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basic hitler posted:Brian Herbert (May God rip his tongue out) decided, decades after the death of his dad, to use his dad's notes and concepts to save his own floundering career, and wrote a book I haven't read but by all accounts doesn't come close to touching the level of his father's abilities as a writer. But if you like pulp sci-fi and just like reading poo poo, and don't have an irrational dislike for them arousing out of your love for the old books, you can probably do worse. I can't say for sure. He also decided that it was too hard to write them alone so he enlisted Kevin J. Anderson, who wrote a bunch of Star Wars novels. Kevin J Anderson has the imagination of a child so these books explained all the things that Frank Herbert deliberately didn't explore, and had them be the most obvious thing ever. Why did the Butlerian Jihad happen? Why, the robots rose up and had to be destroyed, of course! No major shift in society from philosophy or introspection, no way.
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Dec 9, 2017 10:55
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basic hitler posted:I always read the butlerian jihad as a hard rebellion against the weakening of mankind caused by THINKING MACHINES like how the internet and facebook even in 2017 has turned us into soft weak babymen. Not a terminator-esque war against the machines Kevin J. Anderson only had one original thought in his entire life, and it was a blaster that shoots two beams that meet up in the middle for more shooting power, but you couldn't aim.
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Dec 13, 2017 06:49
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Sekenr posted:Considering how the footnotes in the books claim that Atreides family descend from Atreus or Agamemnon, earth is either a half-forgotten legend or the books is a fantasy universe where real earth history doesnt apply. Even the footnotes are written from the perspective within the universe rather than being a definitive voice-of-god. It's probably just like how the Julians claimed to be descendants of Aphrodite and since they had power it was regarded as fact.
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Dec 25, 2017 20:23
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paul_soccer10 posted:Cool trivia about space travel in dune: I thought they originally used Thinking Machines to plan the flights and the use of spice was a substitute for them after trying to do it manually wasn't working
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Dec 25, 2017 22:36
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DebonaireD posted:Dune is good because its like the one sci fi franchise that isnt pro fascist and doesnt have a deep problem with women Dude what
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Dec 26, 2017 00:28
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They fall into the trap of "women use sex to control men and make them do things!"
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Dec 26, 2017 00:35
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etalian posted:https://www.forbes.com/sites/michaelnoer/2011/03/11/the-25-largest-fictional-companies/ I'm deeply suspicious of their methodology in this one.
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Dec 28, 2017 00:06
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paul_soccer10 posted:wouldnt CHOAM have like hundreds of quintillions of 2007 dollars There's literally not enough money to measure the wealth of CHOAM. On the other hand Soylent is massively overvalued. Sure they own a lot of stuff but it's all really lovely. wyntyr posted:I’m buying a new avatar tomorrow. Do I need to make C.H.O.A.M. Gang my actual avatar, or can you still link to an image hosted elsewhere in your avatar text? Someone needs to make the CHOAM Gang their actual avatar and then everyone else can link to it. Think of yourself as the prophet.
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Dec 28, 2017 00:58
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Tallgeese posted:Where the hell is Weyland-Yutani? Gotta make room for the company from Austin Powers
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Dec 28, 2017 06:06
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PTSDeedly Do posted:For example, the Bene Gesserit are stated to seed planets with prescribed mythology which they can exploit as needs be in the future. Yet they hold similar hopes and teachings within their own sect. I believe that's supposed to be an intentional example of hypocrisy.
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Dec 31, 2017 04:04
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Amarcarts posted:Don't get bent out of shape but that happens a lot in real life. It's not the dynamic governing all relationships but it happens. When you make it a cornerstone of a pan-galactic millennia-long conspiracy it starts to feel like you might have issues. Defiance Industries fucked around with this message at 20:52 on Jan 7, 2018 |
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Jan 7, 2018 19:27
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Her selfishness averted humanity's eventual destruction through stagnation, too.
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Jan 16, 2018 05:24
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cis autodrag posted:Yes, but are the BGs goals as altruistic as they claim and would the intended KH have led humanity down the path that Paul did? Is the path humanity has taken by the end of the series even good? I think the BG would want to keep the current stagnation in place. They might slightly move pieces around the table but the heirarchy would have stayed basically undisturbed. After all, they're in a pretty good spot right now, and when you're close enough to the top you're averse to anything that rocks the boat TOO much.
