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G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

The Titanic posted:

1: Those missions we told you about? Lying.

What about the women they told us about, Titanic?! I was told there would be WOMEN IN THIS VERSE!!

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G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

The Titanic posted:

Women, or should I say females!? In the space game of killing and pirates!? Pshaw!

They’d just slow everything down with stupid boob armor space suits and stupid high heels and aprons.

Everybody knows all girls get a Str -1 by default. :colbert:

“But we gentles shall protect the fairer sex from ruffians,, m’lady, would that we could but find some fairer sex in the Verse!!”

It’s such a joke, even by CIG’s pathetic standards...

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

Spiderdrake posted:

Maybe it's a sign the 'verse is ultimately merciful, that we're not subjected to whatever they'd dream up.

That is a possibility.

quote:

Or maybe they keep messing up on the "nipple jets on a female model" problem.

That would have thermonuclear meme potential. But yeah I do wonder if they keep kicking the can for fear of how their player base might create objectionable in-game footage. Some of the stuff Captain Richard’s done for LOLs with all male player characters in his party has been amusing to watch. But it would take on a far different tenor if there were a female model in the mix...

:iiam:

Whatever the reason, I’m ultimately excited because it’s clear that Chris is taking the time to get this right. And I don’t know about you cats, but when I saw the way this Star Marina was walking on ATV earlier this year, I knew her hips were in good hands.



”HipSway is in. Let the games begin.”

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

EightAce posted:

there will be a Pusher thing though. Ive seen it.......................

Can The Curse really be broken after all this time, EightAce? I know Foundry has some magic Germans on the payroll but we’re talking seriously dark mojo at work here considering all the projects she seems to have either tanked or been cut from.

“The Doll” - Crowdfunded web series, with Sandi Gardiner putting in an extremely delicate and nuanced performance as Sunny Maaraw. STATUS: Abandoned?

“The Eighth House” - Independent feature starring Sandi as Mathilda, a psychic prone to exaggerated reactions of diabolical evil. STATUS: Foreclosed.

“American Satan” - Independent feature with Sandi as the conservative religious mother of a boy who joins a band that rocks for The Devil. STATUS: Role exorcised from final cut, allowing the film to see theatrical release (which Chris & Sandi apparently despite her excision.)

And that’s just scratching the surface. We still don’t even know what part called for the constant tattoos, unless she got that feral viper gig she was talking about on RTV years ago. It too perhaps was shot then cursed then binned...

I guess The Curse occasionally faltered, like when she got a word in as a focus group member on Hulu’s “The Mentor”. But for the most part, everything she appears in gets blackholed or removes her so it can escape The Curse.

Will Squadron somehow break this dark magic that prevents her and Chris’s entire “let’s move HQ to Hollywood and backdoor our way into the industry we both really prefer to making stupid game?” Those Germans better bring some Istari-level wizardry to the occasion or I fear they shall not break the spell...

(But I hope hope hope they do!)




Pure gold!

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

Virtual Captain posted:

"The best part? It's coming in 2017" made me lol. I'm glad SC ages all the commentary like fine wines.

drat these need to come back...

Did you know that Cloud Imperium Games is dedicated to bring Girl Power back to gaming, Virtual Captain? Whether by demonstrating equitable hiring practices or by accurately, lovingly modeling the female form — both assets and animations like Hip Sway (rowr!)— CIG is studio at the forefront of a revolution of fairer treatment of the fairer gender!

G0RF fucked around with this message at 15:55 on Nov 28, 2017

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.
The Mancunion: “Is Star Citizen the biggest game ever?”

quote:

When I first heard the name Star Citizen, I quite foolishly assumed that this was yet another space-bound MMO, like EVE: Online or Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic. I have never been so astronomically wrong. This game isn’t just massive — it’s positively gargantuan, and it’s not even finished yet…

For those of you completely out in the vacuum of space, Star Citizen is an ongoing PC project headed up by Chris Roberts, the man behind Wing Commander series: a 90s space-flight simulator with dog-fighting gameplay. Nearly 20 years later, Roberts embarked on the pioneering mission that is Star Citizen, with a nigh-on impossible objective: “I don’t want to build a game. I want to build a universe.”

The premise of the game is two-fold: on the one hand there is the single-player campaign, entitled Squadron 42, which will consist of both flight-simulation mechanics as well as a boots on the ground, first/third-person shooter experience. On the other hand, the star of the show is what is being dubbed the “Persistent Universe”; this is comprised not only of the massive multiplayer format but upon completion is designed to be the biggest game map ever.

Not only do the current builds feature several planets for the player to visit, all of which are designed to match a true planetary scale—we’re talking vast expanses, towns and cities, all with fleshed out interiors — but the ultimate goal is to create a virtual solar system for players to disappear into for weeks on end.

The sheer gravity of this project is mind-blowing and the approach itself is worthy of note too. This game’s production is very much like the construction of a spacecraft itself, in that it is being described as “modular”, meaning that sections and versions of the game can be purchased as and when available.

Roberts Space Industries is the umbrella that envelopes both Cloud Imperium Games — situated in Manchester of all places — and Foundry 42 (Frankfurt). It is this team of developers that are making video game history and they’re taking you along for the ride.

I’m sure you’ve heard of Kickstarter and other crowd-funding sites. They are platforms for creative people to finance their projects through funds generated by the fans and for the fans. Star Citizen has taken this to the next level.

Whilst most top off their own money with that made through crowd-sourcing, Roberts’ vision for Star Citizen was to develop a game entirely from the donations made by fans and respected peers within the industry who understood what this game was all about. The fans.

As of 2011 (the official start date for production), the project has been 100 per cent crowd-funded. The team initially expected to raise around $4 million. This has become merely a drop in the pond, with the current estimation of total funds raised clocking in at a stellar $150 million – give a take a million or so…

So, what does $150 million in funds get you then? Well, nothing finished as of yet; in fact, as of right now there is no official release date. This has become a bit of a running joke amongst the gaming community but has also lead to a great deal of backlash amongst those who donated their hard-earned cash for a game that was supposed to be here three years ago.

In truth, it has come to the point that there is little use for a release date, as the original projection was 2014 and it is still no clearer when the game will be actually finished. Though there are rumours that the target is now late 2018, the issue is that so much money has now been pumped into the game that the community, as well as Roberts himself, feel that there is the capability to push this further: “If I can build a bigger and more robust experience, I will.” (NY Times).

It is not just that this game promises to be the biggest game ever, as we’ve been done dirty by that phrase before (No Man’s Sky), but more so that the level of time and effort being put into the project is backing that statement up. Furthermore, this game is huge in significance purely because of the showcase it has given for crowd-sourcing, with the scrutiny being part and parcel of it too – it almost has to the biggest game ever now.

:bang::sandance:

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

This is :five: star material if anybody missed them the first time around.

quote:

in a dusty old thread on the forums they watched
the collapse of the faithful on reddit
and as denial began, they stood tall to a man
or at least five in the case of ben lesnick

the legend lives on from the forums on down
of the game dev who made wing commander
chris roberts they say always could find a way
to turn failure to more propaganda

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

Tijuana Bibliophile posted:

what's going on with star citizen my man? i sorta checked out around citcon

Your absence is the thread’s loss, TB.

Post CitizenCon has been a bit of a lull, but here’s a highlight reel (I’m not current on the thread so apologies if this is repeats.)

1) YouTube Streamer “FailureToReport”, who had transitioned gradually over the last many months intonte Skeptic camp, finally crossed the Rubicon, went full Heretic, got an SA account, had fisticuffs with the Internet’s most inexhaustible slapfighter, and then dropped a pro-tier level work of firebombing Citizen trollery on his YouTube channel.

2) Longtime SC Trades mod (and presumably a disinterested facilitator of transactions) Jester ended up creating a conspicuous evidence trail suggesting he had an alt with which he bought ships.

3) /DerekSmart subreddit was turned to read-only mode prior to 3.0’s launch. Victory was declared by all parties across the spectrum and now the past denizens (including that hot British model, BooHuxley, who just loves her some space sims because OF COURSE HOT MODELS WOULD!) are seeking refuge elsewhere and bringing their compulsive, never-ending dialogue about the absolutely irrelevant “never was” that must nevertheless always always always be invoked, discussed, dissected, insulted, countered, mocked due to the extent of his irrelevance.

