|
Here's an idea: maybe the unemployment is higher because they're not integrating. You understand that if you're applying and working at a job, you have to actually fit in with your coworkers around you, right? Well, apply that to employers as a whole, and you have your answer. The data you show doesn't itself explain anything. It shows this discrepancy exists, it doesn't show why. "You can't blame the minorities for not integrating when you aren't letting them" where's the proof that these communities we're talking about want to integrate? They want jobs, obviously, because who doesn't want money, but where's the proof they actually give a poo poo about being western? I don't see it.That means the blame is on their shoulders, not anyone else's.
|
#
?
Mar 23, 2016 23:13
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 15, 2024 18:32 |
|
steinrokkan posted:You are saying that the euros are narcissistic racists, how can the Muslims make them like them so they feel welcome? I didn't say that. You must be jumping to conclusions based on your prejudices.
|
|
|
#
?
Mar 23, 2016 23:14
|
|
|
steinrokkan posted:Is the discrimination in educational and job opportunities specific to Muslims, or to anybody who, as they presumably do, has pre-existing disadvantages stemming from being lower class and under-qualified? I mean that article you keep quoting doesn't really provide data except for "poor people are not satisfied". It's specific to people who are of a specific ancestry, actually: quote:A report by the government’s labour oversight committee in 2013 found that 21 per cent of white Belgians were inactive, or not working for any reason, compared with 42 per cent for Belgians of North African origin and 51 per cent for Belgians with other African backgrounds. rudatron posted:Here's an idea: maybe the unemployment is higher because they're not integrating. That would be a worthwhile objection if the people being radicalized were impoverished immigrants straight off the boat, and weren't often the children of immigrants who were born and grew up in the West. quote:"You can't blame the minorities for not integrating when you aren't letting them" where's the proof that these communities we're talking about want to integrate? They want jobs, obviously, because who doesn't want money, but where's the proof they actually give a poo poo about being western? I don't see it.That means the blame is on their shoulders, not anyone else's. If you take the time to actually look into specific cases of European Muslims becoming radicalized, you'll see that they tend to come from families that did try to integrate. 
Majorian fucked around with this message at 23:17 on Mar 23, 2016 |
|
#
?
Mar 23, 2016 23:14
|
|
|
Majorian posted:A 40-50% unemployment rate among people of ME/North African descent in Belgium is not a perceived slight; it's a fact. Are you under the impression that employment discrimination against Muslims in Europe is a "perceived slight"? There's definitely discrimination, but even if you get over it in some perfect scenario, they will still have poor statistics because their community has all the pre-dispositions for staying poor and riddled with petty crime. So the way I see it, if you target racism, the discrimination will survive, justified by socio-economic determinants; if you move to improve socio-economic determinants, then you'll be blocked by racist sentiments. Majorian posted:It's specific to people who are of a specific ancestry, actually: Yeah, that's not what I was asking, how many of the African immigrants have higher education, how many are hampered by being "socially unsuitable" for decent jobs because of growing up poor (the chav effect) etc., compared to the general population.
|
|
#
?
Mar 23, 2016 23:16
|
|
|
Majorian posted:That would be a worthwhile objection if the people being radicalized were impoverished immigrants straight off the boat, and weren't often the children of immigrants who were born and grew up in the West.
|
|
#
?
Mar 23, 2016 23:18
|
|
|
steinrokkan posted:There's definitely discrimination, but even if you get over it in some perfect scenario, they will still have poor statistics because their community has all the pre-dispositions for staying poor and riddled with petty crime. Yet, again, it's not the poorest of the poor who are becoming radicalized. It's usually the children of immigrants who come from middle-class backgrounds. rudatron posted:Again, you keep dodging - what if the community as a whole isn't integrating? Whether or not the peeps are 'straight off the boat' is then irrelevant. I'm not dodging, it's just not applicable to the situation. There isn't a community in this discussion that is refusing, as a whole, to integrate.
|
|
#
?