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Jan 17, 2018 02:51
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priznat posted:For me where the film goes off the rails is the big battle on Arrakis at the end where the emporer and his generals are watching it on some weird motorbike seat viewer thing, and weird poo poo like Alia waving knives around like a crazy person in slo-mo. Otherwise I dig the film a lot. I know that it was the best they could reasonable do but it's a huge letdown for the triumphant entry of Atreides forces through the shield wall to be tight shots of Patrick Stewart and Kyle MacLachan on top of a brown rug that moves up and down going "HAH! HAH! HAH!"
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Jan 18, 2018 08:52
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Improbable Lobster posted:The Weirding Way is basically DBZ teleport fighting If you think of it, Paul is basically Goku. First to get a special power that proliferates among other main characters, teleport fighting, not a great dad...
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Jan 26, 2018 02:28
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Ugly In The Morning posted:I was just thinking about how badly the prequel books hosed up even the concept of the butlerian jihad. I had always read it as humanity overthrowing the stagnation that robot servants had created. Then Herbert’s idiot son decides that nah, that doesn’t have enough shooting and terminators. Ugh. Kevin J Anderson never saw a thing that he couldn't poorly imitate. That Brian Herbert chose him of all people to work with really shows you what level his writing is.
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Apr 14, 2018 01:49
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turn left hillary!! noo posted:Really though? I think the shooting and terminators are a depressingly much more realistic vision of what's to come. As opposed to having every part of your life plotted and predicted by incomprehensibly advanced predictive algorithms?
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Apr 14, 2018 03:36
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turn left hillary!! noo posted:What does your heart tell you, when looking at the entirety of human history. You don't follow the news then, I take it. Besides all that, Kevin J. Anderson wrote it in the most predictable and uncreative way, it's like hearing a ten-year-old tell you about his original character who isn't just Master Chief.
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Apr 14, 2018 04:28
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turn left hillary!! noo posted:I haven't read the proper Dune books in a while but I also think the stultifying omniscient AI you're talking about is kind of reading current trends back into the scanty details hinted at in Frank's books, but I'm willing to be proven wrong on that point. From God-Emperor: quote:"The target of the Jihad was a machine-attitude as much as the machines," Leto said. "Humans had set those machines to usurp our sense of beauty, our necessary selfdom out of which we make living judgments." Especially coming from Leto, whose Golden Path was largely about destroying the power of prescience and its hold over humanity, I don't think he was intending to present machines as killer robots who enslave humans just like in the movies Kevin J Anderson stole his ideas from. Reducing the question of the conflict down to "machines tried to kill humans so we dont have machines" loses any sort of interesting questions or nuance raised by the Jihad and makes it a simple matter of winning an existential conflict and then destroying the aggressor.
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Apr 14, 2018 05:12
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Doc Hawkins posted:This part is strongly implied in Chapterhouse, isn't it? Someone gets a sense of the future that Leto was trying to make humanity capable of escaping, and it's definitely robots (or at least robotic and materialistic culture) seeking and destroying them. It's implied that the Honored Matres were chased back into the Old Empire by some kind of super advanced outside force. It's Brian Herbert and KJA that decided it was Lord Cybertrex-8000 who was BACK FOR REVENGE.
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Apr 14, 2018 07:15
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BrutalistMcDonalds posted:Okay, it is trite, but I can kinda dig the radical pivot from the esoteric to DEATH ROBOTRONS hell yeah bitch let's rock David Lynch can get away with poo poo like that because he's a great filmmaker. You could give Kevin J. Anderson a point-by-point plot outline of the theoretical Most Perfect Novel Possible and he would fart out another literary abortion because he's a complete hack.
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Apr 14, 2018 09:54
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A_Bug_That_Thinks posted:Also, it's pretty clear in god emperor that arafel would have been caused by IX and not by old machines, dead and gone. Also making it arise from something besides Lord Killbot coming back for revenge makes it a cyclical result of Machine Thinking and Machine Culture rather than just there being Bad Computor who wants to kill us. The more you unpack what KJA wrote the worse it gets.
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Apr 15, 2018 08:42
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He also didn't pick up that the Baron acted like a total hedonist perv goon to make people think he was dumb, because Kevin J Anderson assumes everyone is as stupid as him.