4) MOMA is mostly chill and remains a welcome voice of contrast.

5) CIG is getting into the virtual real estate business and everyone is delighted about it.

6) The thread has some welcome new participants with unique insights and contributions.

6) Dreams are happening. Always.

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

kw0134 posted:

"I'm not selling you land, I'm giving you a deed that has your name on it and a place to write in a description for a piece of terrain!" This is literally the argument they're making haha holy poo poo this is so idiotic. When I gave a guy a whole pile of money, it wasn't to buy a house, it was to get him to sign a piece of paper, that's all!

It’s worse than that though. Much worse. I’m not the first to point it out but let’s give it the full attention it deserves.

Listen to this. Chris Roberts is unironically laying out the textbook case for a Protection Racket.

quote:

A protection racket is a scheme whereby a group provides protection to businesses or other groups through violence outside the sanction of the law. Through the credible threat of violence, the racketeers deter people from swindling, robbing, injuring, sabotaging or otherwise harming their clients.

Now, listen to Chris Roberts pitch:

quote:

“So you could go to a world outside UEE space. You don’t have to have a claim or do anything. You could build a base or hang out there or whatever, you know... Mine resources there but it is completely the Wild West so some other player could just come in and try to take it from you forcibly. You’ve built a base, you log off so it could get attacked, so you’d have to worry about defending it all the time.

But if you went and had an actually “official” Planetary Development Bureau recognized claim, so you went to a place, you placed your what we’re calling a Land Beacon here and you’ve placed it on this plot of land. And then you go and file it with the Bureau. And they recognize your land claim, it’s filed in the UEE records and then now in UEE space — you’re basically protected by them. Someone attacks your base or tries to take it from you, essentially they’ll become an outlaw or criminal or wanted. So you have the protection of the UEE when it has the Land Claim mechanic.

Chris Roberts knows exactly what he’s doing and what audience he’s targeting. This one is aiming right at the insecurities of his most invested backers, the ones with the most ships and the frailest egos, the ones with the most to lose. This is e-peen insurance sold to you by E-Peen Industries. Roberts wants them to fear the risks — he outlines them and frames the hopelessness of protecting what’s yours without his help.

All but stated is the clear message, “You’ll have to sleep sometime. You’ll never be able to keep it safe around the clock. Someone could come and steal it, destroy it, and what could you do to stop them? You can’t really, not alone anyway. But don’t worry because you don’t have to. We’ve got the solution already planned, your own private security force is only a moment away. Buy the claim, place the beacon, and we’ll be there when you need us to protect all you hold dear. Otherwise, well... it’s the Wild West out there and well, it’s really only a matter of time before you lose it all.”

It is absolutely an in-game protection racket, sold by the party who controls all the rules of the Verse. They could define them any way they wanted but they chose a model that makes you vulnerable then monetizes the insecurity caused by the vulnerability they enabled.

”It’s nice to have a family. A man should tJe care, seetgat nothing happens to ‘em.”

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

Virtual Captain posted:

Closest I could find: It is a soundbyte somewhere around 30 mins into an interview.


:cheers:

SomethingJones has the full transcript of that gold mine of an interview.

The Business Class ticket story is relayed by Sandi below.

quote:

Sunny:
Given the unorthodox financial structure of your company, how does that kind of structure affect a marketing strategy?

Sandi:
Uhm… well… it’s INTERESTING in terms of… I’m always very mindful of the community… uhm… *tch*… I… for exa… for example I flew to Manchester, I got this cheap, SUPER CHEAP TICKET to Manchester, and Chris was like ‘why didn’t you fly BUSINESS’ and I was like, well, I don’t know, I saw this $900 ticket and I thought well, I’ll just fly economy, um, because I don’t want the FANS thinking… and he’s like ‘well FANS don’t even KNOW, you guys you gotta like be COMFORTABLE’, I said yeah but, you know, I think um, *tch*…

Elsewhere, I think maybe in a Batgirl interview, she talks about buying different ticket types when arranging their travel to Gamescom. Chris gets Business Class and our Lady of Limited Edition Porsche flies coach with the rest of the rabble. Or so she implies anyway.

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

Oh what a contrast in framing.

Euogamer’s subheading takes the piss:

quote:

Star Citizen is selling virtual plots of land for up to £96 a pop
As part of a mechanic that is not yet available in a game that's not yet out.

While Polygon’s carries the water:

quote:

Star Citizen is now selling plots of virtual land
Plots will also be available with currency earned in-game

I hope whatever you’re getting back is worth it, Charlie. Worth hitching your wagon to this, the biggest stinking manure pile in the history of the industry you presumably love. The stink you’ve lost the scent of isn’t going to wash out easily, so make the most of the time left and start working on that mea culpa now.

When the wheels come off and the wailing and gnashing begin, there will be some in your industry like Benson and McDonald who did the thankless work of journalists and shared their troubled findings despite the rage it induced and the clamor it raised. Some who can say “We sounded the warnings. Few listened but we tried.”

Too bad you didn’t chose to be one of them. Too bad you were more interested in being a lap dog than guard dog. The world could’ve used more voices with big pulpits raising the alarm but you couldn’t be bothered and you preferred singing the pretty lie in a major key than chanting the ugly truth in a minor one.

G0RF fucked around with this message at 17:05 on Nov 29, 2017

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

The guy is just spreading F.U.D. He is dismissed.

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

Toops posted:

Holy poo poo Kotaku, shots fired! Proud of those boys/girls.

I know we all have our private too 10 lists of greatest thread moments but I will forever take enormous quiet pride in the knowledge the we Goons, we lowly losers with our obsessive fixation on this godforsaken project helped in our own not trivial way to get the ball rolling that lead to the huge Kotaku U.K. series that remains the single most intensive outside look at the project in distress. It didn’t produce the laughs of so many other great thread moments but it fired a shot across the bow of CIG in a big way, and they forced Chris Roberts, armed with too many quotes from too many sources, to finally acknowledge the truth about Star Marine.

That one tiny victory didn’t mean much in the grand scheme but I will cherish t nonetheless, simply savoring the satisfactions all but demanded by Chris Roberts’ completely inexcusable mismanagement of that project and his toddler-like tantrums and the voices calling for him to account for the whole thing. Since the whole affair proved a microcosm of CIG’s macro problems with scope creep, project mismanagement, and the hype and deceit cycles of their marketing department, the entire affair outlined by Kotaku U’K.’s in-depth look will one day be seen for the omen it truly was. For our small part in helping to make that happen I will forever be thankful, regardless of how little good it did.

I feel the same way about the entire Streetroller saga, even though I was more skeptical of his motives at first and booted him from the discord server due to suspicions he was try to con us. But he wasn’t, he was a straight up guy, a fighter, the best kind of troll and smartass end he joined the ranks and landed a major blow that put CIG on the well deserved hot seat with the spotlight overhead.

Charlie Hall wanted to dox him for the sake of his precious “games journalism” (and the noble work of defending the morally upright gaming studio under unfair siege by evils goons) but alas, he got forced to do the right thing and leave him be. And Streetroller did his part, as Kotaku UK did, to sound alarms and remind backers of their own legal rights. And while that story too wasn’t the laughathon so many other thread moments were, it still lead to the gut busting Streetroller / Derek Smart / James Brand livestream event that IS in my top 10 funniest moments of the Goon War.

Sorry to be getting all nostalgic and wistful. But drat what an incredible story this whole bloody mess has been... what a privilege to watch it all unfold from the best seats in the house in the good company of funny, clever and mostly quite decent people.)

G0RF fucked around with this message at 17:34 on Nov 29, 2017

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

Hav posted:

The overall problem I have is that we got this far down the pike without a major expose because there's literal fear out there post the event that we do not speak of that was never about integrity in journalism, and the relatively small poles of cash that allow the outfits to pay their guys. More simply, we're heading towards a system of patronage that libertarians love until they realize that they're not the ones patronizing.

‘‘Twas ever so, I fear. At least in Games Journalism.