Mar 23, 2016 23:18
|
|
|
Majorian posted:It's specific to people who are of a specific ancestry, actually: "every survivor of discrimination deserves to be heard, believed, and supported" - hillary clinton quote:Using data from the 2006 Portraits of American Life Study, we find that evangelical Protestantism increases the odds that whites will report experiencing racial discrimination, even after controlling for racial context http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0049089X12002578
|
|
#
?
Mar 23, 2016 23:18
|
|
|
Majorian posted:It's specific to people who are of a specific ancestry, actually: Majorian, on the other Africans, it is tough to find a job when you only have one hand.
|
|
#
?
Mar 23, 2016 23:18
|
|
|
as halfway crooks posted:"every survivor of discrimination deserves to be heard, believed, and supported" - hillary clinton lol, what is this even supposed to mean? GreyjoyBastard posted:Majorian, on the other Africans, it is tough to find a job when you only have one hand. Well, that's a situation where Belgium definitely shoulders some of the blame though. 
|
|
#
?
Mar 23, 2016 23:21
|
|
|
Majorian posted:lol, what is this even supposed to mean? ah yes i forgot that you are incapable of reading papers
|
|
#
?
Mar 23, 2016 23:22
|
|
|
Majorian posted:Yet, again, it's not the poorest of the poor who are becoming radicalized. It's usually the children of immigrants who come from middle-class backgrounds. Listen, you have been harping on how low educational and economic opportunities are the reason for these communities becoming dysfunctional, but now you are saying that lack of economic opportunities is not important? What about this: The relatively well-doing individuals become radicalized because their position and education allows them to see the injustices around them, committed against the poor members of their communities who are themselves too preoccupied with trying to make a living to invest into some radical ideology?
|
|
#
?
Mar 23, 2016 23:22
|
|
|
as halfway crooks posted:ah yes i forgot that you are incapable of reading papers All right, I'm going to start ignoring you now.  steinrokkan posted:Listen, you have been harping on how low educational and economic opportunities are the reason for these communities becoming dysfunctional, but now you are saying that lack of economic opportunities is not important? That was in response to you saying, "their community has all the pre-dispositions for staying poor and riddled with petty crime." Which, by the way, seems like kind of a sweeping statement. What are those predispositions, exactly? quote:What about this: The relatively well-doing individuals become radicalized because their position and education allows them to see the injustices around them, committed against the poor members of their communities who are themselves too preoccupied with trying to make a living to invest into some radical ideology? I think that's the way some of them see themselves. Others, though, come from not-terribly-poor backgrounds and are simply extremely frustrated at the discrimination they face. They came to the West, they followed the rules, they did their best to integrate, and still they can't get a fair shake at a job interview.
|
|
#
?
Mar 23, 2016 23:25
|
|
|
Majorian posted:Yet, again, it's not the poorest of the poor who are becoming radicalized. It's usually the children of immigrants who come from middle-class backgrounds. Or converts. About 2/3 of people arrested in America for involvement with ISIS have been converts to Islam, even though converts only make up 20% of the total American Muslim population. In Britian, 31% of Muslim terrorists have been converts compared to just 2-3% of British Muslims in general. I assume that the numbers are similar in other Western countries. So forgive me if I'm a little skeptical of the idea that Islamic terrorism is the result of immigrants "refusing to integrate" or "not sharing Western values."
|
|
#
?
Mar 23, 2016 23:26
|
|
|
rudatron posted:Here's an idea: maybe the unemployment is higher because they're not integrating. You understand that if you're applying and working at a job, you have to actually fit in with your coworkers around you, right? Well, apply that to employers as a whole, and you have your answer. The data you show doesn't itself explain anything. It shows this discrepancy exists, it doesn't show why. Are you under the impression that there are no homegrown Westerners who are opposed to many free aspects of the Western culture? If Jehovas' Witnesses, neo-nazis, fundamentalist Christians, Orthodox Jews, Stalinists etc. can carry on living despite their awful beliefs and actions as long as they don't break the law (and homegrown fundies outnumber the imported ones by a great number) why the gently caress shouldn't fundie Muslims? Like if you asked your average European country if gay marriage, abortion, weed, black people existing in Europe etc. is OK and you'd get 15-40% saying it is not, easily. You seem to have no interest in hounding them to the same degree despite many such groups actually having tangible power over our political process and having in the past trying to prevent social advances, and succeeding in many cases. As long as you don't voice your opinions or post them on facebook any employment should be open to you. That's one part living in democracy. Now homegrown groups have the advantage of being established in their own countries but that doens't always mean that they have integrated except when they go to work. DarkCrawler fucked around with this message at 23:31 on Mar 23, 2016 |
|
#
?
