STAC Goat posted:Except for an elite team of commandos with a honeypot. That didn't work out in the long run!
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May 2, 2020 01:45
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Lurdiak posted:No one can defeat Jason. Jason Goes to Hell brings up an interesting question though. In JGtH the director pretty much abandons Jason in order to crowbar in a bunch of obtuse Evil Dead references. Are there any other franchise monsters which are beaten by their own disloyal directors?
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May 2, 2020 03:35
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Freddy in New Nightmare, diagetically
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May 2, 2020 03:41
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Lurdiak posted:No one can defeat Jason. True. He’s very strong.
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May 2, 2020 05:11
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Not true, like a real Jersey Boy, Jason was defeated by the City of New York itself.
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May 2, 2020 20:21
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STAC Goat posted:I've been wanting to get into the Godzilla... world for a few years now but I just have no idea how to approach it. One marathon I'll give it a try after creating a flow chart or something. Or just watch Godzilla to at least start. Just watch the films in the Criterion Showa Godzilla boxset, you don’t need a chart to enjoy giant monsters punching each other.
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May 3, 2020 05:04
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You don't need a flow chart, here's a list of Toho-produced kaiju films (i.e. official Godzilla continuity, including films that do not feature Godzilla): https://www.tohokingdom.com/genre_movie_lists/kaiju_listing.htm edit: There are some oddities on this list. Like Always: Sunset on Third Street 2 only features Godzilla in a brief daydream sequence and is not actually a kaiju movie. Or the Attack on Titan movies, which are not Godzilla continuity but do feature giant monsters. TrixRabbi fucked around with this message at 14:06 on May 3, 2020 |
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May 3, 2020 13:58
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TrixRabbi posted:You don't need a flow chart, here's a list of Toho-produced kaiju films (i.e. official Godzilla continuity, including films that do not feature Godzilla): I mean, with only a few exceptions, it's not like the Godzilla movies have a lot of ongoing continuity. And most of the instances where it does happen either relate back to the original or to the immediate preceding movie. So, for the most part, it's just easiest to watch the original 1954 version and then just pick and choose based on whether the poster or the opponent design grabs you.
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May 3, 2020 15:33
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Class3KillStorm posted:I mean, with only a few exceptions, it's not like the Godzilla movies have a lot of ongoing continuity. And most of the instances where it does happen either relate back to the original or to the immediate preceding movie. So, for the most part, it's just easiest to watch the original 1954 version and then just pick and choose based on whether the poster or the opponent design grabs you. Ah my friend, no. While it is true that some Godzilla films do not share heavy continuity or characters, as I detailed earlier in the thread, every major continuity has had that very thing. Continuity. Just more subtle than one might think. For example, Across the 1950s, the kaiju movies of note featured consistently human, mundane levels of military firepower. Then 1961 Mothra came out and introduced a brand new anti-kaiju weapon, a heat ray. This weapon was then carried over into the War of the Gargantuas and refined into the Maser Cannon, which itself would then feature prominently in the Godzilla films of the 1970s. The Showa Timeline is also pretty rock solid, all things considered. 54 leads into 55 where Godzilla is stuck in a giant block of ice. This leads into KKVSGoji where Godzilla breaks free of that block of ice but then gets knocked out underwater while fighting Kong. When Godzilla resurfaces in '64, humanity knows that their weapons cannot stop him, they know that Kong cannot stop him, so they turn to the one respite they may yet have- God. Specifically, they appeal to Mothra, a divine entity that kicked the poo poo out of Japan and America three years prior, because this movie is in continuity with Mothra. Godzilla falls into the ocean again, gets recovered by some assholes, falls into the ocean again, washes up on an island and gets woken up by some assholes, so he goes and gets a kid and then the next movie is cannonically the end of the Showa Era and set in the FAR FUTURE of 1999 and it shows the natural progression of humanity as technological giants. The rest of the showa era then establish certain things that will happen in DAM such as humanity's growing technological pallet, and Angirus being A Thing again. But that does get a bit loose with it, I will admit. Then you have the Heisei era which is one long storyline of convolution and plodding glory from 1984 to 1995, with the same characters cropping up from '89 on. Miki is the effective main character of the Heisei Era and her relationship with Godzilla and their son is what defines the emotional throughline of the last three films. If you try to jump into, say, Godzilla VS MechaGodzilla 2, the first image you see is of a destroyed Mecha King Ghidorah head as scientists study it and you stop and go "Wait what the gently caress" The only one that really stands on its own is Godzilla VS Mothra Battle For Earth, as that was more of a Mothra film with Godzilla guest starring. Which then ties itself into the continuity by having Miki along and then being integral to the plot of Godzilla VS Space Godzilla which is a real thing yes and that one also demands that you have seen Godzilla VS Biollante to understand all the stuff in the backstory. Biollante for the record is a genetic abomination that came about because a scientist decided to crossbreed a rose with Godzilla's DNA and then terrorists shot his daughter and her soul haunted the mutation. The Godzilla series is a wild, wild ride
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May 3, 2020 17:46
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I've only seen a scattered batch of Godzilla films, maybe like 10 or so but obviously a lot of posters on this forum who've gone through them all. Even then, if I was going to aim to watch all of them why not just go in order? See the evolution of the character and it makes it easy to keep track of where you are.