Games journos were hardly bolder a generation back. After all, the scuttlebutt in the gaming community was abuzz with stories about the chaos at Ion Storm and the games journalists of the day were very well aware of them. But the first blow landed against the dumpster fire that was Daikatana came from the local alternative press. These gaming stories that must be told but can’t be told tend to just become open secrets yet there are far fewer incentives to disrupt them than to ignore them, and incentives to amplify a trouble studio’s hype are not hard to find and easy to accept.

Still, the Kotaku UK piece hit more than hard enough, dug deeper than anyone else had, and gave a snapshot anyone with a cursory knowledge of studio culture, development best practices or project management would see for the five alarm fire it was and is. It wasn’t Kotaku UK’s job to land a killing blow, just paint a well-informed portrait of the company, it’s history, it’s struggles and customers. I personally appreciated so very much that they took the high road, avoided harsh editorializing and let the sound bites of developers, contractors l, ex-employees and Chris speak for themselves. And they get bonus points for buying the Level Magazine story about the long running feud between Derek and Chris. That too was great journalism and that Kotaku UK paid to run a translated version was a rare event and indeed a fortuitous or that very nearly didn’t happen.

I digress. I certainly share your pessimism about the state of things, Hav.!Maybe I just think they’ve been rotten for a lot longer.

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

Dark Off posted:

You should check discord sometimes you have lot of catching up to do.
Also we are missing those long effort posts you do.

I am going to! Both get back in to the discord soon and effort post (as schedules permit.)

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

Batgirl was endorsing subscriptions a year and a half ago and in a fashion that made me wonder if she’d heard chatter from an LA bestie about the possibility being tossed around.

This was overdue for a refinement pass.

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

Beet Wagon posted:

ITT we're citizens brigading reddit to upvote official propaganda. This is my FUD-FIGHTING MUSIC, what's yours?

The new Fremdschämen Steamroller Christmas Album kills FUD dead...

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

MedicineHut posted:

Yes, I also think so. What is holding the faithful is that "reasonable hope" that stems from the funding tracker. Everything else is going to the pits but the funding tracker is that one red hot beacon of light and hope that backers go back to to reassure themselves there is still hope.

As I wrote of Chris in my “You lie” blog:

quote:

Putting aside whatever their short term financial needs are, the success of the Anniversary Sale is therefore of paramount symbolic importance. A narrative of declining fortunes and waning public demand is widely-presumed and already much discussed. It hasn’t yet become the lede for their story, yet the presumptions are widespread that such a chapter is due to begin in their tale — too much do they now resemble past archetypical development hell DOAs.

Given CIG’s absolute control without oversight of their sales ticker and given Chris Roberts complete ethical bankruptcy, does anyone seriously believe he would sit idly by and let organic demand as reflected by an honest tracker dictate his entire future? If private manipulations can escape the scrutiny of their backers and the media, postpone his overdue public reckoning and preserve the confidence of his most critical financial supporters, does anyone really believe this pathological deceiver would not pursue them?

As with every word that spatters and spittles out of his mouth, I just find that very hard to believe. If ever there was a time to bend truth towards his warped intentions, it is now. His need to preserve his colossal ego and the massive self-deluding distortion field that protects it from unvarnished reality has never been greater and where there’s a will, there’s a way.

The tracker is his last chance after an inarguably lousy year to tell the tale anew, and I believe Chris Roberts would move Heaven and Earth to ensure that the tale it will tell is the very same one no less than Daztek himself often repeats.

The funding-tracker is no more a reliable measure of organic ongoing demand that Chris is trustworthy guide to the project state. Star Citizen is a tale told by an unreliable narrator who goes before crowds and stares into cameras and lies for the sheer thrill of it.

To trust the tracker as a reliable measure of organic, non-manipulated demand is to confuse Chris Roberts for an honest man. We don’t really know what the tracker measures nor how reliably it does so. What we can know is that, so long as it remains public, it will not be allowed to undermine a narrative of continued success told be a serial fabulist and frequent liar. It will not happen.

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

Loxbourne posted:

The problem with that chart is that G0RF wrote it before idiot cultists threw $6 million at CIG for land sales.

Forgive my all-over-the-place reply in advance...

1) This chart and earlier variants are joke charts with no real data feeding it. It’s earliest form was a more sincere attempt at showing what Market Saturation looked like, and was part of a larger post speculating about the possibility that splitting Squadron / Star Citizen could reveal that there was hardly any public appetite for Chris Roberts Dream Baby, Wing Commander: Infinite. I can only assume SQ42’s subsequent appearances on Milkboxes with a “Have You seen This Game?” headline above indicates CIG discovered post IP split the incredible news that people surprisingly prefer buying spaceships. The notorious franchise failure COD: Infinite Warfare sold 14 million copies since then and gave the gaming press a big takeaway “Gamers are getting tired of all this Future Shooter bull crap.” Not good news for Squadron.

Back to Sale Talk:

2) I seriousposted before the sale my earnest opinions about the year-end revenue picture CIG would give the public. The year was inarguably a disaster almost entirely spent turbo-floundering to get a Mini-Me version of 3.0 released, it was a foregone conclusion that appearances of a miraculous 11th turnaround was baked in to the cake.

quote:

“Putting aside whatever their short term financial needs are, the success of the Anniversary Sale is therefore of paramount symbolic importance. A narrative of declining fortunes and waning public demand is widely-presumed and already much discussed. It hasn’t yet become the lede for their story, yet the presumptions are widespread that such a chapter is due to begin in their tale — too much do they now resemble past archetypical development hell DOAs.

Given CIG’s absolute control without oversight of their sales ticker and given Chris Roberts complete ethical bankruptcy, does anyone seriously believe he would sit idly by and let organic demand as reflected by an honest tracker dictate his entire future? If private manipulations can escape the scrutiny of their backers and the media, postpone his overdue public reckoning and preserve the confidence of his most critical financial supporters, does anyone really believe this pathological deceiver would not pursue them?

As with every word that spatters and spittles out of his mouth, I just find that very hard to believe. If ever there was a time to bend truth towards his warped intentions, it is now. His need to preserve his colossal ego and the massive self-deluding distortion field that protects it from unvarnished reality has never been greater and where there’s a will, there’s a way.


The tracker is his last chance after an inarguably lousy year to tell the tale anew, and I believe Chris Roberts would move Heaven and Earth to ensure that the tale it will tell is the very same one no less than Daztek himself often repeats.

”Star Citizen is good.”

3) I don’t personally put much stock in forecasts that predict the near-term shocking apocalyptic end for CIG even if I think they make for funny memes. I appreciate their narrative and moral appeal and Chris Roberts is surely long overdue to be called before the Judgment Seat to account for words and deeds. The real judgment he needs fear is the reputational damage to the brand that is obvious everywhere. Two years ago, the Star Citizen was widely seen as an exciting super game that was going to rebuke Big Publishing and redefine gaming. The bloom is off the rose now, the project has the taint of vaporware, development hell, and scammery. Whatever the true demand is for Land Sales (cig’s vaporware protection racket scheme), they have reinforced the very worst accusations of Chris Roberts’ critics and given agnostics very compelling reasons to finally accept that Skeptic/Heretic/Hater/Troll claims about Star Citizen are indeed right.

Even Zealots acknowledge this, which shows just how obvious it is — some ascribing it to Goon FUD (not true guys), some ascribing it to Big Publisher conspiracies (“hey are terrified of Star Citizen and trying to destroy it by INSERT CONSPIRACY HERE”), and occasionally correctly placing the blame with Chris’s bad record of missing targets. And even the gaming press, hardly bold editorial warriors, have had a blast getting snarky and joining in Skeptical mockery. This is not a good development for CIG and once again speaks to their desperate need to recruit actual Marketing talent with Industry Experience that isn’t secretly spending weeks at a stretch off acting in crap roles that are destined for the cutting room floor... The brand damage is very real, very diffuse, widely repeated and difficult to resist and CIG is playing to the very worst characterizations of critics by continuing their rapacious fleecing of their core supporters with laughable, unethical, non-existent additions to their list of purchaseable goods.

