You could do a lot of good. Or, if you keep going at the rate you're going, you could get a bunch of your friends killed. Tch. gently caress you. What do you know about loss? The hell do you think gives you the right to stick your nose in my business?I sighed, then walked away. There wasn't much else I could do. ... Snake was a critical witness in all of this. He must have some sort of insight. However, after I found him, I was met with something of a wall. [BGM: Dance of the Snakes]  My deepest apologies, Mouse, but everything I have to say on the incident has been spoken for. At the time, my mind was elsewhere. So it's not as though I was able to catch some keen details the police might have missed. I was rather zoned out, all things considered. I'm afraid my perspective won't add anything to your investigation.I sighed. I was afraid of this. Did you think this investigation was easy? That by just asking the right questions, the truth would be made clear to you? I was kinda hoping for that? I'm sad to say, Mouse, life rarely works so cleanly. It's messy, full of things you'd rather be a different way. Take my life for instance. I've spent so many years acting as a teacher, putting my art to the side. Because of that, I fear I've never been able to reach my full potential. Ah, how regretful. It hasn't been a waste! Oh? So what if you haven't been doing art full time? You've been a teacher! Presumably, a good one. That's, like, a super important job. You're shaping the future generation. Isn't that enough? What a hopeful take on the matter. You make me long for simpler days.And with that seemingly dismissive comment, Snake dismissed me. So I left. *BWAAAAAAAAAAM!!* Before I could talk to anyone else, the speakers began to blare. Ow, my ears... I guess this was the two minute warning The Cat was referring to? Anyways, the point was made clearly.
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May 8, 2023 19:59
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Huh. Seems Mouse is... speedrunning their development? Kinda weird, I guess the game wants to keep the simulation development real but also doesn't want to spend 15h rerunning. Which fair I guess. Also Dragon seems to have been chosen to die because the culprit thinks she saw something at the bar? Maybe the mastermind had a deal with Bowen they want to snuff out?
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May 8, 2023 20:13
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Mix. posted:
 loving hell how many master keys are floating around that we don't know about
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May 8, 2023 20:30
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Uh, Bunny... what the gently caress is going on with your neck?
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May 8, 2023 20:42
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Bruh, why is mouse so pushy with people. Like, she wasn't that preachy on the "Aces" route, (the one that happened IRL), so what's up with that.
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May 8, 2023 21:51
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So, Sheep had a master key the entire time, which means the whole idea that Aaron Morris was the only one who could have committed the murder because he was the only one who could have stolen Amadeus Bowen's master key at the bar is nonsense. And I'm guessing Dragon was there when that was supposed to go down, which is why she's a target; if she remembered clearly, she could have testified that Aaron Morris didn't steal the key. And those two facts are the only thing that make him a more likely suspect than anyone else present that day. Snake and Rooster both went into his office as well. And hey, Tiger just said that the door blocked the window when open--so she couldn't see into the office so long as the door was left open, meaning if someone left the door opened or was followed inside, Tiger wouldn't have seen! So, almost everyone at the office had the opportunity to kill Amadeus Bowen, and literally everybody had a potential motive due to the massive blackmail scheme. Moreover, each of them is someone who can and has killed in a route in cold blood, including setting up complicated schemes to throw blame off themselves (Snake and Rooster's whole routes, Tiger's sniper rifle/iron bar gambit, Sheep's fake trap). And even then, that's assuming multiple weren't working together to kill him because, frankly, he gave people plenty of motive to do just that.
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May 8, 2023 21:55
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Regallion posted:Bruh, why is mouse so pushy with people. Like, she wasn't that preachy on the "Aces" route, (the one that happened IRL), so what's up with that. Mouse really told Dragon “have you tried not being a criminal? and your gang too”
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May 8, 2023 23:03
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Regallion posted:Bruh, why is mouse so pushy with people. Like, she wasn't that preachy on the "Aces" route, (the one that happened IRL), so what's up with that. Well, mouse’s deal is that she’s good at shutting down her emotions. Something she’s doing right now. So if she’s able to repress her panic, she may also be repressing her ability to feel empathy, or embarrassment. You know, those emotions that keep you from acting like an all knowing jackass. Or she could genuinely just be acting like a jerk as a reaction to ‘just’ seeing someone killed right in front of her.