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Apr 15, 2018 09:17
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Mein Kampf Enthusiast posted:Stephen King has some good stuff but holy poo poo, Cell is probably the worst book I ever read. I don't blame you for not reading the Brian Herbert dune books
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Apr 19, 2018 21:54
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It would be like that Nicolas Cage movie Next
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Apr 20, 2018 23:21
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BrutalistMcDonalds posted:him and a few other people from what it looks like. the daughter from his first marriage and her family If there's anyone else in the world with authority over Dune and they aren't actively trying to get an injunction against Brian, they're just as guilty.
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Apr 21, 2018 06:31
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paul_soccer10 posted:Where were the atreides atomics Doesn't he use one to crack the shield wall when they storm Arrakeen?
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Apr 23, 2018 04:53
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Vavrek posted:What bothers me is it leaving the realm of fan fiction critiques. It was, I believe, originally referring to someone introducing a new character who was flawless and wonderful and everyone liked them, to some established property. From that definition, it can't be applied to any of the characters that are actually in the primary work. When you have writers working on settings that aren't their own, though, it's a very appropriate term. Kevin J. Anderson got paid to write Mary Sue Star Wars fan fiction about Kyp Durron, for instance.
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Apr 24, 2018 00:49
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Spice basically = caffeine, we're pretty much dependent on it for work to function like it does
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Apr 25, 2018 06:23
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Murray Mantoinette posted:One of the main lessons of the entire Dune series was the importance of change, adaptation, forward thinking, creativity. For his son to employ a Star Wars author, an author in the scifi field requiring or permitting the least amount of creativity or novelty, is especially harsh. I don’t care that his son wrote prequels, I don’t even care that he wrote them badly. Some of Frank’s other non-Dune novels were pretty bad but were still interesting and creative. I think I and most of the rest of us care because he wrote them boringly, fixating of little details in the Dune books and expanding them to ridiculous proportions of importance while neglecting the overall whole. Anderson isn't even creative by the standards of Star Wars novelists. Let that poo poo sink in.
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May 1, 2018 09:02
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It seems like the Houses also rely on professional armies instead of conscripts, so presumably open fighting also spills over into disturbing the commoners and that's also Not Done unless you're a real dick. The whole "everyone in their place" thing, ya know.
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May 2, 2018 02:11
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I'm afraid of what HBO would do to Dune after how Game of Thrones went off the rails
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May 4, 2018 05:53
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moller posted:"Thou shalt not make a machine in the likeness of a human mind," like all Catholic commandments, is open to a lot of interpretation by different actors with different motivations. Herbert left it ambiguous because he wasn't worried about a single specific thing but rather than entire pattern of though. Like Leto says in God-Emperor, it's not machines but "machine thinking" and "machine culture." Prescience is another reflection of how Herbert saw "machine thinking" taking over everything. Because Brian Herbert has the brain of a ten-year-old, we have to deal with the prequel novels.
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May 6, 2018 22:31
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Cymeks. You couldn't make up something that dumb as a parody.
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May 7, 2018 20:35
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ToxicSlurpee posted:It's in the first book like a few dozen pages in. Leto is all like "oh bee tee dubz, Hawat noticed you have the potential and has been training you all along." It happens before they even leave Caladan. Yeah, Leto says "At first you can train a mentat just through behavior but eventually you have to tell them you're doing it, so surprise."
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May 11, 2018 02:56
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phasmid posted:Really we're already in the Duniverse but our backwater planet is so insignificant that we don't get any of the cool stuff and the Guild only drops people off here once every 400 years. Nah, there's way too many civilian casualties for this to be Dune
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May 12, 2018 02:41
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I don't know how fast 6 centimeters a second is in normal person measurements of velocity (how slow you have to go to get through a shield) but I think it's probably less than a dune buggy moves.
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May 13, 2018 10:08
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Remember when people were like "man Dune got really bad in those last Herbert books" And then Brian came along
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Jun 7, 2018 21:28
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etalian posted:Baron Harkonnen did nothing wrong, Leto Atreides was just trying to be a tall poppy and disrupting the balance of power. He let himself get so fat he needed the future version of a scooty puff to get around. He clearly did at least one thing wrong.
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Jul 8, 2018 02:41
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basic hitler posted:I think children of dune is mostly great but Jessica going from smart to hideously retarded is a travesty and the tigers are the dumbest plot point in all 5 books. I bet the tigers are the only part of the original books Brian Herbert liked
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Jul 8, 2018 02:59
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