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May 3, 2020 18:56
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Burkion posted:Ah my friend, no. It's fun to read all of this because I just recently learned a lot of it. In the latter part of last year my main assignment at work was a Godzilla game, and I had watched a few Godzilla movies and loved the concept of them but never dove in. So about two weeks of my work were just watching Godzilla movies and reading about them and now I consider myself a huge fan. I'll be interested to see what the Godzilla fans have to say about the game in a couple months when it hits shelves. Godzilla is an interesting idea because while it's not really a horror franchise, some of the entries do have legitimately scary moments, especially Shin Godzilla and the original 1954 film.
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May 4, 2020 00:55
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Shin Godzilla is so good and revelatory.
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May 4, 2020 02:08
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Burkion posted:Ah my friend, no. On the other hand, how much of that matters? It's one thing to say, "oh, because he fell into the ocean in KING KONG VS GODZILLA, that's why the typhoon washed him onshore in GODZILLA VS MOTHRA." But all that amounts to is "Godzilla appeared on a beach and he's here now." Like, that's the recurring thing you pointed out. And why would anyone care? He's Godzilla, he goes where he will. Inter-story continuity and human relationships are not the things you focus on first in a Godzilla film. So if you're talking to someone who's interested and never seen one, better not to scare them off with that kind of stuff and focus instead on the fun city smashing and monster fights. (Other than the first one, which is its own beast entirely.) So just pick the monster design you or they like best and jump around; worst case there's still some fun dumb monster wrestling action to fall back on. Class3KillStorm fucked around with this message at 04:49 on May 4, 2020 |
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May 4, 2020 04:38
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If you're going to rewatch The Exorcist make sure it's not the extended edition. Wow, that does NOT work at all.
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May 4, 2020 14:33
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BisonDollah posted:If you're going to rewatch The Exorcist make sure it's not the extended edition. Wow, that does NOT work at all. I feel like the library scene is a great addition but I'm not a fan of the other stuff.
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May 4, 2020 15:21
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Class3KillStorm posted:On the other hand, how much of that matters? It's one thing to say, "oh, because he fell into the ocean in KING KONG VS GODZILLA, that's why the typhoon washed him onshore in GODZILLA VS MOTHRA." But all that amounts to is "Godzilla appeared on a beach and he's here now." Like, that's the recurring thing you pointed out. And why would anyone care? He's Godzilla, he goes where he will. I mean, from our modern perspective continuity is pretty low but for movies back then it was pretty high. Watching them today I think it's pretty funny that Japanese actor Akira Kubo appears in 3 Godzilla films during the Showa period, playing very different characters every time.