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May 9, 2023 01:29
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Bunny being left-handed feels like an innocuous but totally important detail the game slipped in.
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May 9, 2023 03:26
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A relatively straightforward solution this time. No trinkets to seek or traitors so far, so things should go ok as long as the cards appear in a reasonable spread. It is possible that this new game was not set up by Monkey and Rooster. If there's a different set of masterminds for it, Oliver Bowen, Bunny, and Dog could have something going, and this is a chance for them to figure out who the original culprits were and retrieve the pen. In this scenario, Dog faked his death, signing something weird to Mouse. Much of the case relies on the presence of Amadeus Bowen in his office at some point. Supposedly, he'd met with his contractor Horse and possibly spoken to Sheep. If that is not confirmed, then it's possible that Bunny delivered the body into the safe and acted as cleanup crew for Oliver Bowen.
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May 9, 2023 03:49
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There's three statements in this update that relate to each other and lead to a big contradiction. Ox says that the reason Morris was suspected is that the body was found much quicker than expected. Why was the body found so quickly? Bunny says it's because Tiger told him Bowen hadn't left the office. But Tiger now points out that she couldn't actually see who was entering or leaving the room because the office door fully blocks hers when opened. So why would she tell that to Bunny? It's very suspicious. This also further hurts her alibi. If the view into her room is blocked whenever you open the office door, nobody would really be able to see if she was still in the room. Also, I don't buy Dragon's explanation of her involvement.
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May 9, 2023 11:37
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Also worth considering that at that point, Snake had left the building. So she no longer has an alibi from after that. It doesn't mean she killed him (the coroner put the time of death at the latest at the point when Snake left), but she could have done other things in relation to the body.
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May 9, 2023 13:01
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NeoRonTheNeuron posted:A relatively straightforward solution this time. No trinkets to seek or traitors so far, so things should go ok as long as the cards appear in a reasonable spread. Mouse saw Dog die, and his body is apparently in the room there, so he's, uh, probably not in on it.
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May 9, 2023 13:29
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So Tiger was reading a light magazine while waiting for her appointment? Something we know she isn't able to do? (Assuming the revelations that weren't present in the Aces route are real, but it would be a dick move on the developers if they weren't.)
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May 9, 2023 13:34
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ZCKaiser posted:Mouse saw Dog die, and his body is apparently in the room there, so he's, uh, probably not in on it.  Actually, Mouse saw someone who she thought was Dog die, and the body of someone who looks like the person that died is in the room there!...but yeah it's a lot more likely he's not in on it.
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May 9, 2023 13:45
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SporkChan posted:So Tiger was reading a light magazine while waiting for her appointment? Something we know she isn't able to do? She didn’t say she was reading a light magazine, she said she was reading a magazine but it was light reading. So possibly she was just squinting at the pictures as she skimmed through. Still a good catch though.
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May 9, 2023 15:38
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She goes to decent lengths to hide her poor eyesight, so I would suspect that holding up a magazine and pretending to read it to pass the time is a thing that she might have been doing.
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May 9, 2023 16:43
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It seems very unlikely to me from a "conservation of plot points" standpoint that we'd go to such lengths to establish that Tiger Can't Read, and then have her alibi conspicuously involve reading, if it weren't intended to be an obvious hole in the story.