Mar 23, 2016 23:27
|
|
|
Majorian posted:All right, I'm going to start ignoring you now. drat i was hoping i could get four replies in row starting with "lol" out of you
|
|
#
?
Mar 23, 2016 23:29
|
|
|
Majorian posted:
Did I mention FGM in my post? I'm pretty sure I didn't. And nice strawman about "all Muslims". "All Muslims" don't view anything about anything. I am under the impression that non-westernized Muslims from the middle east and north africa consider such abhorrent practices to be integral parts of their tradition, and polls on the subject (do I really need to link that survey of Muslim attitudes again?) seem to back that up. Majorian posted:That's not what a hijab is! A hijab doesn't cover the face at all. My mistake, but in fairness, discussion of the hijab is very often used as a rhetorical smokescreen by those who consider the public wearing of the burka and niqab to be defensible as well. If the practices of wearing the burka and niqab did not exist at all, then I wouldn't have any negative feelings towards the hijab due to the garment's guilt by association. For that matter, if there was no history of lynchings, slavery and Jim Crowe, I doubt most people would see any problem with wearing pointy-headed white robes. The Larch posted:What's your opinion on high heels? They're kind of bad but presenting them as the equal and equivalent counterpoint to hijabs is bullshit.
|
|
#
?
Mar 23, 2016 23:50
|
|
|
GaussianCopula posted:It almost seems like a corrupt military dictatorship that is reliant on aid from the West is the optimal form of governance for certain countries until they have reached a standard of living where democracy becomes a valid option. Get hosed. Maybe they should not have the west meddling in their country especially if they are not financing terror unlike Wahabia.
|
|
#
?
Mar 23, 2016 23:56
|
|
|
Guess what they're covering into? It's not a westernized version of Islam, it's a fundamentalist type. I'm not going to give a poo poo about the employment rate of neo-nazis, nor is it the fault of the rest of society that being that kind of person means you can't get employment, or that it's harder. And if they starting bombing train stations, they are the ones who have done wrong, and hand wringing about the rest of society treating them badly is bullshit. I'm not interested in letting any of the other groups you mention off the hook, and I'm absolutely for 'hounding' them, but in not going to simply refuse to apply the same standard to muslims just because they're immigrants. That doesn't mean you deny opportunity, but you absolutely must deter groups from remaining unintegrated.
|
|
#
?
Mar 23, 2016 23:58
|
|
|
This issue is, anyway, entirely based on security, environmental and financial concerns. FIrst of all, anyone who goes to Syria or Iraq to fight and comes back should be loving arrested, what the gently caress? We're not talking about foreign fighters here. Some of these people aren't even of an immigrant background or Muslim background. These people are our BORN citizens, more often well-off then not, who go to fight for a nihilist genocidal organization against people who have no choice but to fight or die. They're insane monsters and 100 loving percent our responsibility. The lack of co-operation between European law, security and military organizations to organize and finance a common European framework and courts to try these people is frankly astounding considering how much we know about them and the lengths we go to hunt down old Serbian war criminals and ancient Nazis. As well as the seemingly complete non-existence of cooperation with Turkish and Iraqi security services who have in many cases spent their entire working careers doing this poo poo in infinite times worse situation. Belgium's police services have been revealed to be kind of disorganized and underfunded, whether because of government gridlock or outdated mode of operation, I don't know - there should be dedicated European-wide police force doing this anyway. The irony is that the loudest voices against Muslims are also the loudest forces against European integration on any level. Second of all we need to stop buying oil and financing figurative and literal Mecca of anti-Western fundamentalism holy poo poo. Not to mention Russia and Iran are so tangled in this poo poo that it's not like they are the better option. Norway and Venezuela can't exactly carry it on their own. Sorry, it might lead to economic destabilization and further conflicts but it's not something that can be avoided