Despite the jokey pseudo-empiricism of the chart, this is the real ‘truth’ of it. Land Claims are further indicators of the saturation of a market niche and fury of CIG’s psychological fracking efforts. And even as they extract some unknowable measure of additional whale wealth, they poison surrounding groundwaters and heighten the risks of low-level earthquakes down the road. Negative press, growing numbers of formerly agnostic gamers subscribing to “it’s a scam!”, “what a joke”, “vaporware”, “the next duke nukem”, “I hate to admit it but maybe that douchebag Derek Smart was right about this turkey” opinions and bad snarky headlines is what that poison looks like.

Frack on, Chris Roberts!

quote:

That's the depressing paradox of this bullshit. There is always more and it's always worse, and the thing there is always more of is Citizens' money. The thread's pretty demoralised just now and that's always when we eat our own.

I’m not. Star Citizen is good.

G0RF fucked around with this message at 17:52 on Dec 3, 2017

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

his nibs posted:

Look, there is no win

As long as this shambolic parody of game development lives and remains lead by a delusional, unethical, micromanaging asset pre-seller pretending to be the World’d Greatest Game Developer, most everybody wins. The only ones who don’t are the employees disallowed entry into Chris’s “friends and family” circle. They will suffer watching a pretender and his cronies profit wildly by squandering the opportunity of a lifetime and carry the memory of what it felt like to witness that tragedy up close and in real-time for the rest of their lives.

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.
YOUTUBE: Walking In Hyperspace Ships

As a Public Service and “3.0 experience” documentation exercise for those not playing, I’m including below this summary of a randomly selected new Dan Gheesling video. (I apologize for any link errors and the absence of graphics. I wrote it on my phone in stages as my schedule allowed. I may edit in gifs later.)

A prior installment of this sort for those interested can be found here.

That summary, written nearly two years ago, saw Batgirl engaging in a riveting “let’s go flip a switch on or off in a satellite array for AlphaUEC” Mission in 2.4. Heads were bonked, complications ensued, and a person actually capable of landing a plane in real life discovered that she could not, for all her experience, land a ship in the game she loves so painfully much...

But that was nearly two years ago, and it’s often said much has changed since then. That there is more and better content in 3.0 than in a AAA game like GTA5.

So with 3.0 around the corner and Cargo Missions finally adding wild variety to the “menial crap to do in the ‘Verse to earn meager game currency”, let’s check it out and get a measure of progress on the gameplay experience 21 months later.



SESSION 1 - QUANTUM JUMP BLUES

0:01 - Dan’s adventure begins, as all Star Citizen adventures must, with the “awake and escape from the bedroom” challenge. And lest you think getting out of a bed and opening a space door sounds hardly a risky affair, think again.

Yet while the challenge recently proved fatal for Batgirl, Dan proves equal to the task. He survives opening the door and is off in search of mega-thrills in Chris Roberts’s living, breathing universe of 3 moons, 1 planet, and a planetoid on loan from another star system as yet not in the game.

“Excited to get started here, we’ve hit a few of non-buttery patches of servers. But we’re going to give it the true experience here. We’re gonna battle through it.”

He then explains that he’s received so many requests to perform a Cargo mission that this will indeed be today’s goal.

0:19 - He races to the terminal to spawn his ship of choice — the Avenger — and then, like a shot, he races out to board it.

But it didn’t spawn, a fact he eventually realizes. IT’S ALPHA.

No matter, he’ll just spawn an Aurora and engage in the first of many fictive conversations with his viewers.

1:12 - ”Alright, lets take an Aurora DL.”
(imitating)
“Dan, you’re gonna take a bucket of bolts over the Avenger?”
(replying)
”Well we pulled out a little early and Albert gave us cream cheese when we asked for... some anchovy-filled olives. Alright nonetheless another of you guys said was ‘Hey Dan, you’re able to go buy the actual easy helmet.’”

With that he’s off to the store and seconds later standing before the helmet he’d like to buy.

1:49 - “I would like to purchase the helmet.”

Apparently the Voice Command feature is having a little trouble because despite repeated attempts to purchase the helmet, he can’t. So he instead heads off in search of adventure resigned to wearing his “Eddie Bauer helmet”. For now.

2:50 - He approaches his Aurora. Gets in. Spends a small eternity trying to get it started but eventually succeeds. 3 minutes since his bedroom escape, his adventure begins.

3:45 - Mobiglass Fu ensues, eventually leading him to accept his Cargo mission four minutes in to his session.

The objective: Retrieve mineral samples from Daymar.

Say goodbye to those boring “flip the switch on/off at the Comm Array” missions of old and hello to the thrilling “get in a spaceship, expend fuel and time, navigate the mobiglass interface, contend with quantum drive challenges and the vast in-game distances to pick up one box of minerals from a pile of junk on the dark side of a moon for a pittance in credits” missions. Now you’re playing with power — SuperPower.

6:10 - After several failed attempts to Quantum jump to Daymar, he decides to apply one of the most ancient of PC rituals to his Aurora. The full-power reboot.

He shuts it off. Then powers it back up. And IT WORKS!

6:52 - “Quantum drive is now OFF. Quantum drive is now ON. Quantum drive is now OFF. Quantum drive is now ON.” (Just tap the button, Dan. Stop holding it.)

7:08 - A dazzling Quantum Jump slideshow begins.

(imitating)
“Dan the frames don’t look very good.”
(replying)
“Don’t worry ‘bout the frames we’re going for the order delivery.”

7:40 - He discovers he’s still too far from the target for a quick approach and thus will have to micro-jump closer.

“Alright so let’s lock on to Orbital Marker 6 — get your dongers out, we’re going for it!”

9:08- “We’re fighting through the curds and whey to try to get to the butter server.”

A protracted interlude of interface difficulty and user error ensues. Eventually his boredom gives way to reflection and a revelatory utterance worthy of the truest of Star Citizens.

11:15 - “Alright so now we are de-coupled we should just literally... use our acquiescence, our momentum to move forward.”

(Acquiescence and momentum have gotten us this far, Dan, may they forever move us forward.)

Meanwhile, back in the Verse, Dan feels an urgent longing and decides it’s time to play with danger.

“While that’s going on... there’s a strong desire to get up and walk around, maybe lay down in the back.”
(imitating)
“Dan are you kidding me?”

He explains that no, he’s not really kidding,“We’ve got a long way to go and what else are you gonna do?”
(imitating)
“But Dan if you get up, there’s a strong chance you may never sit down again.”
(replying)
”I guess that’s a chance we have to take.”

12:03 - Dan leaves the pilot’s seat, eager to embark on a walkabout around his Aurora, a ship which has approximately two meters of walkable floor.

After a brief session of ultra-fidelity crotch shots, his meditative Aurora stroll finds him harkening back to his tender years, as memories of his love of Legos resurface:

”As a kid, I would build Lego vehicles and ships. Not because I liked ships — I kinda did but moreso, I liked the ability to walk around inside of a moving vehicle — store things in there, hide things in there, pull up the panels underneath maybe hide some inadequate... No, do not... Maybe have a little hidden area there where you can hide contraband. But this is the dream. This is part of why I like Star Citizen.”

13:30 - Reinvigorated by his brisk toddle around the Aurora, he returns to the Pilot’s Seat.

“I know there’s problems, I know there’s bugs, I know it’s Alpha, I know it’s going to take awhile. But... with that being said... we can walk around a moving ship. Respect it.”

15:15 - “This is the very definition of ghost riding the whip...”
(imitating)
“But Dan, you’re not very stable here...”

ERROR: DISCONNECTION (CODE 30000)

”Noooo.”

Yes, he crashed. The past 15 minutes spent attempting to consummate an in-game UPS Driver Mission are lost and the Groundhog Day rebirth cycle begins anew. He awakens in his space bed for what surely is his 10000th time at this point and embarks upon the “Awake and escape from the bedroom” mission again.



SESSION #2 - BUTTER SHUFFLE

15:28 - ”Chris Roberts taketh away... but also giveth. And this, look at this, this is a brand new fresh 60 fps server.”
(imitating)
“But Dan, why did you leave the other footage on this episode out?”
(replying)
”This is why. So you can get a taste of the PTU. This is what it’s all about. You get some curds and whey and then you get the smooth butter.”

