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Overeem was a pretty good kickboxer, but his WGP run also had the benefit of some real good luck: Badr Hari was out thanks to his DQ, he fought a Gokhan Saki who'd just broken his hand and extremely should not have been fighting, and Peter Aerts put on an insane effort and took Semmy Schilt out for Overeem, meaning instead of his biggest threat in the tournament he had a final against a 40 year-old he'd already beaten before who'd just gone the distance with the best kickboxer in the world. It's still really goddamn impressive, he just also rolled some really good dice that night.
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Dec 15, 2020 04:58
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| # ? May 4, 2024 20:12 |
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Snowman_McK posted:He's a fascinating figure. He's the best and worst fighter in every fight he's in. He's had multiple losses where you think 'well, that's it for him' and he comes back. He's had at least two career renaissances/reinventions. I remember someone described as looking like he just realised his career was over when Rothwell knocked him out. He's fought 14 times since then and won ten times. While he had the craziest physique in the UFC (and one of the craziest in sports) he managed to lose to three of the most turd bodied guys in history. Honestly, the Coen brothers couldn't write a more tragi-comic figure than him on their best day. poo poo when he first moved up to heavyweight people were rolling their eyes the way we have been at Gian Villante as if that was some long-shot last-ditch career resurrection effort (because he had a reputation for being chinny at 205)
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Dec 15, 2020 05:13
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CarlCX posted:Overeem was a pretty good kickboxer, but his WGP run also had the benefit of some real good luck: Badr Hari was out thanks to his DQ, he fought a Gokhan Saki who'd just broken his hand and extremely should not have been fighting, and Peter Aerts put on an insane effort and took Semmy Schilt out for Overeem, meaning instead of his biggest threat in the tournament he had a final against a 40 year-old he'd already beaten before who'd just gone the distance with the best kickboxer in the world. It's still really goddamn impressive, he just also rolled some really good dice that night. so, essentially, good, but unclear exactly how good? I remember being really impressed with Tyrone Spong in that tournament. He became my favourite kickboxer for a bit before he suffered a bajillion injuries and stopped fighting. And I remember Gokhan Saki looking a bit depleted. Unsurprising since he'd just had that insane fight with Ghita. I watched that tournament on the recomendation of this board and it ended up being one of the best watch parties I've had.
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Dec 15, 2020 05:14
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CommonShore posted:poo poo when he first moved up to heavyweight people were rolling their eyes the way we have been at Gian Villante as if that was some long-shot last-ditch career resurrection effort (because he had a reputation for being chinny at 205) It's interesting, even now, I don't think he's chinny. He can actually take a punch. Whenever he goes out, it tends to be from a barrage of punches. One and done knockouts are still there, like the Ngannou one, but I don't think he has a bad chin. I think it's his reaction to getting hit that's bad. He seems to have put work into it over the years, but he would take one bad punch and seem to go 'well, guess i'm not winning' and just kind of fade, and i think it was a holdover reflex from when he was pissing blood making 205, where his body seemed to straight up shut down after the first few minutes.
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Dec 15, 2020 05:17
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CommonShore posted:poo poo when he first moved up to heavyweight people were rolling their eyes the way we have been at Gian Villante as if that was some long-shot last-ditch career resurrection effort (because he had a reputation for being chinny at 205) No, people were saying he should have done it years before because he was huge and the cut was obviously effecting his fights. I don't know where you got this idea but it doesn't make sense now and wouldn't make sense back then.
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Dec 15, 2020 05:18
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Tezcatlipoca posted:No, people were saying he should have done it years before because he was huge and the cut was obviously effecting his fights. I don't know where you got this idea but it doesn't make sense now and wouldn't make sense back then. i believe he was fighting at mw at one point. could be wrong. but when your main hole in your game is die-to-travis-brown-calibre-fighters your play is generally not to move up to where people hit like mark hunt. that said he was so good at what he did that he'd have equal chance of winning or losing regardless of weight so it evened out.
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Dec 15, 2020 05:25
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Marching Powder posted:i believe he was fighting at mw at one point. could be wrong. but when your main hole in your game is die-to-travis-brown-calibre-fighters your play is generally not to move up to where people hit like mark hunt. that said he was so good at what he did that he'd have equal chance of winning or losing regardless of weight so it evened out. Pride middleweight was 205 or whatever equivalent in kilograms. He was losing to guys like Shogun and Arona so bringing up Travis Browne eight years before they fought is strange(dumb). The main hole in his game was his cardio which dropped off a cliff after four minutes. Most of his fights were Overeem looking amazing then getting tired and punched in the head until he fell over.
