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MF_James posted:Are these guys bad? I just took over a customer that's a bank and they use their hosted platform. They're bad, but not the worst. IIRC, Thanatosian's FI is on DataSafe / UsersConnect which is about my second or third least favorite system to work with (it's real bad). I spent half a decade working in IT / adjacent for a large (top 100 by assets) bank that uses primarily Fiserv software. I'm pretty sure I still had some cases open with Fiserv until the bank deconverted off the product I was most involved with, a couple of years after I was gone. Fiserv suffered hard from brain drain, where they'd buy a company and then all of the talented engineers went "time to go!" and bailed out. They were left with software that they didn't write, couldn't support well, and didn't really have any plans to fix. At one point I did a deep dive into a performance issue that we faced related to some customizations they did for us, it was taking upwards of 90 seconds to pull back a result set that was commonly used by our customers. The system in question had about half a dozen databases running on the same DB server. I pointed out that you could, in fact, query across databases in MSSQL and handed them a query that got the same result set back in under 1 second, but we were told that querying across databases was not allowed, that all results from the DB had to go back to their application server which built a representation in memory and performed all the relational math to generate the exact same dataset. I explained to the TAM that this customization could be made to do so with minimal effort, and since it was a customization, it wasn't like this was going to go upstream into mainline code and violate their incredibly stupid way of doing things. I was semi-politely told to get hosed. I left that job for a direct competitor to Fiserv. I've personally worked several projects that have moved hundreds of thousands of users off Fiserv's software, and it still feels good every time we have another customer go live. Last I heard, they were starting to get out of the particular segment that I was most involved with because companies like my new one have eviscerated their user base. The crown jewel of stupidity in this space is FIS, though. I'm not sure on how much detail I can go into on that one (there have been several "incidents" I'd call them data breaches but whatever), but suffice it to say that anything Fiserv can do, FIS can do worse.
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Jun 12, 2019 04:22
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nullfunction posted:They're bad, but not the worst. IIRC, Thanatosian's FI is on DataSafe / UsersConnect which is about my second or third least favorite system to work with (it's real bad). MF_James, if they're running as a datacenter client on DNA, I have some good news for you: anything they ever want to change, they're going to have to put in a ticket for with Fiserv. It's crazy.
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Jun 12, 2019 05:36
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Thanatosian posted:It really seems like DNA is one of Fiserv's better products It's way better than just OSI, but OSI DNA has been a pain in my rear end twice in recent memory. To be fair, some of the problems we ran into were solely caused by the FI using it, but all banking cores have their warts. Signature (formerly CBS) is fantastic though. One of the few cores that I actually enjoy working with (even if some of the poo poo to deal with it is absolutely bonkers), and maybe the only one from Fiserv that I like, but it's not really geared towards small or midsize banks. I must have been thinking of another goon, I know there are a bunch of banking / CU folks kicking around this thread.
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Jun 12, 2019 05:51
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Thanatosian posted:We're actually DNA. I suspect a lot of our problems stem from the fact that we are not a large institution, so we probably tend to be much lower-priority in their support structure. Some of their decisions for features they don't support are totally crazy, though. It really seems like DNA is one of Fiserv's better products, but yeah, everything you say about brain drain holds true in my experience. Thankfully, I don't have MUCH to do with the software, I honestly don't know what version of the software they run other than the fact that nothing is processed locally and is instead shipped directly to a FiServ DC. I guess that it runs on their teller/pbo machines ( I guess it runs on both, not sure), other than there's some share on the file servers that it accesses and I have to work with one of their people to migrate it and they will make the software work afterwards. The only other piece I have is that they have some desktop that sits on its' own network (Fortigate 62E, ASA and separate comcast line) which is what I had to deal with a week or two ago. The ASA is ours but the Fortigate is "their's" except that AT&T manages the Fortigate's at both ends I guess. So our client dealt with talking to Comcast to make sure that was all clear, while I looked into the ASA (which was fine), FiServ sat on their asses and didn't bother opening a ticket with AT&T and only did something when I copy pasted the logs of IKE traffic ingressing and then egressing the ASA. Whatever this machine does (something about reporting) was kept down for an extra 3-4 days or so because they decided it was too hard to have AT&T look at the Fortigate logs in their DC and be like uh yup poo poo's hosed on that there remote device.