if we want to stop these attacks. Anyone who tries to further global warming denial and fight against removal of oil (and gas, again Russia/Iran) on a political level should be branded as someone wishing to finance terrorism and persecuted accordingly. If a crazy person wants to make a violent statement in the U.S. he goes to the closest gunstore and shoots up some place (majority white male Christians btw), if they do it in Europe they either have to be happy with just few casualties, be an autistic sperglord willing to spend years planning like Breivik, or turn to a ready-made organization willing to transport them, train them, arm them and give them internet fame for free because don't worry, we're paying for that poo poo! There are no other issues. We don't need to have a discussion about Islam, the Islamic community already had it a long time ago and the first and third generations don't really get up to this poo poo, and the ones in the second that do are a minuscule minority. The terrorists are not only unable to integrate with the community of their country but their own community of birth as well, they are no different from any other crazy person. They believe their parents and every other Muslim in Europe are heretics as well. https://mondediplo.com/1998/04/07islam http://mondediplo.com/2015/02/06charlie rudatron posted:I'm not going to give a poo poo about the employment rate of neo-nazis, nor is it the fault of the rest of society that being that kind of person means you can't get employment, or that it's harder. And if they starting bombing train stations, they are the ones who have done wrong, and hand winging about the rest of society treating them badly is bullshit. Except that those groups have actual power, have in the past and continue to commit violent actions, and have much better employment then immigrants. The actual shittiness of your opinions obviously does not determine your employment status or level of prosperity so you should probably stop claiming that it does. EDIT: Also no matter how much you want it thought crime will never be crime in a free Western society. Part of the deal is that we have to co-exist with shitheads whose head is full of poo poo. DarkCrawler fucked around with this message at 00:14 on Mar 24, 2016 |
|
#
?
Mar 23, 2016 23:59
|
|
|
Liberal_L33t posted:Did I mention FGM in my post? I'm pretty sure I didn't. Okay, so what abhorrent practices are you talking about, then? Be specific. quote:My mistake, but in fairness, discussion of the hijab is very often used as a rhetorical smokescreen by those who consider the public wearing of the burka and niqab to be defensible as well. If the practices of wearing the burka and niqab did not exist at all, then I wouldn't have any negative feelings towards the hijab due to the garment's guilt by association. That's, uh...insane. 
|
|
#
?
Mar 23, 2016 23:59
|
|
|
rudatron posted:I'm not going to give a poo poo about the employment rate of neo-nazis, nor is it the fault of the rest of society that being that kind of person means you can't get employment, or that it's harder. And if they starting bombing train stations, they are the ones who have done wrong, and hand wringing about the rest of society treating them badly is bullshit. Here's the thing, though: European society is treating people of Middle Eastern ancestry badly because of their ancestry. Like, that's it. That's the criteria: they look Middle Eastern. Ergo, they don't get a fair job interview. That should disturb you on a moral level. And even if it doesn't, from a practical standpoint, this is something Western European society can change to minimize terrorist recruitment.
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2016 00:11
|
|
|
GaussianCopula posted:It almost seems like a corrupt military dictatorship that is reliant on aid from the West is the optimal form of governance for certain countries until they have reached a standard of living where democracy becomes a valid option. How the gently caress is anything about the current situation "optimal". The Middle East is burning because the corrupt dictatorships reliant on aid from West (and in few cases Soviets) loving killed everyone except their pet mullahs except that the pet mullahs loving hate West and use all that sweet Western money to kill as many Westerners as possible. In the formerly Soviet countries they killed the mullahs too but that doesn't stop the ones on Western titty from sharing the wealth with the ones who go underground. How are people not seeing this forest yet?