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May 9, 2023 20:55
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 [BGM: Mousetrap]  I hurried over to the classroom which I woke up in. There, I found the computer with the Mouse image attached to it. Looking at the computer again, it was clear that someone had just cut out a generic mouse logo and attached it to the computer. This... it felt a lot cheaper than the previous production. Well, I guess that was to be expected; this whole thing had a different vibe. It would have to, since it was being hosted by somebody else. It had to be. Because Brian was dead. ...Right? No, Ox told me that they had positively identified him in the explosion. The police had guaranteed it. The police... … Before I could think about it any more, the screen in front of me flashed to life. Time to input an action! Immediately, I was a bit taken aback by how barebones the whole production was. It was just a black screen with green text I could mouse over and click on. This really was a rushjob, clearly not made by the same people. However, there was no time to focus on such details. The input window was only 33 seconds! Shockingly low. So low as to prevent you from thinking clearly.  First things first, time to read the communal table. -Mouse of Hearts -Ox of Hearts -Tiger of Hearts -Tiger of Clubs -Tiger of Diamonds -Tiger of Spades -Bunny of Hearts -Dragon of Hearts -Snake of Hearts This was... The results of this communal pool were very disturbing. However, I didn't have time to contemplate it too much. My job was unchanged. I saw a Mouse card, I needed to grab a Mouse card. I clicked TAKE, then scrolled over Mouse of Hearts. And like that, the computer shut off. Task done. [BGM: Silence]  Now, time to deal with the fallout of that communal table. I already had some thoughts about it, but I imagined the group would have plenty more– *BOOOOOM!* The hell was that? I made my way to the source of the noise – a classroom on the second floor – and after looking inside, immediately turned around. The classroom was nicely decorated. The walls were all marked with directions on the compass rose – an eastern wall, a western wall, et cetera. There was a big bookshelf by the door, desks for the students, and a desk for the teacher with a computer. But none of that was what drew my attention. What drew my attention was Dog's flaming corpse. A few others had gathered around the scene, and were experiencing similar reactions as mine. What... was this? A moment's thinking led me to the answer. Of course. Failure to input an action would result in execution. Dog, being dead, couldn't exactly input a move. Circle gets the Square. Without the space in my head for another thought on this subject, I turned around and made my way back to the library, where people were meeting. [BGM: Final Squeal]  What the hell was that? You mean Dog's corpse getting blown up? No, not that, who gives a poo poo about that? I'm talking about the dealt cards! I mean, what are the odds?! Is everything doomed? Okay, okay, hold on now. Let's figure things out first. Tiger, Horse, Sheep, Rooster, Monkey, you five were supposed to take Tiger cards when they were placed on the table. Additionally, seeing the predicament, Snake or Pig might've decided to help out by also taking a card. So, could everyone state specifically which cards they took? I just grabbed the Tiger of Hearts, since it matched with the other ones. I also simply grabbed the first Tiger card I saw. That is, the Tiger of Hearts. Um, I thought we needed to try and rip up Tiger cards, so I chose the Tiger of Diamonds. I decided the best was often saved for last. Hence, I took the Tiger of Spades. I also took the Tiger of Spades. I thought it the least likely card to be taken. U-um, I didn't know what to do. I didn't want to be seen as suspicious or anything, so I didn't do anything, I just checked Snake. He didn't have a card. Hm, I wonder if that action determines the number of cards someone had at the start of the round or at the end. That point was ambiguous. At any rate, I realized the predicament we may be getting ourselves into, and I decided to pick a Tiger card. Specifically, the Tiger of Diamonds. Okay, so... It sounds like everything worked out, right? Multiple people took three types of the Tiger cards, so those should be destroyed. And nobody took the Tiger of Clubs, so we can destroy that next round. Then everything will be great! Alright! Good, good. So we're not screwed. Oh, Bunny. Must you always act so deceitfully? Huh? Oh, you're a clever one, aren't you? You should be aware that what you just described couldn't have happened. Wait, it couldn't have?