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May 4, 2020 17:00
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Class3KillStorm posted:On the other hand, how much of that matters? Considering you said Class3KillStorm posted:I mean, with only a few exceptions, it's not like the Godzilla movies have a lot of ongoing continuity. Everything, actually. Yes, you can watch these movies out of order and have a fun time doing it- God knows back in the day that was the only way you could really do it. But you can also piece them together with a rough knowledge of what happens in each film and figure out the timeline by yourself- because I did that as a kid, when the only thing I had to go off of were my VHS releases or whatever I recorded off of TV. But to say that the continuity was superfluous is straight up, top to bottom, wrong. The Godzilla movies built up a whole extended universe, and even in the later movies that didn't have the other series in continuity, they would still work in OTHER films. GMK, from 2001, discounts every other Godzilla or Toho Kaiju film except 1954. But it also includes Godzilla 1998 in its canon. The Kiryu Duology includes Mothra 1961, Frankenstein Conquers the World and War of the Gargantuans, and I believe one or two other Non Godzilla Toho Kaiju movies. It implies a connection to YOG, for example, by having one of the Yog trio cameo at the start of Tokyo SOS. You can change the goal posts and say that it's not necessary to enjoy the films, and that is true, but to say that it isn't there at all and only 'from the previous movie to the next' is flat out wrong and has been wrong since Godzilla VS Mothra 1964, definitively. This is ignoring the Heisei Era which criss crosses itself back and forth and has the tightest through-line of all the continuities as I also detailed. I didn't go on a whole aside about loving Space Godzilla for no reason, even if I was trying to be funny. Funny related story. As a kid, my earliest Godzilla movies I had access to were Godzilla VS Megalon, Sea Monster, 1985, Godzilla VS Mothra 1964, Godzilla VS King Kong, VS MechaGodzilla and Monster Zero. I was able to work out that 85 didn't seem to have anything to do with the older movies but was a sequel to somethign I hadn't seen- I was aware of the original but had never gotten to see it- and I could tell that like in '85, Godzilla used to be a bad guy but became a good guy at some point. I was even able to piece together that King Kong went into Mothra. When I finally got a copy of Ghidorah the Three Headed Monster it was like a puzzle piece falling into place. "Oh, that's where he becomes a good guy!"
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May 4, 2020 17:12
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I have completed the OG Alien Quadrilogy rewatch. Alien and Aliens still great. Still prefer Alien but Aliens good as well. I always forget Alien 3 exists until it starts and then I curse them for killing Newt and vaguely remember it. I know why i forget it, because its boring and bad. Not terrible. Weaver is good, there's a really talented cast, and it looks good. But its not good. Resurrection remains alright. Not good, but trashy 90s sequel popcorn. Perfectly watchable. I watched the AVP movies as part of the Predator binge so that means I'm about to start Prometheus and if I can hold up Covenant. Exorcist still has my vote on the grounds that its a marginally more consistent franchise, that tries to do something different with each film, is truer horror to me, and I love the series. But its close. Lets see if the contemporary films can put it over the top or sink it before voting ends.
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May 5, 2020 01:35
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So I've finished all of the Chucky films and the Larry Talbot saga, and I'm honestly not sure anymore. Curse and Cult really put that series over the top with a couple of very rewatchable instant classics, but Universal has a lot of very rewatchable nostalgic classics too. I think most of the low points are in the Universal films, but Chucky also seems to just coast at times. I guess it comes down to whether I prefer a Saturday afternoon spooky matinee, or a Saturday night beer and a takeout movie. Can we bring back the BloodRayne option, because I'm torn.
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May 5, 2020 02:45
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All of your options are Wishmaster now.
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May 5, 2020 03:35
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Debbie Does Dagon posted:So I've finished all of the Chucky films and the Larry Talbot saga, and I'm honestly not sure anymore. Curse and Cult really put that series over the top with a couple of very rewatchable instant classics, but Universal has a lot of very rewatchable nostalgic classics too. I think most of the low points are in the Universal films, but Chucky also seems to just coast at times. I guess it comes down to whether I prefer a Saturday afternoon spooky matinee, or a Saturday night beer and a takeout movie. Vote with your heart for Chucky.