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2016 00:20
|
|
|
Crowsbeak posted:Get hosed. Maybe they should not have the west meddling in their country especially if they are not financing terror unlike Wahabia. ROFL Historically civilization has been "imported" to areas by a more civilized power until it leaves of it's own will or is thrown out. And I'm not just talking about the ME, same thing happened in Europe and all over the world. People meddle, and controlling your own internal situation enough not to be meddled with is one of the qualifying factors of not being a failed state or sham nation. Majorian posted:Okay, so what abhorrent practices are you talking about, then? Be specific. It's not pleasant but it's correct. When I was in the Navy the logic behind "no shaved heads except for boot camp, black people, and medical reasons" was because "we don't want to look like neonazis". Like it or not certain codes of dress or appears are associated with horrible people or the brutal treatment of others. Saying shaved heads on white people is neonazi and saying burka is controlling women isn't that far out there. These things associate with something negative and send a clear message, even if not intended.
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2016 00:26
|
|
|
MysteriousStranger posted:It's not pleasant but it's correct. When I was in the Navy the logic behind "no shaved heads except for boot camp, black people, and medical reasons" was because "we don't want to look like neonazis". Like it or not certain codes of dress or appears are associated with horrible people or the brutal treatment of others. Saying shaved heads on white people is neonazi and saying burka is controlling women isn't that far out there. These things associate with something negative and send a clear message, even if not intended. ROFL where do you live? I see literally at least fifty white people with shaved heads just by walking on the streets and it is completely loving fine.
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2016 00:28
|
|
|
DarkCrawler posted:How the gently caress is anything about the current situation "optimal". The Middle East is burning because the corrupt dictatorships reliant on aid from West (and in few cases Soviets) loving killed everyone except their pet mullahs except that the pet mullahs loving hate West and use all that sweet Western money to kill as many Westerners as possible. In the formerly Soviet countries they killed the mullahs too but that doesn't stop the ones on Western titty from sharing the wealth with the ones who go underground. Those dictatorships are supported and backed because the alternative is a poo poo show. Religious violence, tribal violence, ethnic violence, do you really want to see what happens if the House of Saud loses control? Syria will look like paradise.
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2016 00:31
|
|
|
DarkCrawler posted:ROFL where do you live? I see literally at least fifty white people with shaved heads just by walking on the streets and it is completely loving fine. I was simply saying when I was in the Navy that was the reason given why you should not. I see people with shaved heads all the time all races now, Washington DC, but I got the logic while I was in.
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2016 00:32
|
|
|
MysteriousStranger posted:Those dictatorships are supported and backed because the alternative is a poo poo show. Religious violence, tribal violence, ethnic violence, do you really want to see what happens if the House of Saud loses control? Syria will look like paradise. Syria and every other shitshow in Middle East is either a direct result of those dictatorships and their policies or because of direct Western intervention. How in the living gently caress do you think religious, tribal, or ethnic violence begins? Someone gets on the top and starts handing out favors to their own people. In Egypt it's the military. In Libya it was the anti-monarchic tribes, in Syria the Alawites, in Iraq Sunnis, in Yemen Sunnis, etc. etc. etc. Those dictatorships will fall down in flames, either because of their people having enough or U.S. deciding to shock and awe them, but they are not stable creations by nature. All supporting them ensures that the final fallout will be that much bloodier. MysteriousStranger posted:I was simply saying when I was in the Navy that was the reason given why you should not. I see people with shaved heads all the time all races now, Washington DC, but I got the logic while I was in. Well that's really weird and not a common thing or belief shared by most people or militaries. DarkCrawler fucked around with this message at 00:36 on Mar 24, 2016 |
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2016 00:34
|
|
|
MysteriousStranger posted:do you really want to see what happens if the House of Saud loses control? Yes, very much so, because I'm not an idiot who thinks some ethnic groups have to have a jackboot in their face because they aren't capable of achieving anything better. White people said the same about black people in the 1800's. Could you imagine if the slaves were free? Or if they could vote? Good god, that would destroy the country. Thank god the plantation owners are there to keep things under control.