[BGM: Dance of the Snakes]  Let's start with a simple fact – the distribution of those cards were anything but random. Well, I suppose The Cat never explicitly stated that they would be random, so this is still above board. At any rate, they very specifically flooded us with the type of card we wanted to destroy in order to reduce our ability to destroy it. That's also the reason why the other cards were all ones that people were tasked with collecting – to reduce the amount of potential crossfire. But then, here's a question: why go through all this trouble if we're all working together? Um... If there's already a traitor in our midst. Wait... really? Last time, the 'traitors' were assigned with a public announcement. But we have no assurance that this will play by the same rules. And this game would be far too easy if there were no such traitor. Exactly. I'm surprised Horse, of all people, was the one to catch on. … At any rate, if The Cat is willing to deliberately send out cards in order to mess with us, there are various other things that wouldn't explicitly be against the rules. For instance... There's no rule against The Cat monitoring everyone else's choices and informing the traitor of which 'Tiger' card was left unclaimed.To put it simply, we are once again facing off against an unknown enemy. ...So I have to suspect, Bunny, why you wouldn't point all this out. Well, uh, that's... It's a little thing called 'tact', Snake. I would think a man like yourself would know about it. Oh, is that what that was? My apologies. Rushing to the assumption that there is, in fact, a traitor can be dangerous. For all we know, the cards were sent this way in order to cause chaos and disruption amongst ourselves. Let's think about how to proceed very carefully. Um, I have an idea. Couldn't we just transition to another animal being our designated winner? I mean, it's not like there was any good reason for it to be Tiger in the first place. Hey! We could easily make it Horse, who hasn't had any cards dealt yet. But The Cat is clearly watching our plans, and is trying to mess it up. Who's to say they don't do the exact same thing again? Well this time, we can come up with a more concrete plan on how to make sure the cards are destroyed? No, there's a simpler method. Look, next round, we'll check if there is, in fact, a Tiger of Clubs on the communal table. If there is, then there's nothing to worry about. If there isn't, we just need to find out who has it. Since the other 3 types of Tiger cards were taken by specifically 2 people, if one person didn't take the card they claimed, the other person would have received the card they attempted to take. Therefore, if next round you have the card you attempted to take, you know who took it. With that in mind, the six people who took Tiger cards should Check the six people who didn't, to see who has something they're not supposed to. Tiger, you can check me. Snake, you check Dragon. Rooster check Mouse, Monkey check Pig, Horse check Bunny, and although its likely a moot point, Sheep can check Dog. With this, we'll know exactly what happened to the card. The rest of us will give Tiger our cards to try and raise her score. Even if all four of us do it, she'll only reach a score of 8, so we don't need to worry yet. Hell yeah, Ox, that's how you do it! New plan in place. We'll show this drat traitor that the Zodiac Animals don't go down easily! The Zodiac Animals? What are we, a sports team? No, it's just, you know, a group name. But I mean, we could be a sports team. We could. We should! I'll pass. But Ox's plan makes sense. I think, uh, we should go with that. Very well then, this sounds acceptable. I guess we can go with it.And like that, the group order had been re-established. However, it felt markedly more fragile than before. Like it was a hair's breadth away from shattering. ...But that couldn't be helped. As the group split up, I decided to resume my investigation. Horse's role in all of this was heavily suspect. Why was he there in the first place? I felt like getting to the bottom of this would be an important point. ... [BGM: A True Foal]  You really want to talk about this? Why wouldn't I? Aren't there bigger concerns at the moment? This and that are connected!Horse merely raised an eyebrow. If you say so. Anyways, what are you asking me about? Why were you meeting with Bowen in his office so early in the morning? I know you said you were discussing construction going on near his building, but that isn't the truth, is it? Nothing I know about Bowen suggests that that's how he'd handle such a matter. …  I suppose there's no harm in telling you, here, now. In the past, I used to be a very different person. Because of that past, Bowen had, on several occasions, tried to scout me to do a certain type of work for him. I refused. I explained to him that it wasn't really me who did all that stuff. He pushed the matter. And that morning, he had finally found the pressure point he needed to get me to agree to his unreasonable requests. He called me in to discuss it because it was the type of thing that needed to be discussed face-to-face. When I left his office, I was convinced I would have to work for him. ...And then he died a few hours later. How lucky for me. … Could you tell me... what that pressure point was?Horse stood there in silence for a couple of seconds before responding.  Mouse, if you had committed a grave sin in the past, would you be able to live with yourself? ...Yes. I mean, I'd definitely have to hold myself accountable. But... assuming I grew and changed from that mistake, I think I could continue to live. I mean... to not do that almost seems more selfish, you know? To wallow in self-pity, when there's good that can be done?Horse didn't respond to this. ...And once it became clear he wasn't planning on responding any time soon, I left him alone, leaving with more questions than answers. … Sheep was Bowen's secretary. She should've known him the best. Certainly, she had insights into the case. [BGM: Lamb to the Slaughter]  You want to talk about that? I mean... I guess, yeah. I can answer your questions. Awesome! First up – when was the last time you had direct contact with Amadeus? It was a bit after Snake had come in. He talked with me a bit on the intercom, not really about anything