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Jun 12, 2019 06:08
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I am normally pretty good with accepting accents but my coworker keeps pronouncing hard disk wrong on a 60 person conference call. Its not so much the mispronunciation but the context of it. "We have tried pulling the hard dicks in and out" "We've removed the hard dicks" "We're dealing with unstable hard dicks"
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Jun 12, 2019 14:47
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Sepist posted:I am normally pretty good with accepting accents but my coworker keeps pronouncing hard disk wrong on a 60 person conference call. Its not so much the mispronunciation but the context of it. If it helps, you're probably not the only person on that conference call abusing the mute button to suppress an immature snort or giggle.
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Jun 12, 2019 14:49
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In a company-wide conference call, there was some sort of acronym that was being brought up as a new initiative and the first letter was "D". After reciting all of the letters of the acronym, the co-speaker proudly exclaimed, "Now give me the D!!!!!". I've never heard an entire office environment laugh in unison.
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Jun 12, 2019 15:03
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Zero VGS posted:After watching Chernobyl I went to see if anyone was ever killed by a software-induced radiation fuckup, like a microwave oven working with the door open or something. I guess not taking computer science in college I missed out on this fun lesson: The Therac-25 was the first thing that sprang to mind when I read the first sentence, but it seems like there hasn't been anything else on the same scale because everybody else was already using hardware interlocks, and the lesson from the Therac debacle was "Keep doing that."
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Jun 12, 2019 15:16
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The story about the irradiation plant in San Salvador is always a good one, less to do with software though and just a complete breakdown of procedures.
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Jun 12, 2019 16:01
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I had a candidate send back an incomplete technical assessment two days early telling me he was too busy to finish it. Well, I'm too busy to consider his candidacy any further.
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Jun 12, 2019 17:43
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psydude posted:I had a candidate send back an incomplete technical assessment two days early telling me he was too busy to finish it. Well, I'm too busy to consider his candidacy any further. The hell. What's wrong with people.
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Jun 12, 2019 17:46
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psydude posted:I had a candidate send back an incomplete technical assessment two days early telling me he was too busy to finish it. Well, I'm too busy to consider his candidacy any further. About how much work goes into completing this technical assessment?
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Jun 12, 2019 17:48
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Internet Explorer posted:About how much work goes into completing this technical assessment? 2-3 hours. I give people a week to do it and tell them not to overthink it, offering them more time if they're traveling or have something that's going to tie up their time. A lot of people have fun with it because it's basically asking you to explore an industrial network and answer questions. psydude fucked around with this message at 17:58 on Jun 12, 2019 |
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Jun 12, 2019 17:56
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What point is this in the candidate hiring process? And for what kind of role?
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Jun 12, 2019 18:06
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psydude posted:2-3 hours. I give people a week to do it and tell them not to overthink it, offering them more time if they're traveling or have something that's going to tie up their time. A lot of people have fun with it because it's basically asking you to explore an industrial network and answer questions. You are asking for a lot of work on unpaid time. I would consider not doing that. I would laugh at anyone asking me to do a 2-3 technical assessment for an interview. gently caress that. Its funnier the longer I think of it. Unless you are a premier employer people are dying to work for LMAO. If you aren't google or on the level of google, stop. Sickening fucked around with this message at 18:17 on Jun 12, 2019 |
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Jun 12, 2019 18:14
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Is an intern hackathon with only 1-2 people being devs and the other 5-6 BA's or business interns odd? It seems odd to me. It is a low-code/no-code hackathon, but still.
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Jun 12, 2019 18:18
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psydude posted:2-3 hours. I give people a week to do it and tell them not to overthink it, offering them more time if they're traveling or have something that's going to tie up their time. A lot of people have fun with it because it's basically asking you to explore an industrial network and answer questions. Lol I'm not doing unpaid homework to prepare for your job interview, I'd happy tell your company to gently caress off.
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Jun 12, 2019 18:25
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Xanderkish posted:Is an intern hackathon with only 1-2 people being devs and the other 5-6 BA's or business interns odd? It seems odd to me. It is a low-code/no-code hackathon, but still. If anything, I'd want to force the business people to do stuff like that. Technical literacy is important.