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May 5, 2020 04:49
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Ok, Prometheus and Covenant watched. They were alright. Not sure what my memory of Prometheus was. I thought it was much more confusing or more Blade Runner-like or I dunno. I'm just gonna assume I was really drunk and didn't even finish it because I really didn't remember that movie at all. Anyway, it was fine, but just not really my think. I think both just lean more into that sci-fi philosophical kind of thing that I just don't like as much as the more horror-y OG Quad. I don't like Blade Runner so like, I'm just not into that side of Ridley Scott. Nothing wrong with it, just not my thing. I guess I'm just not that interesting in a robot's existential crisis. Maybe I'm a robiticst. Dunno. Anyway, so final conclusion... still sticking with Exorcist. I think its interesting you can break up both franchises into the old school half and the contemporary half. Alien/Aliens/Alien3/Resurrection and AVP/Requiem/Prometheus/Covenant. Exorcist/II/III and Prequel/Dominion/TV Series. For me the Alien OG 4 is probably my favorite block and the first is still one of my favorites while Aliens and Resurrection are very rewatchable. The contemporary 4 are fine but less my thing. I think the franchise got progressively more sci-fi and kinda nihilistic at times and existential that just wasn't my thing. I don't like III the way some do but I don't hate II the way some do. I think they're both flawed films but interesting different roads that were totally watchable, but probably not something I'll be jumping to rewatch. The prequels aren't good but I don't think they're any worse than Alien 3 or Requiem. The kicker is probably the TV Series for me. The Alien Quadrilogy probably would have won out because of its rewatchability value. The OG Exorcist is the only movie I can really see myself rewatching (as I gave many times) and I gotta be in the mood for it. I can pop 3 of the first 4 Alien movies on most any time if I'm bored. But the difference maker for me is that I love the TV Series and am planning a rewatch even now. That to me is the bump. Ultimately I prefer the Exorcist TV Series to anything either franchise has put out in 30 years or so. It might come in 3rd to me after the two original films and before Aliens. So I think that's my edge. I love you, Alien, and I gave you the full rewatch to see. But I'm sticking with Exorcist. I also kinda wanted to watch Ninth Configuration but its late and its not really an Exorcist movie. Maybe next round if it advances.
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May 5, 2020 07:07
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Shrecknet posted:Ya'll should keep an eye on this post because I'm gonna be sampling it on the 3rd to remind everyone to read up on the entrants. I got around to watching this video and I'm very pleased to see a scientific experiment on whether Wishmaster 4 owns bones is also on his channel. Very enlightening, pro click. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gP2kkV1guFs I'm still rooting for Friday the 13th.
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May 5, 2020 11:59
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Why is that YouTuber spending so much time on a pitch black background? If that's your setting at least show more clips from the movies.
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May 5, 2020 14:37
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I feel like every documentary about horror movies has someones sitting in front of a black void so it feels right to me.
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May 5, 2020 18:24
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Results!  No surprises, the top seed won all four matchups. I imagine the Evil Eight will produce far more teeth-gnashing than anything else so far. Take the next half-hour or so to reflect on how we as a nation have failed Charles Lee Ray by not having Child's Play advance.
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May 5, 2020 18:35
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The only real surprise there is how much fight Child's Play had in it.
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May 5, 2020 18:38
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I ended up switching my vote to Child's Play - there are unquestionably some better films in the Universal lineup, but the arguments here convinced me that they aren't really a franchise in the same way as most everything else in this tournament. If it had specified "Universal Frankenstein" that probably would've won.
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May 5, 2020 18:49
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gey muckle mowser posted:I ended up switching my vote to Child's Play - there are unquestionably some better films in the Universal lineup, but the arguments here convinced me that they aren't really a franchise in the same way as most everything else in this tournament. If it had specified "Universal Frankenstein" that probably would've won. Those same arguments that started to break down and switched to "I'm voting emotionally rather than logically"? I'm only bringing THAT up because, since Universal is still in the drat thing, we're still going to have this discussion later.
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May 5, 2020 18:53
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RIP Chucky and Exorcist. Sad about losing both despite strong victors. Sweet 16 was too early for you. Bracketmakers are cruel.
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May 5, 2020 19:03
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I thought Exorcist might have fared slightly better but still, no surprise that Alien took it.
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May 5, 2020 19:06
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gey muckle mowser posted:I ended up switching my vote to Child's Play - there are unquestionably some better films in the Universal lineup, but the arguments here convinced me that they aren't really a franchise in the same way as most everything else in this tournament. If it had specified "Universal Frankenstein" that probably would've won. I'm not sure I really follow your logic because you're saying that just the Frankenstein films alone would've been enough to vote against Child's Play. So why not limit your consideration to just the Frankenstein films and vote accordingly? Why disqualify the entry all together? This thing is a free for all, you're allowed to vote on really any basis you want so there's nothing preventing you from defining a given franchise the way you want to and then voting based on that. Like, if I decided the Child's Play remake doesn't count because it wasn't made by Mancini and doesn't share continuity with the rest of the series, who's gonna stop me?