The do-over begins. Frame rates are up as are butter nonsequitors.

16:11 - “The more butter, LOOK at all these people! They’re gravitating towards the butter. Open this. We gotta go! LOOK at how good — this is... I’m not gassing you guys up this is 100% 60 fps... or pretty darn close to it.”
(imitating)
”Dan you said 100% - which is it?”
(replying)
”You tell me — you see the smoke? I got no words for it. This is why when you get the Butter Server you take full advantage of it... I’d like... Butter!”

He races through the hallways to get to his Avenger, but alas, are frames already slowing a bit on the Butter Server?

“See it’s startin’... People are startin’ to drop some curds and whey.”

17:06 - He’s reached the Avenger and boards it post haste as the threat of impending curds and whey looms large over the Butter Server.

(imitating)
“Dan, you said you were gonna do a Cargo mission.
(replying)
“I think the title of this episode just became ‘Butter and Curds and Whey.”

He quickly cycles through missions like a man on a mission to get missions while the getting is Butter and not Curds and Whey.


17:50


(imitating)
“Dan you should probably read that quicker a little bit slower.”
(replying)
“I would... but at the same time, we’re trying to get some Butter into Daymar. But when we get some stableness we’re going to soak all this in like a fine vintage.”

18:21 - The race to get some Butter to Daymar goes Quantum. But upon arrival in orbit, complications ensue. He’s lost his mission.

He navigates the Mobiglass in search of a Daymar-based Cargo mission because Butter, and fortunately, he finds one. A pickup mission at a stash house. He takes it. But sees no stash house added as quest marker.

19:22 - Panic threatens to set in, and Dan makes clear just how urgent the stakes are.

In a brute force gambit to overcome any disappearing objective risks, he accepts every mission and looks to see if that added a quest marker. No joy. Perhaps a jump to a nearby marker might solve the problem?

20:20 - “One can only hope. Let’s enjoy the Butter. Thank you guys so much for tuning in by the way! — So did they not give us the butter?”

Negatory, he sees no quest markers added after accepting all missions and jumping to a nearby orbital marker. Like you said before, Dan — Chris Roberts giveth and Chris Roberts taketh away.

Daymar is out and Yela is in, at least as a waypoint en route to Cellin.

21:42 - After nearly 22 minutes of not being able to engage in his Cargo quest mission, maybe this time is different. He begins the routine futz-with-interfaces ritual to attempt to set his new destination.

23:00 - A minute and a half later, he jumps to Yela — and upon completion, he muses aloud that it would be interesting to poll his viewers for a confidence check in his ability to complete the mission, or at least pick up the stash.

I believe in you, Dan — I gotta believe!

Now in orbit around Yela, he can begin the next leg of the world’s most circuitous “get in get stuff get out” plan. It’s time to visit his third planetary body, Cellin.

23:43 - The Jump to Cellin about to begin, Dan contrasts the incredible experience he’s currently been enjoying with Elite Dangerous, and it’s pretty clear which side of the bread his Butter is coming from.

”Zing!”

(Yeah I hate having to measure the barometric pressure in Elite before traveling, too, Dan.)

24:00 - He’s here — at Cellin! And better still, the quest marker is right before him.

Finally, FINALLY, the quest is within arm’s reach, he’ll be there in no time! So what does Dan decide to do?

(imitating)
“Dan, are you going to walk around in the ship?”
(replying)
”That’s debatable.”

But after a few moments pass, he makes his choice. He will PLAY WITH DANGER again because Legos, Butter, etc.

24:40 - He gets out of his Pilot Seat...

And it seems for a moment there might’ve been a problem, but no, everything’s fine. The terrifying mortal danger he was playing with by exiting a chair has past.

Dan breaths a sigh of relief, “Ah, okay, nice. I was a LITTLE BIT concerned there...”

THEN HE DIES.

“Ahhh. Noooo.”



25:10 - SESSION #3 - DAYMAR ELEGY

25:10 - “I cant believe that happened. No.”

“Desperate times call for desperate measures. We’re back in the exact same locale, exact same server, exact same mission.”

25:30 - Now in the Drake Herald, he sees his abandoned Avenger and wonders if it will beat him to the planet.

25:40 - “We should be able to beat it. We’re coming in hot, we should blow past it, it may crater. I don’t know if we’re going to be able to save our ship but nonetheless, I’m going to get up and walk around.”

He moves to do it.

”I’m just joking. I learned my lesson.”

:lol::lol::lol:

He continues his descent with blistering speed.

(imitating)
“Dan, do you think you should pull up yet?”
(replying)
”I think we’ve still got some time. There’s our Avenger let’s give it a nice little cruise by, shall we?”

Then it hits him, ”Oh we’re still going down Dan because you’re decoupled. Uh-oh! Pull-up!”

BOINK!

27:07 - “Oooaaahhhh!”

Dan’s ship spins wildly and you’d be forgiven for thinking all hope was lost, but no, he manages to stabilize it. He sets his sights on the quest objective and muses to self that he can’t believe he survived what should’ve been a fatal mistake. Given his past experience, maybe not leaving his pilot’s seat had something to do with that.

The pick-up point is now in sight. Consummation of the objective twice denied him is finally near.

27:55 - ”There’s our product! It’s just out there!”

28:07 - ”IT’S JUST OUT THERE!”
(imitating)
”Dan this is what you should be doing instead of dinkin’ around!”

28:17 - Dan pulls off an ”I can’t believe it’s not butter!” smooth landing that even he seems impressed with.

”Let’s go ahead and set her down- I didn’t know it was gonna be like this! Just dropped, like an airdrop!”

Dan decides to keep the engines on. And why not? He’s got line-of-sight on the package from here. Considering that he’s still got to deliver the thing that’s cost him two ships, two lives, and probably two hours of true gameplay time, he might as well grab-and-go.

30:25 - Having loaded his grabby hands with his “Walter White Stash”, he’s ready for the next leg of this rip-roaring, page turner of an adventure to begin.

Briefly, a dark thought cross his mind and lips. The butter-smooth landing of his Herald was actually more awkward than he realized before exiting the vehicle. He considers the possibility that he might not be able to get back in his vehicle. But hope springs eternal and he’s not afraid to show it.

“We got a shot at it. You think we don’t but YOU HAVE TO BELIEVE!”

(Hell ya Dan, you’re right about that — you gotta believe!)

30:42 - Paranoid about possible unseen threats in on the dark side of the moon near Box Retrieval HQ, he draws his weapon, inadvertently dropping the mission objective in the darkness.

30:59 - Confirming the box is no longer in his grabby hands, a horrified utterance escapes:“We dropped the box - no!”

31:38 - All hope seems lost, but wait... What’s that? Could it be? Saints be praised HE FINDS THE BOX and the adventure of a lifetime begins anew! You GOTTA BELIEVE, indeed!

32:05 - Oh wait, he can’t get the cargo in his ship. He really did park it wrong and the inordinate and only partially documented efforts at attempting to complete his first Cargo game loop, that of a riveting interstellar FED EX mission, ends in a heartbreaking realization:

32:10 - “I think this is probably... we’re stuck in a, in a spot. I hope that someone can come to Cellan and piece together what happened here. Thank you guys so much for watching!”



Postscript:

His YouTube description of this exercise in funkilling grinding through fatal bugs, poor choices and adventure-free missions?

“Star Citizen 3.0 Gameplay at it's finest!”

G0RF fucked around with this message at 06:21 on Dec 5, 2017

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

Combat Theory posted:

Just as I wanted to go to sleep :argh:

Thanks G0RF. Hell of a post

Ha! No need to thank me, Combat Theory! I started watching that video back when the view count was below 1000 and while I found it boring and annoying it first, over time Gheesling’s demeanor just won me over with its goofy commitment. So I really felt like it deserved a write-up — partly as examination of the Cargo Mechanic, but also just because the sound bites are so kooky and setbacks so hilarious.

So writing it up was its own reward — I laughed and laughed throughout. I only wish I had had the time to drop screencaps in and gifs. But when I get a good couple hours at my machine I will revise. It mostly certainly deserves it.