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2016 00:35
|
|
|
Majorian posted:We don't know because that information is presumably classified, since they haven't even released the identity of the individual. The names have been released, its not classified, they just had to start putting together the info. The names have been released for a while it seems. http://bigstory.ap.org/article/1c1661cef71c4a1a93f3a1863d27a284/trains-400-fighters-attack-europe-wave-bloodshed AP posted:On Wednesday, Turkish authorities said one of the Brussels suicide attackers, Ibrahim El Bakraoui, was caught last June near the Syrian border and deported to the Netherlands, with Ankara warning Dutch and Belgian officials that he was a "foreign terrorist fighter." But he was released from Dutch custody due to lack of involvement in extremism. Majorian posted:It's possible that Belgian intelligence was lax in its assessment of the suspect; it's also possible that Belgium simply didn't have the evidence necessary to make a case against him under their own laws. Turkey's threshold for evidence of involvement in terrorism is lower than most Western countries'. Turkey's anti-propaganda (anti-terrorism) laws are routinely used to squash journalists, lawyers, and other members of the opposition. However, Turkey is probably the absolute best country currently in NATO at identifying foreigners travelling to Syria to fight. http://www.cbsnews.com/news/turkey-cracks-down-on-foreign-fighters-crossings-its-border-to-join-isis/ http://icct.nl/wp-content/uploads/2015/07/OP-FININT_web_low-res.pdf Mr Bakraoui wasn't deported because he violated the anti-terrorism law, he was deported because he matched the profile of a foreign fighter. Belgium released him because he was a common law criminal "not known for terrorist acts" on conditional release. Belgium choose to disregard Turkey's profiling of Mr Bakraoui, and treat him and his brother as the common criminal they were known to the authorities as, despite his having recently traveled to Syria and been profiled as a foreign fighter by Turkey. In retrospect, this was a mistake, as an investigation would have revealed an ISIS terrorist cell linked to the Paris bombings. Majorian posted:It's kind of amazing to me, btw, that you would assume Turkey has such an incredible handle on counterterrorism when it experienced an attack of comparable deadliness a week before Belgium. Turkey shares a common border with Syria. Its situation, in regards to the ability of potential terrorists to enter the country, is completely different from that of Belgium's. Turkey correctly identified Mr Bakraoui as a potential terrorist. Arguing that they have been repeatedly attacked, so therefore they must be bad at counter-terrorism, ignores the reality of their much more dangerous situation with regards to exposure to ISIS and Kurdish attacks.
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2016 00:37
|
|
|
MysteriousStranger posted:I was simply saying when I was in the Navy that was the reason given why you should not. I see people with shaved heads all the time all races now, Washington DC, but I got the logic while I was in. I never once heard that in the army, and there were a shitload of people with shaved heads. Did you hear that from an actual briefing or from some NCO speaking on behalf of himself?
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2016 00:38
|
|
|
DarkCrawler posted:Syria and every other shitshow in Middle East is either a direct result of those dictatorships and their policies or because of direct Western intervention. How in the living gently caress do you think religious, tribal, or ethnic violence begins? Someone gets on the top and starts handing out favors to their own people. In Egypt it's the military. In Libya it was the anti-monarchic tribes, in Syria the Alawites, in Iraq Sunnis, in Yemen Sunnis, etc. etc. etc. Those dictatorships will fall down in flames, either because of their people having enough or U.S. deciding to shock and awe them, but they are not stable creations by nature. All supporting them ensures that the final fallout will be that much bloodier. That violence has been going on since before we were there or even existed as a country.
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2016 00:38
|
|
|
MysteriousStranger posted:That violence has been going on since before we were there or even existed as a country. Yes except that now we are directly financing that violence and providing them with weapons and getting attacked because of that on a constant basis in our own home countries and thus can't just wash our hands of it, genius.
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2016 00:40
|
|
|
Volkerball posted:I never once heard that in the army, and there were a shitload of people with shaved heads. Did you hear that from an actual briefing or from some NCO speaking on behalf of himself? I was an NCO and heard it officially. You could violate it, just as you could get around not shaving with a no-shave-chit, but it was frowned on even then. It was socially enforced rather than books enforced and you didn't want to end up on the wrong side of it. Of course it didn't apply to the Marines we were with which was kinda LOL.