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May 5, 2020 19:11
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Eastern Division SWEET SIX-SCREAM  And with that out of the way, the matchups!  Michael Meyers vs. Leatherface. It's time to go mask-off on these masked madmen. Jason carves up coeds while Leatherface serves up family fare. Whose cuisine reigns supreme? In Defense of Halloween: No Volunteers In Defense of Texas Chainsaw Massacre: No Volunteers  What we got here, is two big ol' mother-humpers. How do you think Lecter would serve up a Graboid? It's basically really big escargót, right? You think he'd serve it with a side of... Bacon?  In Defense of Tremors: No Volunteers In Defense of Lecter: No Volunteers  This one is absolutely soul-crushing. Both of these are foundational to my love of horror. Craven is the undisputed master. I'd put him above even Hitchcock in his ability to elicit thrills and terror. No matter who wins, it will be close, and it will be earned. In Defense of Nightmare: No Volunteers In Defense of Scream: Timeless Appeal   Ash vs Kirsty! Deadites vs Cenobites! Goofy cartoon violence vs insanely over-the-top sado-masochism! In Defense of Evil Dead:No Volunteers In Defense of Hellraiser: No Volunteers Vote Now! Voting and discussion will continue until May 12th! HERE'S YOUR BALLOT! SHARE THIS LINK! Shrecknet fucked around with this message at 19:24 on May 5, 2020 |
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May 5, 2020 19:17
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Basebf555 posted:I'm not sure I really follow your logic because you're saying that just the Frankenstein films alone would've been enough to vote against Child's Play. So why not limit your consideration to just the Frankenstein films and vote accordingly? Why disqualify the entry all together? The argument against the group of Universal Monsters movies we have here is the same as the argument against The Return of the Living Dead series as a whole - that there's enough mediocre or even outright bad films weighing against the good ones to drag them down. We are voting for all of these films as a collective, after all, and limiting the view of the Universal series to "The Larry Talbot Saga" still ends up pulling what most people view as 3 different sub-franchises (Frankenstein, Dracula and The Wolf Man) under the aegis of providing prequels or scenery setting for the later crossover films, as if they were the main focus here. Limiting the view to something like just the direct Frankenstein films would have made for a stronger showing of the promise of the Universal Monsters series as a whole, and would have had less cruft to weigh against the strength of the best titles in that particular group. (To say nothing of the deliberate omission of the films that are widely viewed as subpar (like all of the Noun of the Mummy sequels) from the conversation - no other series has that defined from the start, though we are all taking personal liberties with things like remakes or crossovers.) I mourn the loss of the Child's Play franchise, and thank the people that joined me in making the morally correct choice here. But I take solace in the fact that UM is only going one more round before it gets blown the gently caress up by Jason.
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May 5, 2020 19:26
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By far the easiest matchups for me. The righthand series for each of those graphics represents a series I don't really hold near and dear.
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May 5, 2020 19:32
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I'm not really voting that way. I'm not thinking of a bad sequel as like a -1, I'm not really considering bad sequels as a "drag" on a franchise. They just don't help, so it's more like a score of 0. I'm looking at the good/great/decent stuff in a given franchise and comparing that to what it's opponent has to match it. Plus throw in some bias based on nostalgia, obviously.
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May 5, 2020 19:34
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feedmyleg posted:By far the easiest matchups for me. The righthand series for each of those graphics represents a series I don't really hold near and dear. I love Tremors, and really like Tremors 2, but Manhunter and Silence of the Lambs is a 1-2 Punch that can't be dodged.
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May 5, 2020 19:35
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Franchescanado posted:I love Tremors, and really like Tremors 2, but Manhunter and Silence of the Lambs is a 1-2 Punch that can't be dodged.
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May 5, 2020 19:36
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If Manhunter wasn't so good I'd probably be voting Tremors though. But Lecter has two legit great films in it so yea I gotta go against Tremors on this one.
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May 5, 2020 19:38
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Basebf555 posted:If Manhunter wasn't so good I'd probably be voting Tremors though. But Lecter has two legit great films in it so yea I gotta go against Tremors on this one. Pretty much! A career-defining Tom Noonan villain role in a Mann film? Brian Cox as Lecter? Flaming corpse in a wheelchair?! Real tigers taking naps! Oh yeah and then there's that literally perfect film Jonathan Demme made, too. Heard the Lecter on that was good, too.
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May 5, 2020 19:40
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