Dogeh posted:

You're wasted here G0rf.

No way - it’s a privilege being a contributor here.

quote:

Ever thought about writing scripts for Squadron 42?
Alas, if the CIG Intern assigned to the thread is doing their job, I suspect at this point Chris is not an especially big fan of my work... besides, I think Squadron is in good hands. From what I hear it’s going to kick other games in the rear end!

G0RF fucked around with this message at 06:15 on Dec 5, 2017

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

no_recall posted:

Lol, it's absolutely unbelievable that people are celebrating this mess of a game.

You’re only saying that because you haven’t had the Butter.

quote:

Hell of a write-up tho G0RF

It is the tale not he who tells it. Dan is the man!

Seriously — don’t just read this part, click the link and tell me you aren’t cracking up at his rhapsodic Butter interjections. I was tearing up by the third time I replayed it during transcription.

“I’d like — BUTTER!”

quote:

16:11 - “The more butter, LOOK at all these people! They’re gravitating towards the butter. Open this. We gotta go! LOOK at how good — this is... I’m not gassing you guys up this is 100% 60 fps... or pretty darn close to it.”
(imitating)
”Dan you said 100% - which is it?”
(replying)
”You tell me — you see the smoke? I got no words for it. This is why when you get the Butter Server you take full advantage of it... I’d like... Butter!”

G0RF fucked around with this message at 06:27 on Dec 5, 2017

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

Rad Russian posted:

Why is he using powerpoint for this? Is there an actual gameplay video?

What you’re seeing is the Curds and Whey. He didn’t manage to find his way to the Smooth Butter. This is why, when you get the Butter Server, you take full advantage of it.

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

thatguy posted:

There must be fifty ways to slay your spaceman.

”Just get out of bed, Ted...
Clip out of your ship, Chip...
No need to have fun, son -
Just listen to me.”

G0RF fucked around with this message at 18:11 on Dec 6, 2017

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.
UBISOFT: Beyond Good & Evil 2 - Livestream - December 7th, 6pm CET

quote:



Join us for our first SMP Report live stream!

Come find out what the dev team and Space Monkeys have been up to…

7 December 2017
6 pm (CET)

PARTICIPATE. INSPIRE. PLAY.

Take part in building the world of BGE2!

For those of you who love big evil publishers and their soulless, conformist games that lack ambition and imagination in equal measure, this might be an interesting watch. The last one certainly was. I mean, if you like getting glimpses at the tech behind soulless, conformist games in development, that is. You sellouts...


no_recall posted:

Fuckin caught up with the thread.

Seems like "Holiday Sale" Ended on the Funding Tracker. So lets announce the winners!

[Winners are defined by the closest estimated guess]
Total Earnings in Holiday Sale: $7,848,797

THE TOP 3!
1. Sandweed 7.4
2. Sarsapariller 7.3
3. Tokamak 7.2

Congrats to the winners!

(And to Chris Roberts, too, for creating the appearance of enough sudden, organic demand to close the gap and squeeze the correction in before close of the year!)

Xaerael posted:

I just... don't even see how it's possible.

It’s easy!

G0RF fucked around with this message at 03:46 on Dec 7, 2017

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.
PODCAST: The Arcade Show

At 39:15 in, they begin discussion of CIG’s business practices... The segment, which follows on the heels of discussions of microtransactions and gambling, begins with the segue: “Speaking of predatory games... and naked greed...”

Comparisons to real-world (scam) sales of lunar plots are lobbed, then the discussion begins in earnest.

Quotes include:
  • “There is no game.”
  • “It’s less than No Man’s Sky.”
  • “I don’t think this game is ever coming out. This is just a funding scheme.”
  • “Get out while you can.”
  • “For those of you thinking about getting into this game? DON’T.”
  • “It’s a straight-up scam!”
  • “We’re beating a dead horse here, but it’s five years now.”
  • “When do the smart people who contributed to it start to get annoyed? When do they take legal action?”
  • “What happens when someone dials the help line? Do they just laugh at you? Hahaha!”
  • “There has to be money laundering going on.”

They invoke the specter of Chris escaping to an island and leaving the crashed ruin of his project behind him when the money runs out. Disbelief is expressed that demand continues despite the absence of progress. Sunk cost fallacies invoked. Images of CIG employees smoking cigars, burning wads of cash, and driving Ferraris to work bandied about. (Technically, they prefer weed and Porsches but close enough...) / Speculations about office decor reflecting the rarefied sensibilities of old money. (Uhh, no, just a mix of nouveau riche tackiness and space nerd kitsch...) And more of the like.



The discussion isn’t especially insightful but it’s interesting inasmuch as it captures the incredulity and skepticism that increasingly is becoming conventional wisdom for gamers outside the bubble.

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.


Sandi’s Twitter: “Filming for ATV this week!”

So excited! After seeing “The Doll” and “The Eighth House” fail to see release, then paying to see “American Satan” only to discover she got cut from the film, Goons finally have assurance that we’ll get to see that multitalented superstar in an actual performance!

:chelseaeyeroll:

Combat Theory posted:

I woke up after a short night and saw xaerael say he doesn't believe the funding is possible.

I typed up a long answer about me and the citizens I know and about how nobody bought anything or even knows somebody who bought anything

Then I see G0RFs post. And I delete the self doxxing wall of text and decide I'll just go and grind some coffee and listen to this podcast.

Thank you G0RF

My pleasure, man. I am not sure I’d even recommend the full listen since their knowledge of the project is that of lay outsiders. They’re far enough removed from the Skeptics / Heretics / Haters / Trolls vs Believers / Evangelists / Zealots / Shills battles to seem ignorant of the memes and shibboleths that so quickly surface in discussions. They didn’t even realize that some ships cost three or four figures — which shows very quickly that they’re only barely in the loop of the business model.

They instead just seem like average gamers giving a hot take based on the data widely believed —
  • 5 years
  • $160+ million
  • Land Sales
  • Ship Sales
  • Game still stuck in Alpha and lacking any depth

Yet even only knowing those things, they are drawing the very obvious conclusions most can and should — if you spend this much money for 5 years and only have a buggy Alpha to show for it, something is horribly wrong. Out of the mouth of babes, as they say.

And of course something is wrong, and even backers see this. They have had to embrace increasingly convoluted retcons and disingenuous comparables to convince others and themselves that ”Uh, everything’s under control — situation normal.” At this point, the case for the prosecution is obvious and common-sensical while the defense’s case requires heroic suspensions of disbelief and Orwellian efforts at revisionism to even swallow. It’s just too much at this point. Too much has been spent too long for too little. It’s either by design (which maximizes revenues) or by incompetence (which minimizes hope) or by both (which maximizes :lol::lol::lol:)

So that’s what makes segments like that podcast interesting to me — they’re a tiny sample set from the profane masses, but their conclusions are as Goonish as anything here. Malfeasance and mismanagement are simply too compelling an explanation given the data, and no amount of glib show-banter can make the case for maintaining faith in the enterprise a reasonable alternative.

(All that said, you gotta believe!)

G0RF fucked around with this message at 08:48 on Dec 7, 2017

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

Raskolnikov posted:

If there ever was a song that pgabs needs to use it's this one:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LIyibFd6WaA

THAT’S WHAT I’M TALKIN’ ABOUT!

(Although truth be told, this version seems closer to the CIG spirit.)

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

Morningwoodpecker posted:

Does anyone have a link for the James Brand podcast I only ever heard a short clip.

This is the Livestream:

YOUTUBE: SuperNerdLand.... Plays? Star Citizen — Part 2 : Featuring TheStreetRoller & Derek Smart

Part of what made it so funny to me was the slow burn of it all.

It was during a period of extreme goonfear. New goon Streetroller had come out of nowhere and delivered an unexpected critical blow with his refund counterattack. The gaming press then trained all their spotlights all on the subject, the general gaming public briefly cried out “WTF is this crap?”, and Zealots were lurking on SA and manning battlestations whenever Goons or Derek made a move.

