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fuzzknot posted:! Here's another one. …why is it that people so often seem to misuse the term “ambitious” when relating to this game? Maybe I'm missing a trick here, but the only somewhat ambitious part of SC is the purported seamless transition between station, ship, and space environments, and even that one is only really ambitious due to the interlinked local physics of each zone. For everything else, there are games out right now that does what SC is supposed to do on a far larger, far more intricate and complex, and far more ambitious scale. It's the same between visual fidelity and detail on the one hand (which is moving in this direction anyway as hardware becomes more powerful), and the claim of “realism” on the other, even though realism is so far divorced from everything related to SC, and indeed any space shooter. The “realism” is just a function of predictable computer evolution, not of some grand vision… and especially not as deadlines keep being missed and spectacular visuals become common-place simply because that's what happens over time. Do these people simply not play space games?
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Dec 7, 2015 17:59
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Tippis posted:No. They just mentally edit that part out. You have to rectify the past to achieve goodthink, after all. I'm glad i'm not the only one getting a slight "1984" feeling from the groupthink the "true fans" are spreading on the media.
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Dec 7, 2015 18:00
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fuzzknot posted:! Here's another one. That article is structured like an 8th grade book report.
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Dec 7, 2015 18:04
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Tippis posted:…why is it that people so often seem to misuse the term “ambitious” when relating to this game? It's more the 'seamless' move from walking to barrelling along at multiple c that is 'ambitious', but having seen this presented for the past couple of decades in various forms (Mercenary being the first), I struggle to actually understand the reason why it's desirable. Eve Online provoked much the same reaction with walking in stations; why? The reasoning ultimately came down to opening a revenue stream for clothing and geegaws for your 'apartment', but the 'win' on the players side was a lot more amorphous and involved role-playing, something that inevitably involves a grown rear end man pretending to be a waifu space-hooker. edit: aleksendr posted:I'm glad i'm not the only one getting a slight "1984" feeling from the groupthink the "true fans" are spreading on the media. Doublethink is 1984. The ability to hold in your mind two entirely contradictory concepts without a problem. Groupthink is a psychological phenomenon where a number of people reach the same fallacious conclusions to strengthen the group. The latter is why the Romans would have someone that would advocate outside of the group to allow for all possibilities. Hav fucked around with this message at 18:10 on Dec 7, 2015 |
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Dec 7, 2015 18:06
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Stanko-Prussian posted:That article is structured like an 8th grade book report. Their target audience being gamers then?
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Dec 7, 2015 18:06
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Tippis posted:Do these people simply not play space games?
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Dec 7, 2015 18:07
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D_Smart posted:Yes. Because you know, they had to build a company, studios all those years. Then the real development started in Nov 2014. But it's all good now though because it's coming in 2016. Didn't you say something major was going to happen this month? We're getting close to d-day on whatever that rumor is. Who's going to be departing?
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Dec 7, 2015 18:07
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fuzzknot posted:! Here's another one. quote:A myth. Star Citizen have been in development now for 3 years. Most other AAA games have far more development time. So don't just repeat something you heard on Internet, research it before writing about it. LOL!!
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Dec 7, 2015 18:11
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Tippis posted:…why is it that people so often seem to misuse the term “ambitious” when relating to this game? *cough* Line Of..*cough* Defe*cough*
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Dec 7, 2015 18:13
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Stanko-Prussian posted:That article is structured like an 8th grade book report. Which is still better structured than Star Citizen.