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Dec 15, 2020 05:58
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Tezcatlipoca posted:Pride middleweight was 205 or whatever equivalent in kilograms. He was losing to guys like Shogun and Arona so bringing up Travis Browne eight years before they fought is strange(dumb). The main hole in his game was his cardio which dropped off a cliff after four minutes. Most of his fights were Overeem looking amazing then getting tired and punched in the head until he fell over. yeah it might be strange and dumb to bring up getting knocked out by shogun is a reason to move up to people who hit like mark hunt especially when you bring up that his cardio went off a cliff even more but
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Dec 15, 2020 06:00
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His cardio was trash because of his weight cut to 205 and it wasn't punching power he was having trouble with so moving up to fight slower, less skilled dudes was smart and good and extended his career 10 years. How have you been watching fights this long and are so ignorant about them?
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Dec 15, 2020 06:11
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Marching Powder posted:yeah it might be strange and dumb to bring up getting knocked out by shogun is a reason to move up to people who hit like mark hunt especially when you bring up that his cardio went off a cliff even more but nah, his cardio at heavyweight has never been as bad as it was at 205, where he would straight up try to leave the ring after 5 minutes.
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Dec 15, 2020 06:17
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I don't think he would be alive right now if he were still trying to do that cut to 205. Even as a kid in his 20s that cut was horrific, and when he fought in PRIDE, it showed.
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Dec 15, 2020 06:23
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Snowman_McK posted:nah, his cardio at heavyweight has never been as bad as it was at 205, where he would straight up try to leave the ring after 5 minutes. Tezcatlipoca posted:His cardio was trash because of his weight cut to 205 and it wasn't punching power he was having trouble with so moving up to fight slower, less skilled dudes was smart and good and extended his career 10 years. How have you been watching fights this long and are so ignorant about them? well you can't argue with this
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Dec 15, 2020 07:10
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Tezcatlipoca posted:He was really good but didn't fight for very long and had a very convenient Grand Prix run in K1. By the time he was kickboxing K1 had changed the clinch rules to nerf Buakaw so his best skillset/distance was compromised but he still did well for himself. Buakaw was un MaX WGP nit the WGP tho. unless you're saying that to explain why some fighters moved away from K-1 at that time. IIRC, that's when It's Showtime was really picking up steam, albeit for the smaller fighters. Mekchu fucked around with this message at 08:32 on Dec 15, 2020 |
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Dec 15, 2020 08:24
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Snowman_McK posted:so, essentially, good, but unclear exactly how good? No, he beat legit talent in legit fights and was arguably the best kickboxer at that time and arguably the best combat sports fighter period for that year due to holding MMA titles and Kickboxing titles. It was just also a year that was, due to no fault of his own, a slightly questionable run due to Badr being out, and stuff. The bracket was arguably the best for him out of all the other fighters that year, but it was still a stacked tournament final. He also murdered Everton Texeira with a helacious knee that lives on in Texeira's nightmares. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7fmpo2lT8NI To put this in perspective, Overeem took 3rd in the WGP in 2009, then 1st in the WGP in 2010. He is quite a legit kickboxer and was with Golden Glory for a good portion of his career. Mekchu fucked around with this message at 08:38 on Dec 15, 2020 |
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Dec 15, 2020 08:30
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brian posted:uh that fight was good and the only way someone would call it garbage would be if they were really biased against the people involved lol flailing arm punches are not good op
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Dec 15, 2020 12:07
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crepeface posted:flailing arm punches are not good op we're not talking about chase hooper here though??? neither were expert strikers but dern looked very competent compared to previous and it was very clear the effect parillo has been having and it was your typical 2 grappler striking battle but both fighters fought at a high pace and did damage to each other, you're just mad at dern for being dern, the match was fine and did not slow down the card in any way
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Dec 15, 2020 14:48
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Sometimes cutting weight makes you chinnier. Robert Whittaker got rocked in like nearly all of his welterweight fights and as a middleweight he survived ten back to back rounds with Yoel Romero
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Dec 15, 2020 15:30
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Tezcatlipoca posted:Arlovski has been having the worst, most boring fights these last five years. Old Man Fundamentals Arlovski is someone to root for. He's past his prime by a lot, but he gets in there, and he gives em' the ol' fundamental striking. For a brief moment, it's 2005 again and every punch has the pride of Belarus behind it. Brings a fuckin tear to my eye. How taste my peepee indeed.
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Dec 15, 2020 15:55
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Snowman_McK posted:so, essentially, good, but unclear exactly how good? I think it was pretty clear that he wasn't the best. His technique / variety was adequate, but he wasn't the fastest (though at HW, nobody really was besides Saki). His defense was pretty reductive of the Dutch style, though it was often good enough with big gloves. He was pretty smart in getting people to play enough into his style of fighting to be effective and catch them with his power. I think he would have been a crisper kickboxer if he had never done MMA, which seemed to make him more one dimensional in kickboxing.
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Dec 15, 2020 16:05
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in a weird way the big gloves were way more suited for his style. he could just hang out behind the gloves and his troll biceps and forearms for days. i don't think he ever did that hilarious little jog away from the ropes/cage in kickboxing.