1) Goon posts some new Star Citizen article in thread.
2) Other Goons make comments on article, a mix of seriousposts and shitposts.
3) Zealots (often from /DS) race to counter those comments and try to reframe debate narrative to “Derp Shart is a jealous hack (possibly under contract from Big Evil Publishers) watching Chris Roberts succeed as he never could and so in rage he doxxes Roberts kids and tells outrageous lies in hopes of destroying this incredible game that’s achieving the impossible daily. And all these negative comments are from Goons taking their orders from Derek who is their de facto leader now.”
4) Derek eventually joins the fray and the whole thing becomes a Warlord vs. Zealots slapfight producing hundreds of additional comment volleys.

So, against that backdrop...

I’d noticed an unfamiliar twitch stream that had an unusual number of viewers, so I posted the link in the thread. Several goons quickly jumped in to the chat on the stream, eventually including Streetroller, Major Tom / pgabz and many more. Derek hops into chat not long after — thereby making this now a full-on “Man your battlestations this is not a drill!” moment for the Zealotry.

Streetroller had only recently gotten his refund and was still doing a lot of interviews about it. Given all the bad press, the Goonfear, and the 24 hour a day /DS panic riot brigade, it was unsurprising to see Zealots quickly hopping on

Streetroller starts in livechat but he joins the voice chat around 69 minutes in. At first he’s a little disengaged from the dialogue, I think perhaps because his attentions were distracted by Discord chat with Goons.

But he starts to get more engaged with the hosts and dropping some devastating fact bombs. And the whole thing slowly and surely gets nuttier and nuttier. It’s so incremental that it’s easy not to even see it — the absolute absurdity of all of it. But at some point around here, as Streetroller is recounting TOS debates with MOMA (?) on SA, it just hit me “look at this LOOK AT THIS GAME why is anyone even pretending to defend this LOOK AT IT!” and I just exploded with laughter and I couldn’t stop. I was guffawing, half-choking with tears running down my face I was laughing so hard at the incongruity of it.

Anyway, Derek shows up in the voice stream for a good stretch, then checks out. James Brand eventually joins the dialogue a bit after Streetroller challenges him to join in.

This is his arrival, only a few minutes after Derek leaves. And it, too, delivers huge laughs, in part because of the juxtaposition between totally straight-faced debate going on and the game itself being played live on screen and completely and totally falling apart. It’s just so bonkers.

G0RF fucked around with this message at 18:09 on Dec 7, 2017

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

EightAce posted:

MoMa is not Toast.
Also lol at what the rest of the game development community thinks of Star Citizen as evidenced on CE etc

Also what happened to 'Throw MoMa from the train-wreck ' as a thread title

This was a :five: thread title and I hope eventually it gets its due. It would be a nice bookend to the glorious “Big MoMA’s House” phase of the thread — which was absolutely glorious.

You can’t say the thread doesn’t love you, MOMA. You da MVP with all the shoutouts you get.

Also, BG&E2 livestream underway. I was so busy writing up the SuperNerdLand thing I missed the kickoff. Have no clue if it’s cool and good or more and worse. I heard some crap about mixing animal DNA to create new creatures, which made it smack of a French-accented 10ftChairman episode. But here’s hoping.

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

Can the curse be broken? Finally?

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

Sarsapariller posted:

There is no character creator. There aren't even any female player models. Don't let them bullshit about how they're coming, either- it's apparent that every suit of armor in the game is designed for the male commando. There's not even space in the stores for female mannequins.



Liar! Female characters and suits are being fast tracked and when you see the Ba-Da-Da-Da-DUM of that hip sway in action you’re gonna :chanpop: ‘til you :gary: then stand up and :sandance: because it was worth the wait!

Wise Learned Man posted:

I always laugh when I see a video of CRobertz talking about "emergent gameplay." He seems to think that SC will be some kind of sandbox where the gameplay will just sort of organically arise, when in reality there's no sand and barely a box.

It’s actually shorthand for “oops we were so busy grinding out assets for cash for years we forgot to include mechanics and really we know crap all about MMO design anyway so it’s up to you take make your own fun — buy this face scanning camera and get out your cosplay and start making up entertainment with the meager tools you have.”

G0RF fucked around with this message at 22:33 on Dec 8, 2017

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

:five:!

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.
Gentlemen, Ladies, I am thrilled to report that a long ago dream, one once thought only a fantasy, is finally at hand. Oh sure, I was a skeptic once, I’ll be the first to admit it. But my friends with Cloud Imperium Games, a promise made is a promise kept.

Behold!

“10 for the Developers - May 16th, 2016” posted:


TheDeadlyKenny:
Does Star Citizen plan to have loose clothing physics? As in, if you had a trench coat or cape and you moved, would the clothing 'flutter' or 'flap' in both atmospheric environments and in space?

Fluttering, billowing, flapping and flowing fabrics are IN!

Say goodbye to Legacy Armor — that crap is tacky, clunky and just so cliched. Say hello to space capes, shawls, tunics, and other exotic wears to let you Get Your Flap On(tm) as you EVA boldly, elegantly, dare I say rakishly through the vacuum of space. Your enemies will know you, fear you and want to be you — for your menacing yet oh so stylish billow becomes you, even as you become death.

Come on, CIG. Now that you’ve cracked the billowing fabric nut, and you’ve got Face Over IP on the fast track, put them lady models with their Hip Sway in the game. You’d have all the requisite ingredients to put some Sassitude in the ‘Verse and drat, I am ready for someone to bring that back to gaming!

G0RF fucked around with this message at 04:05 on Dec 11, 2017

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

Virtual Captain posted:

* clicks stopwatch *
1 year, 7 months? Not your best lap Roberts, let's try another another pass at Mile's jacket. Focus on how far you've come, not how far you have to go and all that.

I am far too excited about the gaming sassibilities this could unlock to be cynical.



Speaking of silly things I truly can’t be cynical about, I have — to my complete shock — found that Dan Gheesling has become my favorite SC streamer. He butchers the language and is goofy in the absolute extreme, but at this point, his straight-faced ludicrousness about everything feels exactly right.

I mean, stuff like this just cracks me up.

”It’s been a dream of many... primarily myself... to just skim the surfaces and in a hostile attack light fighter that has the maneuverability, the minutiae, the wherewithal and everything else in between to fly in and out of craters.”

In his latest video, he goofs around flying close to the planet, eventually gets to a base, summons a Nox, is trying to ride it and clips into someone else’s ship where he discovers a dragonfly. Then he improvises a contest to see which spacebike will escape the craft first (or blow it up) if he turns them both on.

It’s just so absurd, he knows it, and it all comes across as the video equivalent of a shitepost. But it’s greatness and I actually look forward to each new installment now.

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

Enchanted Hat posted:

:laffo: the backers are falling over themselves to defend the terrible framerates, saying that the best-case 20-30 FPS is perfectly fine.

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

BeigeJacket posted:

They couldn't even do a 90 second trailer?

Even by CIGs standards that doesn't sound right. They crap these things out all the time when there's a ship sale.

Or do you mean they were aiming to have a playable version of S42 ready to go?


I apologize for a wall of words dropped in the thread flow. I’m behind on the thread and dove into an effort post promoted by the rumors + a longtime gnawing bit of Coutts loan revisionist theorycrafting.

Here’s a crazy :tinfoil: alternative on the latest Squadron 42 gossip... though I’d caution against placing too much hope or despair in provocative apocalyptic rumors or any crackpot theorycrafting about said rumors. I’m really on a limb and feel duty-bound to state that upfront before dropping a :tinfoil: wall of :words:. (Apologies also if I’m not the first to articulate this theory and am instead simply the one to write hundreds of words where only a dozen would’ve been needed.)

Disclaimers having been stated, first, let me harken back to a couple of posts written prior to and about the Valentine’s Day IP split:

G0RF posted:

Splitting the IP is going to finally give CIG a measure of the market viability of Squadron 42 as a standalone property.

If Chris isn't terrified about the possibilities, I think he should be.
That project is his Dream Baby, so near and dear to his director's heart and his gaming legacy. He's thrown everything he's got at it.