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Dec 7, 2015 18:14
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Omi-Polari posted:There's a portion of them who say they haven't played any video games in years. Well you have to stay pure for Star Citizen, you know. It won't embrace the unclean, who have soiled themselves with other games. Which is why Rainbow Six: Siege presented such a huge dilemma for me. Sarsapariller posted:Didn't you say something major was going to happen this month? We're getting close to d-day on whatever that rumor is. Who's going to be departing? A whole bunch of people are supposed to be leaving over Christmas break, per Crobbits
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Dec 7, 2015 18:14
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Hav posted:It's more the 'seamless' move from walking to barrelling along at multiple c that is 'ambitious', but having seen this presented for the past couple of decades in various forms (Mercenary being the first), I struggle to actually understand the reason why it's desirable. That's the feeling I get more and more: that ideas are being thrown into the mix without any consideration to that singularly important question. It also makes them not consider what has and hasn't been tried before and what the results were. The constant cries for “immersion” might hold some superficial value, but at the end of the day, it turns out that it just becomes a synonym for cumbersome, fiddly, and terminally boring. That was part of the problem with WiS: aside from the failed microtransaction scheme, it was just the most inefficient UI imaginable, and it came as no surprise that the first thing CCP patched back in was the ability to directly access your ships and go flying rather than run around and click virtual virtual buttons on in-game holo-displays. The parts that were supposed to give it any kind of gameplay purpose were nowhere to be seen and turned out to have been unceremoniously dumped just to get the tech demo out of the door. Now we're seeing something very similar happen again for much the same reason. But I suppose that partially answers my question: somewhere along the line, someone confused “ambition” with “dumping everything in without any filter” — more is better! If anything, the opposite should be true… Omi-Polari posted:There's a portion of them who say they haven't played any video games in years. The scary part is that I think we can include CRobber on that list…  Even with his well-documented inability to manage a project in mind, some of the stuff he's suggesting only makes any sense from that perspective.
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Dec 7, 2015 18:23
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Hav posted:Doublethink is 1984. The ability to hold in your mind two entirely contradictory concepts without a problem. Groupthink is a psychological phenomenon where a number of people reach the same fallacious conclusions to strengthen the group. The latter is why the Romans would have someone that would advocate outside of the group to allow for all possibilities. So they sudffer from both ? Having a "Doublethink" condition of "Things are awesome and on track" and "We are already 4 years in that project with nothing more than a Tech Demo and a huge list of promised features" in the brain at the same time and a groupthink of "Only us really understand this awesome dream/game, buy more ship" ? The whales are going to spew so much tears once reality knock on the door next year. Even if that thing come out and is awesome in four more years the rational people will be able to say "Look, i know the game is good, but your 35k placed on the Down average 10 years ago would be worth 39k now, allowing you to buy even more ships if you choosed too"
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Dec 7, 2015 18:30
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Thor-Stryker posted:Didn't the whole maneuvering thrusters idea come about because of the sperg team for the ship contest that actually 'balanced' their ship around thrusters having individual physics? No they've been doing it since the beginning. You can see the design in the Hornet. The problem is that CIG does not take into account the ship's maneuverability until the model is already done (or at least that's how it was in the beginning). You would think they would mock up something simple and run it through CryEngine to make sure the feel of flight is appropriate before having an artist spend hundreds of hours crafting every little bit, but I guess I just don't understand games development.
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Dec 7, 2015 19:04
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Or they could just add offsets to the thruster physics positions to adjust ship handling without having to remodel the ship.
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Dec 7, 2015 19:07
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mashed_penguin posted:Or they could just add offsets to the thruster physics positions to adjust ship handling without having to remodel the ship. There's a lot of things they could do, but won't for whatever reason.
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Dec 7, 2015 19:11
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Beer4TheBeerGod posted:No they've been doing it since the beginning. You can see the design in the Hornet. The problem is that CIG does not take into account the ship's maneuverability until the model is already done (or at least that's how it was in the beginning). You would think they would mock up something simple and run it through CryEngine to make sure the feel of flight is appropriate before having an artist spend hundreds of hours crafting every little bit, but I guess I just don't understand games development. Obviously. How could they sell a thruster-placement dummy box to players? Anyone could replicate that jpeg in MS Paint, doy!
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Dec 7, 2015 19:12
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blueberrysmith posted:
Humorous, ability to count.. loving goons. Why do you ruin everything.
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Dec 7, 2015 19:13
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https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/3vsav1/top_secret_new_tech_december_16_livestream_p/ Speculation? Does anyone care? I'm going to guess that it'll involve procedural planets, because the closest competitor to Star Citizen just released a procedural planet generator and it would be just like Roberts to ditch all of the work already done on planetside to pursue yet another tech.