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Jun 12, 2019 18:28
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Echoing "I would also tell you to gently caress off," which is why I asked.
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Jun 12, 2019 18:38
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Interview him for having the balls to call you on the dumb test knowing that it would probably tank his chances.
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Jun 12, 2019 18:40
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Interviewing is unpaid work, and we don't make candidates come on site if they can't swing it. If you don't wanna do it, then don't look for a new job I guess.22 Eargesplitten posted:What point is this in the candidate hiring process? And for what kind of role? Security SME/sales engineer. They were pretty late in the process, as the next step would have been an interview with the CTO and then a hiring decision. psydude fucked around with this message at 18:46 on Jun 12, 2019 |
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Jun 12, 2019 18:43
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jaegerx posted:Also json should be output. You should not use json as input to configure poo poo. Looking at you ansible. Yaml is input. Json is output. I hate that it's difficult to decipher failures in the output by default.
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Jun 12, 2019 18:45
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psydude posted:2-3 hours. I give people a week to do it and tell them not to overthink it, offering them more time if they're traveling or have something that's going to tie up their time. A lot of people have fun with it because it's basically asking you to explore an industrial network and answer questions. psydude posted:Interviewing is unpaid work, and we don't make candidates come on site if they can't swing it. If you don't wanna do it, then don't look for a new job I guess.
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Jun 12, 2019 18:47
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psydude posted:Interviewing is unpaid work, and we don't make candidates come on site. If you don't wanna do it, then don't look for a new job I guess. Interviewing is a two way street though, which makes it a time investment by the company doing the interviewing as well. That keeps it from being exploitative. That being said, there has been plenty of push-back in the industry against really grueling and time consuming interviewing. Are you going to spend 2 hours interviewing someone who you know isn't going to get the job? The person doing this test gets to make no such call. You've had quite a few folks, knowledgeable folks, say it's dumb. You're losing potentially good candidates due to this. I am not just speaking in hypothetical here. I am currently between jobs and if applying for a job takes me 30+ minutes to do, or they come back and ask me to do 1-2 hours of unpaid work, I am stopping the process there. By all means, keep doing what you're doing. Just don't be surprised if people say no and probably don't complain about it to make them look bad.
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Jun 12, 2019 18:48
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It's a late stage interview step and he's the first person to ever not complete it. So I'm not sure you're right that we're turning away quality candidates.
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Jun 12, 2019 18:49
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psydude posted:It's a late stage interview step and he's the first person to ever not complete it. So I'm not sure you're right that we're turning away quality candidates. I mean, sure, you're right, this person was a terrible candidate. They only made it to a late stage interview.
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Jun 12, 2019 18:51
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2-3 hours of self-paced work over a week is not remotely unreasonably as part of an interview process, given that the work is clearly not-useful to your prospective employer for anything except determining candidate quality. Giving candidates the opportunity to do some work at their own pace without serious time pressure provides such better signal than an in-person coding interview. I am also not sure I agree with the assumption that interviewing should be equally burdensome for the employer—that just seems spiteful. If I bring you onsite and sit you in front of a laptop and give you 3 hours to do this project while I watch, how is that a better experience for anyone involved? If the full interview process is <6 hours of candidate time, and the take home assignment isn't free labor (that is, psydude will just be throwing it away after reviewing it, not putting it into production) nothing about this really seems unreasonable.
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Jun 12, 2019 18:56
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I had one company give me a take home project to write in a prometheus library to instrument some dummy app. I thought it was a fine excerise to do, I probably should be able to do that. But then I sat down to do it and realized I didn't give a gently caress, I know I can do it if I put in the time, and had more important things to do instead and never got beyond opening the prometheus library docs and git cloning. Its still not as stupid as live coding interviews though. Those are some seriously dumb poo poo.
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Jun 12, 2019 18:58
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Sepist posted:I am normally pretty good with accepting accents but my coworker keeps pronouncing hard disk wrong on a 60 person conference call. Its not so much the mispronunciation but the context of it. I was on a call with a person from Ireland talking a building that included facilities operations centers (FOC) and security operations centers (SOC) and I had a good five minutes of utter confusion trying to figure out why he kept talking about "fucks and sucks."