-- A buttload of recognizable, expensive Hollywood actors
-- Phonebook-sized bloody scripts
-- Craploads of motion capture for different studios (x4)
-- Tens of millions of dollars
-- Endless hyperbole like "If I was doing a AAA Wing Commander for EA, Squadron 42 is going to be that and then some."
-- His wife

Expectations are sky high thanks to CIG hype and Gaming Mag amplification of it. Yet they have precious little to show for Squadron 42-- conspicuously little-- beyond uncanny valley cornball tripe uttered by A List actors who surely assumed at the time they signed on that being in this game was a great career move. It might end up that they've lent their talents to an absolute mega-turkey that ends up solely redeemed by the embarrassment of riches it provides in animated gifs. (I know we're excited by that possibility- but I doubt Gary Oldman and Co will be.)

:gary: "PAAAARRP!"

---

What if - after the split - new backers just choose Star Citizen?The project they've heard so much about.

-- The one they can play with lots of friends. (theoretically)
-- The one with VR coming. (theoretically)
-- The one with procedural generation of planets. (theoretically)
-- The one with ship-to-ship combat between dozens of players (theoretically)that allows one party to storm the other and engage in satisfying FPS combat (theoretically) to secure the other party's ship and (theoretically) cargo?

I mean, I know Ben Lesnick is seeing his dream come true with this, but what if Chris learns that Ben and the Wing Commander diehards really are just an endangered species? I mean, if you spend hours with Ben a week, and all he does is prattle on-and-on about Wing Commander, it just might create false impressions about the worldwide demand for said game? What if most everyone who actually wants a spiritual successor to Wing Commander (nerds!) already backed Star Citizen to get it?

Does anyone else think this is a real possibility?


G0RF posted:

SO... Who is going to want to actually buy Squadron 42?

It would be really surprising if CIG hasnt already sewn-up every nerd alive who grew up loving (and still loves) Wing Commander games by now. They need young buyers now, those who have no memory of the game-- yet the cast itself features a lot of older people (Oldman, Hamill, Anderson, John Rhys, etc.) It's just hard for me to see what hooks they have for the under 35 gamers who haven't already bought it.

Speculating further, I will guess the lackluster sales conversion for SQ42 post-split is quickly made into an internal crisis that demands immediate attention.


This doesn't mean a financial crisis. If they flog ship sales for SC non-stop and keep shortchanging older backers in order to attract newer spacepixel porn nerds they can probably manage a small monthly burn on overhead, even if it means disenfranchising the megawhales in the process. (They allegedly have more cash on hand than the oft-rumored pittance.)

The crisis CIG will be concerned about, really concerned about, is a Chris Roberts Prestige crisis.

The split will be CIG's first clear measure of market interest in SQ42. If there is little to none, and Star Citizen continues to get the lionshare of new revenue, Chris will start to panic.
He will then crank even more ultra-fidelity uncanny valley 'in engine' videos out from his celebrity-packed Dreambaby / Triumphant Return / Wing Commander: Infinite experiment and the gaming media will dutifully parrot these teaser releases as gospel, giving SQ a baseline bump. But even Quad Titans in SLI can not overcome turgid line deliveries of space pulp pretending it's space opera.

So, there’s the set-up for a :tinfoil: hot take on Squadron gossip.

What if over the last couple of years, CIG leadership — which technically includes Chris Roberts despite his proven inability to actually provide it — actually realized what was obvious to most reasonable people quite a long time ago? What if the tepid demand for new Squadron preorders came as a surprise to them? What if they actually figured out that nearly all of the revenue they bank comes from high dollar spaceships pre-sales? That they’d sewn up the lionshare of any market for a Wing Commander reboot in the early years and even that wasn’t much to write home about?

I know this is so obvious as to not bear mention and it has been for years and yet inside the Chris Roberts bubble, was it so obvious?

And consider too the horror of COD: Infinite Warfare as plot complication for Chris’s grand plans for Squadron. 14 million units sold for a game his literal and figurative biggest fanboy declared “What a modern Wing Commander game might look like” (or something to that effect.) It had a slick and largely well-reviewed campaign, featuring arcade style dogfighting, beautiful mo-cap, and the insanely refined combat you’d expect from one of the biggest shooter franchises in the world. It was a failure yet one that scooped up a huge buying audience. It was a failure yet one completely beyond the reach of a team that can’t deliver a modern-era FPS experience that is in anyway satisfying. Did Infinite Warfare help further inoculate the market against Squadron simply by virtue of being a space dogfighting / shooter that most now consider a genre failure? And did CIG eventually figure that out, too?

Take all of that in — the tepid new demand worsened by future demand destruction because “I played that crap already and it sucked!” sensibilities in the mainstream? Given the miserable per customer retail revenues for Squadron, the difficulties CIG has had with all the motion capture, and the fact that it really must be finished and released before CIG can even gauge if there is demand, what if CIG finally realized that Squadron 42 is now and always has been a giant black hole sucking away backer funds from the bright glowing mass of crazy stupid that is Star Citizen? And it has to stop?

:tinfoil:”IN CASE OF EMERGENCY, BREAK LOAN”:tinfoil:

With all that as pre-amble, here’s the :tinfoil:. What if CIG realized this some time ago, and the Coutts loan — backed by the IP rights to Squadron — was in fact constructed pre-emptively to both fail and then absolve them of obligations to finish the game that too few want, leaving Coutts with the oh so prestigious cast and owning the game that would cost a fortune to finish yet may not have much of a new audience? Would there be any better way out than to create appearances of mighty efforts to complete the game but ”Oops! Wow, we didn’t see this coming backers but we’re actually in a real bind here! And we had to make the toughest decision we’ve ever made. We’re more expensive than ever now and even with big sales we’ve got a burn. And cash is precious now. So we had to choose between two games we love equally and dammit, we chose Star Citizen but man it hurt.”

Coutts ends up holding the bag of poo, CIG is absolved of their burden to finish it, and nearly nobody at CIG is mourning the loss but Chris, Sandi and a handful of his old film industry entourage? And that was the plan for the Coutts loan all along, hence the rights to Squadron IP only? To everyone else, it’s the clean break from the thankless nightmare of Squadron work. Work that costs a fortune to turn around yet very well might not have had a chance to recoup it.


Again, let me reiterate this is :tinfoil:. Too many IF conditions to be more than that. Yet what gives it at least a little bit of resonance to me is the cynicism and cowardice of such a maneuver. The theory may be outlandish yet not because it is beneath the character of Chris Roberts. He is absolutely the sort of person who’d mash an “IN CASE OF ENERGENCY, BREAK LOAN” button to get himself out of a jam, and even if planning the escape in its very design, he’d be the first to blame anyone and everyone else who failed the project before himself.

Having said all this, I still believe in Squadron 42. Rumors and theorycrafting worst case scenarios when out on the tree branch of said rumors is nuttery I’d limit solely to such good company as all you good people.

G0RF fucked around with this message at 02:07 on Dec 12, 2017

G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

AngusPodgorny posted:

That's what they pretend, but "pledge" isn't a magic word that immunizes them from consumer protection laws. And a prosecutor is a far more existential threat than Coutts, which is why they flinch every time a prosecutor gets involved in a refund request.

THE AUTHORITIES: “You can’t just decide not to deliver your single player game, Mr. Roberts...”

CHRIS: “Of course not!”

THE AUTHORITIES: “Then you’re aware that you’d be legally obligated to refund any pre-purchase revenues derived from said product?”

CHRIS: “Yes and in fact I’ve already cut the check to make any backers whole.”

THE AUTHORITIES: “Well presumably you’ll be printing more than one?”

CHRIS; “Nope, just one!”

Chris reaches behind his Restoration Hardware desk and pulls out a comically oversized check, “PAYABLE TO MR. BEN LESNICK in the amount of $60.”

Cue laugh track. Roberts turns to camera and makes an exaggerated shrug with a stupid, sheepish grin on his face which locks in FREEZE FRAME.

Title pop: “Directed by CHRIS ROBERTS”

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G0RF
Mar 19, 2015

Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

Milky Moor posted:

that stuff about the S42 trailer before star wars is crazy as hell. like surely, if it is indeed true, that's a horrible blow to CIG?

It would be wonderful if there’s a Squadron trailer before Star Wars and if the game did release.

Plus it would mean Jake’s big scoop from a year and a half ago finally came to pass.

Please let this be true!

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