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Dec 7, 2015 19:27
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Sarsapariller posted:https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/3vsav1/top_secret_new_tech_december_16_livestream_p/ new dance emotes hundreds of them all animated poorly edit: or paint jobs / decals for your ships sold separately of course! 3.99 per paint job - best value!
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Dec 7, 2015 19:29
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Procedural dance emotes. 400 billion possible dances. Created using RNN.
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Dec 7, 2015 19:32
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Mirificus posted:Don't forget about Wesha, CitizenSlum, and Kurt_M. hahah someone posted the conversation slum had on reddit where he told some guy he built low income housing in Mexico and called him (for no reason) all sorts of names and acted like a lunatic and the admins banned the guy who posted the conversation, not slum for "abusive behavior".
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Dec 7, 2015 19:40
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ShredsYouSay posted:Procedural dance emotes. 400 billion possible dances. Created using RNN. …and you should have to grind for the combinations. If there's anything missing in SC, it's that Borderlands 2 touch, so it's about time they add something like that in. Chalks posted:Humorous, ability to count.. loving goons. Why do you ruin everything. Why climb a mountain?
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Dec 7, 2015 19:41
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aleksendr posted:So they sudffer from both ? Having a "Doublethink" condition of "Things are awesome and on track" and "We are already 4 years in that project with nothing more than a Tech Demo and a huge list of promised features" in the brain at the same time and a groupthink of "Only us really understand this awesome dream/game, buy more ship" ? There's a great psychological mix in there; groupthink is basically just a self-affirming viewpoint that just becomes reinforced. 'Chris Roberts has a proven track record' would be an example. Cults tend to survive on groupthink and isolation of challenging viewpoints. There's groupthink in here, but it's largely mediated by Goons. If you ever want to start a fight between Goons, lock them in a room together. Reddit's vote mechanism tends to feed groupthink, because dissent can 'disappear'. Doublethink is harder, because it _has to be_ opposite viewpoints. Normally this gives rise to horrific cognitive dissonance, and is used in torture to attempt to break people. The point in 1984 was that the regime was utterly psychotic at that point. The only solid example of doublethink that I can produce would be the talking points that 'Immigrants are lazy freeloaders' and 'immigrants are taking all the jerbs' being largely accepted by one group of people. Edit: If they were smart, they'd create an IK chain editor and allow people to submit emotes. And by 'smart' I mean 'playing into Goon hands'.
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Dec 7, 2015 19:49
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mashed_penguin posted:Or they could just add offsets to the thruster physics positions to adjust ship handling without having to remodel the ship. Look, if you buy a Galvin 418-k thruster for your Hornet and it somehow gets 24.1% extra thrust so that the ship handles fine that would totally ruin *my immersion*. And you're suggesting having an offset? Jesus Christ! I would have a heart attack if that happened. BTW, I have already five tuned all variables to get maximum performance from my ship. I hope SC lets your pilot go on a diet so that you can manage his mass.
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Dec 7, 2015 19:54
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Let's see what Kurt_M has been up to lately: Hmm...  Oh no, another publication added to Kurt_M's blacklist: 
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Dec 7, 2015 20:01
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Mirificus fucked around with this message at 20:05 on Dec 7, 2015 |
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Dec 7, 2015 20:01
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Sarsapariller posted:https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/3vsav1/top_secret_new_tech_december_16_livestream_p/ Dynamic Unscripted Module Builder It uses preconfigured assets and the dimensions of module slots for ships to generate and build unique "one-off" modules for players who want something more than just "cargo bay type 1" or "torpedo bay type 3" or whatever.
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Dec 7, 2015 20:03
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Derek didn't know about that stream
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Dec 7, 2015 20:04
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Hav posted:There's a great psychological mix in there; groupthink is basically just a self-affirming viewpoint that just becomes reinforced. 'Chris Roberts has a proven track record' would be an example. Cults tend to survive on groupthink and isolation of challenging viewpoints. Ya, which is why the worst thing you could do to a goon thing is to ignore it and go about your life. With no drama or news, all the smartest goons in the room will tear each other to shreds.... or post recipes/catte photos.