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2016 00:41
|
|
|
Volkerball posted:Yes, very much so, because I'm not an idiot who thinks some ethnic groups have to have a jackboot in their face because they aren't capable of achieving anything better. White people said the same about black people in the 1800's. Could you imagine if the slaves were free? Or if they could vote? Good god, that would destroy the country. Thank god the plantation owners are there to keep things under control. Not just the boots with a jackboot on their face and also cross border issues. Say Iran jumps in to back the Shia, then someone else. The entire loving region is a powder keg with borders that don't make sense, fundamentalists, and horrible governments just barely holding on. I'm not saying I agree with the House of Saud or like them. I'm just saying "I probably will dislike what comes next more".
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2016 00:44
|
|
|
MysteriousStranger posted:Not just the boots with a jackboot on their face and also cross border issues. Say Iran jumps in to back the Shia, then someone else. The entire loving region is a powder keg with borders that don't make sense, fundamentalists, and horrible governments just barely holding on. So in the fight against Islamic fundamentalism, the best case scenario in your opinion is to provide Islamic fundamentalists with unlimited money and weaponry
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2016 00:47
|
|
|
MysteriousStranger posted:It's not pleasant but it's correct. When I was in the Navy the logic behind "no shaved heads except for boot camp, black people, and medical reasons" was because "we don't want to look like neonazis". Like it or not certain codes of dress or appears are associated with horrible people or the brutal treatment of others. Saying shaved heads on white people is neonazi and saying burka is controlling women isn't that far out there. We're talking about hijabs, not burkas. Head scarfs. Like, by your insane logic, do sikhs who get beaten up for wearing turbans "deserve it" because they looked too close to Muslims?
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2016 00:52
|
|
|
Volkerball posted:Read from the bottom up. Sounds like Belgium is operating with a pre-9/11 mindset in a post-9/11 world. rudatron posted:Here's an idea: maybe the unemployment is higher because they're not integrating. You understand that if you're applying and working at a job, you have to actually fit in with your coworkers around you, right? Well, apply that to employers as a whole, and you have your answer. The data you show doesn't itself explain anything. It shows this discrepancy exists, it doesn't show why. If an individual refuses to work with a woman as their superior, perhaps they deserve to lack a job.
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2016 00:54
|
|
|
Laphroaig posted:Mr Bakraoui wasn't deported because he violated the anti-terrorism law, he was deported because he matched the profile of a foreign fighter. Belgium released him because he was a common law criminal "not known for terrorist acts" on conditional release. Belgium choose to disregard Turkey's profiling of Mr Bakraoui, and treat him and his brother as the common criminal they were known to the authorities as, despite his having recently traveled to Syria and been profiled as a foreign fighter by Turkey. As did the Netherlands. Given the fact that Turkey has been known to charge people with terrorism for publishing Chomsky, it's hard for me to blame both governments with treating the Turkish assessment of Bakraoui with a grain of salt. Turkey may have turned out to be correct, but that was only after crying wolf for years. No one is arguing that Belgium shouldn't have done a more thorough investigation, but at the same time, it's a little ridiculous to suggest that a warning from Turkey should have carried as much weight as you're suggesting.
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2016 00:55
|
|
|
Majorian posted:We're talking about hijabs, not burkas. Head scarfs. All of your posts and opinions are as far left as you can get. Do you even realise that your suggestions and opinions are so far from center that it makes you no better than the far right racists? Do you live in Europe? If so, where?
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2016 01:04
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 15, 2024 18:32 |
|
|
as halfway crooks posted:ah yes i forgot that you are incapable of reading papers Maybe take your own advice? http://psycnet.apa.org/index.cfm?fa=buy.optionToBuy&id=2012-31072-001 quote:Over time, the percentage of parents classified as tiger parents decreased among mothers but increased among fathers. Path analyses showed that the supportive parenting profile, which was the most common, was associated with the best developmental outcomes, followed by easygoing parenting, tiger parenting, and harsh parenting.
|
|
#
?
Mar 24, 2016 01:04
|
|