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Jun 12, 2019 19:01
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Comradephate posted:2-3 hours of self-paced work over a week is not remotely unreasonably as part of an interview process, given that the work is clearly not-useful to your prospective employer for anything except determining candidate quality. If you have attrition from your hiring pipeline, you're doing something wrong. Maybe it has nothing to do with your interview process; I've gone through a few of these recently for companies like Two Sigma where I haven't felt put off by the request, because it's a really exciting place to work. Like a user experience, the outcomes in your hiring pipeline are a cumulative expression of people's experiences through the process. Someone exiting the process is a clear indication that they feel your company isn't worth the effort. It's a good opportunity to learn, if you want it.
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Jun 12, 2019 19:05
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Methanar posted:Its still not as stupid as live coding interviews though. Those are some seriously dumb poo poo. What's wrong with those?
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Jun 12, 2019 19:09
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Vulture Culture posted:Here's the issue with your argument: you're setting the bar for a candidate exiting your recruiting pipeline at "I have done something to a candidate that is literally unreasonable", which just isn't the case for people who have options. Every interview process contains leverage; the hiring manager may need the candidate more than the candidate needs the job, or vice versa. But unless you're a body shop, you want to be hiring the people who you need more than they need you. And the problem with your argument is that it's based on the assumption that the single candidate who exited psydude's interview process is the reasonable, logical average, and a superstar that psydude would be crazy to not hire, rather than the outlier that he is shown to be by the comment that this is the first time it's ever happened. Making process changes because of an outlier is foolish, and making exceptions to the process because you believe the candidate might be an outlier is doubly foolish. It is good to keep data on your interview process and make changes as needed, but one datapoint is not compelling proof of a problem.
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Jun 12, 2019 19:20
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Asking people to work for free is wrong and you should not do it.
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Jun 12, 2019 19:25
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Whether or not you reject the take home project is a test to see how well you stand up to authority. A necessary skill that the job will require.
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Jun 12, 2019 19:27
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CLAM DOWN posted:Lol I'm not doing unpaid homework to prepare for your job interview, I'd happy tell your company to gently caress off. I'll do interviews and reasonably brief technical tests and the like but a potential employer handing me hours unpaid busywork as part of an interview process is "lmao no" Nuclearmonkee fucked around with this message at 19:32 on Jun 12, 2019 |
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Jun 12, 2019 19:29
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Internet Explorer posted:Asking people to work for free is wrong and you should not do it. It's a standardized assessment that has no business value to us outside of assessing a candidate's technical skills, so it's not "free work" any more than asking them to fill out our job application or answering hypothetical questions about specific use cases is "free work."
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Jun 12, 2019 19:31
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psydude posted:It's a standardized assessment that has no business value to us outside of assessing a candidate's technical skills, so it's not "free work" any more than asking them to fill out our job application or answering hypothetical questions about specific use cases is "free work." If you are giving them a task that takes hours of their time that's loving work, regardless of how pointless it is. I'm given pointless tasks from time to time which I do at work, for money. Them being devoid of value does not change the amount of my time I am wasting to do them.
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Jun 12, 2019 19:33
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psydude posted:It's a standardized assessment that has no business value to us outside of assessing a candidate's technical skills, so it's not "free work" any more than asking them to fill out our job application or answering hypothetical questions about specific use cases is "free work." Do you also do personality tests to try to find those on the spectrum?
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Jun 12, 2019 19:34
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Nuclearmonkee posted:If you are giving them a task that takes hours of their time that's loving work, regardless of how pointless it is. I also sit on phonecalls with people who ask me questions for work. Is your argument that doing things at job interviews that you do for work is free work? If I ask a candidate how to configure a switch, is that free work?
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Jun 12, 2019 19:34
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psydude posted:I also sit on phonecalls with people who ask me questions for work. Is your argument that doing things at job interviews that you do for work is free work? If I ask a candidate how to configure a switch, is that free work? Yes, but you are showing good faith by being on the call and hopefully sparking a conversation. You are not showing good faith by giving out homework.
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Jun 12, 2019 19:40
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