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Dec 15, 2020 16:21
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though that defense clearly did not work against hari, who probably would have stomped him 99/100 times after the whooping overeem put on him the first time made him see the merits of horse meat. i wish hari wasn't a particularly violent psychopath in a sport full of violent psychopaths because he's such a cool fighter.
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Dec 15, 2020 16:24
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Mekchu posted:Buakaw was un MaX WGP nit the WGP tho. unless you're saying that to explain why some fighters moved away from K-1 at that time. IIRC, that's when It's Showtime was really picking up steam, albeit for the smaller fighters. I'm saying when Buakaw beat Masato and some of their other golden boys K1 was like oh hell no and changed the clinch rules to disallow double collar ties and limit the amount of time people spent in clinches. It was a little while before Overeem went over.
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Dec 15, 2020 17:55
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Bluedeanie posted:Sometimes cutting weight makes you chinnier. It absolutely does. The brain floats around in the skull and that fluid gets depleted when they dehydrate to cut weight. One of the big concerns about same day weigh-ins is that they wouldn't have the opportunity to rehydrate properly before being in the ring and it's a big safety concern.
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Dec 15, 2020 18:25
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Mekchu posted:No, he beat legit talent in legit fights and was arguably the best kickboxer at that time and arguably the best combat sports fighter period for that year due to holding MMA titles and Kickboxing titles. It was just also a year that was, due to no fault of his own, a slightly questionable run due to Badr being out, and stuff. The bracket was arguably the best for him out of all the other fighters that year, but it was still a stacked tournament final. fun fact: Golden Glory was the reason Reem got dropped from the Strikeforce HWGP, because they demanded all fighters' pay go thru them first, which--in a decision totally out of place for them--Zuffa prohibited.. so Daniel Cormier's career success was all because of Dutch organized crime. also guess who Jake Paul just called out for a match. Troy Queef fucked around with this message at 21:33 on Dec 15, 2020 |
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Dec 15, 2020 21:31
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Troy Queef posted:also guess who Jake Paul just called out for a match. https://twitter.com/Chisanga_Malata/status/1338953253409714178
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Dec 15, 2020 22:31
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nate diaz beating up jake paul after 3 months of shitposting at each other feels right https://twitter.com/NateDiaz209/status/1338669298038919169
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Dec 15, 2020 23:11
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G-Hawk posted:nate diaz beating up jake paul after 3 months of shitposting at each other feels right I really want to see Nate just gently caress him up now.
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Dec 15, 2020 23:42
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i cannot help but respect the paul brothers. imagine grinding your entire life, getting garbrandt levels of brain damage for a career high of 50/50 per fight, and seeing these guys getting mayweather and diaz level paydays for being annoying.
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Dec 16, 2020 00:15
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 Khabib Unretirement Speech: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hWk6JcheLMU
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Dec 16, 2020 01:03
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G-Hawk posted:nate diaz beating up jake paul after 3 months of shitposting at each other feels right Lol
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Dec 16, 2020 01:12
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Lid posted:
lmao
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Dec 16, 2020 02:36
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Lid posted:
This is somehow an even more clear sign of mental health problems than getting in a fight with your own fireplace.
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Dec 16, 2020 04:19
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https://mmajunkie.usatoday.com/lists/ufc-hall-of-famer-tito-ortiz-city-council-train-wreck Of Course, it it's a train wreck.
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Dec 16, 2020 05:46
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TheReverend posted:https://mmajunkie.usatoday.com/lists/ufc-hall-of-famer-tito-ortiz-city-council-train-wreck quote:So, to recap Ortiz’s first week in office: a botched swearing in, COVID jokes, gibberish, fearmongering, and maybe a hit-and-run. lmaoooooo Of Course
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Dec 16, 2020 06:38
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Huh, Hooper had a real highschool hallway type of fight, goddamn
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Dec 16, 2020 07:42
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I would greatly like for Geoff Hanzo Steel Neal to knock Steve Tomson 100% completely out cold this weekend
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Dec 16, 2020 14:28
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anyway, here's this: https://twitter.com/SandhuMMA/status/1339225673966243840
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Dec 16, 2020 16:43
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LobsterMobster posted:anyway, here's this:  HE RAN UP THE WALL LIKE A NINJA 
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Dec 16, 2020 16:47
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LobsterMobster posted:anyway, here's this: gently caress, I’m old
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Dec 16, 2020 16:51
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| # ? May 4, 2024 20:12 |
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I had it on my calendar to post that WEC53 was 10 years ago today, quite possibly one of the greatest cards ever. A bunch of the pictures are gone, but the thread is here: https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3373859&userid=0&perpage=40&pagenumber=1 You can see when the Showtime Kick happened in there, it was magical. quote:Preliminary card
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