productive. He didn't even bother to talk to you face to face in the morning? From the sounds of things, he was lying on the couch. He had a habit of doing things like that. That's an... odd habit to have. Yeah, well... I-I don't think people really understand what Amadeus was like. I've never met someone who was so confident at all times. And he had good reason. Because, no matter the situation, he was always in control. He knew how to strike at your weaknesses. He certainly... he knew mine. Oh? Don't get me wrong, I could never condone murder, never ever! But I mean... I get why Aaron did what he did. Amadeus did a lot of... a lot of things I don't like to remember. He was a very, very, very, very bad boss. I can't imagine how he treated Aaron. Not too badly, I'd imagine, or else why'd the two go out to drink like that was something normal? Yeah, well... It's not like Amadeus always had it easy, either. He had a pretty rough time of it when he was a kid. Who gives a poo poo?  That's an understandable response. … Say, Mouse? What would you do with a horrible past? How would you handle it? Me? ...Forget it, I guess. Just like that? Just like that. You shouldn't let your past define you. If you always look backwards, you'll never look forwards. Come on Sheep, you know this! Why are you asking me about it? Y-yeah, yeah, you're right. Dumb question, huh? You're telling me. Anyways, I've gotta get going. Oh, uh, okay then.Curiosity stated, I left Sheep to herself. … I hadn't heard much from Rooster about the whole incident, but he was also there. Surely he had something to chip in to this debate, right? I found him wandering outside the auditorium, as though he was also looking for someone. [BGM: Rooster Style]   Ah, Mouse. What is it? Want my autograph? Rooster, I thought we've established at this point that I'm not just some fan. Of course you're not just some fan. You're my number one fan, right? … I kid, I kid. You do know that a lot of this is a shtick, right? It's hard to tell sometimes. Anyways, what did you want to talk about? The Amadeus Bowen case. Is there anything you can tell me about it? Agh, that old thing? Don't get me started on it. Just thinking of that Amadeus rear end in a top hat gets me heated. Look, I wasn't even brought in during the trial, so clearly nothing I saw was all that particularly relevant, huh? But there's got to be something you can tell me! I don't know what you're expecting from me, Mouse. I came in, sat down by Tiger. I had one of those water cups, because I was thirsty. And I don't know, something just didn't agree with me. I had to get to the restroom – stat. After I dealt with that situation, I returned to the waiting room. I was kept waiting for far too long. The time of a progeny is very precious, Mouse, don't forget that. So I stormed into his office, just to find he wasn't even there. I looked around the place, but then Sheep came in and started nagging me, telling me to leave. So you just looked around his office? Just liked the architecture? Well, you know... So what if I was looking for something else? What something else? Look, my parents are quite wealthy and influential. However, I ended up estranged from them when I stood by my morals, when I couldn't condone something they were doing. But from my conversation with them, it seemed like Amadeus might have been the real reason they were doing what they were. So is it such a crime to look around the office of an rear end in a top hat I was suspicious of? I didn't even find anything! Okay, okay, settle down there Rooster. I didn't mean to accuse you of anything. No, no, the fault is all mine. I apologize for losing control there. It's just these drat death games, they're starting to get to me. I thought I was cooler than this... It's a reasonable reaction. Not for a hero. And you're a hero? Well, you tell me. Am I a hero? ...You're not a hero. No one is. It's not healthy to put that sort of pressure on yourself. We're all just, you know, people. Flawed, imperfect people, trying our best. Yeah. That's the truth, ain't it.Rooster smiled an oddly somber smile. It was a side of him I hadn't seen before. ...That it is. Anyways, I've got to get going. Lots of things to do, after all. Well, good luck with all this Mouse. We need someone to sort things out. If it's not me, it should be you.And just like that, our conversation was over. Mix. fucked around with this message at 13:17 on May 16, 2023 |
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May 10, 2023 19:45
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So I know everyone wants to leave as fast as possible, but there are 12 rounds. There was no need to rush to collect or rip up cards. Sure, you should collect for the designated winner. But you only need a few people collecting. 8 people can guaranteed rip up cards from the designated winner. 2 traitors won't pose a problem unless they are paired with each other. With Dog's body gone and the low production value of this game, this could still be a massive fakeout. (Also, Rooster found the knife, didn't he?) EDIT: knife, not pen NeoRonTheNeuron fucked around with this message at 23:00 on May 10, 2023 |
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May 10, 2023 20:34
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We don't know how many traitors (if any) are there, there could be 11 for all we know.
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May 10, 2023 20:53
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