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Dec 7, 2015 20:07
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Hav posted:There's groupthink in here, but it's largely mediated by Goons. If you ever want to start a fight between Goons, lock them in a room together. Reddit's vote mechanism tends to feed groupthink, because dissent can 'disappear'. Thats one of the thing i like here. When the thread goes too much in suckling on D_Smart "They are going to fail so horribly" narrative, a few voice rise up to say "Look, its poo poo now and they dont deserve money, but somehting might yet come out of this"
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Dec 7, 2015 20:08
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Sarsapariller posted:https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/3vsav1/top_secret_new_tech_december_16_livestream_p/ Given that they've been making GBS threads out faces lately (albeit captured) I'm going to guess that we're going to see a prototype of their revolutionary person maker. But you're probably correct. Also TIL AMD and other hardware manufacturer advertising campaigns are word of mouth advertising. Dusty Lens fucked around with this message at 20:11 on Dec 7, 2015 |
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Dec 7, 2015 20:09
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Real gameplay! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1i7GlAVrjAU
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Dec 7, 2015 20:10
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Dusty Lens posted:Given that they've been making GBS threads out faces lately (albeit captured) I'm going to guess that we're going to see a prototype of their revolutionary person maker. But you're probably correct. Faces? Are you saying that we might see more of this?  I can't wait!!!
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Dec 7, 2015 20:14
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Sarsapariller posted:https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/3vsav1/top_secret_new_tech_december_16_livestream_p/ You mean procedural planets in the background (how they visually look while you are flying around), or procedural planets for you to land on and walk around on with randomly generated terrain and structures? I could see the former, but not the latter, because of how much Roberts loves to approve and re-design things, I just can't see him giving up creative reigns to a computer's random number generator. I could see a new buggy or buggy skin though. Their livestream will most likely show something like their upcoming voxel-asteroid tech, where they will probably show us a pre-rendered demo, and then we won't see it again for a year at least. And another ship for sale, of course.
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Dec 7, 2015 20:17
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CashEnsign posted:Real gameplay! i'm the super realistic gun-flying-off-the-wall animation
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Dec 7, 2015 20:18
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Dusty Lens posted:Given that they've been making GBS threads out faces lately (albeit captured) I'm going to guess that we're going to see a prototype of their revolutionary person maker. But you're probably correct. Because 18 mocap studios and more than a year spent on "FPS" gameplay, and that's still a thing for some reason.
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Dec 7, 2015 20:22
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Sarsapariller posted:https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/3vsav1/top_secret_new_tech_december_16_livestream_p/ My money would be on some high-end graphics Pizzaz, like prettier explosion or more glowing pew pew. That or maybe a new ship ready for Hangar. Maybe a B-reel of some finished mocap from SQ42. CIG dont seem to be a fan of "procedurally generated" anything. Grab Bag procedurally generated modules (kinda like a module bay filled with random cubesats) would be a fantastic cash cow as a slot machine. Pay 1$ Citzenbuck, 95% of modules are trash but sometime you get a good random combination for a certain type of ship. You can even have another version of the machine costing real $$$ giving trash only 50% of the time. Unwanted modules get scrapped for points you can use to upgrade other bonus modules for reduced iterative gains (each bonus module giving only 90% of the value of the preceding bonus module of the same type), ensuring a never ending cycle of consumption !
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Dec 7, 2015 20:25
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Beer4TheBeerGod posted:No they've been doing it since the beginning. You can see the design in the Hornet. The problem is that CIG does not take into account the ship's maneuverability until the model is already done (or at least that's how it was in the beginning). You would think they would mock up something simple and run it through CryEngine to make sure the feel of flight is appropriate before having an artist spend hundreds of hours crafting every little bit, but I guess I just don't understand games development. Here-- allow this animated gif to explain. 
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Dec 7, 2015 20:29
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aleksendr posted:That or maybe a new ship ready for Hangar. They did say the Starfarer is like basically done in the last space talk show they did. And the new
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Dec 7, 2015 20:33
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